Question for men of the board


Jane_Doe
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(this is a spin off of another thread, with me totally jacking @Backroads's question)

For us girls, there's a difference between "I feel pretty!" and "Other people think this looks good on me".  The first really has nothing to do with anyone else, but is just a self-indulgence on our parts.   Obviously the second is all about what other people think.

Does that make sense?  Do guys have anything like that?

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I had a friend who attended a big deal university and managed to work it into every conversation. She had two daughters both of whom she felt were real intellectuals, age 10 and 7. The 7 year old started to make airplanes in every color of the rainbow and mount these planes on bookcases and tables. The mother got excited and stated to discuss the mechanics of flight with the 7 year old. The little girl shut mom down immediately, 'No Mom. It's all about the colours'. The mom told me shamefaced that the girl wanted to into fashion design. 

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"I feel pretty" for me is like playing with Barbie where I'm the Barbie.  I love love love makeup, dresses, shoes, baubles.  But, just like my Barbies, I only play once in a rare while even as I buy all these stuff when it catches my eye on the shop window.

But my norm is, I wear my hair the way my husband likes it.  I wear clothes he likes.  I pretty much get dressed up to be pleasing to his eye.

My husband on the other hand dresses for success and to impress.  White dress shirts to work, rugged masculinity for casual.  Brand names and high quality.  He has more clothes than me.

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52 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

For us girls, there's a difference between "I feel pretty!" and "Other people think this looks good on me".  

Do guys have anything like that?

Oh absolutely.  There's things I do and ways I act that I really enjoy, and there's the rest of the time I have to be around humans, and can't do that stuff because of the embarrassment (for either me or witness, or both).  

It was better when my girls were younger and liked a daddy that sang to the radio and danced badly and arted badly and yelled at the tv and did MMA and took them shooting and got kicks out of prepping.  Now they roll their eyes and tell me to stop it.  So I job.  And I church.  And I service.  And I diet and exercise.  And I lift heavy things and pay bills and occasionally fix things.  Until nobody's looking, then I'm off doing my things I like.  I call it 'flying my freak flag'.  Humans expect it from me come Halloween, and y'all seem to accept it when you see it from me here.

Edited by NeuroTypical
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35 minutes ago, Backroads said:

I recall my daughters being very young ages without any particular exposure to "prettiness" of culture... who you put a skirt on them and they twirl. Once my daughter, being all of 4 months, took a particular interest in a particular dress.

I think little girls just care about things that make them feel pretty.  It is only as they get older that they believe they need someone else's approval to believe they are pretty.  I skipped past all that by telling my daughters that they are simply the prettiest girls in the world.  So, all the other girls are just naturally going to be jealous of them.

For guys?  I don't know.  It has really been a long time since I cared about being considered "handsome".  I try to groom myself for propriety more than anything else.  I just don't want to be "ugly".  But "handsome"?  Meh.  No man that good looking is straight.

Is there an analogue apart from personal appearance?  Hmmm... I actually feel a lot of pride in my work.  I believe I'm a very good engineer.  But I just always feel better when someone else compliments me on my work.

Edited by Guest
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I've found, through trial and error, a type and style of clothing that works best for me given the field I work in and what my daily life is like. 

I can literally go into a store, find what I need, and be at the register before some people finish looking at a rack. 

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Honestly as a male I'm frequently pretty lazy about dressing. Is it clean and is it not wrinkled enough that I can get away with wearing it without looking like I woke up in it are my two main concerns most days?.

Now that's about 90% of the time. The other 10% would be closer to what you're talking about. Job interviews, taking my wife out on a nice date, and going to the temple are all occasions where I try to look a little snappier because I want to look nice.

Edited by Midwest LDS
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20 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

(this is a spin off of another thread, with me totally jacking @Backroads's question)

For us girls, there's a difference between "I feel pretty!" and "Other people think this looks good on me".  The first really has nothing to do with anyone else, but is just a self-indulgence on our parts.   Obviously the second is all about what other people think.

Does that make sense?  Do guys have anything like that?

Yes, and yes. I would say for me it is, "This looks good," and "Other people will think this looks good on me."

