IronMormon7

Why is the law of chastity still important for engaged couples (like myself and my fiance)?

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I'm an LDS girl engaged to an amazing LDS guy. We both served missions and both love the gospel. That being said, we are having a hard time with the law of chastity. I'm not sure if we've broken it, but if we haven't we've definitely played with the line. I think a big reason why I personally have had such a hard time is that I don't understand why it is important under the circumstances my fiance and I are in. We are committed to each other. We are going to get married. We love each other and likewise have strong sexual feelings for each other. We're not going to be sexual with just anyone. I honestly don't get why we have to wait until we're married to be sexual with each other. Furthermore, if I'm being honest, the times we've either crossed the line or gotten close I've really enjoyed it. I want to be sexual with my fiance, and I don't think that's a bad thing. 

Can anyone help me understand why the law of chastity is still important when two people are going to be married very soon, are very committed to each other, love each other, and want to be sexual with each other? What's the big difference between being sexual now and being sexual in a few months from now? I'd appreciate answers with more substance than 'it's a commandment'. I know it's a commandment (which is why I haven't had sex yet), but I would like to know if anyone has insight as to why its a commandment for two people in our given situation. 

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One reason, is because until the covenant is made, there isn't a covenant in place.   Up until that moment, either party is fully able to back out of the deal at any time, with or without reason.  And it happens.  

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4 hours ago, IronMormon7 said:

I'm an LDS girl engaged to an amazing LDS guy. We both served missions and both love the gospel. That being said, we are having a hard time with the law of chastity. I'm not sure if we've broken it, but if we haven't we've definitely played with the line. I think a big reason why I personally have had such a hard time is that I don't understand why it is important under the circumstances my fiance and I are in. We are committed to each other. We are going to get married. We love each other and likewise have strong sexual feelings for each other. We're not going to be sexual with just anyone. I honestly don't get why we have to wait until we're married to be sexual with each other. Furthermore, if I'm being honest, the times we've either crossed the line or gotten close I've really enjoyed it. I want to be sexual with my fiance, and I don't think that's a bad thing. 

Can anyone help me understand why the law of chastity is still important when two people are going to be married very soon, are very committed to each other, love each other, and want to be sexual with each other? What's the big difference between being sexual now and being sexual in a few months from now? I'd appreciate answers with more substance than 'it's a commandment'. I know it's a commandment (which is why I haven't had sex yet), but I would like to know if anyone has insight as to why its a commandment for two people in our given situation. 

The short answer is, it's the Lord's rule, not ours!  We don't make the rules, the Lord does.  Unfortunately, we also don't get to choose the consequence.  For someone who has been on a mission (and has presumably been through the temple), the consequences of breaking the law of chastity is, frankly, disaster (likely disfellowshipment if you repent, telestial kingdom if you don't).

If you are having a tough time keeping the law of chastity with your fiance, maybe you should consider getting your fiance and just going to the courthouse and getting married, today.  It may not be an ideal solution, but it is worlds better than trying to wait a couple of months and winding up breaking the law of chastity !

Edited by DoctorLemon

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Suppose you were going to buy a house.  You and the seller agreed that you could move in a month before the sale was finalized.  Everything was going fine, but then a week before the contract close, you found another house that you liked better.  Since you had not yet purchased the house, you bought the other house and moved in.  As a result, not only did you break the agreement with the seller, you used the sellers house in anticipation of the completion of the agreement, and now have unjustly treated the seller.  However, there is no law requiring you to compensate the seller, or to make amends in any way.

Until the marriage contract and covenant is enacted, there is no legal or spiritual binding or obligation to one another.

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4 hours ago, IronMormon7 said:

I'm an LDS girl engaged to an amazing LDS guy. We both served missions and both love the gospel.

Frankly I'm a little surprised that you even have to ask.  You really need to really think about the commitments that you made in the temple and what you are doing to uphold those commitments.

If your having such a hard time keeping your hands off of each other go get married now.

 

 

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4 hours ago, IronMormon7 said:

I'm not sure if we've broken it

Translating this into English, we get: "We've broken it short of intercourse, but don't want to face that fact."

