Whites more likely than blacks to be shot by police in violent crimes

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

@Backroads  are you on Facebook?  If so I recommend you follow Rodney Smith Jr, https://www.facebook.com/rjr.smith  or "like" his page "Raising Men Lawn Care".

He is the coolest guy.  Not only does he mow lawns for elderly and single moms for free...but even better, he is teaching and inspiring young men to do the same.  He has Raising Men Lawn Care shirts in different colors, and when a boy cuts a certain number of lawns he gets a new t-shirt in the color for that level.  It's powerful and his idea is growing and catching on even with boys who live in other states...

 

 

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

@Backroads here's another one that talks a little more about the boys....also on Facebook check out Humans of New York.  I can't find it right now, but he shared a really cool story a while back about a principal and the difference she is making in her school because she believes in her students and encourages them.  People he interviews often talk about others who strengthened and uplifted them.  You could also befriend me (if my "Liberal" ideas don't make you crazy, LOL!) I post positive things as often as I find them.  

 

 

Edited July 9, 2016 by LiterateParakeet

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

@LeSellers I wrote this for a class, but it addresses some of the issues you brought up.

What Nazi Germany Can Teach Us About Systemic Racism

Many high school students upon first learning about the Holocaust ask, “Why didn’t the Germans do something?  Why did they just allow that to happen?” A likely answer is the old cliché: they couldn’t see the forest for the trees.  They were too close to the situation to see clearly what was happening all around them.  They were busy simply dealing with their own daily lives, and believed the propaganda they were told by the government.  We are really not that different from them.  The similarity is seen in the current discussions about race, especially with police brutality. The Black Lives Matter movement has arisen to bring attention to this problem.  Those who oppose them point to black on black crime and ghettos and say blacks just need to get themselves out of those situations.  This is a grave misunderstanding.  The problem is it’s extremely difficult for black people to improve their circumstances educationally, financially, even emotionally due to systemic racism. 

Ghettos did not just naturally occur; they were created by racism.  From 1910 to 1970, six million blacks fled the Jim Crow South in search of a better life in the northern and western states.  Unfortunately, what they found was that even though it was more cleverly veiled, racism still existed in abundance.  All-white neighborhoods had drawn up covenants that prohibited home sales to blacks (even though the Supreme Court outlawed this practice in 1948.)  Some real-estate agents agreed not to show, sell or rent to black people.  Some banks and mortgage companies refused to grant mortgages to black homebuyers.  In 1951 in Chicago, Harvey E. Clark Jr., a black World War II veteran and graduate of Fisk University, managed to overcome these obstacles.  Even though Clark was harassed by the local Cicero police department, he and his family moved into the all-white apartment building on June 26.  On July 11, 1951 a mob of 4,000 whites gathered in the street outside their building.  Only 60 police officers responded and were not enough to contain the crowd who threw rocks through the windows and destroyed a bathtub, woodworks, doors, windows, plaster and set fire to the place.  This was not an isolated incident. Other black families that made their way into white neighborhoods had similar experiences.

Families, who now find themselves living in ghettos, need an education to get out, but for blacks the “school to prison pipeline” makes this crucial goal difficult - if not impossible.  The school-to-prison pipeline is a phrase referring to the practice of pushing kids (especially black children) out of school and toward the juvenile and criminal justice system.  The National Education Association (NEA) recognizes this is an issue and is working on solutions.  Explaining the problem the NEA says, “Consider the Maryland 7-year-old who was suspended in 2013 for chewing his Pop-Tart into the shape of a gun. Or the Michigan senior expelled in October for forgetting the pocketknife in her purse. Or the seven North Carolina teenagers who were arrested and charged with ‘disorderly conduct’ in 2013 for an end-of-the-year water balloon fight.”  The U.S. Department of Justice reports that Black students are suspended and expelled at a rate three times greater than White students, and Black and Latino students account for 70 percent of police referrals.  The Department of Justice ordered school districts to respond to misbehavior in “fair, and non-discriminatory” ways.

Another essential for escaping the gangs and drugs of the ghetto neighborhoods is to get a decent job, again blacks face discrimination in this area as well.  Dave Prager of Princeton University recently conducted a study that revealed that a white ex-con has a better chance of getting a job than a black man.  Prager says, “The young black men posing as job applicants in this study were bright college kids,

models of discipline and hard work; and yet, even in this best case scenario, these applicants were routinely overlooked simply on the basis of the color of their skin. The results of this study suggest that black men must work at least twice as hard as equally qualified whites simply to overcome the stigma of their skin color.”[ii] Another study shows that blacks must complete two more levels of education to have the same probability of getting employment as their white peers.

