Your Political Views Reflects Your Moral Views


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POLITICAL BELIEFS REFLECT MORAL CHARACTER

 

With my wife, I've continued reading Elder H. Verlan Andersen's book, The Great and Abominable Church of the Devil, and he teaches some very interesting things regarding your political beliefs and how they reflect your moral values.

THE INDIVIDUALS MORAL RESPONSIBILITY FOR GOVERNMENT ACTION

With the fact in mind that government is exclusively an agency of compulsion, we are now prepared to understand the basic moral nature of all government action. Throughout history civilized man has regarded the forcible taking of human life, human liberty, and human property rights as having the greatest possible moral significance. No ethical or moral question has been regarded of greater importance than that of determining when it is proper and when improper to put a person to death, take from him his freedom, and deprive him of the property with which he sustains life and exercises liberty. Since every government enforced law involves these very acts, the decision as to what laws should and should not be passed is the most moral problem we face. Furthermore, the moral responsibility for acts performed in the name of government must rest on some person or persons. The actions of government are the actions of men performed by men at the command of men, and someone is morally accountable to God for every regulation of human conduct by force, and for every forcible taking of human life, liberty, and property. In a nation of self-governing people, that someone is everyone—everyone who approves of the law in question, or because of indifference has failed to oppose it. With the privilege of self-government comes the corresponding responsibility to answer for what that government does, and no member of a free society can avoid his own obligation.

Of course, if one opposes a law, justice demands that he neither be blamed nor given credit for the evil or good done under that law. Those who sanction it, or fail to take action regarding it, must bear the responsibility because there is no other place to rest it. Some may desire to charge the officers of government—the legislators, judges, and executive—with full responsibility. While these officers must bear their share, which may oft-times be great because of the sensitive positions they occupy, in the final analysis, they are the servants or agents of the people. The power to elect and defeat, to pass judgment on candidates, platforms and issues rests in the hands of the voters.

One’s moral accountability for his political convictions arises not only from the political control he exercises, but also from the fact that his political beliefs constitute a most intense and accurate expression of his views on morality and justice. Let us observe that this is so.

A PERSONS POLITICAL PHILOSOPHY EXPRESSES HIS MORAL CONVICTIONS IN THE STRONGEST MANNER POSSIBLE

A person’s political philosophy is an expression of his moral beliefs because he cannot determine whether he favors or opposes a law without consulting his moral standards. Before he can approve of a law which forbids a certain act he must believe the forbidden act to be wrong or harmful. More importantly, he must determine that the law requires proof of an evil intent before punishment is inflicted. Who would be so lacking in justice and compassion that he would approve of taking a man’s life, liberty, or property for having done a deed with a righteous or an innocent intent? To classify an intent as good or evil demands the use of moral judgment.

Similarly, before one can approve of a law which commands an act, he must believe the act to be good and a failure to perform it a culpable omission deserving of punishment. There would be an inherent contradiction in commanding the people to perform an act regarded as evil and punishing them for failing to perform it. It is contrary to logic for anyone to espouse a political philosophy which is inconsistent with his moral beliefs. On the other hand that philosophy is a formulation of his moral code.

A person’s political philosophy not only reflects his moral convictions, but it also represents his most intense feelings regarding good and evil. Those acts which are prohibited by the laws he favors are not only regarded by him as evil, but are also so objectionable to him that he is willing to physically punish anyone who commits them. His feelings are equally intense regarding those acts he thinks he has a moral right to compel others to perform. When a person is so firmly convinced of the correctness of his political code that he is willing to impose it on all other members of society with death, imprisonment, and fine, he has expressed those convictions in the strongest possible manner.

POLITICAL BELIEFS REFLECT MORAL CHARACTER

Suppose one were given unlimited power to use force on his fellow man without fear of retaliation, physical punishment, or condemnation by other members of society. Under such circumstances, the manner in which he treated others would be an accurate index of his moral character. The only thing left to restrain him or to determine the good or evil he would do with that force, would be his conscience. This is substantially the position a person would be in if he were given the power to secretly direct the affairs of government. He would have in his hands the supreme physical force in society and could use it to control others without incurring either physical danger or condemnation.

