The War in Heaven


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JST of the verses.

4 And again, ye shall say unto them, Why is it that thou beholdest the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

5 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and canst not behold a beam in thine own eye?

6 And Jesus said unto his disciples, Beholdest thou the scribes, and the Pharisees, and the priests, and the Levites? They teach in their synagogues, but do not observe the law, nor the commandments; and all have gone out of the way, and are under sin.

7 Go thou and say unto them, Why teach ye men the law and the commandments, when ye yourselves are the children of corruption?

8 Say unto them, Ye hypocrites, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.

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15 hours ago, yjacket said:

Ah the modern world. Only believe the scriptures verses that support what you want to believe.....the rest don't count. 

Philosophies of men mingled with scripture. 

I think it interesting that you think you know what the philosophies of men are. I think it even more interesting that you think you know enough to judge my understanding as such. Who do you think you are?

I guess I shouldn't expect better of Mormons, but I do. It's a weakness of mine. One would think, that after the fiasco with race in the priesthood, that they'd stop doing it, but I can see that will not happen soon. (I doubt anyone here will understand what I mean by that statement and probably assume that I'm condemning the church for the restriction, but I am not. It is the excuses that Mormons created to explain the reason for the ban to which I am referring...)

I remember sitting in a priesthood class where the instructor made the statement: "We have the priesthood and the Holy Ghost, we can talk about the mysteries of heaven" and invited a candid discussion. What a mistake. No sooner than he opened the floor for discussion than we had one priesthood holder condemning another for the "philosophies of men".

How do you know that what is there is actually supposed to be there? You don't. You don't have the originals. How do you know that the way you've interpreted it is what was meant? Well, you don't. You aren't the author. What makes you think my understanding of the passage is the philosophies of men and yours the philosophies of God? Well, you can't. You're not God.

Does it make sense that the person who has the beam in their eye can remove it? Apparently, they didn't even know it is there? How can they remove it if they don't know it's there? Who can tell them? It is clear to me that the intent of the passage was that we don't know it's there and to stop trying to fix other peoples problems. The latter portion of that verse was quite clear. "cast out first the beam out of thine own eye", assuming you can even do.

Don't presume that you can tell me anything about what's in my eye.

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2 hours ago, brotherofJared said:

Who do you think you are?

Don't presume that you can tell me anything about what's in my eye.

Lol . .. well now . .. .  Boy if this isn't the typical, petulant millennial response.  My 9 year-old gives a better response.

Note: the above isn't judgement, it's an observation.

Another observation: I have found in my life that those who complain about others judging them are almost always the worst offenders themselves.

Do you have kids?

(This is judgement)

Exhibit A of why this country is going down.  You see in the modern day approach, no-one can tell you you are wrong, b/c if you tell someone they are wrong you are "judging". This is the typical BS moral relativism mantra that has infested and indoctrinated this land.  Sick, sick, sick.

If you don't like what someone says, the correct response is STTE  . . .hmm, that's interesting, I don't agree with it but I respect your opinion.  Nope, not today. It's WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE TO JUDGE ME!!!!!!! DON'T TELL ME ABOUT MY FAULTS!!!!

I simply make a comment that you are the one who is disregarding scripture you don't like.  If it doesn't fit with your notion of what the world should look like-you discard it and then tell anyone who is telling you that you are fitting the scriptures to match your own notion that they are judging you.

We are commanded to judge. Unless you are a part of this moral relativism group-God tells us we should judge.

24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

1 Now these are the words which Jesus taught his disciples that they should say unto the people.
2 Judge not unrighteously, that ye be not judged; but judge righteous judgment.


Dude . . . grow up.  

Edited by yjacket
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@brotherofJared, I'm curious. How do you reconcile your views with the idea of "Reproving betimes with sharpness, when moved upon by the Holy Ghost" in D&C 121?


"Behold, I send you out to reprove the world of all their unrighteous deeds, and to teach them of a judgment which is to come." D&C 84:87

and v 117

"And verily I say unto you, the rest of my servants, go ye forth as your circumstances shall permit, in your several callings, unto the great and notable cities and villages, reproving the world in righteousness of all their unrighteous and ungodly deeds, setting forth clearly and understandingly the desolation of abomination in the last days."


"Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine." 2 Tim 4:2


"And again, verily I say unto you, those who desire in their hearts, in meekness, to warn sinners to repentance, let them be ordained unto this power." D&C 63:57


"Behold, I sent you out to testify and warn the people, and it becometh every man who hath been warned to warn his neighbor." D&C 88:81



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On 6/11/2017 at 0:09 AM, brotherofJared said:

The message for me is: stop trying to fix other people's problems. Fix your own. 


11 hours ago, brotherofJared said:

reproving what they do, not what they are.

I'm asking you to reconcile these two ideas that seem to me to completely contradict each other.

11 hours ago, brotherofJared said:

I think that's what I was doing.

It's obvious that is what you think you're doing. What doesn't make sense is that as you're doing it you're constantly making statements along the lines of the first thing I quote here, saying that it should be none of your affair to try and fix others problems and remove the motes from their eyes -- but all the while doing your best to tell others how to remove the motes from their eyes.

How is it that you can be determining that anyone else has motes in their eyes of judgment and hypocrisy and bigotry that need to be removed if you feel so strongly that it is never anyone's place to determine that another has a mote in their eye?

Edited by The Folk Prophet
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