Lack of education and employment issues lead to stress and can exacerbate mental and emotional health issues.  Once again this is an area where blacks face discrimination.  Tené T. Lewis, an associate professor of epidemiology at Emory University Rollins School of Public Health in Atlanta, lead a review for the psychology review on this topic said, “If you are African-American or Latino and you present to the emergency room with a broken leg or a kidney stone, for example, you’re less likely to be given analgesics at the recommended level.”[iii] Dr. Amber Barnato, an associate professor of medicine and clinical and translational science at the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine, said that with black patient’s doctors were less likely to do little things that display empathy or built rapport. “For example, they would use more closed posture and they had their arms crossed, or had their hands in their pockets. They would stand further away from the bed,” Barnato says. “They would spend more time looking at the nurse or the monitor and less time touching the patient.”[iv]   Getting mental health care is also more difficult for blacks.  A recent study, published in the Journal of Health and Social Behavior, showed that mental health practioners are more likely to offer appointments to whites than to blacks.

Society all around us is full of examples of systemic racism, only a fraction of which have been covered in this paper.  So why is this?  Is it because whites are inherently racist?  I don’t think so.  I think like the Germans of Hitler’s time, they are simply oblivious most of the time to what is really going on around them.  Whites are often unconsciously and unintentionally biased against blacks by seeing blacks presented negatively in the media and by being taught white-washed history in school.  White-washed history meaning that they are not taught about the Great Migration when six million Blacks fled the Jim Crow South, so they don’t understand the history of ghettos and the aftermath that results.  The Germans were not evil, hateful people nor are the majority of today’s whites.  A solution to this problem is first to listen to each other.  When black people say they are being treated unfairly, a common response is, ‘Don’t play the race card.’  This response shuts down communication rather than furthering it.  So the first step is to listen to each other.  We need to learn from the Germans and not repeat their mistakes.  Desmond Tutu reminds us, “If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. If an elephant has its foot on the tail of a mouse and you say that you are neutral, the mouse will not appreciate your neutrality.”[v]

 

Flannery, M. E. (2015, January 05). The School-to-Prison Pipeline: Time to Shut it Down - NEA Today. Retrieved from http://neatoday.org/2015/01/05/school-prison-pipeline-time-shut/

[ii] Prager, D. (2008, August 9). Study: Black man and white felon – same chances for hire – CNN. Retrieved from http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/09/study-black-man-and-white-felon-same-chances-for-hire/

[iii] Schroeder, M. O. (2016, February 11). Racial Bias in Medicine Leads to Worse Care for Minorities. Retrieved from http://health.usnews.com/health-news/patient-advice/articles/2016-02-11/racial-bias-in-medicine-leads-to-worse-care-for-minorities

[iv] Schroeder, M. O. (2016, February 11). Racial Bias in Medicine Leads to Worse Care for Minorities.

[v] Desmond Tutu Peace Foundation - Quotable Desmond Tutu. (n.d.). Retrieved from http://www.tutufoundation-usa.org/exhibitions.html

 

Edited July 9, 2016 by LiterateParakeet

[Guest]

As if on cue.  This video was just published yesterday.

 

[LeSellers]

When we hear "This country needs an honest discussion on race!" the last thing the speaker wants is an honest discussion on race. What he wants is a podium to attack historic USA and demand that current USA give Blacks (and other minorities, but not Asians) lots more money.

The speaker will call anyone racist who brings up the fundamental differences among the races. It's okeh to mention that Blacks are, on average, taller than Whites and Asians. It's usually fine to note that Blacks have sickle cell anemia (but that's whitey's fault, at the base). But note that Blacks have a genetic tendency to (fill in the blank), even with over whelming proof, not merely evidence, but absolute proof, and the speaker goes ballistic and throw out the "racist" label. Even something as innocuous as Blacks tend to twin more often than Whites gets a racist rubric. Raising the topic of a controversial subject like the presence in Blacks of a specific gene that doubled (coming from both father and mother), coupled with Black men's having a higher levels of testosterone and Black mothers' using more violent discipline (especially with their sons) leads to (controversial, but irrefutable, topic removed), and one's whole life can be destroyed. Facts, truth, evidence or proof, none is shield against the charge of racism.

Racism is a charge that even the bravest fears above all else, including actual death. Racism is a charge against which there is no defense.

So, my first sentence stands: When we hear "This country needs an honest discussion on race!" that last thing the speaker wants is an honest discussion on race. And, even if he did, he'd reject the evidence because it's "racist".

