Homosexual crush on missionary


TilKingdomCome
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I'm getting baptised soon. Unfortunately, I've developed something of a crush on one of the missionaries. We're both the same age - in our late teens - and he just happens to be particularly good-looking. I've tried to not let it distract me during our lessons together, and I generally try to talk to other missionaries and church members during church events like the weekly sports matches, I try to talk to other people instead of him so that my crush on him doesn't serve as a distraction. However, when we're talking - such as when he's trying to teach me stuff during the lessons - I find it very difficult to look at him or maintain eye contact. I know such crushes are unlawful but I can't get rid of it. Any advice on how to deal with it?

One of the annoying things about it is that I am asexual - I feel absolutely no desire to have sex with anybody - but I still get crushes on people.

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Wish I could give sound advice about how to deal with a crush; but all I can really offer you is, "don't entertain it"--the more you brood on it, the stronger it will get.  Of course, it's natural--once told not to think about something--to want to think about it all the more . . . so probably, finding some pastime or hobby to occupy yourself will be somewhat helpful.

I would suggest, though, that having a crush on the missionary who's teaching you (whether a homosexual crush or heterosexual crush is irrelevant) introduces all kinds of weird issues into the conversion process.  You might want to look into having some other set of missionaries teach you, or else taking a break from the discussions (but not church attendance or independent study) for a couple of months until the missionary you're attracted to is transferred.  I would also suggest that rather than have this discussion with the missionaries directly, you contact the mission office and speak directly to the mission president (he will be older and more experienced, and will probably handle your situation with a lot more maturity and sensitivity and tact than the missionaries would).

It would be easy for me to also remind you of how problematic homosexual relationships are in the context of Mormonism; but I'm going to go out on a limb and surmise that you are well acquainted with those issues already.  Assuming you are, and are ready to move forward--welcome to the fold!  :) 

Edited by Just_A_Guy
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6 minutes ago, zomarah said:

What you're describing sounds like infatuation, meaning it is an arbitrary biological response. In which case, yes, distraction and separation can generally alter (lessen) the biological response.

A bit of a threadjack, I suppose; but I would just submit in passing the possibility that even "real love" can be consciously and deliberately be lessened and, over time, killed (conversely, I think it can be consciously and deliberately grown and even, in some cases, created ex nihilo).

Exhibit A.

:)

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When I find myself obsessing about something, whether it's a problem or an earworm song, my go-to method is to just let my mind do its thing. Oh, so I want to think about the TripleDent Gum jingle, huh? OK, TripleDent Gum it is, for the next hour, or three hours, or maybe three days. Whatever. I'll dissect that sucker, learn the words, and eventually my brain will tire out and will want to think of La Mer or Figure.09 or Nacqui all'Affanno. Same with problems. Eventually, I get tired of worrying about it, and move on. Then when I think about it again, it's not so upsetting.

 

 

 

 

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There is a phenomenon that happens, especially between mothers and obstetricians, where a person translates feelings of trust and gratitude toward a caregiver in to love and affection. Of course love is not what it is, and the feeling eventually fades and is forgotten; but it happens frequently enough that there's a name for it. If I had a better memory, I'd give it to you. 

Anyhow, I suspect that's what's happened more than anything. He's brought you something beautiful that will change your life, and so these feelings develop and in your mind morph into a crush. Don't let your mind make it bigger than it is. On top of the phenomenon mentioned above, it's well-documented that the adversary will work harder on those who are about to make covenants, or who have just made covenants. You have power over your mind. Recognize that this is an intense but fleeting thing multiplied by different factors, and don't blow it up in your mind into anything more than that. The missionary will leave and the luster will wear off; but you'll still have the Gospel and the covenants you made. 

Edited by Eowyn
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1 hour ago, Eowyn said:

There is a phenomenon that happens, especially between mothers and obstetricians, where a person translates feelings of trust and gratitude toward a caregiver in to love and affection.

Or people misread feelings between friends. It can happen in a heterosexual way. When a good female friend of mine helped me through a difficult problem, we both mistook feelings for something romantic. It did not end well for either one of us.

