Severely Need Relationship Advice


Recommended Posts

So I have been dating this girl on and off since high school. Close to six years in fact. She has broken up with me a couple of times, and we have always ended up coming back to each other at some point later on.Before anyone asks, we've not done anything against the law of chastity, or anything remotely near to it. Anyway, I am really lost and need some advice. She has broken up with me a few times over the years, but never because she has lost her feelings for me. She claims that her feelings for me have never changed. The problem is that she has a bit of an issue with commitment. I am 22, and have been home from my mission for two years. She keeps coming back and breaking up with me again, and I just recently learned the issue. Someone did something to her when she was very young. I don't want to go into detail, but I am sure you can guess what it was. She said that this one event made her not want to ever get married, or have kids. She is trying to work through this so she can get married one day, but she said that she doesn't know how long it will be till she is ready, but it will probably be years if she is ever ready. I expressed my love for her, and said I am always here to talk. I want to always be there for her, and I will be, whether it is as a friend or more. I am at a crossroads,though. I have always loved her, and to this day do. Do I wait for her, possibly for years. Or do I move on? I am so lost.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest LiterateParakeet

Oh I'm so sorry.

I'm a survivor too, and I can tell you for so of us healing can take years and years. I can't predict how it will be for your girlfriend, of course.

I think only the Lord can answer this question for you. He can see the end from the beginning and He know your hearts.

I recommend you fast and pray and get a priesthood blessing.

I think she needs lots of therapy (therapy has helped me a lot). If she will, it would be great if she would also fast, pray and get a blessing.

So sorry you guys have to deal with this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh boy, this is a hard one. 

 

Someone will answer for how they have changed this girl's life. 

 

She does need help, and she does need fixing, but you need to think really really hard and pray harder to determine whether you want to sign up for that for the rest of your life. Because it will be the rest of your life. That kind of damage weaves itself through every part of a person. She'll be struggling with those demons forever, in one way or another. It will affect her perspectives on everything, from parenting to your intimate life. 

 

As an extreme example, it has affected someone in my family so drastically that she trusts no one, and has gradually burned every bridge and pushed every person out of her life except her husband and small children, including her adult daughter, her family, her husband's family, most friends they've had, etc. She has isolated their family to them and them alone, and doesn't even really trust her husband of 20+ years. The demands she places on him (mainly being home to be with her and help her with the kids) have literally made it impossible for him to provide a stable life for them for most of their marriage.  His whole life is about her and her issues, to the exclusion of building any sort of career or even being able to have a relationship with his identical twin (she's too jealous). 

 

I'm not saying you should absolutely not go down this road, but just be aware that it could be a long and hard road, even after she's ready to marry.

Edited by Eowyn
Link to comment
Share on other sites

She has told you why she is the way she is. She has point blank said that marriage and family is not something she desires right now. Until she receives the help she needs, you cannot change the circumstances, but you can continue to be a friend and continue to live your life. In my opinion, you are very very VERY young, and there's lots for you to still learn about yourself. Experience life, meet new people, travel, and get to know yourself more. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can't say what you should do, but you should be aware that this experience will have far reaching implications even after she decides to get married.  Something like that affects a person's perspective on sexual relationship and it often leads to challenges in the bedroom.  Sometimes there are certain things or acts which are perfectly normal in marriage that will trigger the same feelings as when the abuse took place, sometimes it leads to near total sexual withdrawal from the marriage.  If she ever decides to marry, she really needs to see a therapist who can help her prepare to have a healthy sexual relationship with her spouse, and that will take some time.

 

So you need to ask yourself if your feelings for her are strong enough to endure the possible hardships and frustrations and hurts that could happen in a marriage with her.  Do some research on the challenges survivors of abuse run into when they marry so you can make your choice knowing what you are choosing between.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

She was clear with you on where she is.

 

You are very young.  

 

There are lots of women out there without this type of baggage.  Find one of them.  

 

Sounds too simple right?  Well it is that simple.  

 

Go and date lots of other women.  You will find the world is full of beautiful women who want to get married, and don't have the type of baggage this one carries.  

Edited by mdfxdb
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest LiterateParakeet

With adversity also can come great blessings. I would not count her out just because she experienced trauma at the hands of another, but it is something to pray about.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

She's on a mission: to get better.  It is unknown how long this will take, or where the Lord will take her.

 

How do you treat this?  The same way you treat it when any other friend goes on a mission: you wish them well, and continue to live your life.  You become a better person and listen to the Lord's guidance.   

