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Kirby: Pushing A Couple Into The Temple

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Kirby: Pushing a couple into the temple

Robert Kirby

Tribune columnist

...This isn't about whether getting married in the temple is important. This is about believing coercion is an acceptable way of getting people there. If you don't believe me, call the temple and ask if you can bring a hostage next time...

http://www.sltrib.com/columnists/ci_6538691

What are your views regarding this article? Do you feel that this does happen in Mormon families and if so why? If families are considered important, why do you think this attitude of coercion exists?

M. :)

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There are just too many Scriptures that warn about not being "unequally yoked," not giving the sons of Israel to the daughters of Egypt, etc., for me to believe it is OK for Christians to be wed to non-Christians. So, what if my child were to come home with a non-Christian fiance?

Frankly, it would be a heart-breaking situation. On the other hand, yes, by that stage in her life, she is old enough to walk her own faith. She will know how I feel without me needing to express "priggish disapproval."

So, I concur about the coercion part. However, now I am getting old enough that I wish the young lovers understood their parents' anguish too, instead of being filled with their own myopic sense of self-fullfilment.

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Kirby: Pushing a couple into the temple

Robert Kirby

Tribune columnist

...This isn't about whether getting married in the temple is important. This is about believing coercion is an acceptable way of getting people there. If you don't believe me, call the temple and ask if you can bring a hostage next time...

http://www.sltrib.com/columnists/ci_6538691

What are your views regarding this article? Do you feel that this does happen in Mormon families and if so why? If families are considered important, why do you think this attitude of coercion exists?

M. :)

Is your implication, Maureen, that such dumb behavior happens because of Mormonism? Or inspite of it?

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Kirby: Pushing a couple into the temple

Robert Kirby

Tribune columnist

...This isn't about whether getting married in the temple is important. This is about believing coercion is an acceptable way of getting people there. If you don't believe me, call the temple and ask if you can bring a hostage next time...

http://www.sltrib.com/columnists/ci_6538691

What are your views regarding this article? Do you feel that this does happen in Mormon families and if so why? If families are considered important, why do you think this attitude of coercion exists?

M. :)

I live here in part of the Bible belt and I hear this kind of thing from all religions...in regards to what kind of wedding will take place.....Mormons are not the only ones if thats what you are implying.

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Within Catholicism, only marriages sanctioned by the church I considered legitimate.

In my fellowship, if a minister knowlingly officiates a marriage between a Christian and one who is not, his/her ministerial license will be revoked.

LDS teaching is that temple marriages are forever, whereas others are "til death."

Any rule can be seen as "coercion," and some parents try to take last stands far too late in the dating game. However, if ever there was an area in life where a perspective couple should have agreement, imho it would be faith practice.

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Thats why I said in this area where I live we have alot of Baptists.....and I could go on about that. I have heard conversations around here and from friends of my kids about what parents have said about getting married to someone not of the Baptist faith.

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Once again, another article, or experience, or "historical fact" that somehow we that are Mormons are nuts...either our leaders are corrupt, or the parents are, or whatever.

It seems that lately all that is being posted by certain individuals on this board are justifications on why they can't believe or no longer believe in the church.

It is tiring... :glare:

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While the article cites a couple of parents who seem to be behaving foolishly, the author is LDS. Furthermore, I see nothing foolish about trying to instill within children the importance of marrying within one's religion, and according to the highest standards of the faith.

It may well be that folk are out to get you, but in this case, the OP seems to be intended to stimulate an interesting and legitimate discussion.

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after reading this My thoughts were that the mothers of these kids were just frustrated with there chilldren's choices, so they were talking about what they wish they could do, but when it comes to their children getting married I bet they would be supportive.

He had overheard the conversation so he wasn't part of it.

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Hmmm...

I may be having second thoughts about this issue.

First, I thought that the parents who wouldn't pay for a wedding unless sealed in the temple were being dumb.

Then I thought, that if it is belief that we are commanded to serve and obey the Lord and if it also your belief that the Lord has commanded temple marriage, then would it be unreasonable for parents to financially support an action that they believed was contrary to the will of the Lord?

I didn't hear anything about the parents not loving their children. I heard that they didn't think it good to financially support certain behaviors. Maybe it is not a perfectly clear cut issue.

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Guest Yediyd

My thoughts? If my daughter wants me to foot the bill for the wedding...she needs to acknowledge my feelings about said wedding...if she wants to do it her way...that's her choice...she can use her own funds and do as she pleases. May sound like blackmail...but I will not pay for something I am adamantly against...I will still love my daughter and I will attend the wedding if she still wants me to come...but If she is not willing to acknowledge our beliefs in Temple Marriage...that is her choice to make, and mine not to finance a wrong choice as I see it.

