Windows 10 inspired me to move to a Linux operating system


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On 5/3/2017 at 11:11 PM, Still_Small_Voice said:

I am now using 64-bit Linux Mint version 17 as my main operating system and I am quite impressed with the improvements that have been made with the software in the last few years.

Xubuntu here, and the only minor annoyance has been not remembering things that used to be second nature before I spent five years making a living with SketchUp and was therefore stuck with having at least one Windows system around at all times.

It's almost unnerving how much faster some fairly large apps load.  No time to take a drink or adjust my mousepad.

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  • 11 months later...

I thought this was a reason to raise this thread back to life.  The below are some 2018 September statistics of what personal computers are on the Internet and what operating system is being used:

Windows    81.76%
Macintosh Operating System  13.49%
Unknown    1.99%
Linux Operating System  1.68%
Chrome Operating System 1.08%

From what I remember in the past Windows used have about 90% of the marketshare.  I think Windows 10 is taking it's toll.  I am still using 64-bit Linux Mint and Windows 7.

Edited by Still_Small_Voice
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Since the last discussion I had to install, etc., Linux (I went with Xubuntu, thought I tried out several flavors) for work.

After several weeks of that I'd had enough and have swapped back to Windows. Yes...I had to set up my own "WAMP" environment because work would only support LAMP. Whoopty. Took about 5 minutes with Laragon. Everything has been better since. So many fewer problems.

Edited by The Folk Prophet
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I am in the process of saving for a new central processing unit.  I would like to get the Intel Core i7 6600K processor.  This will enable me to not have to get a new motherboard for hopefully another 4.5 years or longer.  I have 64-bit Windows 7 and Linux Mint 18.3 on two separate hard drives.  I just switch the hard drive priority in my basic input output system when I want to switch operating systems.  Only thing I really like to use Windows 7 for is video gaming.  The main video games I play are a racing similator called GTR2 with a steering wheel and foot pedals and Defense of the Ancient 2 (D.o.T.A. 2).

Everything else pretty much I like to do on my computer is with Linux Mint 18.3.  I also like to play the Deal or No Deal gameshow video game with Linux.

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Most of the whining people did about Windows became invalid when Windows 7 was released. If Win 7/10 is not as rock-solid as your favorite Linux flavor, it's plenty close enough for almost all use today. I daresay it's as solid as MacOS, which is built on Linux. I have been using a Macbook for the last six months or so, and it's fine. I like it. But I don't like it any better than a good laptop running Win 10. My IT friends say that Windows servers, including Win10 servers, run just fine and on the whole aren't any more of a pain to configure than Linux boxes. They seem to hold the MacOS in some disdain, though I'm not quite sure why.

If you don't like Windows because you think the UI is ugly, then whatever. Being the non-IT, non-computer-nerdy guy that I am, I doubt there is a significant difference in performance or reliability between Windows 10 and *nix Flavor-O'-The-Month. True Believers are welcome to educate me.

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In my research I discovered you do not really control most Windows 10 computers.  Windows 10 does four annoying things. 

First, it's a telemetry gathering platform for Microsoft. Microsoft slurps up huge amounts of data direct from within the operating system core. It helps them make an accurate picture of the user allowing them to monetize them in various ways. 

Second, it's designed as a portal to push the user into Microsoft services. Many things within Windows 10 (OneDrive, Groove, Microsoft Store et cetera) all nudge users into these services. 

Third, Windows 10 is an ad platform. Advertisements are injected into various parts of the system in order to extract money from the user.

Fourth, most versions of Windows 10 push automatic software updates to your computer.  This cannot be shut off short of doing hacks or making modifications to the operating system.   The software updates may do the following:
* Twice per year you may need to re-install software deemed not required by Microsoft that they may remove
* Your preferences (including privacy settings) may be be reset to default, so you'll need to go through them regularly to change them again.
* Some Metro applications may be re-installed if you deleted them previously. 
* Expect your group policy settings and tweaks to be completely removed or changed and the only way to get them back is to change to Windows 10 Enterprise.

Edited by Still_Small_Voice
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On 5/9/2017 at 7:56 AM, The Folk Prophet said:

Just out of curiosity, what kind of software can you run (is even available) on a Linux operating system? I've heard praise for Linux systems for years and yet...the primary reason I run a computer is to run the software on said computer. I know that most of that software is unavailable on Linux.

It strikes me that having a really great operating system doesn't do much good if nothing runs on it.

So am I mistaken?

Most popular applications have a Linux equivalent, e.g. IE doesn't run native on Linux but Firefox does, Open Office is the equivalent to MS Office, etc.  But where the pedal hits the metal really is in the gaming world.  There's just not that many Linux users to justify coding a game to work on Linux.  But, no worries.  You can run any Windows application on Linux by running it through a windows compatibility layer software.  Several freeware out that does this.  WINE is the most popular.