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2 hours ago, Vort said:

When I find myself obsessing about something, whether it's a problem or an earworm song, my go-to method is to just let my mind do its thing. Oh, so I want to think about the TripleDent Gum jingle, huh? OK, TripleDent Gum it is, for the next hour, or three hours, or maybe three days. Whatever. I'll dissect that sucker, learn the words, and eventually my brain will tire out and will want to think of La Mer or Figure.09 or Nacqui all'Affanno. Same with problems. Eventually, I get tired of worrying about it, and move on. Then when I think about it again, it's not so upsetting.

I tried that with The Battle Hymn of the Republic A decade later it's still running through my head. 

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2 hours ago, Eowyn said:

There is a phenomenon that happens,

It is not uncommon for investigators to have confused feelings/attractions towards missionaries. Besides the fact that they are tidy, happy, well groomed and professional, they also bring a message with them that invites the Spirit. Unless explained well, those feelings of happiness, joy, optimism, warmth, etc can erroneously be attributed to the individual missionary instead of the Holy Ghost. Those feelings are to help investigators recognize the validity of the message, not to fall in love with a missionary. 

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On 5/14/2016 at 1:44 AM, Eowyn said:

There is a phenomenon that happens, especially between mothers and obstetricians, where a person translates feelings of trust and gratitude toward a caregiver in to love and affection. Of course love is not what it is, and the feeling eventually fades and is forgotten; but it happens frequently enough that there's a name for it. If I had a better memory, I'd give it to you. 

I'd hazard a guess and say that it's the Oedipus Complex, but I thought that only happened with maternal figures, not with guys who are the same age as you?

But ye may be right - I might be getting confused because of the gratitude I have for finding the spirit. I've purposely avoided speaking to this missionary except when necessary, and didn't speak to him at all during Church yesterday, and it is helping me move past it.

 

Another, somewhat-related question (if this is better suited to a seperate thread, lemme know): I'm having my baptism this weekend. However over the last few days - and, I expect, over the next few days between now and the day of the baptism itself - I've been feeling very scared about the baptism. Being baptised is a very big decision to make, and by agreeing to be baptised - by agreeing to keep the Lord's commandments - it means that my life, and the plans I had for my future, will completely change.

Up til now, all of my friends have been members of the LGBT community. I've purposely kept to those social circles because I felt safer there, I could be myself around those people. But, now that I'm joining a church that considers those people sinners, my friends have basically abandoned me. They don't want anything to do with someone who's an active member of a community that discriminates against them. I only have one friend left who I still talk to, and even then there's an awkwardness whenever we meet up. I know she thinks of it as a betrayal, especially since she in particular offered me a lot of support when I was struggling with LGBT stuff in the past.

Basically I'm losing all of my friends, so that I can join this church. And someone I've spoken to online - who used to be a member of the church before losing faith in it - said that the moment you leave the baptism waters, everyone in the church suddenly turns a lot colder to you. They "love-bomb" you before you get baptised, making it seem like a nice community you're joining, but then after you're baptised, they want nothing to do with you. They just keep to their own already-established cliques and, because you weren't raised in the church and know nobody else there, you're left feeling like an outsider. If I get baptised, I'm losing my friends and I'm going to enter a community where I'm alone.

Also, a large part of my plan for the future was to find a nice guy and to settle down and have kids. I can't do that anymore. I was speaking to one of the older Brothers during a car-ride to a stake meeting on Saturday and he said that all types of homosexual relationships, even celibate ones, are sinful and unnatural. Which means that I'll never be able to find true love or happiness if I join the Church. I'll be closer to God - which is definitely a great thing - but still I won't have any companionship. It's an awful lot to give up and yet, I can't exactly turn my back on the Church either, seeing as I know that it's the true church.

What would ye suggest for someone in my situation?

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Guest LiterateParakeet

TilKingdomCome, congratulations on your baptism.  I'm sure the Lord is well pleased with your sacrifice!  

I don't feel that I can advise you on your situation since I haven't experienced it, but I can share with you a blog you might find helpful.  There are a long of gay Mormons, doing just what you are doing trying to navigate these waters of faith and desires.  You won't be alone. One of those people that I know is Josh Weed.  He is "gay, Mormon and married to a woman."  I'm not suggesting you marry a woman, simply stating that is the choice Josh made.  He says it is not necessarily the right choice for everyone.  The reason I mention his blog is because he writes in a very real, and vulnerable style that I think you will appreciate.  He also has a page on Facebook, perhaps you could contact him and ask about support groups of other faithful Mormons.  His blog is www.joshweed.com.