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What's with all these kids nowadays having an entitlement attitude?

Their parents are under no obligation to pay for any wedding, temple or other.

Refusing to fund a wedding that isn't a temple wedding is merely assigning a consequence to an action.

God does that too. He's a pretty good parent (to put it lightly).

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Once again, another article, or experience, or "historical fact" that somehow we that are Mormons are nuts...either our leaders are corrupt, or the parents are, or whatever.

It seems that lately all that is being posted by certain individuals on this board are justifications on why they can't believe or no longer believe in the church.

It is tiring... :glare:

amen

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I guess my reason for posting the article was mainly to see if others on this board have also come across this type of attitude or action when it comes to a difference in religious choices. A temple marriage is important in Mormon culture and religion. But the family organization is also important. How can a each individual member of a family respect and love each other and at the same time be accepting of each members individual moral choices, even though those choices may not meet everyones expectations. Lets say the couple wishing to get married is LDS but for whatever reason do not wish to marry in the temple. Is it possible for the parents to be disappointed of course, but still be respectful of their children's agency to accept their decision? And carry on with celebrating and preparing for a happy occasion?

M.

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Guest Yediyd

I guess my reason for posting the article was mainly to see if others on this board have also come across this type of attitude or action when it comes to a difference in religious choices. A temple marriage is important in Mormon culture and religion. But the family organization is also important. How can a each individual member of a family respect and love each other and at the same time be accepting of each members individual moral choices, even though those choices may not meet everyones expectations. Lets say the couple wishing to get married is LDS but for whatever reason do not wish to marry in the temple. Is it possible for the parents to be disappointed of course, but still be respectful of their children's agency to accept their decision? And carry on with celebrating and preparing for a happy occasion?

M.

Absolutely! But as CK mentioned, what gives with this sense of entitlement? Let them pay for their OWN wedding!! I would be VERY disappointed, but I would still love them and be at the wedding if invited...would I voice my opinon? Yep!!! Would I pay for the wedding? Nope!!!

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My very LDS brother told his daughters he would only pay for their weddings if they were married in the temple. Then his daughter got married, but not in the temple. He paid for it. It was his baby!

It actually turned out to be a good thing, as the husband had an affair within a year and the couple broke up. So there were no temple covenants broken, which would have broken my brother's and niece's hearts.

Elphaba

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Guest Yediyd

Woulda, coulda, shoulda...I love my kids, too....I'll most likely fold like a cheap suit, too! <_<:(:rolleyes:

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It's easy to criticize devoutly religious parents for apparent harshness in expressing disapproval of opposing spiritual decisions of their adult children. Society says it's all about the individual. Me thinks society is rather callous and insensitive to these parents, who fear their children are making eternally unfortunate decisions.

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It's easy to criticize devoutly religious parents for apparent harshness in expressing disapproval of opposing spiritual decisions of their adult children. Society says it's all about the individual. Me thinks society is rather callous and insensitive to these parents, who fear their children are making eternally unfortunate decisions.

But what if these adult children are just as devoutly religious, but their religion is not the same as their parents. Should these children be insincere in how they worship God for their parent's sake?

M.

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Guest Yediyd
<div class='quotemain'>

It's easy to criticize devoutly religious parents for apparent harshness in expressing disapproval of opposing spiritual decisions of their adult children. Society says it's all about the individual. Me thinks society is rather callous and insensitive to these parents, who fear their children are making eternally unfortunate decisions.

But what if these adult children are just as devoutly religious, but their religion is not the same as their parents. Should these children be insincere in how they worship God for their parent's sake?

M. What does that got to do with the artical? The artical was about a couple who would not PAY for the wedding....let the kids do what they want...but why call the parents bad because they refuse to foot the bill on something they know in their hearts is wrong...If the kids feel they are right and know it is against what their parents believe, they are just being selfish and spoiled to expect the parents to cough up the dough....

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<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>

It's easy to criticize devoutly religious parents for apparent harshness in expressing disapproval of opposing spiritual decisions of their adult children. Society says it's all about the individual. Me thinks society is rather callous and insensitive to these parents, who fear their children are making eternally unfortunate decisions.

But what if these adult children are just as devoutly religious, but their religion is not the same as their parents. Should these children be insincere in how they worship God for their parent's sake?