 

If, when she's done with her mission, and if at that time the Lord wishes you to be together, then do so at that time.  In the meantime don't put your life on pause.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you marry a damsel in distress, you end up married to a distressed damsel.  Don't do that.  

 

On the other hand, she can do the heavy lifting, delve into her past to the dregs, resolve stuff, and figure out her life's plan to deal with the scars and consequences, be open and honest with herself and others, and then decide she wants to marry. That can happen - she can do it.  It'll probably take a long time (think years).   Point here is, she'll be a very different person than she is now, and for all you know she might not even pick you.  You might end up being the supportive guy she was fortunate enough to have in her life while she went through all her crap that eventually led her to her husband.  Think about that as you consider what you're saying here.

 

 

I expressed my love for her, and said I am always here to talk. I want to always be there for her, and I will be, whether it is as a friend or more. 

 
Edited by NeuroTypical
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm usually more of a compassionate type of poster.  But your short description raises a LOT of alarms in me.  Given my life experience of one divorce, and a potentially second in the works, I would highly advise moving on, despite what feelings you have for her.  Your caring and concern is great, but don't let it become your downfall in selecting a help-meet.  It hurts like nothing else, but if I can survive a divorce, you can survive a breakup.  

 

Marriage, even to a whole and healthy person is a refiner's fire itself because of the challenges and opportunities for development.  Marriage to a person with emotional/mental issues is a crucible you might not emotionally/spiritually survive. 

 

There is a book you really need to read/listen to.  Attached: The New Science of Adult Attachment   I think you will recognize her attachment style quickly in there.  You will also understand your attachment style.  Some attachment styles result in decent relationships, others are a complete disaster that exacerbate each other and make both partners anxious and needy.  

 

It is never a bad idea to date around and get to know lots of people before settling down with one person.  Even if you end up finding this gal is the one for you, you will have 1) life experience, and 2) a secure knowledge that she is the one (you won't be wondering later if you could have found a better friend, supporter, and companion).  Don't wait. Go forth and date!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Abuse is no excuse. It absolutely isn't. And I feel qualified to say that, having been sexually abused myself for several years when young, and living with and overcoming the ramifications of that. The implicatIons still color some of my personality traits (such as being reluctant to unilaterally seek my gratification, even if spouse is encouraging it - that is a turn off when for many it is fine).

As heinous as such abuse is, it is the individual that chooses what to do with it. Are they going to make lemmonaid,or continue to suck on sour lemons? I know that if I were more emotionally mature two decades ago when the abuse really hit me (about 12 years after it ceased), I could have moved on much faster, healed better, etc. But I'm certainly no Elizabeth Smart. Nor was I entirely willing to wallow in self pity and make excuses either (although I certainly did from time to time!).

I absolutely don't intend to criticize her for not moving on yet. We all have our own paths and capabilities, And no one is wrong or better. It just is what it is, and progress is not a matter of comparison to others, only to our former self. What matters is for you to understand who she is, and what her capabilities are, and if that is ok to you. Will you really have endless patience if you marry and she decides to wallow in self pity long term? Does her difficulty in progressing indicate an overall incapability to cope? Or was the abuse particularly heinous and the amount of progress so far indicates she can handle any thing life can dish up?

I'm guessing based on your post, and the anxious/avoidint attachment (breakup - makeup, breakup - makeup, repeat), she is more of the type (currently) to wallow and make excuses, and not tackle the issue internally where it really resides. That is concerning for success in marriage, where challenges are sure to arise.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you all for the advice.  I have been really needing it lately.  I really do need to do a lot of thinking, praying and fasting on the matter.  However, you all have brought points to my mind that I had not really considered as of yet.  Thank you for that.  I have just been so lost on the matter, but all of your answers have helped me a lot, and I really appreciate every one of them!  Thank you!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some of these comments and recommendations make my heart hurt. I am a survivor..... was abused in many forms as a child. When I was a young adult it all started to surface, including the intense need to not be alone anymore----to have someone to talk to, hugs, feel cared for etc...... I didn't have any of that growing up, and was very emotionally isolated/ alienated. For years I tried to reach-out to people, and over and over it was the same result. I was pushed-away, ignored....treated like an inconvenience. It was as if my very needs created barriers / prohibited those needs being met, because as soon as anyone got a glimpse, or heard a small bit of my story---they would disappear. Mind, I never even really asked for help, and was someone who constantly helped, and over-gave to others......so I was not a "drain".....just people literally would treat me like I was damaged goods and not worth giving the time to that it would take to just talk with me, or even give a hand-squeeze. I ended-up developing complex post-traumatic stress disorder ( I was hit with flashbacks that were like time warps of re-experiencing it all over and over), and again people turned away. I was lectured by a long-time friend about how I should go out and seek new friends to see if someone would be willing to help ( which is a horrible thing to say to someone in immediate need by the way)......and heard, " I can see you need help, but am worried if I provide it you will depend on me." I ended-up shutting down and isolating myself with the sense that I had to protect myself ( including from rejection).....and turned to food for comfort. I tried to fill the emptiness of a soul-wound with food. I had to go through it all alone, and in silence again, despite my initial attempts to get help. I would not wish for anyone to know what that is like. Imagine having locked, chained-up doors in front of you, and darkness pressing behind you----essentially being trapped.

