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Poor Man! Another Senseless Killing

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Guest LiterateParakeet
4 hours ago, beefche said:

BTW, I took the OP as highly sarcastic. I think Carb's true feelings are the opposite of what he posted initially.

I agree.  I could tell he was being sarcastic even before I read the article. :)  

The first time I read the article, I thought she came home and the stranger was in the BEDROOM with her sleeping child...in that situation, I would "aim for center mass"* and shoot.  As a rape survivor, there would be only one reason a stranger is in my child's room at night, and I would shoot to stop him.  

Reading it again, it seems like the children had been with her and they came home together and found a stranger in the house....honestly I don't know what my mama bear instincts would do then.  But the stranger better hope that my hands aren't shaking so badly that I accidentally shoot him in that case.  

I was surprised that someone called her actions "un-Christlike".  I disagree.  She was protecting her home and family.  Remember what Mormon said about Captain Moroni...who also defended his home and family.  

* I would "aim for center mass" because I'm not a good enough shot to try for an arm or leg even if I wanted to.  My intent would simply be to stop him in his tracks.  

Edited by LiterateParakeet

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8 hours ago, beefche said:

BTW, I took the OP as highly sarcastic. I think Carb's true feelings are the opposite of what he posted initially.

THANK YOU!!! Someone actually got it.  I cant' believe all you guys were criticizing me for my position as if I hadn't made my PRO-gun position quite clear on this site at least once or a 100 times.  Since when does a pro-gun person decry "gun violence"?

Edited by Guest

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1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

THANK YOU!!! Someone actually got it.  I cant' believe all you guys were criticizing me for my position as if I hadn't made my PRO-gun position quite clear on this site at least once or a 100 times.  Since when does a pro-gun person decry "gun violence"?

Hence, my post that states, my response to your OP was simply a sanity check...

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2 hours ago, Carborendum said:

THANK YOU!!! Someone actually got it.  I cant' believe all you guys were criticizing me for my position as if I hadn't made my PRO-gun position quite clear on this site at least once or a 100 times.  Since when does a pro-gun person decry "gun violence"?

My memory is not that good.

I just thought maybe you were insane.

Have I read any of your posts before?  Maybe I have, I don't know.

I think it would help if you were to use an animal avatar.  That way I could remember you as the elephant or the burro or something.  (I like burros)

I don't know if that would help me remember your posts tho'.

dc

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3 minutes ago, David13 said:

I just thought maybe you were insane.

Well, I am insane.  But that doesn't mean I want to take everyone's guns away.:D

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"But if you carry a gun and look for reasons to play Dirty Harry than congratulations. You are part of the problem."

Here's my hypothetical conversation I'll probably have some day:
Someone: "Why do you carry a gun?"
Me: "Self defense, and to scare off bears and signal for help if I ever break down out in the middle of nowhere."
Someone: "Self defense?  Why?  What do you expect to happen standing here today?"
Me: "Absolutely nothing.  Why, do you think something might happen?  Should we move to a safer location and continue the discussion?"

Interesting personal anecdote: From age 16 to my mid-30's, I've been, not a rude driver, not an aggressive driver, but let's just say very serious driver.  It's not something I was proud of.  I'd get personally invested in things.  I tried to change this about myself and failed for a long time.  When I started carrying, I noticed my driving habits changed overnight.  Not only that, but there was a sensation of "it ain't worth it" that just kept me from going there in the first place.   I have to slam on the brakes because Dood decided to cut in front of me to make that turn?  Well, he probably had somewhere to be.  I'm 10 minutes late and the old lady was slowing down before the stupid light even turned yellow?  Meh - it'll turn green again.   Carrying me = polite, patient, safer me.  It sort of surprised me.  Still does. 

 

"There's a troubling bloodthirsty feel to the idea that anyone who trespasses automatically forfeits their life no matter what their reason is for being there.  That's not a Christian attitude."

Oh, I don't think it's troubling, and I don't judge the Christian attitude behind it, but yeah, it may be sort of bloodthirsty.  That said, most serious gun owners I know are only interested in ending the threat, not killing someone.  It just so happens that the highest chances of quickly ending a threat involve the use of deadly force.   I know tazers and pepper spray and whatnot - I've seen them fail.  When someone invents a gizmo thing that makes someone not be a threat any more, and it's as reliable as my Glock, and will scare a bear away and signal for help, I will gladly switch.  Until then, yeah, a stranger standing in my daughter's bedroom may be met with deadly force until I'm satisfied he's no threat.  (See below)

 

"I don't want to have blood on my hands and have to explain to the Savior on the Day of Judgment that I took the life of one of my earthly brethren because he might have been in my home to steal my sweet SONY TV set..."