In a society of self-governing people, this is essentially the position the voter occupies. While one man acting alone cannot control government, it is most obvious that the laws he favors represent his most uninhibited desires regarding what force he wants used on human beings. Indeed, if enough of his countrymen vote as he does, he will actually use that supreme physical force to accomplish his purposes.

Our political desires are an extremely accurate index of what we would do if the Lord made us a king, a judge, or a ruler with power to govern others. If we would exercise “control or dominion or compulsion,” unrighteously, then our support of laws which regiment and control the business and private affairs of our neighbors and deprive them of their stewardships would clearly indicate this. If we would steal, except for the fear of being punished or exposed, then our approval of laws which forcibly take property from its rightful owner and give it to those to whom it does not belong would demonstrate this trait. If we would commit extortion except for fear of being caught, then our support of licensing laws which forcibly deny people freedom to enter legitimate business and patronize whom they please will reflect this criminal tendency. We must expect the Lord to use our political beliefs as a measure of our moral or immoral character.

The Great and Abominable Church of the Devil

 

 

My take on this is that you are responsible for the actions of the person you voted into office, and for the laws you vote for. It the laws or the person voted into office are unjust, you will be held responsible by the Lord. I would think that we should be very careful about investigating the voting record and philosophical/political background before voting for any candidates. I would also think you had be very careful about which political party you associate with. If their political philosophy does not embrace God's laws, you will be held accountable.

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Guest LiterateParakeet

Just how can we be accountable for their actions when they LIE?  You vote for a candidate because of things he says on the campaign, but he gets in office and is totally different.  Politicians lie all the time.  I don't believe the Lord will hold us accountable for that.  

 

That said, I am praying about whom to vote for...and it will most likely NOT be a Republican candidate.  

Edited by LiterateParakeet
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Just how can we be accountable for their actions when they LIE?  You vote for a candidate because of things he says on the campaign, but he gets in office and is totally different.  Politicians lie all the time.  I don't believe the Lord will hold us accountable for that.  

 

That said, I am praying about whom to vote for...and it will most likely NOT be a Republican candidate.  

The prospects politically seem very poor indeed.

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Guest MormonGator

Just how can we be accountable for their actions when they LIE?  You vote for a candidate because of things he says on the campaign, but he gets in office and is totally different.  Politicians lie all the time.  I don't believe the Lord will hold us accountable for that.  

 

That said, I am praying about whom to vote for...and it will most likely NOT be a Republican candidate.  

Exactly.

 

You can also be a very, very left wing person and be patriotic, moral and upstanding. For the record, I'm not a person of the left at all.  

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There is no doubt that our political views are a reflection of our moral convictions, any more than there might be doubt that our premortal choices influenced our mortal condition. The problem lies in connecting those dots. All too often, the AB connection we want to draw is simply wrong, as e.g. with those who wish to believe that Brother So-and-so has a lot of money because he was so righteous premortally.

 

The Democratic Party is evil. Those who serve it serve evil. Those who vote for it (at least on a national level) vote for evil. So it has been for probably a generation, at least. That is my firm opinion. But even if I'm right, it does not follow that those who support national Democrats are evil. There may be, and I'm sure there are, some very good people who, for whatever reason, support the Democratic Party. I'm sure there are even some who support [openly-Socialist-candidate-for-US-president-who-never-would-have-been-given-the-time-of-day-by-any-rational-American-even-a-generation-ago-but-is-widely-supported-today].

 

How is such a thing even possible? What are we to take from this situation? We may conclude that such people are ignorant, or that they are deceived, or that they have been foolish to have bought into the lies they have been fed. But we cannot reasonably conclude that they love evil.

Edited by Vort
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Guest MormonGator

 

 

The Democratic Party is evil

So if an apostle is a democrat, does that mean they are evil? James Faust comes to mind. And I'm not a democrat-I'm not a republican. 

Edited by MormonGator
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So if an apostle is a democrat, does that mean they are evil? James Faust comes to mind. 

 

No, it does not follow that they are evil. That was the point of my entire response.

 

Elder James E. Faust was not a Democrat. None of the apostles are Democrats, or Republicans either, for that matter. They abandon all such party affiliations when they accept their callings.

