Eve1991 Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 Why do so many people leave the Church? Some people say its because what a past prophet said about black people over 100 years ago and some people say its because they read things in the book of mormon ect and some people let over the new policy back in November. Why do people decide now they are leaving the Church because of something that was said 100 years ago? Also did the people ever read the bible where it says homosexuality is a sin and that marriage is only between a man and a woman? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Godless Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 People have been leaving the Church long before the gay marriage issue came to a head, and for a multitude of reasons. I left because I didn't believe Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. Others leave because of friction between themselves and other members. And yes, some leave because of the Church's history. Regarding the recent exodus due to the Church's stance on homosexuality, that had less to do with the Church's stance on something that every member knows is sinful and more to do with the impact that the policy has on the children of homosexual couples. And it's probably safe to say that many of those who left the Church because of that already had one foot out the door anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eve1991 Posted May 4, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Godless said: People have been leaving the Church long before the gay marriage issue came to a head, and for a multitude of reasons. I left because I didn't believe Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. Others leave because of friction between themselves and other members. And yes, some leave because of the Church's history. Regarding the recent exodus due to the Church's stance on homosexuality, that had less to do with the Church's stance on something that every member knows is sinful and more to do with the impact that the policy has on the children of homosexual couples. And it's probably safe to say that many of those who left the Church because of that already had one foot out the door anyway. Are there any other atheists on here? Did you pray and ask if Joseph Smith was a prophet? If Jesus comes back tomorrow or next week or next month or next or in 2 or 5 or 10 years and he confirms the church is true and Joseph smith is a prophet of god then will you believe him? Edited May 4, 2016 by Eve1991 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane_Doe Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 25 minutes ago, Eve1991 said: Why do so many people leave the Church? Some people say its because what a past prophet said about black people over 100 years ago and some people say its because they read things in the book of mormon ect and some people let over the new policy back in November. Why do people decide now they are leaving the Church because of something that was said 100 years ago? Also did the people ever read the bible where it says homosexuality is a sin and that marriage is only between a man and a woman? There's a lot a reasons. There are many stumbling blocks out there, and many different people's responses to them. Going over some of the examples you presented-- Yes, some people leave the church because church leaders were/are not perfect. Frequently, that's because they put leaders on a pedestal, when in reality the only sinless person that's ever been on this planet is Christ. Some people find the churches teachings/lifestyle are hard to keep. Some people think that they know better than the Lord (stuff like homosexuality). And there are so many more examples. NeedleinA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightSG Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 34 minutes ago, Eve1991 said: Why do so many people leave the Church? Well, the bishop said I should avoid people of low moral character. Haven't been to Sunday School or Priesthood since. May start sitting in the foyer for Sacrament meeting too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 4 minutes ago, NightSG said: Well, the bishop said I should avoid people of low moral character. Haven't been to Sunday School or Priesthood since. May start sitting in the foyer for Sacrament meeting too. That's not bad general advice, so I'm assuming there's more nuance in the context. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 35 minutes ago, Eve1991 said: Why do so many people leave the Church? How many is "so many"? Do you mean this as in, "Even one is too many?" If so, then I agree. But it is not like 30% of the Church is apostatizing. Those who leave do so because they have decided one or more of the following: They despair of forgiveness for their own perceived unworthiness The Church's claims of divine authority are untrue Some person or people and/or leaders offended them, and now they're cutting off their nose to spite their face Living the gospel demands more than they care to give The Church itself has left its own path and is in apostasy (actually a subset of #2) The mockery of those in the great and spacious building is just too hard to bear The praise of the world is of more importance to them than the fellowship of the Saints These are more or less in order of how much sympathy I feel for those who succumb to these reasons. NeedleinA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Godless Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 27 minutes ago, Eve1991 said: Are there any other atheists on here? I don't believe so (been wondering what happened to Elphaba). Did you pray and ask if Joseph Smith was a prophet? Yes. I prayed, sought answers in the scriptures, and carefully studied my patriarchal blessing. I never found anything to keep me in the church. If Jesus comes back tomorrow or next week or next month or next or in 2 or 5 or 10 years and he confirms the church is true and Joseph smith is a prophet of god then will you believe him? Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just_A_Guy Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 8 minutes ago, Godless said: I don't believe so (been wondering what happened to Elphaba). Me too, Godless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday21 Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 I wonder what the percentage of active: less active is generally. In my city we have 100-150 attending but 554 members in total. That's roughly 1:4! When I was stake singles rep, I tried to call all of the inactives. I received some interesting responses! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 1 hour ago, Godless said: some leave because of the Church's history. Which is a really poor reason (but then, all of them are). I have a testimony of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I do not have a testimony of the history of the Church. Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 2 hours ago, Godless said: the impact that the policy has on the children of homosexual couples. So, what was that "impact"? Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maureen Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 3 hours ago, Godless said: I don't believe so (been wondering what happened to Elphaba).... She hasn't posted here in awhile, but she sometimes posts at Mormon Discussions. M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maureen Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 2 hours ago, LeSellers said: ...I have a testimony of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I do not have a testimony of the history of the Church. But isn't the BofM, the First Vision, Polygamy, the Priesthood, etc, all part of the history of the LDS Church? M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 Just now, Maureen said: But isn't the BofM, the First Vision, Polygamy, the Priesthood, etc, all part of the history of the LDS Church? M. You must have worked especially hard to come up with this non sequitor. Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane_Doe Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 42 minutes ago, Maureen said: But isn't the BofM, the First Vision, Polygamy, the Priesthood, etc, all part of the history of the LDS Church? M. A testimony is based in Truth: Truths like Christ is the Savior of the world, the Father loves His children, the scriptures (Bible, BoM, etc) are His words to us, etc. Truth is infallible. Church history is events that happened in the past, and frankly is frequently recounting of people sinning and messing up in big ways. It is not Truth, though it may be true events. LeSellers and NeedleinA 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maureen Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 Lehi, are you saying the events that have taken place that brought about the existence of the LDS Church do not need matter? M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eve1991 Posted May 5, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 9 hours ago, Godless said: I don't believe so (been wondering what happened to Elphaba). Yes. I prayed, sought answers in the scriptures, and carefully studied my patriarchal blessing. I never found anything to keep me in the church. Yes. Would you come back to Church again then if Jesus confirms it? LeSellers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eve1991 Posted May 5, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 How do you reach out to the inactive members and people who resigned from the Church over the new policy? The people who resigned from the Church over the new policy must have read the bible and know what the bible says that homosexuality is a sin and that a marriage is between a man and a woman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tesuji Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 Someone please show me statistics showing that lots of people are leaving the church now. I'm skeptical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tesuji Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 7 hours ago, LeSellers said: You must have worked especially hard to come up with this non sequitor. Lehi Meanness is the opposite of the gospel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday21 Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 1 hour ago, tesuji said: Someone please show me statistics showing that lots of people are leaving the church now. I'm skeptical. I am not sure that it is true that many people are leaving the church. I read a pew poll saying that the lds church is holding steady. LeSellers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 (edited) We've had another thread that covered all this. You can either try to put it under a very broad umbrella (like pride) or you can look at each individual cause and discuss them. It doesn't really matter. All you can do to anyone who leaves is love them like a brother or sister. The rate of people leaving the Church is statistically no different than always has been. What disturbs me is one of the reasons for it. Historically, there have always been people who have been "offended". Some "found out" something in Church history that they felt they could not reconcile. Some discovered some doctrine that didn't sit well with them. Many many causes that always have been and always will be. The one that sticks out in my mind, though, are those, like Godless, who leave simply because they never had a testimony. I think that's sad. I somehow get the impression that they expect a "First Vision" type experience or something so overwhelming that there is no denying it. While that certainly happens to some, it is the less common experience. The more common one (and I know many are thinking of Elder Bednar's video on the topic) is where we have a single spiritually nutritious meal that feeds us for a few hours. We certainly don't see any physical growth due to that one nutritious meal. We merely have our hunger abated. We continue to have them throughout our lives, multiple times a day, and we realize that we've grown from infancy to adulthood over the course of several decades. Even then, as an adult, we must still eat and be nourished by the Good Word of God if we are to live. It can never end. There are far too many who either never had any spiritually nutritious meals or had them so few and far between, that a similar physical treatment would result in starvation either way. (insert parable of the seeds on stony ground, etc.) Some study the scriptures like they're eating beans and rice. The scriptures can be like beans and rice or they can be a Thanksgiving feast or anything in between. Many just don't know how to cook. Edited May 5, 2016 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 3 hours ago, tesuji said: Meanness is the opposite of the gospel First, I can't see any "meanness" in what I wrote. As to whether "meanness" is the opposite of the Gospel: Ye generation of vipers! Scribes, Pharisees, hypocrites! Tell that old fox, … You were saying? Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 7 hours ago, Maureen said: Lehi, are you saying the events that have taken place that brought about the existence of the LDS Church do not need matter? I'm saying that the members of the Church over the past century and a half were human, and that they, from the least to the greatest made mistakes. Further, I'm saying that people who suffer from chronocentrism are blinded by their own presumed wisdom, and are no better at judging the past than I am qualified to judge you. Lehi Jane_Doe and NeedleinA 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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