"As Man Is, God Once Was..."


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Guest Starsky

Originally posted by lindy9556@Apr 12 2004, 06:24 PM

Yes, I do understand the problem, I was once one of those non member Church investigator's searching for the answers to questions like that.

And I have learned that I will know the answers to all of the unanswered questions that I have had, that you have had, and that many others have had, when God gives us the answers. "As man is, God once was" that is one of the questions I don't dwell over, one that I just accept as one of those statement/questions that will be answered.

"As God is, man may become" A missionary told me like he would have told a child, but it was in terms that I could understand. I'm sure that you have heard the analogy of the king and his royal family, that the family members would inherit positions and responsibilities, (being of the royaly family) only after they have proven their worth to the king. I liked that analogy. That the king, being a gracious and fair ruler of the kingdom, chose those who would carry on in his footsteps, the goals and aspirations of what he wanted to acheive for his people.

Of course that is my opinion as a working class female with no degree.

Again well put Lindy.

I think Ammon is the one who isn't getting the 'key' points of his own discussion. Like when he assumed my 'not giving him credibility' was the same as me stating that I would 'not be replying to his posts.

LOL

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Guest Starsky
Originally posted by Ammon+Apr 12 2004, 06:25 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Ammon @ Apr 12 2004, 06:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Starsky@Apr 12 2004, 07:22 PM

That was a hogs belly full! LOL :lol: You definitely are a scribe.

More insults? :rolleyes: Let us be civil and Christlike, shall we?

That wasn't an insult....it was a statement of fact...do you think that Christ wasn't being Christ like when he called the scribes and pharasees hypocrites? Liers? Or suggested that putting doctrine to them was like throwing pearls before SWINE?

How unChrist like can one get? hmmmm?

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Guest Ammon
Originally posted by Starsky+Apr 12 2004, 07:28 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Starsky @ Apr 12 2004, 07:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--lindy9556@Apr 12 2004, 06:24 PM

Yes, I do understand the problem, I was once one of those non member Church investigator's searching for the answers to questions like that.

And I have learned that I will know the answers to all of the unanswered questions that I have had, that you have had, and that many others have had, when God gives us the answers.  "As man is, God once was" that is one of the questions I don't dwell over, one that I just accept as one of those statement/questions that will be answered.

"As God is, man may become"  A missionary told me like he would have told a child, but it was in terms that I could understand. I'm sure that you have heard the analogy of the king and his royal family, that the family members would inherit positions and responsibilities, (being of the royaly family) only after they have proven their worth to the king. I liked that analogy. That the king, being a gracious and fair ruler of the kingdom, chose those who would carry on in his footsteps, the goals and aspirations of what he wanted to acheive for his people.

Of course that is my opinion as a working class female with no degree.

Again well put Lindy.

I think Ammon is the one who isn't getting the 'key' points of his own discussion. Like when he assumed my 'not giving him credibility' was the same as me stating that I would 'not be replying to his posts.

LOL

You wish enter a war of words with counsel? :blink: Note that I stated, "if you wish to not respond...." Thus, I suggested that you not respond further, as opposed to making the assumption that you would not. My "adieu" was a very strong hint, which you apparently missed.

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Guest Ammon
Originally posted by Starsky+Apr 12 2004, 07:30 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Starsky @ Apr 12 2004, 07:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by -Ammon@Apr 12 2004, 06:25 PM

<!--QuoteBegin--Starsky@Apr 12 2004, 07:22 PM

That was a hogs belly full! LOL :lol: You definitely are a scribe.

More insults? :rolleyes: Let us be civil and Christlike, shall we?

That wasn't an insult....it was a statement of fact...do you think that Christ wasn't being Christ like when he called the scribes and pharasees hypocrites? Liers? Or suggested that putting doctrine to them was like throwing pearls before SWINE?

How unChrist like can one get? hmmmm?

Making judgment on others, putting oneself in the place of Christ, and putting Christ's words out of context are a good start. So far, you've done quite well. Do you wish to see how many more commandments you can manage to break?

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Guest Starsky
Originally posted by Ammon+Apr 12 2004, 06:31 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Ammon @ Apr 12 2004, 06:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by -Starsky@Apr 12 2004, 07:28 PM

<!--QuoteBegin--lindy9556@Apr 12 2004, 06:24 PM

Yes, I do understand the problem, I was once one of those non member Church investigator's searching for the answers to questions like that.

And I have learned that I will know the answers to all of the unanswered questions that I have had, that you have had, and that many others have had, when God gives us the answers.  "As man is, God once was" that is one of the questions I don't dwell over, one that I just accept as one of those statement/questions that will be answered.

"As God is, man may become"  A missionary told me like he would have told a child, but it was in terms that I could understand. I'm sure that you have heard the analogy of the king and his royal family, that the family members would inherit positions and responsibilities, (being of the royaly family) only after they have proven their worth to the king. I liked that analogy. That the king, being a gracious and fair ruler of the kingdom, chose those who would carry on in his footsteps, the goals and aspirations of what he wanted to acheive for his people.