 

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17 hours ago, Vort said:

Most of the whining people did about Windows became invalid when Windows 7 was released. If Win 7/10 is not as rock-solid as your favorite Linux flavor, it's plenty close enough for almost all use today. I daresay it's as solid as MacOS, which is built on Linux. I have been using a Macbook for the last six months or so, and it's fine. I like it. But I don't like it any better than a good laptop running Win 10. My IT friends say that Windows servers, including Win10 servers, run just fine and on the whole aren't any more of a pain to configure than Linux boxes. They seem to hold the MacOS in some disdain, though I'm not quite sure why.

If you don't like Windows because you think the UI is ugly, then whatever. Being the non-IT, non-computer-nerdy guy that I am, I doubt there is a significant difference in performance or reliability between Windows 10 and *nix Flavor-O'-The-Month. True Believers are welcome to educate me.

I have Windows 7 Pro on my work puter.  Edict from on high not to upgrade any higher than that.  The problems with Windows 8/10 is not the UI or the efficiency.  It's the restrictions on Enterprise Management.  This is also the reason why most corporate IT guys don't like MacOS.

For a personal puter, it may not matter to most people.  It would matter a great deal to those who hate MacOS or those who like Linux - the ones who want complete control of their operating systems.

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4 hours ago, anatess2 said:

Most popular applications have a Linux equivalent, e.g. IE doesn't run native on Linux but Firefox does, Open Office is the equivalent to MS Office, etc.  But where the pedal hits the metal really is in the gaming world.  There's just not that many Linux users to justify coding a game to work on Linux.  But, no worries.  You can run any Windows application on Linux by running it through a windows compatibility layer software.  Several freeware out that does this.  WINE is the most popular.

 

Why on earth would I want to do that?

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On 11/29/2018 at 1:25 PM, Vort said:

If you don't like Windows because you think the UI is ugly, then whatever. Being the non-IT, non-computer-nerdy guy that I am, I doubt there is a significant difference in performance or reliability between Windows 10 and *nix Flavor-O'-The-Month. True Believers are welcome to educate me.

There's one huge + point with Linux, well open source software. The source code is available so you can tweak it for unique needs. For your typical desktop user this is meaningless. For a guy building a robotic device that needs an OS but he doesn't want to build one from scratch it's a heaven send.

Linux kernels beat at the heart of everything from single board computers to the world's most powerful supercomputer specifically because of this aspect. You can roll it your own way.

I personally spend 98% of my computing time at home on a Linux station, at work our workstations are win7, because I've used it (Linux) for so long and am used to it and I get frustrated when I go to windows and try to do tasks there.

 

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On 11/30/2018 at 9:20 AM, anatess2 said:

Whoa!!!  Did you use it for architecture/interior design or did you use it for game design?  I can spend hours on youTube watching sketchup videos.

Steel building design. Its component handling makes that sort of construction modeling quick and easy.  Create components for all the common structural members, then just push/pull to length and assemble. 

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On 11/30/2018 at 2:10 PM, The Folk Prophet said:

Why on earth would I want to do that?

Because you're a developer/ethusiast/hobbyist.  Or you're just tired of the crap MicroSoft produces because they don't have much competition to encourage them to do better.  Kinda like putting up with Google crap because there's not much of another choice.

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28 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

Because you're a developer

I am...and I still see no reason to use Linux. Windows works beautifully for my work.

28 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

Or you're just tired of the crap MicroSoft produces because they don't have much competition to encourage them to do better. 

I wouldn't argue that MS isn't full of problems. But two points. 1. None of them are severe enough to justify running Windows programs through comparability layer software instead of just running them in Windows in the first place. 2. There are distinct advantages to the size of MS and how many people use it...particularly businesses. Yes, there is complacency on one side. There's also the distinct reality that MS, overall, works.

One might compare Toyota or Honda to some fringe Mom -n- Pop car maker as an example. (Not that MS quality compares directly to Toyota's...but, still...) Point being...smaller means less quality control...less responsive to customers, etc. Yes, I know, the Open Source world isn't the same thing...kind of the point of open source...if you don't like something, fix it yourself, etc... But who wants to do that unless they're an enthusiast/hobbiest (I am not). The fact is that when something doesn't generate revenue to keep the makers in business, the makers aren't motivated by sales to fix it or lose sales.

I had every bit as much trouble (and more) with the various flavors and versions of Linux I worked with as I've ever had with Windows -- literally to the point where I abandoned it in frustration.