 

Do you honestly believe that James E. Faust would have supported the modern Democratic Party's insistence on elective abortion as a sacred right (or rite) or their approval and celebration of homosexual "marriage"? In what meaningful sense can we point to James E. Faust as an example of a present-day "Democrat"?

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Guest MormonGator

No, it does not follow that they are evil. That was the point of my entire response.

 

Elder James E. Faust was not a Democrat. None of the apostles are Democrats, or Republicans either, for that matter. They abandon all such party affiliations when they accept their callings.

 

Do you honestly believe that James E. Faust would have supported the modern Democratic Party's insistence on elective abortion as a sacred right (or rite) or their approval and celebration of homosexual "marriage"? In what meaningful sense can we point to James E. Faust as an example of a present-day "Democrat"?

No, but he's still a democrat. They are allowed to vote, I think. 

I wish it was that easy to say "all democrats are evil" or "the party is evil" I really do, but in reality it's much, much more complicated than that. 

in fact, it's usually liberals who think that those who don't agree with them are "evil". I don't know your political views Vort (Though I assume you aren't a democrat ;-) but when conservatives act like liberals and say "the other side is evil." I cringe a bit. I expect more from conservatives. 

My views are more aligned with the Libertarian Party-but I usually vote for the lesser of two evils for practical reasons. 

Edited by MormonGator
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I wish it was that easy to say "all democrats are evil"

 

Note that I explicitly said this was untrue.

 

or "the party is evil" I really do, but in reality it's much, much more complicated than that.

 

When you are talking about individuals, it's complicated. When you are talking about institutions, not so much. An evil institution is an institution that supports evil. If an institution supports one incidental thing that is evil, perhaps that institution is not irredeemable. But the Democratic Party is very far beyond any such point.

 

in fact, it's usually liberals who think that those who don't agree with them are "evil".

 

Too true. The supposed "party of tolerance" is, hypocritically, the least tolerant of dissent.

 

I don't know your political views Vort (Though I assume you aren't a democrat ;-) but when conservatives act like liberals and say "the other side is evil." I cringe a bit. I expect more from conservatives. 

 

Gator, there is a difference between calling people names and calling institutions names. On a national level, the modern Democrat Party is evil. Period. Take pretty much any issue in America today, and you can bet that the Democratic Party holds an evil view. Even when the Republicans humiliate themselves, as with immigration, the Democrats are far worse.

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Guest MormonGator

 

Gator, there is a difference between calling people names and calling institutions names. On a national level, the modern Democrat Party is evil. Period. Take pretty much any issue in America today, and you can bet that the Democratic Party holds an evil view. Even when the Republicans humiliate themselves, as with immigration, the Democrats are far worse.

 

 Believe it or not, I don't strongly disagree-I'm playing devils advocate too. You make a lot of good points, frankly. Democrats HAVE changed a ton from the JFK years, that's for sure. Sadly, Republicans have drifted leftward too.  

 

So that wasn't you I saw at the Obama rally in 2012? 

Edited by MormonGator
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 But the Lord said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the Lord seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the Lord looketh on the heart.

 

I wonder if this scripture is more than it appears to be.  We think of it as a call to see beyond physical appearance. Maybe it's a call to see past our assumptions, as well. "If Gator is a democrat, he must be without morals." "If Eowyn leans Republican, she must be heartless and uncaring." It would be nice if things were that simple, but they're not. Maybe the Lord would say, "Man looketh on political parties, but the Lord looketh on the heart." He knows our hearts and intentions and why we believe as we believe. He understands that there are different ways to see different political debates, and neither side is all good or all bad. 

 

Otherwise, wouldn't we be told, or at least know pretty clearly, which way is the right way to vote? On the contrary, we are frequently reminded that the Church doesn't endorse any party or candidate. 

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Of course your political views reflect your morality...

 

However it falls in the category of unrighteous judgement for us to conclude that a individual who is affiliated with a certain political group or voting for a particular person has a certain type of morality.

 

It is simply not that easy to find a political group or individual that perfect aligns with us in all areas... and if it turns out they are dishonest about where they stand even more so.  So we end up picking the ones we think might be closest on things we feel are priorities knowing that other areas not so much.