Oh yes indeed - carrying, for me, equals running through scenarios in my head, and asking myself specifically about whether I'd want to explain my actions to my Savior and Judge.  My stuff, my wallet, my car - it ain't worth it.  My life, my family?  You bet - I'll even look my Savior in the eye, and I have good reason to believe He'll be understanding.  It's all situational.  If we're sitting there and hear someone trying to bust in, there'll be all sorts of cop calling and yelling "we're armed - just go away!".  If we come home and a door is open and a car is in the driveway, we'll drive the heck the other way and call the cops.  If my family is somewhere else and I come home alone, I'll be less hair trigger.  If we come home and see a stranger passed out, or obviously not a threat, things'll probably be fine.  

 

"While she did not take the christlike route,..."

Yeah, that's an unrighteous judgement.  We don't know whether she did or not.  Christ talked about gathering swords and self defense.  The BoM is full of people practicing self-defense.  Our restoration history is full of people practicing self-defense.  Was Joseph not being Christlike when he fired on the mob at Carthage?

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Guest MormonGator
49 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Well, I am insane.  

Something I've thought for a long time now Carb. 

(Just playing!) 

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On 6/27/2016 at 2:31 PM, unixknight said:

There is absolutely no justifiable reason for a stranger to be in the kids' bedroom, so it's easy to imagine a serious threat is present. 

This.

As a Mother I can tell you there is a deep, undeniable, instinctive, overwhelming urge to protect my babies. I don't know what I would have done in that situation, I can only guess or 'say' I would have done this or that. And for the record, I did feel bad when I read the article (not here, I read it a couple days ago on my own) that it seems he was probably homeless and had squatted there before.  But again - as a Mother, it's a deep, natural feeling to instinctively protect my child.  And this is a stranger... a man... in her home. Her personal space. Her child's bedroom no less.

 

If you break into my home... I'm not going to take time to discuss it with you.  I'm going to protect my family, my home and myself. 

 

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On 6/28/2016 at 3:21 AM, LiterateParakeet said:

But the stranger better hope that my hands aren't shaking so badly that I accidentally shoot him in that case.

I chuckled in agreement when I read this.  Being perfectly honest, this would probably be me too... I have never had to be in that situation so I can only guess based on a couple other minor situations and I found no matter how 'ready' I thought I would be, I ended up being shook up by it more than I thought I would.  :)

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I don't own any firearms and my children are grown.  But I have 2 little granddaughters and 2 little grandsons.  If there were ever anything like what this woman experienced with her kids, I can't imagine myself gently trying to talk some stranger out of their room.  I'm a pacifist by nature and abhor violence.  But when you've broken in and you're hovering over my grandkids then I'm almost certainly going to go with assuming the worst about you.  

I don't know quite how this would play out and would hope for emergency promptings from the Spirit.. But barring any clear promptings to hold back and talk it through, I suspect my natural instincts would be to charge them without warning and ask questions only AFTER I feel sufficiently confident they are no longer a threat to my little ones.. once they've been subdued and/or forced to retreat from the room or the house.  I don't own any guns, but I have studied the martial arts for a few years and know enough about the frailties of the human body to know where at least some of the vulnerable spots are.  Hit fast.. Hit as hard as you can to the most vulnerable spots you can reach ... Eyes, throat, temple, groin.. If they're able to see you coming and square off to face you then don't do anything "Hollywood or action film" like attempting flashy kicks to the face or fists to the jaw.. Use low wing-chun style kicks to the knee or instep in an effort to quickly put them down and in agony so they can't get up again.  Then, if the kids haven't already fled the room, grab them and retreat, call 911 etc.

So.. If such a "defensive attack" succeeds, in many ways it's MUCH more violent and ugly than a quick gun shot or seven might turn out to be.  I don't fault any of my brothers or sisters who would rather try getting results with hardware instead of their fists and feet.  Nobody in their right mind ever hopes for an encounter like this.  But if it ever does happen, there are a lot of reasons most of you would probably prefer to be packing heat rather than to go hand to hand if it turns into a battle.  Me.. I have my own reasons why I choose not to presently own firearms but those might change in the coming years.  We'll see how the world goes...

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You can despise guns. That's your right.

You can disbelieve in God. That's your choice.

When someone breaks into your house at night, you will do two things:
1) Call a man with a gun
2) Pray he'll get there in time.

Lehi

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On 6/28/2016 at 10:42 PM, Blackmarch said:

While she did not take the christlike route, she was within the bounds of justice. 

She lacked the faith to cast out his demons in the traditional way, so she poked some holes and let them leak out.  

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