It is true, in part that people will start to "fade back" a bit after your baptism.  This is normal human behavior.  Think of it this way, when someone dies, people rally around the person who is left behind.  They bring meals, they mow the lawn, they offer to babysit, etc...but after the funeral they begin to fade away, to return their attention to the daily stresses of life, and the grieving person is unfortunately left alone.  I've heard this mentioned enough that I believe it is a fairly common occurrence. Hopefully, it won't be so dramatic for you.  I hope that you will always feel the loving support of a ward family, but remember always the most important thing is your relationship with Heavenly Father and the Savior.  They are why you are sacrificing so much to join this church.  They are the ones that you can count on to never 'fade away."  Love them, and serve them by loving others...then you will never be alone. 

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1st off Congratulations on deciding to become baptized. The Gospel of Jesus Christ is awesome, there is nothing more powerful in the world and joining his Church is a big step in learning how to live like He would want us to live and to become as much as possible in this life like Him.  

2nd off, I will provide some of my thoughts and please do not take personal affront nor offense, I mean none and always remember no matter what you are a Son of God, your were created in His likeness and image with the potential to become like Him and to one day live with Him again.

No one understands your situation like your Heavenly Father, ultimately in the extremely tough times of your life it is to Him who you should always turn.  He might not always answer your prayers in the time-frame you want, but he will always answer them-sometimes with a No, sometimes Yes, sometimes it doesn't matter and sometimes not yet.

Yes, your LGBT friends will most likely abandon you. You are very young and most likely very tender, I can't imagine you being more than 18, which means that you've had at most 4-5 years in puberty. For you, those 4-5 years have seemed like a long time (over 25% of the time you've been alive!). But compared to the likely length of your life those 4-5 years represent maybe 5% of your life and represent nothing in the scheme of your eternal life. But while in the big picture it is a very small portion of time, the choices you make now will have lasting consequences for years and decades to come.

I feel very sorrowful for today's youth, they are being led by the Syren Call down to paths that led nowhere good. In general, the youth today do not have good role models, they do not have good teachers, they do not have parents who teach discipline, responsibility and grit. Today's culture is a "do whatever you want" culture where it's no rules and no consequences.  It is a lie, a lie from the Great Deceiver.

Ultimately, if you make the choice to continue to follow Christ, what you will find in your life is that you will change your attitude and your very nature to become more like Christ. In doing so, you will find that you will naturally change the types of friends you have. I would urge caution on using terminology that the Church "discriminates", discriminates is a loaded term that is used improperly.  Every day, every individual discriminates, one's choice of friends is a form of discrimination. As a society we are seeing the natural evolution of the word "discrimination" that turns any type of choice that some people don't like into a "social justice". The Church discriminates based on behavior, it discriminates against thieves, against adulterers, against murderers, against all forms of deviant behavior as specified by Holy Scriptures. 

The problem being with LGBT is that they see their behavior as something they can't change, in fact in many cases don't want to change-therefore they see it as the Church discriminating against their very person, which isn't the case, it is discrimination against behavior.

And it is very unfortunate because it is only within the bounds the Lord has set, obeying His commandments and His laws that regulate our behavior that we can find ultimate peace and happiness in this life. I applaud your desire to have a family. However, a homosexual couple with children is a lie, it isn't a family it is a pretend family. The only way that children can be created is from man and woman. For a homosexual couple to have children it requires an individual of the opposite sex. It is why infertile heterosexual couples feel such devastating loss.  There is absolutely nothing in this world like creating another human being with someone you love, to watch it grow, and then to give birth. Adoption is a good substitute for some couples, but regardless it still isn't the same. In addition, the raising of adults requires both Father and Mother.  The farther one gets away from the ideal of a heterosexual couple creating a child together and raising it together the more challenges and problems will occur and the more likely that the children that are raised will have issues.

I would also stay away a little bit from the psycobabble, Freud was doing cocaine and mushrooms and who knows what else http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/07/22/sigmund-freuds-cocaine-problem/. How many of his ideas came when his was high??? Who knows.

Most psychologist have absolutely no way to prove their theories, they simply sit and think and then when they think they've thought of something good they write it down and sell it.  Psychology is in many ways a modern day religion (and I've read a lot of it).