 

  My point here is.... despite all the hype out there saying that victims are not "damaged goods".....people tend to treat us like that anyway. So many jump to the conclusion that it is too much work, would require too much of them.... would take-up time. They would rather have someone ready-made, and "not damaged" .......yet pride themselves in going to an animal shelter and "rescuing" an abused dog.

 

  It is natural to want to reject, and stand against abuse and violations..... to not even want to think about those kind of things. However, too often in the effort to push those "uncomfortable things" away..... the victims also get pushed away, and further isolated and hurt. It communicates to them that they are damaged goods, and worthless... unwanted. It continues the abuse, and even can succeed in making the abuser's intent and words come true. " No one will ever want, or love you....." It contributes.

 

  We talk about using Christ as an example in how we lead our lives, and how we treat others. Do you really think he would turn-away someone who had been abused? Deny them because they will require some time, love and patience? Those who have been abused are the most in need of love and support, and yet so many are quick to step-away, and even automatically advise others to do so as well. 

 

   This young woman likely has ptsd, but does not know it, or understand. It sounds like she is experiencing triggers that cause emotional flashback responses. She also maybe has lived in silence for so long, and is simply so down on herself that she doubts her own ability to recover-----because it can feel like a lonely pit that is impossible to climb out of. The thing is, it is not true. With help, support, therapy.... LOVE..... being shown care, and that touch does not equate to pain..... people can heal. Does it take extra time, patience, love, and giving of self? Yes. However, you know how those rescued dogs often turn-out to be the most loyal and loving? The same can be true with abused people when they finally find love----because they of all people understand how precious it is.

 

   If you truly love this young woman ( and really when we do love people, we don't look at them as inconveniences or abandon them--- so I guess if anyone feels those kind of responses it says where their hearts really are)....... please know that she is not a "lost cause", even if she herself right now thinks that she is. It took a lot of courage for her to explain to you what happened to her ( and she likely has not shared that with many). I would recommend researching ptsd, and look for support groups for family and partners of survivors/ people with ptsd...... because there are so many resources out there that can help you help her. Chances are, seeing you support her, seeking ways to help her.... in itself likely will do absolute wonders in how she views herself, as well in her ability to trust and open-up to you ( in many ways). Most likely, she told you those things with the fear, and knowledge that it could result in losing you. Victims suffer feeling shame, and become conditioned to expect that most people will just see them as damaged, and not want them.

 

   Please everyone, don't throw people away. Love one another.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The main point is that she is telling him she isn't ready.

Marriage is hard under the best circumstances. She is wise to know that intense healing within herself will make her better prepared to be a partner. Marriage based on one person rescuing another starts out on shaky ground.

I am sorry for what you went through. As I said, someone will answer for that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

FiestySoprano,

 

I'm a survivor too- as are 1 in 3 women, and 1 in 6 men.  The need for help is great- no one is saying that the OP shouldn't be this girl's friend and help (if she asks for it).  The question is whether or not is is advisable for the OP to wait for her in marriage.  

 

Survivors need help- no one doubts that.  Fighting the scars of abuse is a lot like fighting cancer: part of yourself that has been mutated, that must be fended off and eventually cast out, and must be regrown new.  A hard reality of this battle (one I was forced to learn) is that the only person who can fight a cancer in you is you.  The doctors can give medicine, and friends can hold your hand, but ultimately its you whom has to win this battle (with Christ's help obviously).  

 

Friends can hold a survivor's hand, listen to their story, and sympathize.  But friends cannot cure their PTSD, nor be their self esteem, nor beat their heart for them.  There are limits to what a friend can do, and asking a friend to do something they cannot is a recipe for disaster.  

 

The OP's lady friend is working through her issues, and while the OP can always be her friend, it is unknown if/when the lady will be ready to have a husband (or who it will be).