Lehi

[LeSellers]

Read the whole thing. Here's the conclusion:

Quote

 

I am a liberal. I believe that those of us who are able to produce abundance have a moral duty to provide basic food, shelter, and medical care for those who cannot care for themselves. I believe we have this duty even to those who can care for themselves but don’t. This world view requires compassion and a willingness to act on it.

My experience has taught me that we live in a nation in which a jury is more likely to convict a black defendant who has committed a crime against a white. Even the dullest of blacks know this. There would be a lot more black-on-white crime if this were not the case.

However, my experience has also taught me that blacks are different by almost any measure to all other people. They cannot reason as well. They cannot communicate as well. They cannot control their impulses as well. They are a threat to all who cross their paths, black and non-black alike.

I do not know the solution to this problem. I do know that it is wrong to deceive the public. Whatever solutions we seek should be based on the truth rather than what we would prefer was the truth. As for myself, I will continue do my duty to protect the rights of all who need me.

 

I think he's wrong in many points. He's over generalizing. And he's looking at a small subset of the Black population: those who have court dates. But he does make one thing abundantly clear: Blacks and Whites (not to mention Asians) are different. Not everything is racism: the differences make a difference.

Enjoy,
Lehi
 

[Guest MormonGator]

On July 8, 2016 at 4:24 AM, LiterateParakeet said:

Ironically, I think everyone thinks that about those who disagree with them.  Myself included. 

Exactly. 

Lit I think even those who disagree with you admire you for your willingness and courage to think for yourself. 

[prisonchaplain]

IMHO, on a campus forum, level-heads would probably agree on a lot, here. There are some intended bad actors among our politicians and community leaders. They know that they are stirring up their bases to gain leverage, and do not worry much about the collateral damage (executed police, or killed/harmed protestors). Then there are those who are less intentionally, but follow these bad actors.  I don't talk about this subject in the aftermath of these kinds of events, in "unsafe places" like facebook, etc. Here the active audience is small, and we're pretty good about thoughtful posting.  This is such a bitter, hard matter.  :::sigh:::

[Guest MormonGator]

12 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

Here the active audience is small, and we're pretty good about thoughtful posting.  This is such a bitter, hard matter.  :::sigh:::

I totally agree with this. Everyone here brings a unique and interesting perspective including those (no, especially those) whom I disagree with. 

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

4 hours ago, Carborendum said:

As if on cue.  This video was just published yesterday.

Carb, it's a great video, but I can't imagine this is new to black folks.  Did you know that while you and I give our kids "the talk" about the birds and the bees, black parents give their children "the talk" like this.  Their "talk" is about how to survive an encounter with the police.  It so wrong that that is truth in America, Land of the "free".  

Did you see the video I posted for you? (I cant remember which thread it's in) The one where the black guy got shot because he reached for his wallet when the officer told him to? He was trying to be compliant, but implicit bias. . .

 

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

35 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

IMHO, on a campus forum, level-heads would probably agree on a lot, here. There are some intended bad actors among our politicians and community leaders. They know that they are stirring up their bases to gain leverage, and do not worry much about the collateral damage (executed police, or killed/harmed protestors). Then there are those who are less intentionally, but follow these bad actors.  I don't talk about this subject in the aftermath of these kinds of events, in "unsafe places" like facebook, etc. Here the active audience is small, and we're pretty good about thoughtful posting.  This is such a bitter, hard matter.  :::sigh:::

This is good advice.  I talk about this on Facebook and I think I have alienated my entire redneck family.  (It's okay that I call them that, rednecks are proud of being rednecks.  They are also hard core Trump fans, if that give you any idea.  LOL)

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

2 hours ago, MormonGator said:

Exactly. 

Lit I think even those who disagree with you admire you for your willingness and courage to think for yourself. 

 

Gator, you are the best!  Thanks!

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

Just saw this on Facebook...

Study Supports Suspicion That Police are More Likely to Use Force on Blacks

[prisonchaplain]

1 hour ago, LiterateParakeet said:

This is good advice.  I talk about this on Facebook and I think I have alienated my entire redneck family.  (It's okay that I call them that, rednecks are proud of being rednecks.  They are also hard core Trump fans, if that give you any idea.  LOL)

Trump and Clinton benefit from this environment. Many Republicans, who are tempted to not vote, may now vote for Trump, as a support for Blue Lives and law & order. Also, many whites are furious that they are once again presumed to all be racist, so as push-back against PC.  Clinton gains, because many blacks are also hesitant to vote for her. She's not so inspiring, many believe she is corrupt or untrustworthy. However, they sure don't want Trump and the racist police crowd, so they'll vote for her, rather than abstain.

I hate being so cynical in my early 50s! 