When I purchased sunglasses I purchased with both mentalities, "I like the way this looks on me," and "Honey, what do you think, do they look good on me"?

But really, come on @Jane_Doe, let's be honest with ourselves, I make everything look "good" so it really doesn't matter what I wear. :bananarockon: (100% joking -- I don't look good in my wife's workout pants :animatedlol: )

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Guest Godless

Generally speaking, I think most guys are more pre-occupied with fulfilling their own image goals than trying to impress others. As for me personally, I like to dress comfortably. About 360 days of the year, I'm wearing a T-shirt and cargo shorts. I'll wear pants and a shirt with a collar on special occasions when my wife and I go out, but that's rare. 

I think it's also worth noting that my wife and I have a bit of an understanding when it comes to hair. She used to have shoulder-length blonde hair. It's now dyed dark red and in a short pixie/bob hybrid cut (I'm not good with haircut styles). I prefered the longer blonde hair, but what makes her feel pretty is more important to me than my preferences. And at the end of the day, she's still beautiful. I like having facial hair. For years I'd grow out a short goatie between Reserve weekends in the Army. After I got out of the Army I grew the goatie out for a year. It got to about 7 inches. My wife didn't like it and frankly it wasn't worth the hassle. So I agreed to trim it twice a year, on our anniversary (August) and her birthday (January). She likes the goatie, but not when it gets too long. Still though, I've had a yearning to try out a full beard. So last month when our anniversary rolled around, I trimmed everything down to start from scratch. She's not thrilled with it, but she respects that it's what I want. So far I think it looks great. 

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On 9/1/2017 at 5:26 PM, Jane_Doe said:

(this is a spin off of another thread, with me totally jacking @Backroads's question)

For us girls, there's a difference between "I feel pretty!" and "Other people think this looks good on me".  The first really has nothing to do with anyone else, but is just a self-indulgence on our parts.   Obviously the second is all about what other people think.

Does that make sense?  Do guys have anything like that?

Personally, I don't feel pretty all that often.  I'm kinda a homely guy and if you ever saw what I wear, you would realize that what other people think of the way I dress is the faaaaaaaaaarthest thing from my mind.

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On ‎9‎/‎1‎/‎2017 at 4:26 PM, Jane_Doe said:

Does that make sense?  Do guys have anything like that?

Of course it makes sense. You are a female and so everything you say makes perfect sense. :tongueflower:

As for whether guys have anything related to how we think when we dress ourselves, the short answer is:  :nosign:

Our women inform us as to what looks good on us, then lay it out for us, and, if we are truly blessed, iron them.  :cloud9:

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My wife will not let me pick out anything for me or anyone else to wear.  But since I really do not care what I wear this is not a problem for me.  The last suit I bought for myself – the wife told me I could pick.  5 minutes into the store I picked out a suit.  She said I had to try it on.  I do not understand this.  I will be measured and a suit will be tailored to fit.  I see no sense in trying on a suit.  An hour and a half later she informed me which suit I could pick. 

How I look is something my wife is good at figuring out.  Engineers are designed for other things.   The wife has taught all our kids how to dress – especially the ladies (two daughters).   About 30 years ago, I decided our kids should be well trained on how to act and behave.   I decide that whitewater rafting would provide the platform for learning how to behave and handle what the world dishes out.

Our whitewater expeditions grew over the years to 6 rafts and up to 60 rafters.  Myself and each kid became trained as raft guides (boat captions).  Besides guiding a boat in up to class 4 hydraulics the kids were trained to handle the full week activities of wilderness camping.  My theory was that if someone can handle 8 or 9 critics in a boat and get them all to work together – they will do ok in life.  I think that between the wife and I the kids have all turned out quite well.  They all still make fun of my shopping abilities and looking the part but no one have ever made fun of what they learned on the river.

The point I want to make is that everybody has gifts and talents to contribute for the benefit of humanity.  Looking good may not work for everybody but there is something (usually something better) that everyone can offer.  If we can help bring out those gifts and talents – the better it will be for them and everybody else.

