Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 (edited) http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/boy-scouts-ends-policy-barring-transgender-boys-programs-article-1.2960021 I was never a scout as a kid, but I know the church is involved with them. I'd rather take a shotgun blast to the stomach than go camping and I don't have kids... so I don't have a dog in this fight...thoughts anyone? Edited January 31, 2017 by MormonGator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirkwood Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 Yep, my son will not be attending any BSA sponsored scout camps. unixknight 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 3 minutes ago, mirkwood said: Yep, my son will not be attending any BSA sponsored scout camps. This might be the end of the Boy Scouts. But I thought allowing gays would be, so what do I know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unixknight Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 The problem is this: An 8 year old transgendered? That's absolutely disgusting, and represents a catastrophic parenting failure. Are my words too strong? Nope. We don't let people decide whether to drink until they're 21. We don't let people vote until they're 18. We don't let people operate a car until they're 16 (and that only in some states). We don't let people consent to sex until they're around 16 and that has limits. But we're going to trust the life experience of a 6 year old (according to the article, the child in this example was 8 but had "transitioned" 2 years prior.) to decide to just change sex? By the way, if they do any surgery or hormone treatments that kid's sterile for life. But totally cool because it supports today's modern, gender bending culture. I'm deeply disappointed in the BSA over this, because supporting child transgenderism is, in my view, the same as supporting child sexual abuse. It sexualizes a child in order to satisfy the "progressive" views of the parents, and is NOT in the best interest of the child. If this kid is legitimately a boy trapped in a girl's body then she can sort that out when she's old enough to make decisions and understand the consequences, presumably around 18. The BSA shouldn't even have to be involved. a mustard seed, yjacket, Backroads and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 (edited) 21 minutes ago, unixknight said: The problem is this: An 8 year old transgendered? That's absolutely disgusting, and represents a catastrophic parenting failure. Are my words too strong? Nope. We don't let people decide whether to drink until they're 21. We don't let people vote until they're 18. We don't let people operate a car until they're 16 (and that only in some states). We don't let people consent to sex until they're around 16 and that has limits. But we're going to trust the life experience of a 6 year old (according to the article, the child in this example was 8 but had "transitioned" 2 years prior.) to decide to just change sex? By the way, if they do any surgery or hormone treatments that kid's sterile for life. But totally cool because it supports today's modern, gender bending culture. I'm deeply disappointed in the BSA over this, because supporting child transgenderism is, in my view, the same as supporting child sexual abuse. It sexualizes a child in order to satisfy the "progressive" views of the parents, and is NOT in the best interest of the child. If this kid is legitimately a boy trapped in a girl's body then she can sort that out when she's old enough to make decisions and understand the consequences, presumably around 18. The BSA shouldn't even have to be involved. I'm a big supporter of gay rights, but- I agree 100%, for what little it's worth. An eight year old deciding they are "transgender"? Are you kidding me? Edited January 31, 2017 by MormonGator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackmarch Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 59 minutes ago, MormonGator said: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/boy-scouts-ends-policy-barring-transgender-boys-programs-article-1.2960021 I was never a scout as a kid, but I know the church is involved with them. I'd rather take a shotgun blast to the stomach than go camping and I don't have kids... so I don't have a dog in this fight...thoughts anyone? Comes hand in hand with homosexuality nowadays. Gotta love equality laws.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Osborn Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 I am a Scoutmaster in my local ward. I was previously a Scoutmaster in my old ward. I have watched it all unfold over the years when the BSA used to stand for something honorable. It greatly disappoints me to be associated with an organization that no longer represents my views. I didnt sign up to be a part of the LGBT scouts of America!!! Backroads and Blackmarch 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a mustard seed Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 I never understood why they couldn't just make their own club in the first place(back when it was a gay issue). It felt like a woman demanding entry into a hunting lodge "man's club". Why? Starting a new club seemed a no-brainer because then they could set their own standards and rules. Child transgenderism is an example of sexual grooming in children. They dont have(and shouldnt have) a clear concept of genitals and bodies until pubescence because that is when those parts actually start to "mean" something naturally. Even then the hormones are in a state of flux and some people dont achieve a full balance until 20. Knowing with a concrete certainty that the body feels a certain way and is not just in the mode of "changing" is impossible until those changes have stopped. If they havent even begun, then those ideas are flights of fantasy and whims as children often play and grow out of. If they are more serious than that then you have to question where this indepth inoweldge of sexuality and gender came from and seek help for them. Anddenex, Blackmarch, unixknight and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, a mustard seed said: I never understood why they couldn't just make their own club in the first place(back when it was a gay issue). It felt like a woman demanding entry into a hunting lodge "man's club". Why? Starting a new club seemed a no-brainer because then they could set their own standards and rules. So true! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backroads Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 I'm glad I no longer work for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 Still waiting for the Church to come out with their own program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane_Doe Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 38 minutes ago, Carborendum said: Still waiting for the Church to come out with their own program. I have no doubt it'll happen. I think it'll be for the best. a mustard seed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windseeker Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 I'm an eternal life scout with a project to go and really tried to make it up with my youngest son. I was shocked when I attended Scout Camp and there were girls everywhere. While it was surprising I didn't have a problem with it until my son's swimming class. There were about 30 boys and one girl in the class and the instructor (18-20 year old) literally had his back on the entire class while focused on the girl. The boys were all in various states of not doing as he was instructing (could have been drowning for all he cared) while he ignored all of them the entire class time while working with this girl who seemed to enjoy the attention. It was then I saw the writing on the wall. The inmates are running the asylum. (Don't get me wrong..I probably would have loved it when I was a Scout and can imagine all the trouble I would have gotten in). Now top it off with this..how are they going to deny girls that say they identify as boys? Jane_Doe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anatess2 Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 (edited) It's not clear to me how they determine transgendered. They don't require physical proof or some such. Basically, if you feel like a dude, go sign up for the Boy Scouts. Okay, I am the first daughter after 2 older brothers. I've always resented that I was not allowed to do stuff that my brothers do - I wasn't allowed to wear jeans, I wasn't allowed to ride a boy's bike, I was not allowed to go anywhere without my brothers, I was not allowed so many things. I wanted to be a boy sooooooooo bad I even peed standing up just to show my brothers I can do it. My sister was born 3 years after me and she's a weakling. She does nothing but stay home with my mother. Anyway, I would have signed that stupid BSA application form and put MALE in big bold letters and join in on their fun. So, I guess I'm what the BSA considers transgender. Edited January 31, 2017 by anatess2 Jane_Doe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Osborn Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 The big problem is that now no one can question a girl who wants to join. They may not even be what can be defined as trasgender, they can be completely female in every respect but if they choose to identify at that moment, for whatever reason, as a boy, no one can question it and they cannot be denied membership. This is a cultural pressure issue the BSA should have never caved into. I know the church, in their chartered organizations will not allow transgendered children in their own chartered groups so it will be intetesting to see how the church handles this latest issue. Jane_Doe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 So the overall trend I'm seeing from the replies is that everyone is pretty cool with the Scouts allowing transgender kids in, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anatess2 Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 53 minutes ago, MormonGator said: So the overall trend I'm seeing from the replies is that everyone is pretty cool with the Scouts allowing transgender kids in, right? You are awesome, MG. This wins the internet today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightSG Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 18 hours ago, MormonGator said: I agree 100%, for what little it's worth. An eight year old deciding they are "transgender"? Are you kidding me? It's interesting how we used to tell people "be yourself," but now we tell them "make up whatever you want to be, regardless of reality." mirkwood and a mustard seed 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 5 minutes ago, NightSG said: It's interesting how we used to tell people "be yourself," but now we tell them "make up whatever you want to be, regardless of reality." To be fair, I'm sympathetic to adults doing pretty much anything they want. If I can change my religion, leave my home country and "create" my life than you should be allowed to change your gender, even if I personally think it's not moral. But I draw the line at a minor doing it, just because they don't know what they are doing. It's much to big a life choice for an eight year old to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightSG Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 Just now, MormonGator said: To be fair, I'm sympathetic to adults doing pretty much anything they want. If I can change my religion, leave my home country and "create" my life than you should be allowed to change your gender, even if I personally think it's not moral. I draw a very hard line when they expect me to "accept" it, which to them means endorse and celebrate it. All too often, it also means pay for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, NightSG said: I draw a very hard line when they expect me to "accept" it, which to them means endorse and celebrate it. All too often, it also means pay for it. We agree totally on that, 100%. You don't have to accept it anymore than they have to accept your view-and you sure as heck should never have to pay for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just_A_Guy Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 Here is an article with BSA commissioner Charles Dahlquist. Dahlquist was also YM General President until relatively recently. So it sounds like the Chirch is on board with this BSA policy change. https://voiceofscouting.org/national-commissioner-charles-dahlquist-transgender-policy-change Backroads 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 5 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said: Here is an article with BSA commissioner Charles Dahlquist. Dahlquist was also YM General President until relatively recently. So it sounds like the Chirch is on board with this BSA policy change. https://voiceofscouting.org/national-commissioner-charles-dahlquist-transgender-policy-change Do you know if the Scouts will even be here in twenty years? Not an insult, I just don't think it's as popular as it was in the past. Parents might pull their kids out with this latest ruling, so I'm not sure it'l help enrollment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 1 minute ago, MormonGator said: Do you know if the Scouts will even be here in twenty years? Not an insult, I just don't think it's as popular as it was in the past. Parents might pull their kids out with this latest ruling, so I'm not sure it'l help enrollment. I'm keeping my boys in only because it is still the activity arm of the YM. But I'm not giving any money to FOS or anything other than is what is minimally required to have activities. I'm seriously considering ending all our involvement with scouting soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted January 31, 2017 Report Share Posted January 31, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Carborendum said: I'm keeping my boys in only because it is still the activity arm of the YM. But I'm not giving any money to FOS or anything other than is what is minimally required to have activities. I'm seriously considering ending all our involvement with scouting soon. Everyone-do NOT take this as an insult. Growing up the Scouts were considered :: gasp :: sort of uncool and old fashioned. Think Bart Simpson in the episode where he has to join them. I know of two people who I grew up who were Scouts and um...they got beaten up more than I did! Edited January 31, 2017 by MormonGator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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