[prisonchaplain]

This link contains a statistic (it's #5) that I knew and had forgotten:  The rate of blacks BEING KILLED by cops is much lower than the rate of blacks KILLING cops. 40% of cop killings are done by blacks.  This does not justify racial profiling, or prejudice in the use of lethal force by trained law enforcement. It may give us some insight into the "why?" (as opposed to the obnoxious suggestion that cops are racist killers).

 

http://www.dailywire.com/news/7264/5-statistics-you-need-know-about-cops-killing-aaron-bandler

[LeSellers]

20 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

This does not justify racial profiling … by trained law enforcement.

Why not?

This aversion to common sense is pathetic. It's gonna get people killed. Oh, wait! It already  has.

Lehi

 

[Guest MormonGator]

26 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

This link contains a statistic (it's #5) that I knew and had forgotten:  The rate of blacks BEING KILLED by cops is much lower than the rate of blacks KILLING cops. 40% of cop killings are done by blacks.  This does not justify racial profiling, or prejudice in the use of lethal force by trained law enforcement. It may give us some insight into the "why?" (as opposed to the obnoxious suggestion that cops are racist killers).

 

http://www.dailywire.com/news/7264/5-statistics-you-need-know-about-cops-killing-aaron-bandler

If we have to understand minorities and their view of police officers-and we do-it helps to understand from the cops perceptive as well.  I can see why cops can get nervous. I agree with you PC, it doesn't justify racial profiling. 

[LeSellers]

7 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

I agree with you PC, it doesn't justify racial profiling. 

Again, why not?

Lehi

[Backroads]

5 minutes ago, LeSellers said:

Again, why not?

Lehi

How are we defining racial profiling? What will it look like?

 

[Guest MormonGator]

Something else that needs to be said is that we are all praying for your daily safety Mirkwood. All of us here without question should be/are doing it. 

And as someone who is in the trenches we should be giving your opinion more merit than ours. 

How do you do that mentioning thing here? 

Edited July 9, 2016 by MormonGator

[LeSellers]

2 minutes ago, Backroads said:

How are we defining racial profiling? What will it look like?

It's the term from the Left, not mine. They who coined it should define it.

It's just "taboo", and no one is willing to defend it. It's just "the way it is".

That said, the Israelis have been profiling for decades, and they haven't had any airliners hijacked lately.

Lehi

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

@MormonGator you use the at symbol, see it there at the beginning of your name...then type the first couple letters. A menu should pop up with a list of names. Click on the one you want. 

You have to click on one of the names not just type it, or it doesn't work. If you did it right the name will be highlighted.

I agree we should all pray for @mirkwood. I will join you.

[Guest MormonGator]

3 minutes ago, LiterateParakeet said:

@MormonGator you use the at symbol, see it there at the beginning of your name...then type the first couple letters. A menu should pop up with a list of names. Click on the one you want. 

You have to click on one of the names not just type it, or it doesn't work. If you did it right the name will be highlighted.

I agree we should all pray for @mirkwood. I will join you.

Thanks @LiterateParakeet! You were the first one I mentioned! Feel very honored! Take a bow! 

Edited July 9, 2016 by MormonGator

[LeSellers]

Then, there's this from the Canada Free Press:

Quote

[David Clarke, the Sheriff of Milwaukee County, Wisconsin] cited “a study done by Dr. Timothy Johnson of Toledo University…” that invalidates the widespread claim that police officers practice racial discrimination. He said the study found that twice as many white men “…are killed in police use of force situations” than black men.

“There is no research, there is not one bit of research or data that supports their lie—which is why I call them ‘Black Lies’—their lie about police use of force in the United States of America.”

Sheriff Clarke calls Black Lives Matter a “hate group,” saying, “These are nothing more than riot makers and they stoke up bitterness and resentment in people; and they use the police as a distraction from the staggering failure of liberal politicians in these large urban areas where these ghettos are contained.”

Comparing Chicago’s crime-ridden culture of death to “… some war-torn, sub-Sahara African nation that’s constantly under civil war with a tribal mentality,” Sheriff Clarke confronted the movement’s passivity on this issue.

“Where is Black Lies Matter? If they cared about the lives of black people they would be marching against the liberal establishment in these large urban areas and demanding a better quality of life and a better way of life. But no, that’s not what they’re doing. They’re instead using the police as a straw man…”

Again, it's the differences that make a difference, not racism.

Lehi

Edited July 9, 2016 by LeSellers

[Just_A_Guy]

Just got back from a family vacation where I was out of internet service for five days.  

By the look of the reaction to this Dallas thing in media and on my Facebook feed, apparently the shooting--while tragic--is a grim reminder that police officers do tend to wear awfully short skirts.