 

Of course now it seems to me that unless I wish to opt out entirely that my choices are based on who is least offensive to my sense of morality

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Guest MormonGator

 

Of course now it seems to me that unless I wish to opt out entirely that my choices are based on who is least offensive to my sense of morality

 Opting out is the far, far greater evil. People literally died for our to right to vote and complain. 

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How is such a thing even possible? What are we to take from this situation? We may conclude that such people are ignorant, or that they are deceived, or that they have been foolish to have bought into the lies they have been fed. But we cannot reasonably conclude that they love evil.

 

The Church teaches that there is no excuse for being deceived.  We have the guidance of the prophet and all the writings of every church leader before, as well as the scriptures.  If that is not good enough to not be deceived then we face the consequences. 

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Guest MormonGator

Really? If you had the choice of voting for Stalin or Hitler you'd consider opting out a greater evil?

 

Hmm.

No, but if you compare anyone in American elections from 1952-onwards to Stalin or Hitler, you don't know much about history, or you are blind with hate (not you meaning FP). 

Stalin and Hitler killed millions of people. Say what you want about Al Gore but he didn't set up Gulags. Nothing against Gore, just the first person I thought of. 

Huge difference between Hitler/Stalin and who we have in America. 

Edited by MormonGator
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Guest LiterateParakeet

The Church teaches that there is no excuse for being deceived. We have the guidance of the prophet and all the writings of every church leader before, as well as the scriptures. If that is not good enough to not be deceived then we face the consequences.

I disagree. The church is very careful not to show support for any candidate (even Romney) or direct us to any political party.

How we interpret which party/person to vote for is up to our own discretion. For example when I was 18, I automatically chose to be Republican because of abortion.

But we've has a couple Republican presidents and they didn't do anything to stop abortion. Choosing a party is not that simple then.

The church has encouraged us to support and help the refugees. All of the Republican candidates are against letting any refugees come here...so by your logic voting for a Republican candidate reflects your moral views and in this case not in a good way.

Conservatives often call Liberals bleeding hearts, well I call them more compassionate so in my mind being Liberal can be representative of good morals.

I have many friends from different political views. I don't judge them based on politics. And I know that the Lord knows I'm making who I vote for a serious matter of study and prayer. If I still choose wrongly, I believe He will forgive me for my childish ignorance.

FWIW, just because I'm most likely not voting Republican doesn't mean I'm voting for a Democrat. I might vote third party. We shall see.

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Conservatives often call Liberals bleeding hearts, well I call them more compassionate so in my mind being Liberal can be representative of good morals.

Is it truly compassionate to take some one else's property and give it to the poor or the needy?

Compassion would dictate that you leave that other person alone, and give your own property to the needy one.

Welfare is not charity. Welfare is destructive, charity is uplifting.

Progressives are not compassionate, they're greedy; they take other people's money rather than give their own.

Lehi

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Guest LiterateParakeet

Is it truly compassionate to take some one else's property and give it to the poor or the needy?

Compassion would dictate that you leave that other person alone, and give your own property to the needy one.

Welfare is not charity. Welfare is destructive, charity is uplifting.

Progressives are not compassionate, they're greedy; they take other people's money rather than give their own.

Lehi

My point is though that there are problems with both parties. You don't agree 100% with the Republican party do you?

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You don't agree 100% with the Republican party do you?

NO!

I was tempted to take an earlier message and change "the Democrat party is evil" to read "the Democrat party Republican party is evil".

I believe Joseph Smith was/is right: teach people correct principles and let them govern themselves. We have 'way too much government, and both parties are complicit in destroying our freedoms.

Lehi

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Guest LiterateParakeet

NO!

I was tempted to take an earlier message and change "the Democrat party is evil" to read "the Democrat party Republican party is evil".

I believe Joseph Smith was/is right: teach people correct principles and let them govern themselves. We have 'way too much government, and both parties are complicit in destroying our freedoms.

Lehi

 

 

Now you're talking.  :)

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Guest MormonGator

Now you're talking.   :)

 LOL! That's awesome. Both you and LeSellers are right about that, that's for sure! LOL .

We might want to agree on that, stop and move on while we are all friends! 

:D

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