New Church policy regarding Bishop and Stake President interviews

[Guest]

8 hours ago, person0 said:

Perhaps I missed some juicy details, but what exactly led you and JAG to suspect this?  Is it that they are both females from Australia who are undecided about their religious affiliation and who share similar opinions in this thread?  Or something else?

How about her utter refusal to answer any questions but continue in the path of complaint as if no explanations had been offered?

[anatess2]

13 hours ago, truthseaker said:

I said it was unethical for a bishop to counsel couples about their marriage, which I stand by.  I said it was unethical for a Bishop to counsel members about problems in their lives, which I stand by.  Its fine for a bishop to tell a church member to pray about their problems, but anything above that, in my opinion is unethical.

This is the main reason that Mormons (and Catholics, for that matter) advice each other to go to an LDS (or Catholic) professional counselor.  This complete disregard, even disrespect, for religious life is way too common in the world of mental health, especially in Australia.

Since you seem to be @Blossom76's sock puppet, do you also believe that Catholic Priests shouldn't counsel with their congregants on the matter of their marriage?

 

[NightSG]

11 hours ago, Just_A_Guy said:

If I had a dime for every time I'd heard the phrase "My therapist said I should . . .",

Probably not nearly as many times as Mirkwood hears "my lawyer said..."

Whether someone is court ordered into therapy, or goes voluntarily in order to be able to show the court they're trying to work past something, they should be applying whatever their therapist tells them, just as often as, if not more often than they should be applying their lawyer's advice.

[Vort]

9 minutes ago, NightSG said:

Whether someone is court ordered into therapy, or goes voluntarily in order to be able to show the court they're trying to work past something, they should be applying whatever their therapist tells them, just as often as, if not more often than they should be applying their lawyer's advice.

If you trust the therapist.

Real question: Are there cases where therapists are successfully sued for malpractice? Not overt horrible things, like sleeping with the client or encouraging illegal drug use or suicide, but malpractice because the advice and suggestions they gave the client were simply terrible and worsened the situation. Crappy lawyers, crappy doctors, and crappy auto mechanics can all be sued at law for botching their job. Teachers less so, but at least there's some accountability there. Is there any with psychologists?

[NeuroTypical]

Fun fact: In several states, you don't need any sort of training, education, or certification to call yourself a "counselor".  I mean, there are plenty of those things available, and a career path of sorts.  You hit X office hours, or get Y credential under your belt, you can justify charging an extra $10/hr.  But other than that, your ability to dispense advice and get paid for it, is limited only by your list of clients willing to pay.  Open a business and hang out a sign. 

I once knew an LMFT (Licensed Mariage/Family Therapist).  The conversation went like this:

Him: "I'm moving my office to a new building."

Me: "Are you moving to the second floor?"

Him: "...yes... Why does that matter?"

Me: "Because I'm going to open up my own office on the main floor and hang out a sign that just transposes a couple of letters in your last name.  I bet I can cover rent just from people who pay me because they think I'm you."

Him:  ...

Me: "Yeah, and I'll put a big sign by the stairs with a catchy phrase like [Dr. Nick voice] "Why climb those stairs to see Clarence Dean, I'm half of the price, and not near as mean!"

Him: ...

 

For a well-adjusted professional counselor, some of 'em sure lose their senses of humor pretty quickly.

 

 

[Full disclosure, the guy was a miracle worker, who literally saved lives and healed broken people every week. There's a big pile of happy healthy people out there who owe a lot of their healing to this guy, and many others like him.]

Edited March 28, 2018 by NeuroTypical

[askandanswer]

On 3/27/2018 at 4:03 PM, truthseaker said:

I understand, I think you are missing my point.  The point is no one should be going for counselling or referrals for counselling to someone not qualified to make that judgement.  A Bishop is not qualified to counsel people or refer people for further counselling to anyone else.  He shouldn't be involved in it at all.

I'm not sure if I should laugh at this statement or shake my head in amazement. It seems to place an unrealistic and perhaps even unwarranted importance on the value of formal qualifications and a sad lack of value on common sense and the guidance of the Spirit. I believe in the teaching that who the Lord calls, He qualifies. 

Edited March 28, 2018 by askandanswer

[NeuroTypical]

[Mod hat]

Ok folks, the mods have taken some action.  No need to discuss individual posters here any further.  Thanks!

[/hat]

[zil]

2 minutes ago, askandanswer said:

I'm not sure if I should laugh at this statement or shake my head in amazement. It seems to place an unrealistic and perhaps even unwarranted importance on the value of formal qualifications and a sad lack of value on common sense and the guidance of the Spirit. I believe in the teaching that who the Lord calls, He qualifies. 

This at least tells us that the disagreement was not entirely Australian norms vs. American norms.

[Grunt]

In many cases, I'd trust my bishop more than most shrinks.

