Writing in the temple?

[Jane_Doe]

4 hours ago, Carborendum said:

I didn't realize there was such a policy.  But my biggest question is more of a practical nature.  Where do you carry anything to write with/on when you're in temple clothes?  My pockets are too small to carry anything useful.

I like to write on a simple piece of paper which is folded up to the size of a credit card.  That and a small pen fit in my pockets just fine, both in the temple and other places.  

4 hours ago, Carborendum said:

There used to be a policy/law against jurors being allowed to take notes while sitting in the jury box.  In the N.F.L. (National Forensics League) we were debating the policy and the proposed legislation to allow jurors to take notes. One of the concerns was that they may not be paying attention properly if they were writing.  Another argument was that the court reporter notes were available if they needed to review anything.  I'm not sure what happened to that legislation.  But I do know that some states do allow that.  It may be that only my state had such a policy.

I'm with @zil on this one...  Granted taking notes while listening to a presentation is a very different thing than writing for a prayer.  

Edited August 11, 2017 by Jane_Doe

[Jane_Doe]

2 hours ago, Vort said:

In the endowment, we covenant to keep certain things private, even -- dare I say it? -- secret. We do not speak of those things or write them down. Such sacred things are to be kept very close to the vest. They are to ponder in our minds and hearts, to commune with God in spirit and not communicate to others.

Just because a person is writing doesn't mean that they are transcribing temple secrets.  Conversely, a evil person can transcribe temple secrets a million ways without writing in the Celestial Room.  

2 hours ago, Vort said:

But I hesitate to condemn previous authorities or decry their decisions as men stabding impudently or stubbornly or foolishly between you and God.

No condemnation here, only love.  I get that we as limited humans really struggle to understand someone who is different than us.  It's hard, I get that.  And I think many other people get it too.  We need to forgive each other of our shortcomings and love each other through them.   The other temple president specifically- I have a lot of love and empathy for him: he was my old stake president for over a decade.  I watched his kids grow up, watch him change through time, and he righteously guide our stake.  He's a great man, even if he like many other struggle to understand those who are different.  

2 hours ago, Vort said:

Now that you have been granted this blessing, perhaps you might start working on your ability to ponder and pray without relying on pen and paper. 

The way I speak to God is not a disability that needs to be overcome.  It is not a sin, it is not unrighteous, there is nothing "wrong" with my voice speaking to God.  My voice is part of my divine nature and something to celebrate and thank God for.

[Vort]

1 hour ago, Jane_Doe said:

The way I speak to God is not a disability that needs to be overcome.  It is not a sin, it is not unrighteous, there is nothing "wrong" with my voice speaking to God.  My voice is part of my divine nature and something to celebrate and thank God for.

Not sure why the defensiveness. Sorry if I  offended you.

If one cannot ponder without a pen and paper, that sounds to me like a limitation. Why wouldn't you want to learn to ponder without external props? Can't see how that would not be a worthy goal, any less than my working to be an audible learner. Do you think I would have been well-served to say, "I don't learn through lecture, and God made me this way, so I'm good"? I'm happy that I have learned how to learn by lecture.

I guess I assumed that anyone would rather be able to do something desirable than not. Maybe I was wrong.

[Jane_Doe]

2 hours ago, Vort said:

Not sure why the defensiveness. Sorry if I  offended you.

If one cannot ponder without a pen and paper, that sounds to me like a limitation. Why wouldn't you want to learn to ponder without external props? Can't see how that would not be a worthy goal, any less than my working to be an audible learner. Do you think I would have been well-served to say, "I don't learn through lecture, and God made me this way, so I'm good"? I'm happy that I have learned how to learn by lecture.

I guess I assumed that anyone would rather be able to do something desirable than not. Maybe I was wrong.

I appreciate your kind sentiment here.  I also apologize if I was too sharp in my previous post.  I'll try to better explain myself:

I have no desire to change my alto sining voice into a soprano.  There is nothing "better" or "wrong" about one singing voice over another.  Same with one prayer voice versus another.  It does not matter if one person folds their arms to pray, another clasps their hands, or another a pen-- all of these are people raising their voices to God.  We are all different be divine design, the bring a rich harmony to God's choir.   And then temple is God's house, a place where His chorus signing His lyrics should all be welcomed.

Now, your college lecture example is different in a number of basic ways.  For starters, rather than expressing you are receiving information.  Hence, you need to adapt to the way that information is being delivered.  For a lower-quality professor, it's their way or the highway, so you just need to suck it up and deal with how they do things.    But what about a great professor?   A great professor doesn't just chat at you, but also has a text book, writes notes, visual demonstrations, activities, and many lessons even come in song and dance form!  A great professor reaches all types of learners.  God is the best professor of all.   

[Guest]

19 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

I like to write on a simple piece of paper which is folded up to the size of a credit card.  That and a small pen fit in my pockets just fine, both in the temple and other places.  

I'm with @zil on this one...  Granted taking notes while listening to a presentation is a very different thing than writing for a prayer.  