IMO, go see your bishop(s) who can help you understand the seriousness of it.  Perhaps right after you go get a civil marriage to ensure you don't sin further.

I have also found that a detailed study (which is not the same as "reading scriptures", and which includes pondering, note taking, and more pondering) of something you think you understand will give you greater understanding.

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12 minutes ago, zil said:

Translating this into English, we get: "We've broken it short of intercourse, but don't want to face that fact."

IMO, go see your bishop(s) who can help you understand the seriousness of it.  Perhaps right after you go get a civil marriage to ensure you don't sin further.

I have also found that a detailed study (which is not the same as "reading scriptures", and which includes pondering, note taking, and more pondering) of something you think you understand will give you greater understanding.

Agreed!  If you have broken the law of chastity short of intercourse and you are already engaged, you should get a civil marriage right now, because frankly you likely aren't going to make it holding out for the temple (especially if the temple has to be delayed to allow for some repentance time).

This is actually kind of a good thing - once you are married civilly, you remove temptation from the equation, and you and your new husband can enjoy newlywed life and work together and help one another do any necessary repenting and work your way up to the temple.  If anyone (e.g., parents, siblings, friends, etc.) gives you grief about getting married civilly, you are an adult and it is none of their business.

You may be getting your married life started a little differently than the traditional getting married in the temple, but this is a good way to build a strong foundation for a long, happy, eternal marriage and is infinitely better than your current trajectory, which may very possibly end in fornication.

Edited by DoctorLemon

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5 hours ago, IronMormon7 said:

I'm an LDS girl engaged to an amazing LDS guy. We both served missions and both love the gospel. That being said, we are having a hard time with the law of chastity. I'm not sure if we've broken it, but if we haven't we've definitely played with the line. I think a big reason why I personally have had such a hard time is that I don't understand why it is important under the circumstances my fiance and I are in. We are committed to each other. We are going to get married. We love each other and likewise have strong sexual feelings for each other. We're not going to be sexual with just anyone. I honestly don't get why we have to wait until we're married to be sexual with each other. Furthermore, if I'm being honest, the times we've either crossed the line or gotten close I've really enjoyed it. I want to be sexual with my fiance, and I don't think that's a bad thing. 

Can anyone help me understand why the law of chastity is still important when two people are going to be married very soon, are very committed to each other, love each other, and want to be sexual with each other? What's the big difference between being sexual now and being sexual in a few months from now? I'd appreciate answers with more substance than 'it's a commandment'. I know it's a commandment (which is why I haven't had sex yet), but I would like to know if anyone has insight as to why its a commandment for two people in our given situation. 

Keep in mind that temple marriage is NOT a covenant between you and your husband to be faithful to one another. It is a covenants between you and God and him and God and within that covenant are MANY promises made, many of which contain the promise to be faithful to one another. 

So the idea of you two choosing each other is only a small part of what is happening in the temple marriage. While being sealed, you will be looking at the sealer, not each other, when you say the infamous “yes” 

Sex has two purposes. To bring a husband and wife together, and to have a family. It is NOT to be used as tool to bringing two friends together, two lovers together, two fiancés together. It is to be used to strength the bond of a couple have already made the necessary Covenants with God.

I recommend the following. Talk to your bishop, participate in temple sealings for the dead and learn about the covenants you will make in marriage.

Edited by Fether

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You don't quit living the law of chastity after you get married. On the contrary, it gets even more important. Don't make a mockery of your most intimate relationship by prostituting your sexuality for your own gratification. You will lose the Spirit of God for such solemn mockery, as will your fiance. He will have no power in the Priesthood. You will be refusing the blessings of God in order to gratify your sex organs. Don't do it. You were a missionary. Go back and review all that stuff you taught people for 18 months.

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We must not rely on "the world's wisdom" to make our decisions, but it can be reaffirming when they agree with us. Sociologists tell us that when couples live together they develop a relationship in which either party can bail when s/he feels the arrangement is not working out. For people of faith, who learn that sex before marriage is prohibited, it's easy to argue that breaking the Law of Chastity is a version of living together. Marriage, and its accompanying covenants, just don't mean as much once a pattern of "I can leave at any time" is established.