 

The Traveler

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4 hours ago, Traveler said:

My wife will not let me pick out anything for me or anyone else to wear.  But since I really do not care what I wear this is not a problem for me.  The last suit I bought for myself – the wife told me I could pick.  5 minutes into the store I picked out a suit.  She said I had to try it on.  I do not understand this.  I will be measured and a suit will be tailored to fit.  I see no sense in trying on a suit.  An hour and a half later she informed me which suit I could pick. 

How I look is something my wife is good at figuring out.  Engineers are designed for other things.   The wife has taught all our kids how to dress – especially the ladies (two daughters).   About 30 years ago, I decided our kids should be well trained on how to act and behave.   I decide that whitewater rafting would provide the platform for learning how to behave and handle what the world dishes out.

Our whitewater expeditions grew over the years to 6 rafts and up to 60 rafters.  Myself and each kid became trained as raft guides (boat captions).  Besides guiding a boat in up to class 4 hydraulics the kids were trained to handle the full week activities of wilderness camping.  My theory was that if someone can handle 8 or 9 critics in a boat and get them all to work together – they will do ok in life.  I think that between the wife and I the kids have all turned out quite well.  They all still make fun of my shopping abilities and looking the part but no one have ever made fun of what they learned on the river.

The point I want to make is that everybody has gifts and talents to contribute for the benefit of humanity.  Looking good may not work for everybody but there is something (usually something better) that everyone can offer.  If we can help bring out those gifts and talents – the better it will be for them and everybody else.

 

The Traveler

My wife says my taste is all in my mouth. About the only thing I insist on choosing are ties.

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I think the two kind of go hand in hand,  If the woman feels pretty, obviously she thinks or is very hopeful that others will feel the same. It was mentioned on another thread that women dress for comfort, not to impress.  So 3 inch heels are comfortable? Most women like to be noticed, feel attractive and sexy. I once had a female coworker tell me that it was a competition with women. She said when a woman walks into a room she is showing off her stuff to other women and trying to tell them (by her dress, and I suppose attitude as well)  that they could take their man if they wanted, she said its just a game. She told me that any woman that said they dont do that is a lie.   Now keep in mind I am not talking about 60 and 70 year old women. younger women, 20's and 30's

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1 hour ago, Dillon said:

I think the two kind of go hand in hand,  If the woman feels pretty, obviously she thinks or is very hopeful that others will feel the same. It was mentioned on another thread that women dress for comfort, not to impress.  So 3 inch heels are comfortable? Most women like to be noticed, feel attractive and sexy. I once had a female coworker tell me that it was a competition with women. She said when a woman walks into a room she is showing off her stuff to other women and trying to tell them (by her dress, and I suppose attitude as well)  that they could take their man if they wanted, she said its just a game. She told me that any woman that said they dont do that is a lie.   Now keep in mind I am not talking about 60 and 70 year old women. younger women, 20's and 30's

3-inch heels are not as comfortable as flats.  That's why not many women wear them.  I wear 4-inch heels.  I love them.  They shorten the 14-inch gap between my husband and I and make my legs with its bomber-thighs look ballerina-slim.  All the other women in my family think I'm an idiot. 

Note that I'm married.  So, I don't have to compete with other women for the attention of my husband or need to feel noticed, attractive, and sexy.  But yeah, I like ballerina-slim looking legs because, heck, I'm my own Barbie doll and my husband likes it.  It makes me feel very feminine.

My grandma was 82 when she died.  She fell off the stairs and broke her hip when she was 76 or so and they didn't do surgery because she's too old to have one.  So she walked with pain in her hip the rest of her days.  But, she still wore her high heels all day every day even just to clean the floors with her broken hip.  Now, my grandma has been widowed since she was in her 20's and was very devoted to her dead husband that she will only wear clothes with shades of violet on it (their wedding color).  So she wasn't in the market to attract anybody.  She wore heels because, like me, she loves dressing up.  She's a fashion designer.  It's very feminine.

It is in women's nature to be feminine.  And yes, it is biologically tied to ancient dominance hierarchies the same way that it is in men's nature to be masculine.