Edited by Jane_Doe
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Another thing that may or not be the case:

 

I remember as a single, immature young woman, I'd say things like "I have too much going on" or "I don't think I'm ready for marriage" (yes, I actually used that one on a guy for whom I had no more desire to date) when I wanted to end things but didn't want to be mean. Yeah, girls can be dumb like that. I thought I was being nice. Later my husband explained to me why that approach really isn't nice, and the kind thing is straight-up honesty. 

 

So again, this might not even apply, but she could be letting you down easy (in her mind). 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm sorry, I should have been more clear. I was responding mainly to the couple people that just referred to her as "baggage" and "damaged" and to move on etc...... I know not everyone said that. It just made me cringe, for obvious reasons.

 

Yes, it is good that she at least is being honest with herself, and him as well regarding what her limits are at this point ( that is a good starting point). It is also helpful to know what the cause and situation is, because if he does decide to stick it out, he can know better how to help and support her on her journey. 

 

 Its also still possible that she won't be "deadlocked" as long as she currently thinks. Victims say that because it can seem overwhelming and impossible, but often people find once they do face things, and have support etc.... that things resolve in ways they had not expected to be possible previously.

 

  As for affecting a person when it comes to perspectives, and personal inner-wiring etc.... yes, abuse does make people "different". Even once someone has overcome things ( as I have), there can still be differences and quirks etc.... BUT, that is not always a bad thing. I have found having had my experiences has given me insight, awareness to others, appreciation, strengths etc.... that I would not have gained in any other way. I have been able to help people in unique ways, and to me that is a blessing, and helps me to view my past with greater understanding. So there truly are positive "differences" that people gain. Adversity is what often results in the greatest wisdom, strength of character, and compassion for others. So though someone may be struggling now, they could blossom into something truly special later once they work their way through things. It is just something to consider when rushing to label someone as "baggage" etc.....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm sorry, I should have been more clear. I was responding mainly to the couple people that just referred to her as "baggage" and "damaged" and to move on etc...... I know not everyone said that. It just made me cringe, for obvious reasons.

"Being" baggage, and "having" baggage are not the same thing. I did not go back to read the offending messages, but as I recall, the writers said she had baggage. Whatever you may think of her (based on your own experiences), she has a lot of baggage. No, she didn't ask for it. No, she is not responsible for having it. She may be responsible for keeping it: we can't know what she's done to get rid of it, and it's none of our business.

And, you are the best expert on this, she has been damaged, cruelly. No, she is not responsible for her damage. No, she did not ask for it.

The OP is concerned about what to do with his own life. Neither he nor we know how long it will take her to jettison her baggage, how long to heal. It is his right to be concerned: this woman would be the mother of his children if they married. This woman would be his eternal companion if they married. But, if it takes her ten years more to heal, he will not have those children, and he will not have that companion for a decade. The question is, should he wait for her? Should he wait for her or find someone who is truly available now?

I can't see how we can answer that for him: it depends on how much he loves her and how much he is willing to sacrifice the time he will lose as a husband and father to wait for that healing so they can marry.

It also depends on what he learns from the Holy Ghost. And that is something not even he can know without asking.

Lehi

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest LiterateParakeet

I'm sorry, I should have been more clear. I was responding mainly to the couple people that just referred to her as "baggage" and "damaged" and to move on etc...... I know not everyone said that. It just made me cringe, for obvious reasons.

Yes, it is good that she at least is being honest with herself, and him as well regarding what her limits are at this point ( that is a good starting point). It is also helpful to know what the cause and situation is, because if he does decide to stick it out, he can know better how to help and support her on her journey.

I understood you the first time, probably because I feel the same way. I appreciate your posts.

I have to run ,but I'll try and post more later. Until then, thanks for speaking up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Feisty one, thanks for the thoughts, and not being too feisty about standing up for you and others.  :-)  

 

I contemplate two people, hypothetical or real, that undergo the same traumatic and life-altering experiences. Same duration, same severity, same everything.  One comes out of it a stronger tree (Good timber poem), the other one cowering and unwilling to stretch for the light or fight the wind.  Why?  Clearly, it is not the experience that defines us and our responses!  

 

Now, there is real danger is looking to great examples, as we are all too prone to start comparing ourselves, and asking 'why can't I do that', and feed our problem, but there is value too, in seeing what is possible.  Elizabeth Smart. I'm under no delusion she doesn't have major issues.  But the way she has handled herself publicly is the antithesis of locked doors in front of her, and only darkness behind, trapping her in the middle, unable to move.   

 

Viktor Frankl - concentration camp survivor. Man's Search for Meaning.  An amazing example of how we are the only ones responsible for our responses, not the conditions that have befallen us.  