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On 5/16/2016 at 1:22 PM, LiterateParakeet said:

It is true, in part that people will start to "fade back" a bit after your baptism.  This is normal human behavior.  Think of it this way, when someone dies, people rally around the person who is left behind.  They bring meals, they mow the lawn, they offer to babysit, etc...but after the funeral they begin to fade away, to return their attention to the daily stresses of life, and the grieving person is unfortunately left alone.  I've heard this mentioned enough that I believe it is a fairly common occurrence. Hopefully, it won't be so dramatic for you.  I hope that you will always feel the loving support of a ward family, but remember always the most important thing is your relationship with Heavenly Father and the Savior.  They are why you are sacrificing so much to join this church.  They are the ones that you can count on to never 'fade away."  Love them, and serve them by loving others...then you will never be alone. 

Thank you. I had a very interesting conversation with the missionaries today - where I discussed my concerns about the gay stuff (NOT the crush! As others have pointed out, that was probably my confused feelings because the person was bringing me the Word of God, which in turn brought me a lot of happiness) - and they seemed very nice and mature about it. They also mentioned about how, while I'll lose lgbt friends, I WON'T lose friendships from the church :)

 

YJacket, that is a LOT of stuff in your post. I'll reply to various paragraphs by inserting text in bold into the quote-box.

 

1 hour ago, yjacket said:

1st off Congratulations on deciding to become baptized. The Gospel of Jesus Christ is awesome, there is nothing more powerful in the world and joining his Church is a big step in learning how to live like He would want us to live and to become as much as possible in this life like Him.  

Thank you. You're right - the Gospel is awesome, and it is very powerful. It brings me a certain sense of peace ... not sure if we'd call it "happiness" exactly. It's more than that. It's like a sense of clarity, like I'm only just beginning to properly see the world around me, and understanding my place in it.

2nd off, I will provide some of my thoughts and please do not take personal affront nor offense, I mean none and always remember no matter what you are a Son of God, your were created in His likeness and image with the potential to become like Him and to one day live with Him again.

Don't worry - I haven't taken offence. I know you're just offering your thoughts and advice.

No one understands your situation like your Heavenly Father, ultimately in the extremely tough times of your life it is to Him who you should always turn.  He might not always answer your prayers in the time-frame you want, but he will always answer them-sometimes with a No, sometimes Yes, sometimes it doesn't matter and sometimes not yet.

Yes, your LGBT friends will most likely abandon you. You are very young and most likely very tender, I can't imagine you being more than 18, which means that you've had at most 4-5 years in puberty. For you, those 4-5 years have seemed like a long time (over 25% of the time you've been alive!). But compared to the likely length of your life those 4-5 years represent maybe 5% of your life and represent nothing in the scheme of your eternal life. But while in the big picture it is a very small portion of time, the choices you make now will have lasting consequences for years and decades to come.

I'm actually 21 since December :o Do I come across as being immature or something? :P 

But yes, I see your point.

I feel very sorrowful for today's youth, they are being led by the Syren Call down to paths that led nowhere good. In general, the youth today do not have good role models, they do not have good teachers, they do not have parents who teach discipline, responsibility and grit. Today's culture is a "do whatever you want" culture where it's no rules and no consequences.  It is a lie, a lie from the Great Deceiver.

How is it a lie? It does lead somewhere good - people who choose to pursue their gay feelings end up with a loving partner.

Ultimately, if you make the choice to continue to follow Christ, what you will find in your life is that you will change your attitude and your very nature to become more like Christ. In doing so, you will find that you will naturally change the types of friends you have.

This is a very good point. I'm not baptised yet and already I've seen my attitude and personality changing. For example, a lot of my friends use the Lord's name in vain, even without realising they're doing it, and a lot of them smoke and drink. I used to think nothing of it but now when they do that, I feel very uncomfortable.

I would urge caution on using terminology that the Church "discriminates", discriminates is a loaded term that is used improperly.  Every day, every individual discriminates, one's choice of friends is a form of discrimination. As a society we are seeing the natural evolution of the word "discrimination" that turns any type of choice that some people don't like into a "social justice". The Church discriminates based on behavior, it discriminates against thieves, against adulterers, against murderers, against all forms of deviant behavior as specified by Holy Scriptures.

