Jane_Doe Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, Grunt said: My brain hurts. Im not smart enough to be Mormon. LOL. It's ok, it's not an intelligence thing, but different view. Give yourself some slack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gracie238 Posted November 30, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 29 minutes ago, NeedleinA said: If this was written by a teenage seminary student, I'm a part time garbage man in Zimbabwe. Haha what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 9 minutes ago, Grunt said: Im not smart enough to be Mormon. The history of your posts would indicate otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pam Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 minute ago, Carborendum said: The history of your posts would indicate otherwise. I totally agree. I have to remind myself many times that he is NOT a member. Yet. mirkwood, Midwest LDS, Sunday21 and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 13 minutes ago, Grunt said: Im not smart enough to be Mormon. Don't worry, @mirkwood got in. You are fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 minute ago, pam said: I totally agree. I have to remind myself many times that he is NOT a member. Yet. I'm sure I drove the sisters at the Temple CRAZY yesterday with my questions. I woke up this morning thinking I'd go back tonight but changed my mind. That's borderline stalking and someone would likely call the cops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, NeedleinA said: If this was written by a teenage seminary student, I'm a part time garbage man in Zimbabwe. Did you intend to quote a Haiku version of her post? Quote he concluded the story...our staple beliefs...form of monotheism? (sorry, it is an inverse Haiku. But whatever). My kids actually write like this. One of them talks like this. But they are the exception. When the seminary teacher is not getting a response from anyone, he calls on "someone from the Carb family." They always have an answer. My daughter said she didn't feel like it was interesting to her anymore and only went to seminary because it was like Nephi obeying the Law of Moses. She just goes to try to feel the Spirit. She isn't really learning anything. So, we enrolled her in an institute class. She feels like she's getting something out of it. But she still doesn't feel challenged. Still, you may be right. Edited November 30, 2017 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane_Doe Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 22 minutes ago, gracie238 said: Haha what? @gracie238, there are some anti-Mormons individuals that like to come on this forum and (falsely) claim that they're someone young (like middle school through mission prep age) and just made a discovery that concerns them and ask some stock anti-Mormon question. They have no interest in actually reading the answers, but think to themselves something along the lines of "if I lie and play dumb, it'll make the Mormons actually think and then they're realize I'm the source of truth and join my church instead". (Note: I'm not saying you're one of these individuals. I'm just saying that they do exist). Edited November 30, 2017 by Jane_Doe NeedleinA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane_Doe Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 4 minutes ago, Grunt said: I'm sure I drove the sisters at the Temple CRAZY yesterday with my questions. I woke up this morning thinking I'd go back tonight but changed my mind. That's borderline stalking and someone would likely call the cops. By "crazy" you mean super-super excited? Sunday21 and pam 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 2 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said: By "crazy" you mean super-super excited? Super excited when I left. I always feel bad when they can't answer my questions. Then I told them to stop agreeing with me if I'm wrong. They try so hard to be nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane_Doe Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Grunt said: Super excited when I left. I always feel bad when they can't answer my questions. Then I told them to stop agreeing with me if I'm wrong. They try so hard to be nice. Missionaries are specialists in explaining Mormonism 101. They don't get as much practice talking about 501 stuff, specially considering LDS faith is a faith where God still has many great and wondrous things to reveal to us. Hence some questions don't have answers right now, and some we get along the way. We (LDS in general and missionaries included) are ok with acknowledging the fact we don't know everything. Keep learning is what makes it exciting! Edited November 30, 2017 by Jane_Doe Grunt and Sunday21 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Osborn Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 hour ago, Carborendum said: Where is that doctrine written? I've never heard it. Gospel Principles Ch 4 specifically says he can only be in one place at one time. We say His presence can be felt everywhere. This means that His power and influence can be felt everywhere. Not His physical being. So then, why is he a personage of spiriit? So that he can dwell within us. Is that not correct? So that when we are filled with the HG it abides in us. So, if its not literally the HG literally within us how are we filled with the HG? Are you suggesting that we are just filled with his presence? What does that even mean and if that was the case he wouldnt need to be a spirit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 minute ago, Rob Osborn said: So then, why is he a personage of spiriit? So that he can dwell within us. Is that not correct? So that when we are filled with the HG it abides in us. So, if its not literally the HG literally within us how are we filled with the HG? Are you suggesting that we are just filled with his presence? What does that even mean and if that was the case he wouldnt need to be a spirit. Uhmm. I want to preface this with the fact that this is not a "you're so stupid" comment. I'm honestly surprised that you wrote this. So, I need to take a step back and ask you what you do and don't know about this. Do you know the difference between the Power of the Holy Ghost and the Gift of the Holy Ghost? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 4 minutes ago, Carborendum said: Uhmm. I want to preface this with the fact that this is not a "you're so stupid" comment. I'm honestly surprised that you wrote this. So, I need to take a step back and ask you what you do and don't know about this. Do you know the difference between the Power of the Holy Ghost and the Gift of the Holy Ghost? Just in case it's not clear, I'm going to throw this out as the verse Rob is referring to: Quote D&C 130:22 The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit. Were it not so, the Holy Ghost could not dwell in us. I personally think the literal interpretation (of two sentient beings occupying the same physical space at the same time, while one, and only one, of the two is also occupying the same physical space as numerous other sentient beings) is problematic. But that's me. I'm game to embrace my ignorance here and say the HG does what he does and I don't understand the mechanics. SilentOne and Grunt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 I just found out that they changed the chapters in Gospel Principles. It's apparently CH 7 now. I have a REALLY old edition. Quote The Holy Ghost is a member of the Godhead (see 1 John 5:7; D&C 20:28). He is a “personage of Spirit” (D&C 130:22). He can be in only one place at a time, but His influence can be everywhere at the same time. And apparently I misquoted the word "presence." It was "influence." Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zil Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 31 minutes ago, Grunt said: I'm sure I drove the sisters at the Temple CRAZY yesterday with my questions. I woke up this morning thinking I'd go back tonight but changed my mind. That's borderline stalking and someone would likely call the cops. I think you should go back. They're probably bored most nights. The longer you keep them distracted, the more quickly they can get home and go to bed. And they'll feel like they accomplished something, even if it was only fending off the dude with the weird accent. Alternately, have you considered that it's good for you to ask them these questions? If ever they were in an ideal situation to learn (even if it's weeks from when you ask the question, and through personal study, or asking the mission president), your hard questions that they can't answer are a chance for them to learn the answers for themselves. This will make their missions better - for them, for future investigators, and for the people in their lives later. For all you know, your question will inspire study at a time when they are dedicated to the Lord and prepared to receive revelation like never before, and prevent them from asking that question after their mission and potentially stumbling because of it. In short, I think if you feel like going back, you should go back. Send us a postcard. SilentOne, Jane_Doe, Grunt and 1 other 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anatess2 Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 minute ago, zil said: In short, I think if you feel like going back, you should go back. Send us a postcard. Unless you forgot to bring your fountain pen, then don't bother. zil and Sunday21 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytebear Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 5 hours ago, Grunt said: So, if LDS believe that all three individuals in the Godhead are Gods and that we will also become Gods, then why do they worship God? Why does Jesus worship the Father? Sorry if that comes across as accusatory, it's offered in sincerity. I'm having a hard time understanding this. Why do you respect your mother and father above other people? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Osborn Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 6 minutes ago, Carborendum said: Uhmm. I want to preface this with the fact that this is not a "you're so stupid" comment. I'm honestly surprised that you wrote this. So, I need to take a step back and ask you what you do and don't know about this. Do you know the difference between the Power of the Holy Ghost and the Gift of the Holy Ghost? The Holy Ghost has always been a mystery, especially in LDS doctrine. Our doctrine is unique in that we teach he can only be in one place at a time and that he is also a single distinct personage. I have no problem with the idea of that until you put it into practice as the scriptures say. The difference with having the "gift" of the HG is that it gives us gifts such as utterence to speak with the tongue of angels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytebear Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 2 hours ago, Grunt said: I understand, but I know many people who are worthy of praise. I guess this is where I get confused. If we aren’t his peer, and I agree with that, then are there lesser Gods? There is no hierarchy of gods. We don't believe in a pantheon of gods. But we believe there is a state of being, which we can achieve where we will become like God. Again, think of the family analogy. There are countless families out there, but you have a very special relationship with your parents, with your spouse, with your children, unique to you. Even if there are countless other families out there with the same relationship to their parents/spouse/children. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytebear Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 Maybe if you think of God in mathematical terms. God is infinite. We are finite, but have the potential to be infinite, like God. Infinity + infinity = infinity. So we add to God, but God is still God. Jane_Doe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 19 minutes ago, anatess2 said: Unless you forgot to bring your fountain pen, then don't bother. I Lost it on this trip! zil 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 18 minutes ago, bytebear said: Why do you respect your mother and father above other people? I don’t view my relationship with God the same as my parents. It’s not the same to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anatess2 Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 2 minutes ago, Grunt said: I Lost it on this trip! How is that possible? You said you've been driving missionaries crazy not that YOU're crazy. (Lost it... get it? but, yeah, you seriously didn't really lose your fountain pen right? @zil will be in mourning for a decade.) zil 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt Posted November 30, 2017 Report Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 minute ago, anatess2 said: How is that possible? You said you've been driving missionaries crazy not that YOU're crazy. (Lost it... get it? but, yeah, you seriously didn't really lose your fountain pen right? @zil will be in mourning for a decade.) I did. It’s gone. zil 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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