 

What makes one soul grow into good timber, and another soul remain stunted?  I'm not entirely sure. Perhaps the nature of our spirit has much to do with it, and our inherent meekness or stubbornness.  But, as hard as it may be to hear, I do honestly believe, from my own experiences, that a huge factor is not understanding our own part in trapping ourselves into mental anguish.  I too turned to isolation, being an island unto myself, out of the reach of emotional daggers of others, and certainly not connected enough to be rejected by anyone. I didn't turn to food, but to other forms of maladaptive behaviors in efforts to self-soothe.  Those of us raised in homes where abuse occurred, or was allowed to occur, were also not taught how our thoughts can be controlled, our responses can be chosen so that we act, not simply react, and that we are the ultimate determinate of our mental destiny.  It took me a looong time to crack open the door to that understanding, and I've got a long way to go in implementing the understanding that has come to me. But with the light, I can see that it was me, not my circumstances, that determined where I was and what I was doing. 

 

The hardest part is accepting we may be partly at fault, and being ok with that.  It is both the first step to understanding, and simultaneously the first step of change (the not being down on ourselves, but being accepting and even compassionate despite acknowledging our part). 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest LiterateParakeet

I contemplate two people, hypothetical or real, that undergo the same traumatic and life-altering experiences. Same duration, same severity, same everything.  

 

The main issue I have with your post is THIS ^...because there is NO such thing.  

 

Each survivor is different, their circumstances and abuse were different.  That is why we should not judge one another in our healing.  

 

A few years back, when I was in a very dark place dealing with my past (I was very depressed) another survivor told me to "just put it behind me, and don't dwell on it."  I said it doesn't work like that.  Fast forward to now...she admits she still has nightmares, and "triggers" on a daily basis.  She thought she could "just put is all behind her" but she couldn't.  You have to work through it, you can't just ignore it.  

 

People who have not been raped can never know what it is like, and those of us who have been need to show one another compassion, not judgement. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest LiterateParakeet

Some of these comments and recommendations make my heart hurt. I am a survivor..... 

 

   Please everyone, don't throw people away. Love one another.

 

Some of the comments hit me the same way.  Thanks again for your post.

 

For you, here's a quote that inspires me:

 

"Every human being is born with the strength to heal.  No amount of violence or torture can destroy that capacity.  No barbarism or savagery can crush the ability to recover and rebuild."  -Richard Mollica PhD

 

We know we can heal.  The Savior promises us that.  We have to focus on that.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The main issue I have with your post is THIS ^...because there is NO such thing.  

 

Each survivor is different, their circumstances and abuse were different.  That is why we should not judge one another in our healing.  

 

A few years back, when I was in a very dark place dealing with my past (I was very depressed) another survivor told me to "just put it behind me, and don't dwell on it."  I said it doesn't work like that.  Fast forward to now...she admits she still has nightmares, and "triggers" on a daily basis.  She thought she could "just put is all behind her" but she couldn't.  You have to work through it, you can't just ignore it.  

 

People who have not been raped can never know what it is like, and those of us who have been need to show one another compassion, not judgement. 

 

Agree.....in fact, I was itching to reply with much the same response when I read that. No two people are a like. We all have different experiences, different ways of coping, different ways of healing...... there is no exact formula.  Additionally, people lock, and store things inside of them. Think of it like the mind hitting pause buttons to protect someone from something they can not cope with ( especially children), and eventually the pause button is released and suddenly "plays" ( thus how flashbacks happen).  So some people may seem strong and fine, when really they have not fully remembered or addressed things yet, or simply are good at "concealing" ( like so many of us are, especially those who experienced ongoing abuse/ were trained ).  Someone who seems weak and cowed over a situation is NOT destined to remain that way, it just means they are still in need of stages of healing. No one is "instantly okay" after being attacked..... if they are, its because they are in denial. Most everyone will experience the broken stage ( some longer than others), but it is still possible for them to face, overcome, and grow.

Edited by FiestySoprano
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some of the comments hit me the same way.  Thanks again for your post.

 

For you, here's a quote that inspires me:

 

"Every human being is born with the strength to heal.  No amount of violence or torture can destroy that capacity.  No barbarism or savagery can crush the ability to recover and rebuild."  -Richard Mollica PhD

 

We know we can heal.  The Savior promises us that.  We have to focus on that.  

 

 

Thank you. That is beautiful.   ::hug::

 

This is both my favorite scripture, and painting combined......

 

fb1a85998f81ea72949ad38c22acfc1e.jpg?w=2

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share