Yes, the word "discrimination" has become over-used these days but it's not used out-of-context in this situation. The difference between the Church discriminating against thieves, adulterers, murderers etc and discriminating against gay behaviour is that gay people aren't hurting anyone. They're just exercising their love for one another. Love, something God says is a blessing. 

The problem being with LGBT is that they see their behavior as something they can't change, in fact in many cases don't want to change-therefore they see it as the Church discriminating against their very person, which isn't the case, it is discrimination against behavior.

It's something they can't change? Umm, I'm going out on a limb here and assuming you're straight. If you had to, would you be able to change your orientation so that you're attracted to people of the same sex? It's not something that can be changed.

And it is very unfortunate because it is only within the bounds the Lord has set, obeying His commandments and His laws that regulate our behavior that we can find ultimate peace and happiness in this life. I applaud your desire to have a family. However, a homosexual couple with children is a lie, it isn't a family it is a pretend family. The only way that children can be created is from man and woman. For a homosexual couple to have children it requires an individual of the opposite sex. It is why infertile heterosexual couples feel such devastating loss.  There is absolutely nothing in this world like creating another human being with someone you love, to watch it grow, and then to give birth. Adoption is a good substitute for some couples, but regardless it still isn't the same. In addition, the raising of adults requires both Father and Mother.  The farther one gets away from the ideal of a heterosexual couple creating a child together and raising it together the more challenges and problems will occur and the more likely that the children that are raised will have issues.

"It isn't a family it is a pretend family" Are you saying that heterosexual couples who can't have kids the natural way are living a lie by choosing to have kids another way? Are you saying that it's better for orphaned kids or kids who are put into fostercare are better off without loving parents than having a gay couple look after them?

How does the raising of adults require both Father and Mother? This is an argument I've seen a lot and I don't understand it. What if Father dies before the child is born? Can the child not be raised, because it only has Mother? What can heterosexual couples provide their kids that homosexual couples can't?

I would also stay away a little bit from the psycobabble, Freud was doing cocaine and mushrooms and who knows what else http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/07/22/sigmund-freuds-cocaine-problem/. How many of his ideas came when his was high??? Who knows.

Most psychologist have absolutely no way to prove their theories, they simply sit and think and then when they think they've thought of something good they write it down and sell it.  Psychology is in many ways a modern day religion (and I've read a lot of it).

Solid advice but unnecessary. I don't pay much attention to psychologists, seeing as most of the shtick they come up with is stuff that anyone can think about if they just sit down for a few moments and wonder "why do people tick the way they do?" There's barely ever anything useful or new found in psychology, and Sigmund Freud was a complete numptie.

 

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Till,

Incorrect assumption on my part for your age, it was simply an educated guess based on ages of missionaries, etc., my bad. IMO 18 vs. 21 still isn't too much of a difference. I'm glad you don't pay attention to psychologist.

With regards to the not hurting anyone. I'm uber-libertarian, but not libertine.  I believe that from a governmental perspective as long as one doesn't encroach on another's rights, it should be allowed.  Whether it is a moral action, and whether or not it hurts someone else is a different matter. In a vacuum, simply one homosexual loving another homosexual only ends up hurting themselves. That is very similar to fornication.  Two individuals who use protection and fornicate (i.e. neither are married yet have sex) can easily make the claim that they are not hurting anyone else, yet the Church discriminates against them just the same as it discriminates against homosexuals. Quite simply it is a moral matter.

The Church has made very strong claims that homosexual behavior is outside the bounds that God has taught.  God and the Church has unequivocally made that clear, and it is something that you will have to come to terms with.  This much I can guarantee, if you are not able to come to terms with it and be at peace with it, you will one day find yourself walking out the door. Now this doesn't mean you have to come to terms with it right now, it just means that over time you will need to resolve it.

Please notice that I have always said homosexual behavior.  I would point you to a couple of very good resources:

https://www.lds.org/topics/family-proclamation?lang=eng

http://mormonsandgays.org/   

We don't know and I'm not sure we will ever know why people initially become attracted to another person. What we do know is that people can change their behavior. It is the behavior which the Lord and the Church condemns. Love is absolutely a blessing, but everything in this life has its bounds. Pure Christlike love, i.e. Charity, is much different than attraction/emotional love.  Christlike Charity is doing everything in ones power for the blessing of other people with no expectation of any return and has no bounds. For physical and emotional love, we give of ourselves yet at the same time we receive it back.  A relationship where both individuals do not do this is a recipe for a broken relationship. For physical and emotional love the Lord has absolutely set standards that cannot be broken least we face His wrath and judgement.