[NightSG]

8 hours ago, Vort said:

If you trust the therapist.

Irrelevant until you can get the judge to approve changing therapists.

8 hours ago, Vort said:

Real question: Are there cases where therapists are successfully sued for malpractice?

There is malpractice insurance for counseling and therapy practices, from an impressive number of carriers, so I'd assume there are suits making it necessary.

8 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

Fun fact: In several states, you don't need any sort of training, education, or certification to call yourself a "counselor".

"Counselor" is one thing, while "licensed" or "certified" is (usually) a completely different thing.  AFAIK, most states, "certified" could mean one of the fly-by-night "accrediting organizations" that sends the certificate in the same envelope as the 3 DVD "training material" that's a thinly disguised 6 hour infomercial for their "gold level" training, while "licensed" means the state has at least verified you have insurance, haven't been banned from practicing in the state, etc. 

Some states require a 4 year degree for licensing.  Most will waive all of the above for clergy of any sort.  (Not sure whether a ULC or Church of the SubGenius ordination counts in many of those.)  I'm not aware of any that require a Masters or PhD for counselor licensing.  Of course, one can also get around all of the above by being a "life coach," which, last I checked, was completely unregulated in most states; it seems the only requirements, like regular coaching, are to be an abject failure at actually doing what you're coaching, and an epic lack of integrity.

[Sunday21]

21 hours ago, Vort said:

Here's to hoping @Dgal isn't another Blossom sock puppet.

Heck, here's to hoping I'm not another Blossom sock puppet.

No you are looking fine! I see no buttons for eyes and no evidence of that musty sock smell. Good to go!

[Sunday21]

12 hours ago, Grunt said:

In many cases, I'd trust my bishop more than most shrinks.

Oh my yes! Very sad story happened to a lovely person that I know...the marriage counselor persuaded her husband to have an affair.

i had counseling after a divorce. The counselor was a lovely person but had no success in persuading me to date men again. Eventually she started to suggest...I am sure you can guess! 

[Sunday21]

17 hours ago, Grunt said:

In many cases, I'd trust my bishop more than most shrinks.

Dup

Edited March 29, 2018 by Sunday21

[NightSG]

3 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

i had counseling after a divorce. The counselor was a lovely person but had no success in persuading me to date men again. Eventually she started to suggest...I am sure you can guess! 

Cats?  Needlepoint?  A bridge club?

[Vort]

2 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

Oh my yes! Very sad story happened to a lovely person that I know...the marriage counselor persuaded her husband to have an affair.

i had counseling after a divorce. The counselor was a lovely person but had no success in persuading me to date men again. Eventually she started to suggest...I am sure you can guess! 

Appalling but not surprising.

[zil]

2 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

Very sad story happened to a lovely person that I know...the marriage counselor persuaded her husband to have an affair.

And for that, this person should be banned for life from the profession worldwide (after sufficient evidence is provided, of course) - but the world doesn't understand why. 

[Just_A_Guy]

2 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

Oh my yes! Very sad story happened to a lovely person that I know...the marriage counselor persuaded her husband to have an affair.

i had counseling after a divorce. The counselor was a lovely person but had no success in persuading me to date men again. Eventually she started to suggest...I am sure you can guess! 

And if certain folks here had had their way, there would have been absolutely no one legally or “ethically” permitted to tell you what an absolutely crappy idea that was.

[The Folk Prophet]

I can just see the advertising campaign now:

DON'T TRUST MEN ANYMORE?

WHY NOT TRY A WOMAN?

Call Janathan Dimpleberry, PsyD. today!

1-800-555-XXXX

[Vort]

30 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

And if certain folks here had had their way, there would have been absolutely no one legally or “ethically” permitted to tell you what an absolutely crappy idea that was.

Fortunately, the main "certain folks here" is no longer here.

[person0]

52 minutes ago, Vort said:

Fortunately, the main "certain folks here" is no longer here.

Kind of sad really.  There was a moment there for a couple of weeks when 'certain folks' seemed to show promise and progress.  And then all of a sudden 'certain folks' no longer showed said progress.  

[NightSG]

1 hour ago, Vort said:

Fortunately, the main "certain folks here" is no longer here.

You'd certainly like us to believe that, wouldn't you?

Socks do come in pairs, after all.

[zil]

[Sunday21]

5 minutes ago, zil said:

?

[Vort]

27 minutes ago, NightSG said:

You'd certainly like us to believe that, wouldn't you?

Socks do come in pairs, after all.

It's called "deep cover". You won't penetrate it. No way.

[Vort]

42 minutes ago, person0 said:

Kind of sad really.  There was a moment there for a couple of weeks when 'certain folks' seemed to show promise and progress.  And then all of a sudden 'certain folks' no longer showed said progress.  

Not to be cynical, but realistically, it was all likely fake. I take nothing that "she" said with any credence at all.