Then, of course, there is Genesis 2 (which Jesus quoted), in which we are told that the man and woman first leave their mothers and fathers (that meant marriage back then), and THEN become one flesh.  God's Word is just smart business--including the family.

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10 hours ago, IronMormon7 said:

I'm an LDS girl engaged to an amazing LDS guy. We both served missions and both love the gospel. That being said, we are having a hard time with the law of chastity. I'm not sure if we've broken it, but if we haven't we've definitely played with the line. I think a big reason why I personally have had such a hard time is that I don't understand why it is important under the circumstances my fiance and I are in. We are committed to each other. We are going to get married. We love each other and likewise have strong sexual feelings for each other. We're not going to be sexual with just anyone. I honestly don't get why we have to wait until we're married to be sexual with each other. Furthermore, if I'm being honest, the times we've either crossed the line or gotten close I've really enjoyed it. I want to be sexual with my fiance, and I don't think that's a bad thing. 

Can anyone help me understand why the law of chastity is still important when two people are going to be married very soon, are very committed to each other, love each other, and want to be sexual with each other? What's the big difference between being sexual now and being sexual in a few months from now? I'd appreciate answers with more substance than 'it's a commandment'. I know it's a commandment (which is why I haven't had sex yet), but I would like to know if anyone has insight as to why its a commandment for two people in our given situation. 

For starters: YEAH for you engagement--- that's super exciting!!   

For seconds: also welcome to the site :)

It is a GREAT thing that you are attracted to your future husband and he to you.   Marriage is also a great thing, wherein two people fully give themselves to each other and become one.  

 

Now I have a question for you: why have you not gotten married today?  What is the reason you are not walking down to the courthouse and saying "I do" right now?  Why are you not one completely (legally, financially, spiritually, sexually, etc) right now?

Those reasons are the reason you are not one right now, and the reason you should not engage in sexual activities.  You two are still two.

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How can two return missionaries not understand the Law of Chastity or the importance of it?

This puzzles me.

When investigators asked the same question...what did you tell them?

I would think two return missionaries already KNOW the answer to the question...thus I am puzzled why it is even being asked.

Because (as per your statement) you are two returned missionaries who may have taught investigators this same principle on your missions...I'm probably going to sound a lot harsher than I do normally to people who may ask a question like this.

12 hours ago, IronMormon7 said:

I know it's a commandment (which is why I haven't had sex yet), but I would like to know if anyone has insight as to why its a commandment for two people in our given situation. 

The fact that it is a commandment is FAR more substantial than ANYTHING else.  However...for two people in your given situation...simply put...because you ARE NOT MARRIED YET.

This is an act ONLY for married people.  The reason is that it can bring about children into the world...which are supposed to be brought up by a committed Father and Mother.  That means, two people that are Married to each other.  Until you ARE married, there is NO guarantee (as many others have pointed out above me) that you will be married.  Countless couples have backed away from this commitment even at the altar itself.  Until you are married, this act is NOT approved of by the Lord. 

If you DO NOT get married to the individual...you also could be seen as breaking the covenants that you have promised to a future spouse.  They are NOT the ONE that you have been committed to.  In addition, you have also betrayed the Lord in your covenants and promises.  By not keeping it a sacred act between a husband and wife...you have tossed the sacred in the mud by making it unholy and disdaining the things the Lord has ordained.

It is popular in the world today to throw away the things of the Lord and do as one wishes.  Thus, it is more common today for people to not follow the law of chastity and instead live together or other immoral actions prior to marriage.  They do NOT see problems with breaking these laws of heaven.  AS followers of the Lord, we are to follow his commandments and do as he would have us do. 

AS others have stated...just go and get a civil marriage now.  Immediately if possible.  Going to the temple in this state could possibly be showing a disdain for the commitments of the Lord even more.  Get a Civil Marriage immediately and then you don't have to worry about the temptation (at least with that person...just because one is married does NOT mean temptations go away).  Get married and be done with it.

