Bini Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 On 6/19/2017 at 7:49 PM, ray13 said: My husband and I have decided to be child-free. He has had a vasectomy. We also tend to move fairly frequently (one a year/ every 2 years), which means new wards/meeting new people. Whenever I hit Relief Society I get the "So how many kids do you have" type questions. I respond with "none. We aren't having kids." or something similar. And I immediately get hit with a sigh, or "you'll change your mind later sweetie". They just don't seem to grasp the fact we don't want kids and we are happy. Once people get to know me and they pursue more, I tell them No we are sure. My husband got a vasecotmy. We won't be changing our mind. We have lost friends over this because we are going against the church. I have never liked kids and never wanted one. Anybody else going through something similar or can offer words of encouragement / advice on how to deal with it. It got so bad in my last ward that whenever family came up in class and they started talking about children/grandchildren a lot of the older women would stare at me and start whispering and I could hear my name. My husband doesn't have the same issue. They ask about his kids and he says "No. we arent having kids" and the elders class is like ok whatever. He doesn't get any of the harrassment I do so he doesn't understand so I can't really talk to him about it. He thinks Im over-reacting. You might want to consider a supportive network with other women/couples who have chosen not to have children. Whether that is an actual meetup group or something online, I think you could benefit from some comfort and reassurance from those who are in the exact boat, and not just 'trying' to relate. Secondly, I completely agree with the comment that you should immediately stop explaining yourself, as that opens you up to being targeted for a slew of nosy questions. Lastly, you and your spouse sound like a balanced couple, I wouldn't put any weight into what people are whispering about regarding your situation. Absolutely, hands down, without question, you can be happy and healthy without ever having children. I know several men and women who have chosen not to ever procreate and they are some of the most wonderful people I know. They are happy, they make other people feel good about themselves, they share hobbies that make a difference in the world, they have successful jobs, some are churchgoers, too. Hope you find some peace of mind soon and I'm very sorry you're dealing with insensitive and extremely nosy people who can't mind their own business! Sunday21 and Backroads 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday21 Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) I have had a sister ask me how many kids I had and react in horror when I said 'none' but..that woman had emotional problems and has had her records removed from the church. i have been pointed out as an oddity by the person teaching a RS lesson, Look Sunday is still here! ( I guess they were talking about social support being important to remain active. I am not sure because my mind was wandering.) The sister who pointed me out has remedial English. It is hard to be tactful if your language skills are poor. i am sure that there are wards in which they are unkind to those who don't fit the mold. Why not picture Jesus teaching a class about how to be tactful or kind in the next life? You have already passed that class! Edited August 16, 2017 by Sunday21 NeuroTypical 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 1 hour ago, Sunday21 said: Why not picture Jesus teaching a class about how to be tactful or kind in the next life? You have already passed that class! Some phrases by the Lord: Quote Oh, thou hypocrite! Ye fools and blind! Neither cast ye your pearls before swine. Thou fool! ... for Herod will kill thee. And (Jesus) said unto them, Go ye, and tell that fox... O, generation of vipers. Then there's Amulek to Zeezrom Quote Oh, thou child of hell. A lot of tact in preaching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday21 Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 32 minutes ago, Carborendum said: Some phrases by the Lord: Then there's Amulek to Zeezrom A lot of tact in preaching. Hey @Carborendum Are you suggesting that we not be tactful or kind with each other? If so, those who hold positions of authority may be moved to be blunt. Otherwise rudeness or cruelty is to be avoided. Any abuse for this and I will sic @zil on you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 7 minutes ago, Sunday21 said: Hey @Carborendum Are you suggesting that we not be tactful or kind with each other? If so, those who hold positions of authority may be moved to be blunt. Otherwise rudeness or cruelty is to be avoided. Any abuse for this and I will sic @zil on you! No, not the Sheathen Mistress, herself! ARRRGGHHH!!! Stop the madness! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 5 minutes ago, Sunday21 said: Hey @Carborendum Are you suggesting that we not be tactful or kind with each other? If so, those who hold positions of authority may be moved to be blunt. Otherwise rudeness or cruelty is to be avoided. Any abuse for this and I will sic @zil on you! Really? When I was called as RSP, one of the things the bishop said (after I stopped laughing) was that one of the impressions they got when considering my name for the calling was that they needed someone who could be blunt. (That may not have been his exact words, but that was the gist of it.) I'm not sure why that was significant since I haven't noticed a need to be blunt, but maybe that's because my blunt is everyone else's rude & cruel... Or were you trying to threaten Carb with my bluntness? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 3 minutes ago, zil said: Or were you trying to threaten Carb with my bluntness? May she have mercy on my soul... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroTypical Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 We're beating Carb with a blunt what now? (Not taking issue, just wanting to make sure I know what to bring.) eddified and Sunday21 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 4 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said: We're beating Carb with a blunt what now? (Not taking issue, just wanting to make sure I know what to bring.) Given my Sheathen nature, my weapon will have to be a blunted sword. Feel free to bring whatever blunt instrument you like... Sunday21 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday21 Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 38 minutes ago, zil said: Really? When I was called as RSP, one of the things the bishop said (after I stopped laughing) was that one of the impressions they got when considering my name for the calling was that they needed someone who could be blunt. (That may not have been his exact words, but that was the gist of it.) I'm not sure why that was significant since I haven't noticed a need to be blunt, but maybe that's because my blunt is everyone else's rude & cruel... Or were you trying to threaten Carb with my bluntness? But @zil, warrior princess, if the bishop is calling you to be RSP because of your bluntness, then surely there is a need for your bluntness? Right? I am trying to stamp out free range, just-to-get-my jollies bluntness. I understand the need for sanctioned, following a prompting, useful, to achieve a purpose bluntness. Jesus in the New Testament was frequently blunt and even cutting but...He had a divine purpose. He was called to that position. Free range crabbiness, why-are-you-not like me? heckling is to be avoided. For one thing, members will leave and not come back. SilentOne and zil 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday21 Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 39 minutes ago, Carborendum said: May she have mercy on my soul... Be careful. I understand that the mods have slipped her your address! zil 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 Just now, Sunday21 said: Be careful. I understand that the mods have slipped her your address! She already has my address. She sent me some fountain pens and stuff. That's why my keyboard has ink all over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 Just now, Carborendum said: She already has my address. She sent me some fountain pens and stuff. That's why my keyboard has ink all over it. And here I was thinking of ordering you to visit Dromgoole's for me, but if you're just gonna spill ink all over your keyboard, it won't do me any good... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 5 minutes ago, zil said: And here I was thinking of ordering you to visit Dromgoole's for me But you don't get car sick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 Just now, Carborendum said: But you don't get car sick. I don't get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 4 minutes ago, zil said: I don't get it. A joke just isn't funny if one has to explain it. But... Dromgoole is a highly unfamiliar name or word to anyone not into inks. But it carries a vague resemblance to Dramamine - an OTC medication for motion sickness. So, I was playing dumb like "What did you say about my mamma?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 4 minutes ago, Carborendum said: A joke just isn't funny if one has to explain it. But... Dromgoole is a highly unfamiliar name or word to anyone not into inks. But it carries a vague resemblance to Dramamine - an OTC medication for motion sickness. So, I was playing dumb like "What did you say about my mamma?" Hmm. I'm thinking "vague" might be too unvague a word for this resemblance. Meanwhile, Dromgoole's carries knives and leather products too, so who knows, you may like it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 15 minutes ago, zil said: Hmm. I'm thinking "vague" might be too unvague a word for this resemblance. Meanwhile, Dromgoole's carries knives and leather products too, so who knows, you may like it... Hey, I'm a big fan of decorative things and think a lot of fountain pens look cool. I just don't see why anyone would pay $5000 for a pen because it writes so nice. And the same goes for knives. You get the right steel, feel, and peel for a decent price. That's great. But to pay $5000 for a pocket knife??