Yes, that was one of the points brought up in that debate I mentioned.  The team ended up neutral on the idea.  But of course a jury isn't an endowment.

[askandanswer]

On 12/08/2017 at 1:10 AM, Jane_Doe said:

 

So I called the temple matron expressing my concern about not being able to pray/write at the temple.  Honestly, the conversation with her left me sobbing.  She didn't understand, and just shut me down, I felt hurt and shunned.  Too hurt to try talking to the matron myself again, I asked my mom to speak to the temple president about this for me (mom is a temple worker and the temple president is an old family associate).  Again, shut down. Hurting, I seriously considered delaying my temple trip-- which would also meaning missing my sister's sealing.  I hurt really bad.  

 

So there are some who would disapprove of writing in the temple. But there is a Divine precedent for writing ON the temple in Alma 10:2 and we have been counselled to follow the example of our Father in all things.:) 

I am Amulek; I am the son of Giddonah, who was the son of Ishmael, who was a descendant of Aminadi; and it was that same Aminadi who interpreted the writing which was upon the wall of the temple, which was written by the finger of God.

Edited August 13, 2017 by askandanswer

[SilentOne]

4 hours ago, askandanswer said:

So there are some who would disapprove of writing in the temple. But there is a Divine precedent for writing ON the temple in Alma 10:2 and we have been counselled to follow the example of our Father in all things.:)

So much for that "Your body is a temple, and you wouldn't go draw/write on the temple," argument against tattoos.

[Guest]

13 hours ago, SilentOne said:

So much for that "Your body is a temple, and you wouldn't go draw/write on the temple," argument against tattoos.

But we write on the temple all the time.

"House of the Lord"

"Holiness to the Lord"

"Exit"

"Emergency Exit Only"

Edited August 14, 2017 by Guest

[dahlia]

On 8/14/2017 at 12:01 PM, Carborendum said:

But we write on the temple all the time.

"House of the Lord"

"Holiness to the Lord"

"Exit"

"Emergency Exit Only"

And apparently the Church doesn't have an issue with Tongans and Samoans (and probably other groups I don't know of) having tattoos that are important to their culture.

[JohnsonJones]

In answer to the original question, many months late.

Most temples have an area where you can do this.  Some only have chairs, but some have desks or tables where you can sit and ponder (or write) if you wish to.  Obviously, you shouldn't write things holy to the temple, but you can write thoughts and other things as you ponder.  These are utilized many times by Temple workers as places to rest or meditate or relax at times, but they are also designed for patrons who wish to meditate or think beyond certain areas after their sessions, or to contemplate other aspects.  If you wish for one of these areas, mention it to one of the many Temple workers or even the presidency and ask if you may utilize one of them.

[Jane_Doe]

5 minutes ago, JohnsonJones said:

In answer to the original question, many months late.

Most temples have an area where you can do this.  Some only have chairs, but some have desks or tables where you can sit and ponder (or write) if you wish to.  Obviously, you shouldn't write things holy to the temple, but you can write thoughts and other things as you ponder.  These are utilized many times by Temple workers as places to rest or meditate or relax at times, but they are also designed for patrons who wish to meditate or think beyond certain areas after their sessions, or to contemplate other aspects.  If you wish for one of these areas, mention it to one of the many Temple workers or even the presidency and ask if you may utilize one of them.

Yes, I was told that originally many months back.  Frankly for me (someone who prays with a pen) this answer is being told "I'm sorry, you're forbidden to pray in the actual celestial room, but if you want to pray in the waiting lobby that ok."  It was VERY hurtful and really damaged my temple experience at first. 

[anatess2]

On 8/11/2017 at 10:27 PM, Jane_Doe said:

Now, your college lecture example is different in a number of basic ways.  For starters, rather than expressing you are receiving information.  Hence, you need to adapt to the way that information is being delivered. 

So is prayer.  If you're only expressing in your prayer and not receiving information from the Spirit, then something is missing.  Personally, I can receive info while I'm writing but my brain is too engaged in writing that my attention is not focused.  I can't pray and write at the same time.  The writing distracts me from the prayer.  Writing at the temple would also be distracting for me from my main focus of receiving promptings from the Spirit.  Reflecting on the experience by writing it down is of great value.  But I can do that outside the temple.  So, I guess what I'm saying is... I can't relate to your experience.

I say try to learn to pray without props.  It would become helpful if you find yourself stranded with Idris Elba on an icy mountain after a plane crash with nothing but your clothes on your back.  Staring at Idris can only be enjoyable for so long.  Eventually, you'll have to pray. 

 

Edited October 10, 2017 by anatess2

[Jane_Doe]

9 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

  Personally, I can receive info while I'm writing but my brain is too engaged in writing that my attention is not focused.  I can't pray and write at the same time.  The writing distracts me from the prayer.  Writing at the temple would also be distracting for me from my main focus of receiving promptings from the Spirit.  Reflecting on the experience by writing it down is of great value.  But I can do that outside the temple.  So, I guess what I'm saying is... I can't relate to your experience.

  The diversity amongst God's children is amazing.  As are the strides we take to understand each other and become one.