Edited by JohnsonJones

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14 hours ago, IronMormon7 said:

I'm an LDS girl engaged to an amazing LDS guy. We both served missions and both love the gospel. That being said, we are having a hard time with the law of chastity. I'm not sure if we've broken it, but if we haven't we've definitely played with the line. I think a big reason why I personally have had such a hard time is that I don't understand why it is important under the circumstances my fiance and I are in. We are committed to each other. We are going to get married. We love each other and likewise have strong sexual feelings for each other. We're not going to be sexual with just anyone. I honestly don't get why we have to wait until we're married to be sexual with each other. Furthermore, if I'm being honest, the times we've either crossed the line or gotten close I've really enjoyed it. I want to be sexual with my fiance, and I don't think that's a bad thing. 

Can anyone help me understand why the law of chastity is still important when two people are going to be married very soon, are very committed to each other, love each other, and want to be sexual with each other? What's the big difference between being sexual now and being sexual in a few months from now? I'd appreciate answers with more substance than 'it's a commandment'. I know it's a commandment (which is why I haven't had sex yet), but I would like to know if anyone has insight as to why its a commandment for two people in our given situation. 

I'm going to be blunt because the cloud of hormones and emotions you are in shields your conscience to a degree.

How many couples have felt as you do, either on the night they meet or soon after or while engaged, yet wind up not getting married to each other.  You don't think he'll back out or that you will, but so did all those others who went and had sex while engaged then had the engagement fall apart.  How do you think they felt when they found out they gave their virginity to somebody who won't be marrying them after all?  How do you they felt having to confess what happened later on to the person they actually do marry? 

Your sexuality is the most God like power you have in mortality.  What makes sexual relations permissible in the eyes of God is not your emotions or how committed you feel, it is the covenant you make with God and each other.    You have not made that covenant, so sexual relations are not permissible yet.  God gave you those feelings to lead you into marriage where they can and should be expressed.  God has set the standard and he did that knowing how you (and every other engaged couple) feel and the desires you experience.  Do you trust him enough to deny your desires for a short time? 

Sexual self control is important for married people too.  If years down the road your husband said he felt so in love and so committed to some other woman would you then be OK with him sleeping with her?  Of course not, he would be violating a covenant.  Likewise you have both made covenant at baptism to follow Christ, andsince you both have been endowed already there is a very clear covenant about the law of chastity made in the temple you both made.

If you have had oral sex, or manual sex, dry humped or fondled each other's sexual parts through clothing or not then you certainly have crossed the line and need to see your Bishop pronto.  The fact that you are engaged will more than likely make the path to repentance easier but you still need to repent of anything like that if you did it.  Taking the sacrament unworthily is a serious thing, how much more so for temple ordinances?  How valid do you think God will view you marriage covenant if you make it while unworthy to be in the temple? Do you think you can expect his blessing when you break his commandments?

As for enjoying it, it is designed to be enjoyable, but that doesn't make it right and doesn't mean there won't be a price to pay down the road.   It is a physical reaction, a reflex.  Tickle somebody and they laugh even if they are sad.  Your feelings and desires and hormones and what you expect in the future do not define what is right and wrong, so don't try to use those things to justify what you know is a violation of God's commands.

If it really is that big a problem, repent then get married the day the Bishop clears you or as soon after as humanly possible.

Edited by Latter-Day Marriage

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Alma told Shiblon to bridle his passions. This is one reason it's important to remain chaste while engaged, the main reason being you both made promises to God that you would. Unlike those who are suggesting you head for the courthouse, I'm going to suggest you run for the hills until you and he BOTH have learned to bridle your passions. Fast together, at the same time and for the same purpose, as this will help you. Limit alone time. No kissing unless you're both wearing shoes. Do whatever it takes to curb your sexual appetites. You can feast once you're married.

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6 hours ago, seashmore said:

I'm going to suggest you run for the hills

As long as they are separate hills. ;)

I tend to agree with you - if they can manage it, but so far, they've proven they can't manage it...

6 hours ago, seashmore said:

Fast together, at the same time and for the same purpose

But not at the same location.

6 hours ago, seashmore said:

No kissing unless you're both wearing shoes.

Pffff.  That ain't gonna stop nuthin.

Never being alone together - i.e. out of the sight of other humans - that will stop things, but I find it doubtful anything else will - these drives, given into this far, are beyond powerful.