M. What does that got to do with the artical? The artical was about a couple who would not PAY for the wedding....let the kids do what they want...but why call the parents bad because they refuse to foot the bill on something they know in their hearts is wrong...If the kids feel they are right and know it is against what their parents believe, they are just being selfish and spoiled to expect the parents to cough up the dough....

I was specifically commenting on PC's post. But regarding the article, it wasn't just about paying for a child's wedding; it's about coercing your children into doing what you want them to do, instead of allowing them to follow their own agency and integrity.

M.

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Guest Yediyd
<div class='quotemain'>

<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>

It's easy to criticize devoutly religious parents for apparent harshness in expressing disapproval of opposing spiritual decisions of their adult children. Society says it's all about the individual. Me thinks society is rather callous and insensitive to these parents, who fear their children are making eternally unfortunate decisions.

But what if these adult children are just as devoutly religious, but their religion is not the same as their parents. Should these children be insincere in how they worship God for their parent's sake?

M. What does that got to do with the artical? The artical was about a couple who would not PAY for the wedding....let the kids do what they want...but why call the parents bad because they refuse to foot the bill on something they know in their hearts is wrong...If the kids feel they are right and know it is against what their parents believe, they are just being selfish and spoiled to expect the parents to cough up the dough....

I was specifically commenting on PC's post. But regarding the article, it wasn't just about paying for a child's wedding; it's about coercing your children into doing what you want them to do, instead of allowing them to follow their own agency and integrity.

M. Oh, I read the artical and I didn't get that...it was just two frustrated parents who chose not to pay for a wedding that they did not approve of...I see nothing wrong with that...Did they say they would not attend the wedding? Maybe my memory fell asleep, too!!! Sorry!!!

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I don't think it is a 'right' for parents to pay for a child's wedding, like so many people think. Same with a college education. It would be nice if they pay for these things, but it's always the choice of the person who owns the money, as to how they want to spend the money.

What would I do? I would contribute to my son's wedding, no matter what beliefs his fiance had. But if someone feels differently? Well, that's their choice. And I am talking about financial support. I do think it's a huge mistake to let your child's choice of spouse affect their relationship.

I plan to pay for college for my son as well, as long as it's not something like a 6 year degree in basket weaving. But if my financial situation changed and I wasn't able to pay for either, I wouldn't feel as though I had failed as a parent. It is a parent's duty to pay for the basic needs of their children, and when the child reaches 18, anything above and beyond is not required.

I guess this comes from my exp. of paying for my own wedding and college education... didn't hurt me one bit! In fact, I think I appreciate both of them more than some of my peers because I worked so hard for them and they weren't given to me.

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I guess my reason for posting the article was mainly to see if others on this board have also come across this type of attitude or action when it comes to a difference in religious choices. A temple marriage is important in Mormon culture and religion. But the family organization is also important. How can a each individual member of a family respect and love each other and at the same time be accepting of each members individual moral choices, even though those choices may not meet everyones expectations. Lets say the couple wishing to get married is LDS but for whatever reason do not wish to marry in the temple. Is it possible for the parents to be disappointed of course, but still be respectful of their children's agency to accept their decision? And carry on with celebrating and preparing for a happy occasion?

M.

Yes I sadly came across it because I did get married in the Temple (with because I am in the UK a civil ceremony first), my Mother 5 years on still does not acknowledge my husband. I paid for my own wedding which is nice as I got to call the shots and had a wonderful day which was exactly what my husband and I wanted

I know one of the Prophets is believed to have said he would rather his daughter marry a good man than a bad Mormon and that is the way I feel about it. I want my daughter and sons wedding day to be one where they knw without a doubt Mummy and Daddy love them, they will always be welcome, with their spouse and family. If something goes wrong and its beyond repair they can come home. Parents who push their children away at this point open the door for abuse etc My dream for my son and daughter is that they marry someone who will be good to them, and that they can be with at least until their dying day, that their life on Earth may be as full as it can be. I don't know what their future holds and at their marriage its time to put them in Heavenly Fathers hands - my intention is for them to each have a fund that I turn over to them at 16 or 18 whenever they leave home, its their choice what they use it for. That way if my son wants to marry another man he can do so, as the choice becomes his. By the time they get to 16 and can get married, I think its a bit late to worry about trying to change their actions, its time to offer advice when needed and hope with fingers crossed you have instilled the teachings. CS Lewis said we love our children to the point at which they no longer need us. that for me will be a terrible but exciting day.

-Charley

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