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 23 minutes ago, Carborendum said: I just don't see why anyone would pay $5000 for a pen because it writes so nice. No one pays $5000 for a pen, even a fountain pen, because of how it writes. You don't need to go beyond maybe $200-$500 to get that (and the only reason you'd have to hit the high end of that is because that particular nib doesn't come on a cheaper pen). When you get beyond hundreds of dollars, you're paying for something else entirely - the artwork / craftsmanship; the custom, one-off work; the expensive materials; the status-symbol of the brand; or something, but at that point, it's not the nib itself that's driving the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) 15 minutes ago, zil said: When you get beyond hundreds of dollars, you're paying for something else entirely - the artwork / craftsmanship; the custom, one-off work; the expensive materials; the status-symbol of the brand; or something, but at that point, it's not the nib itself that's driving the price. And that is exactly what I just can't wrap my head around. If it is a collectible or work of art that you keep in a glass case, sure, I get that. But I don't carry around anything like that with me anywhere at any time. The most expensive piece of jewelry I ever bought was less than $2000 for my wife on our 20th anniversary. There's nothing else I own that is along that level of expense that doesn't have a utilitarian use. Maybe I'm just a boring person. But that's why I can't wrap my head around something like this. http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCARSE-2003-MONTBLANC-ATELIERS-PRIVES-JOHN-HARRISON-DAY-3-SKELETON-FOUNTAIN-PEN-/222163534295?hash=item33b9fa81d7:g:12QAAOSw5VFWLZZA $300k for a pen. Edited August 16, 2017 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdfxdb Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 42 minutes ago, Carborendum said: And that is exactly what I just can't wrap my head around. If it is a collectible or work of art that you keep in a glass case, sure, I get that. But I don't carry around anything like that with me anywhere at any time. The most expensive piece of jewelry I ever bought was less than $2000 for my wife on our 20th anniversary. There's nothing else I own that is along that level of expense that doesn't have a utilitarian use. Maybe I'm just a boring person. But that's why I can't wrap my head around something like this. http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCARSE-2003-MONTBLANC-ATELIERS-PRIVES-JOHN-HARRISON-DAY-3-SKELETON-FOUNTAIN-PEN-/222163534295?hash=item33b9fa81d7:g:12QAAOSw5VFWLZZA $300k for a pen. Montblanc makes pretty good pens. Skeleton fountain pen is not my style. I like the Legrand series: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Montblanc-Signature-for-Good-Meisterstuck-LeGrand-0-9mm-Mechanical-Pencil-/112333360230?hash=item1a27970c66:g:JmEAAOSwSlBYxheB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Carborendum said: There's nothing else I own that is along that level of expense that doesn't have a utilitarian use. This statement confuses me. A pen has a utilitarian use. And who cares whether it does or does not have utilitarian only, aesthetic only, or both types of uses? Either you're paying for the cost of providing the product, or you're paying for something in addition to that. There are lots of expensive things we buy (houses, cars, education) where a cheaper version is available, but we're paying extra for craftsmanship/quality, the convenience of "larger", personal preference (as far as its appearance / color goes), etc. So you don't like the extreme version of this tendency - congratulations, most humans don't. (Personally, I don't comprehend why you or your wife might want jewelry, beyond maybe a wedding ring. so from my perspective, whatever you spent on that piece you bought her was a waste of money. But if it wasn't from yours or hers, more power to ya.) As for the link: You're not paying for "a pen". It's a Montblanc (immediately doubles the price: status symbol, craftsmanship, probably limited edition), it's said to be "rare" (thus making it a collector's item), and who cares - just because some nut might be willing to pay that price doesn't mean it's worth it or anything. And how do we know some nut will pay that price? Maybe the seller is nuts. I'm not saying I think that item is worth the price, I'm just saying there are reasons people put that price on that item, and as far as I'm concerned, that's their problem. The nib on that pen can be got on a much, much cheaper pen (if it's the writing experience you're after). Edited August 16, 2017 by zil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday21 Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) @zil Seeking converts for the Church of Fountain Pens. Tithing slips made out to... Edited August 16, 2017 by Sunday21 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Karma Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 3 hours ago, Sunday21 said: @zil Seeking converts for the Church of Fountain Pens. Tithing slips made out to... I love fountain pens, I used to have a bunch that my Grandpa gave me when I was a kid, now, those things are crazy expensive. zil and Sunday21 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Bad Karma said: I love fountain pens, I used to have a bunch that my Grandpa gave me when I was a kid, now, those things are crazy expensive. Nonsense. https://www.gouletpens.com/fountain-pens-under-100/c/631/?sortBy=price+asc&facetValueFilter=price%3A[0+TO+25] ...and that's a mom & pop style FP store. eBay and Amazon will get you a decent fountain pen (or not so decent - you have to learn to distinguish) for even cheaper than some of these... ETA: Keep getting alerts about posts after this one, but can't see any of them - not even the one I just posted noting this same phenomenon... Edited August 16, 2017 by zil ETA: Can't see anything after this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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