Edited by zil
My opinion, obviously, but I can't recall hearing stories that contradict it.

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23 hours ago, DoctorLemon said:

If you are having a tough time keeping the law of chastity with your fiance, maybe you should consider getting your fiance and just going to the courthouse and getting married, today.  It may not be an ideal solution, but it is worlds better than trying to wait a couple of months and winding up breaking the law of chastity !

I like that solution...beware though. We had a couple In our old ward who did that and told everyone. They were a laughing stock. Couldn't wait 2 more weeks. Just wait till ur married in the temple.

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6 minutes ago, paracaidista508 said:

I like that solution...beware though. We had a couple In our old ward who did that and told everyone. They were a laughing stock. Couldn't wait 2 more weeks. Just wait till ur married in the temple.

"A laughing stock"?  Why?  They did what they needed to do in order to keep the commandments.  What are people laughing about?  They (the gossip mongers) are the ones who need to repent.

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2 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

"A laughing stock"?  Why?  They did what they needed to do in order to keep the commandments.  What are people laughing about?  They (the gossip mongers) are the ones who need to repent.

Repent??? The kids announced it to everyone who would listen. It isnt gossip.

We cant wait for two more weeks to have sex were getting married now!!! People were dying laughing at them.

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9 minutes ago, paracaidista508 said:

Repent??? The kids announced it to everyone who would listen. It isnt gossip.

We cant wait for two more weeks to have sex were getting married now!!! People were dying laughing at them.

You're gossiping about them here.  Why were people laughing at them?  What did they do wrong?

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1 minute ago, Carborendum said:

You're gossiping about them here.  Why were people laughing at them?  What did they do wrong?

You don't see any humor in them running around talking about how badly they have to have sex now??? That is literally what they were saying...as for gossip. A...I'm not naming them and B...heard it from them as did everyone else. It's true. They literally went around telling people this because they felt they should tell everyone why they cancelled the sealing. Nice way of saying thanks for your RSVP, but we have to go knock boots now.

It was ridiculous....people literally were asking them they couldn't wait two more weeks and they just laughed. 

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27 minutes ago, paracaidista508 said:

I like that solution...beware though. We had a couple In our old ward who did that and told everyone. They were a laughing stock. Couldn't wait 2 more weeks. Just wait till ur married in the temple.

I think that is very sad.  The couple in your ward were just trying to take care of themselves and avoid a really bad situation.  Getting married under such circumstances is honorable, not a subject for ridicule.

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4 minutes ago, paracaidista508 said:

You don't see any humor in them running around talking about how badly they have to have sex now??? That is literally what they were saying...as for gossip. A...I'm not naming them and B...heard it from them as did everyone else. It's true. They literally went around telling people this because they felt they should tell everyone why they cancelled the sealing. Nice way of saying thanks for your RSVP, but we have to go knock boots now.

It was ridiculous....people literally were asking them they couldn't wait two more weeks and they just laughed. 

I think I'm beginning to see what you're saying.  I was thrown off by your original phrasing.

31 minutes ago, paracaidista508 said:

beware though. We had a couple In our old ward who did that and told everyone. They were a laughing stock.

So, you're not criticizing their decision to get married civilly per se.  it was the fact that they decided to tell everyone about their decision and the reason behind it, that was probably not the wisest thing.

Edited by Guest

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32 minutes ago, paracaidista508 said:

I like that solution...beware though. We had a couple In our old ward who did that and told everyone. They were a laughing stock. Couldn't wait 2 more weeks. Just wait till ur married in the temple.

OK I read the rest of your posts.  They should not have told everyone with ears, what they did, because frankly it ain't anyone else's business!  What is that saying - don't show your dirty laundry?

Edited by DoctorLemon

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Just now, DoctorLemon said:

I think that is very sad.  The couple in your ward were just trying to take care of themselves and avoid a really bad situation.  Getting married under such circumstances is honorable, not a subject for ridicule.

Sure ...that's why I replied they may want to beware. 

When they told me I was like are you serious? You can't wait two more weeks? They said nope and I was like well ok ...whatever.

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