Edited by anatess2
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22 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

It is in women's nature to be feminine.

I'm sitting here thinking about the bazillion arguments against this tautology that I encounter every day.  Maybe it's just my wide facebook circles that include lots of different sides of lots of different fences.  I'm thinking how utterly silly it is, that such a statement actually needs to be made at all, much less defended. 

Perhaps next year we'll need to all specifically mention why it's rational to think about how squares have four sides.

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4 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

I'm sitting here thinking about the bazillion arguments against this tautology that I encounter every day.  Maybe it's just my wide facebook circles that include lots of different sides of lots of different fences.  I'm thinking how utterly silly it is, that such a statement actually needs to be made at all, much less defended. 

Perhaps next year we'll need to all specifically mention why it's rational to think about how squares have four sides.

Feminism is cancer and Sweden is its mecca.  Good thing only 18% of American women identify as feminists.

Edited by anatess2
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Based on what @anatess2 one could still conclude that she (and her grandma) still dress for comfort..  It just that the discomfort of heels is less then the discomfort they feel not feeling feminine.  And what makes one woman feel comfortably feminine is going to vary from woman to woman based on their own understanding, expectations and experiences.  Some will wear heels some will were flats.. all will be dressing to their own standard of what feels comfortable to them..  Its just not always physical comfort they dress for.

 

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5 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

Based on what @anatess2 one could still conclude that she (and her grandma) still dress for comfort..  It just that the discomfort of heels is less then the discomfort they feel not feeling feminine.  And what makes one woman feel comfortably feminine is going to vary from woman to woman based on their own understanding, expectations and experiences.  Some will wear heels some will were flats.. all will be dressing to their own standard of what feels comfortable to them..  Its just not always physical comfort they dress for.

 

I am actually very picky about my shoes.  High heels can only be worn comfortably with the right design for one's feet.  I see lots of women - even Angelina Jolie in one of her movies - wear poorly designed heels for their feet.  I can chase down my 2 boys in my 4-inch heels.  They know this.  So they don't try the limits of my patience even when I'm in heels.

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"make my legs with its bomber-thighs look ballerina-slim   " But yeah, I like ballerina-slim looking legs because, heck, I'm my own Barbie doll and my husband likes it.  It makes me feel very feminine."

 

By "feminine" you mean sexy.  But at least you admitted it. I have never heard a woman say that high heels are comfortable,  just on here, only reason being I am trying to prove a point and you guys will never let that happen.  Some women will die before they admit that they dress to look sexy, desired, etc. They will still claim they walk around in their 4 inch heels all day because they are comfortable.

Edited by Dillon
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3 minutes ago, Dillon said:

Some women will die before they admit that they dress to look sexy, desired, etc. They will still claim they walk around in their 4 inch heels all day because they are comfortable.

I don't believe I have ever in my entire life heard a woman claim she wears heels because they're comfortable. One of the open secrets and long-running jokes about (and among) women is how they subject themselves to torture by wearing heels because [insert reason for self-torture -- makes legs look good, makes her taller, shoes are fashionable, shoes are "cute", etc.] Pretty sure I have never heard a woman try to disguise this most obvious of fashion devils.

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8 minutes ago, Dillon said:

"make my legs with its bomber-thighs look ballerina-slim   " But yeah, I like ballerina-slim looking legs because, heck, I'm my own Barbie doll and my husband likes it.  It makes me feel very feminine."

 

By "feminine" you mean sexy.  But at least you admitted it. I have never heard a woman say that high heels are comfortable,  just on here, only reason being I am trying to prove a point and you guys will never let that happen.  Some women will die before they admit that they dress to look sexy, desired, etc. They will still claim they walk around in their 4 inch heels all day because they are comfortable.

Don't put your words in my mouth.  It's poisonous.

And yeah, keep thinking that.  But please, don't get married.  It would be even awesome if you dox yourself so we can warn our friends not to get involved with this guy named Dillon X living in X with phone number X.  And so we can tell these feminists, this guy Dillon X is rare and should not be used to judge men in general.

Edited by anatess2
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