To directly answer your question, I would do whatever the Lord required of me. If the Lord required me to sacrifice all that I have and all that I am for Him-yes I would do it. And I do not say that lightly.  I have had my own personal experience, that was my own Abrahamic experience that in some ways was similar to Abraham sacrificing his own son. And after having that experience, I can say 100% absolutely yes, I would do whatever the Lord required.

Yes I am straight, however, it is 100% possible to change behavior, the will to act however is a different matter. For heterosexual married men, this is evident in abstaining from things like pornography and bad movies, not flirting, etc.  Simply not oogling a pretty woman, these are all behaviors that can be changed. What is amazing is that the more practice one has with changing behavior, the more attitudes and actually who you are change.  One can be a heterosexual man (married or unmarried) and not look at porn, not develop a crush on a co-worker, etc. One can acknowledge physical beauty without feeling anything for it or needing it. The idea that we cannot control feelings is absolute bull.  In the moment, it is very difficult to control one's feelings, however feelings are meant to be controlled, tamed, harnessed. It is one of the defining characteristics between children and adults.  A child throws a tantrum and rages inside.  The child is taught to control the tantrum and not act out, and internally eventually the rage becomes controlled and the child no longer throws a hissy-fit anytime something goes wrong. 

No, I'm not saying heterosexual adoptions are a lie, because it is still a man and a woman and it is within the bounds the Lord has set, it is not the same as having one's own flesh and blood, but given the pain and suffering those who cannot have children go through it's well worth it. Homosexual adoptions are an abomination; we are talking about the raising of the next generation and there is no responsibility more sacred and more important than training the next generation. The ideal family unit is a man and a wife (it is spelled out in the Proclamation).  Quite frankly the parts (physically, emotionally, and spiritually) do not fit together for a homosexual family.  There are attributes that children need to learn that only a woman can provide, there are attributes that children need to learn that only a man can provide. Single part households are especially difficult b/c one piece is missing.  Homosexual households are worse because they try to replace the missing part with a fraud. A man, no matter how feminine he is will never be a woman, the brain, the body, etc. it is fundamentally different. The same goes for a woman, she will never be a man.

With regards to fostercare children, yes I am saying they will be better off not being adopted by homosexuals. Foster care children are already (through no fault of their own) messed up and have lived horrible lives.  One is taking a child, who has lived an extremely messed up life and is now putting them into another environment that is messed up. A fostercare child, needs love, leadership and most importantly above all else discipline. A foster child needs a stable environment with representative examples of both sexes loving each other and working very hard.  

One of the reasons why children need both is because they need to see the strengths and weaknesses in both sexes to understand and learn value in and about the opposite sex and their own sex. How is a male child in a homosexual environment going to learn to treat his future wife if he has 2 dads? I guarantee you the moment that he tries to treat his wife the way one "Dad" treated the other "Dad" he is going to be in for some rough lessons. Where do we learn these behaviors? In the home!!! How is the female child going to learn to treat her future husband? It is amazing how much we as children pick up and learn from our upbringing and we don't become self aware about it until much later in life. 

There is a fallacy in modern-day parenting that parents are there to be a child's friend and to help the child explore who they are.  Nothing could be further from the truth. The task of raising an adult is no less than teaching and training a child how to be responsible, independent, and a good moral person.  Being a parent is an indoctrination job.

Up until about 50-60 years ago, if a young father lost his wife or a young mother lost her husband they would remarry and generally pretty quickly.  I know that I would easily remarry if that happened to me. People simply understood the necessity of the opposite sex in the home.  And I guarantee you just about any single parent out there would say STTE I just wish my children had a good "father/mother" in their life.  God did not intend for men nor women to raise adults alone. 

Society has stayed with the opposite sex household for thousands of years, it has worked, it has worked very well.  Yet us modern humans, in our hubris seem to think that simply because two people love each other it is the basis for overturning the fundamental unit of society, the family.  It will be for our destruction.

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