Church dropping Scouting program


pam
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7 hours ago, JohnsonJones said:

Now this is a separate issue, so I'm making a separate post.  If your Young Men's leader feels camping every weekend is something they need to do, that is their prerogative.  However, this isn't addressing this, it is addressing the Young men's issue.  I'll relate from many years ago when I was a Young Man.

Though the programs have changed since I was a kid, I went to state in several sports, was noted in stringed instruments, supported my teams and orchestra, was also in the Latin Club and Chess team as well as fencing, and still was an active participant in the Young Men's program. 

I do not know your circumstances, but I know I was a very busy guy as a young man, more than MOST who try to claim that they are so busy with sports that they can not do Young Men's.  It boils down to what the youth and their parents feel is important.  If one feels Young Men's is important, they will DO Young Men's.  If they do not...they won't.  I did football, soccer and track, and yes, there were some times meets were on Wednesday nights (the evening our ward did Young Men's when I was growing up), but it wasn't always.  Football was only 10 games a season at the time (so EVERY Friday night during that time), but it wasn't year round. 

I don't know you or your son's situation.  I know in general (not you specifically, I've been normally talking in general, instead of specifics because I do not know YOUR situation or specific situations as they differ from each other...and who knows, maybe there is an exception) MORMONS USE THESE EXCUSES and they are just that...excuses...of why they cannot be a part of the Young Men's program...and many other things.  Why they cannot go to the temple, why they cannot clean the church, why they cannot go to sunday school, relief society, or why they cannot even attend church.  Most of it is simply due to their own choice.

You are absolutely correct in it is what we place as a priority in life.  When I was a Young man I supported my sports teams.  I went to practice and I went to meets and games.  I was extremely busy.   However, it was also a priority to be a 4 year seminary graduate (and with how late meets and practices sometimes went and me going to early Morning seminary, sometimes I question how smart a goal that was as I slept through a LOT of it, but I DID accomplish that goal), it was a priority to participate in Young Mens (and if there was a Venture program back then, which there wasn't, I would have been participating in it I believe), and it was a priority to participate in the church in general. 

Those priority's still are part of my life today.  What we make as a priority in our early years, normally become what we have as a priority later in life.  We can change, but many do not.  Many do NOT put a priority in the Young Men's and Young Woman's programs these days, and we see how that reflects our inactives and actives among Young Single Adults later.  I am not really accusing you of anything (except maybe gross misunderstanding of the Venture program), as I do not know your situation.  But I DO know about the situation regarding the Young Single Adults in the LDS church in general right now, and what the probable causes are, and the situation is pretty darn grim.

I do hear that we are doing better than many OTHER religions and churches currently in retaining our youth to young single adults...but at the same time that isn't so much encouraging, as simply realizing how bad it is for other religions if their retention rates are worse then ours.

Its like we are not even speaking the same language...  So this is going to be as simple as I can make it.  Its about having enough hours in the day to get everything done.  Now I gave and example of a weekly activities (mutual night) and monthly activities.  I gave camping as an example of a monthly (not weekly) weekend activity, but you can replace that with any other type of activity you want it doesn't change the underling issue.  Young Men's activities require time and if the Young man has even a bit of interest in things outside of church then the time requirements are likely to come into conflict.

You claim I do not understand the venture/varsity programs... and maybe I don't.  But I understand time conflicts well enough.  The only way the venture/varsity programs will not be part of time conflicts is if they take no time...  And if they take no time then what good are they?

The moment they take the young man's time it becomes inevitable that there will be a time conflict at some point, and some one will have to make a hard call on what does not get done.

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3 hours ago, estradling75 said:

Its like we are not even speaking the same language...  So this is going to be as simple as I can make it.  Its about having enough hours in the day to get everything done.  Now I gave and example of a weekly activities (mutual night) and monthly activities.  I gave camping as an example of a monthly (not weekly) weekend activity, but you can replace that with any other type of activity you want it doesn't change the underling issue.  Young Men's activities require time and if the Young man has even a bit of interest in things outside of church then the time requirements are likely to come into conflict.

You claim I do not understand the venture/varsity programs... and maybe I don't.  But I understand time conflicts well enough.  The only way the venture/varsity programs will not be part of time conflicts is if they take no time...  And if they take no time then what good are they?

The moment they take the young man's time it becomes inevitable that there will be a time conflict at some point, and some one will have to make a hard call on what does not get done.

Yes, time conflicts happen.  That can be a very difficult thing.  I can understand how people have these difficulties and I can sympathize.  The LDS church is a very involved church and religion.  At least we can be grateful that it isn't expected that we live the law of consecration still (then the church basically owns us...all we have and all our time) as of yet.

They can be difficult choices.  Russell M. Nelson talked a little about this type of conflict in his talk recently at General Conference

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2017/04/drawing-the-power-of-jesus-christ-into-our-lives?lang=eng

But that doesn't address that issue and actually has the gospel taking more time for those young adults that follow it (though I feel there are rewards for those that do).

We have other examples of those who chose sports and various areas (Steve Young is one that many idolize that focused on sports and became a Mormon icon) as their way forward.

Life is full of difficult choices and time management is part of it.  I only hope that our Young Men attain a strong testimony and remain strong in the church.  I also hope the same for our Young Women.

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  • pam unfeatured this topic
  • 2 months later...
On 5/19/2017 at 2:17 PM, JohnsonJones said:

Yes.  I was going to go on a Scout Campout recently and told the Scout master I'd bring a set of my Laser tag system (I have a complete Laser tag system with two groups of six guns each for two teams) which I thought the boys would enjoy.  He informed me that scouts could not point things like that at each other.  I was surprised by that update of a system.

I got a fast (slightly less than a second, assuming gravity remained constant - hard to tell in free fall) lesson in how to do a cannonball in the dark from running off a 12' high riverbank while playing full moon paintball during a Scout campout.  Didn't get hit, though.

I think that was the same campout where I was rather rudely awakened at sunrise by a hereford cow bellowing at the fact my tent was set up in the middle of her usual path to the water.

Edited by NightSG
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