So...*shrug*...color me unconvinced. ;)

Edited by The Folk Prophet
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On 11/29/2018 at 4:40 PM, Still_Small_Voice said:

In my research I discovered you do not really control most Windows 10 computers.  Windows 10 does four annoying things. 

First, it's a telemetry gathering platform for Microsoft. Microsoft slurps up huge amounts of data direct from within the operating system core. It helps them make an accurate picture of the user allowing them to monetize them in various ways. 

Second, it's designed as a portal to push the user into Microsoft services. Many things within Windows 10 (OneDrive, Groove, Microsoft Store et cetera) all nudge users into these services. 

Third, Windows 10 is an ad platform. Advertisements are injected into various parts of the system in order to extract money from the user.

Fourth, most versions of Windows 10 push automatic software updates to your computer.  This cannot be shut off short of doing hacks or making modifications to the operating system.   The software updates may do the following:
* Twice per year you may need to re-install software deemed not required by Microsoft that they may remove
* Your preferences (including privacy settings) may be be reset to default, so you'll need to go through them regularly to change them again.
* Some Metro applications may be re-installed if you deleted them previously. 
* Expect your group policy settings and tweaks to be completely removed or changed and the only way to get them back is to change to Windows 10 Enterprise.

I don't really care about telemetry much as long as they don't steal passwords and personal data

I have never had an app need to be reinstalled.   No complaints, nothing.

Have no idea what a metro app is

I have no group policy settings and tweaks.

I see zero ads coming through the OS.  Zero.

My computer is 10 years old.  runs a core 2 duo processor.  I upgraded to an SSD and a newer graphics card.  And with that, the computer runs just as snappy as my work computer with an I7 processor.  It can't do video editing as fast, but for internet browsing, office type stuff, etc..  it is smooth as butter.

I have tried linux and didn't have an issue with it, but it can be a pain in the butt to get some programs loaded and running when compared to windows.

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Just now, The Folk Prophet said:

I am...and I still see no reason to use Linux. Windows works beautifully for my work.

I wouldn't argue that MS isn't full of problems. But two points. 1. None of them are severe enough to justify running Windows programs through comparability layer software instead of just running them in Windows in the first place. 2. There are distinct advantages to the size of MS and how many people use it...particularly businesses. Yes, there is complacency on one side. There's also the distinct reality that MS, overall, works.

One might compare Toyota or Honda to some fringe Mom -n- Pop car maker as an example. (Not that MS quality compares directly to Toyota's...but, still...) Point being...smaller means less quality control...less responsive to customers, etc. Yes, I know, the Open Source world isn't the same thing...kind of the point of open source...if you don't like something, fix it yourself, etc... But who wants to do that unless they're an enthusiast/hobbiest (I am not). The fact is that when something is free, the makers aren't motivated by sales to fix it or lose sales.

I had every bit as much trouble (and more) with the various flavors and versions of Linux I worked with as I've ever had with Windows -- literally to the point where I abandoned it in frustration.

So...*shrug*...color me unconvinced. ;)

It's a matter of principle.  It's the exact same issue between developing in iOS versus Android.

 

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12 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

You're going to have to explain that.

The difference between iOS and Android is the comparatively lack of freedom in iOS due to iOS "lock downs".  Now, iOS does this because of the Jobs paradigm of treating the computer as an appliance (I call it that because I have a feeling that now that Jobs is gone, Apple is going to abandon that paradigm and end up failing like they did before... there's plenty of evidence for that in iPhone X).

MicroSoft doesn't have that same paradigm and it became a sideshow to expect Windows to fail at something during unveiling and it became the MicroSoft norm to release a buggy product then fix the bugs as an "upgrade".  But they're trying to change that now because of all the security problems they've been having that cost them a lot of money.  So they're trying to "backdoor" their own version of a Jobs paradigm where instead of locking down the OS, they Big Brother your enterprise and vacuum info for their analysis then force an upgrade into the OS into your Enterprise.  It's stupid.  And, of course, they locked down the OS in as much as, you can't modify certain aspects of the OS itself.

The beauty of Linux is the freedom to develop anything without having Big Brother watch over you.  And, if  you don't like the way the OS handles certain things, you can always surgically modify the OS itself.

Edited by anatess2
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7 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

Perhaps. But not so meaningful to me and my work.

I edited my post above.

In any case, like I said... it is for certain people.  My paying job uses Windoze.  My house runs on MacOS/iOS.  And we have several Linux machines like... the system that I started to build but abandoned (just no time to mess with it some more) that controls the chicken coop and some other hobbyist projects like that.  It's too much of a hassle and can run expensive to do hobbyist projects in Windows and MacOS.  Much easier on Linux because you can tinker with the OS to control certain oddball devices.  I guess you can say, if you were the kid who went straight to the back of a RadioShack, you would have Linux.

Edited by anatess2
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