Of course that is my opinion as a working class female with no degree.

Again well put Lindy.

I think Ammon is the one who isn't getting the 'key' points of his own discussion. Like when he assumed my 'not giving him credibility' was the same as me stating that I would 'not be replying to his posts.

LOL

You wish enter a war of words with counsel? :blink: Note that I stated, "if you wish to not respond...." Thus, I suggested that you not respond further, as opposed to making the assumption that you would not. My "adieu" was a very strong hint, which you apparently missed.

Twisting words around to suit you is very much in harmony with your lawyer profession...but doesn't wash with me.

Now...as for people who put out hints instead of straight communication? Well I believe you are suffering from 'emotional' hang-ups...maybe you should check with a professional therapist.

I don't take or give hints. I state it like it is. I don't turn others or my own words around to suit....I just shoot straight from the hip.

Try it sometime...you would be amazed at the therapudic effect it has on your mental state.

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Originally posted by Ammon@Apr 12 2004, 06:01 PM

You see, the antimormon sites, which claim to be "Christian" sites, and which our Church's investigators are reading in record numbers due to powerful search engines like Google,

Do you realize that even now, companies with vast financial resources like Yahoo and Microsoft are developing new technologies that will create even more powerful search and query engines? Whatever will the Church do? Where will we turn? How will we survive.

Our very survivial depends upon the apologetic efforts of people just like you, without whom we would surely succumb (can I say that word in public?) to the lying hatemonger of the antiMormons.

I mean geeze Ammon, get a grip. It's either the Lord's church or its not. If it is, try and and take the panic out of your voice.

Try here:

http://www.fairlds.org/apol/misc/misc09.html

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I am an active member of the Canyon Country First Ward of the Santa Clarita Stake of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.

I was at magic Mountain just last week!

I currently serve as the financial clerk, hold a temple recommend, and attend church regularly.  My forefathers were converted and left Herefordshire, England in the mid-1800s, came across the plains, and settled in the Weber Valley of Northern Utah.  I accordingly have a long heritage in The Church.

Ahhh, England and Northern Utah...that explains a lot. :lol::P

I served a Spanish-speaking mission in San Diego California under President Christensen from 1990-1992.  And I've served as both a stake and ward missionary.  More importantly, my testimony in The Church is strong.

Si, si...comprendo. If I'm off base I apologize...but the tone and tenor of you posts have made me suspicious.

I also have a desire to do missionary work, which includes correcting false teachings regarding our Church on the Net so that investigators who study our Church by lurking on the Net read what we really believe.  I do this via visiting various other Christian websites that preach falsehoods about our Church.  On occasion, I will hit a snag and come here for help so that I might help those who lurk and investigate the Church.  So far, I've had many who have approached me in private with sincere interest in the Church from that which I write.  Thus, I feel that I am doing my task as a member missionary.

IMSHO, the best way to do missionary work is to share the Gospel and allow them to gain a witness of the spirit. Have them read the Book of mormon and pray w/ a sincere heart.

That is who I am and what I want.

Esta bien, gracias

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Originally posted by Snow+Apr 12 2004, 10:02 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Snow @ Apr 12 2004, 10:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Ammon@Apr 12 2004, 06:01 PM

You see, the antimormon sites, which claim to be "Christian" sites, and which our Church's investigators are reading in record numbers due to powerful search engines like Google,

Do you realize that even now, companies with vast financial resources like Yahoo and Microsoft are developing new technologies that will create even more powerful search and query engines? Whatever will the Church do? Where will we turn? How will we survive.

Our very survivial depends upon the apologetic efforts of people just like you, without whom we would surely succumb (can I say that word in public?) to the lying hatemonger of the antiMormons.

I mean geeze Ammon, get a grip. It's either the Lord's church or its not. If it is, try and and take the panic out of your voice.

Try here:

http://www.fairlds.org/apol/misc/misc09.html

First of all, nice shoes Snow. And if Ammon approaches anyone with the same sort of overexcited (enthusiastic?) attitude outside the board, what kind of representative of the LDS church is he being? :o

Just a thought.

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I also have a desire to do missionary work, which includes correcting false teachings regarding our Church on the Net so that investigators who study our Church by lurking on the Net read what we really believe.  I do this via visiting various other Christian websites that preach falsehoods about our Church.  On occasion, I will hit a snag and come here for help so that I might help those who lurk and investigate the Church.  So far, I've had many who have approached me in private with sincere interest in the Church from that which I write.  Thus, I feel that I am doing my task as a member missionary.

That is who I am and what I want.

Hi Ammon,

<grin>

There are a lot of "snags"...

But concerning apologetics... when it goes to the personal level rather than professional responses, people are turned off to any denomination. The Christianity forum are just that... question and answer forums, or discussion panels. They aren't designed to be whipping posts for individuals with personal insults.

It has been interesting to "watch" this thread (and others).... It appears that when a question is raised that criticizes the CoJCoLDS's, the criticism is re-directed to the person rather than the issue.

Personally, I like your responses....

~serapha~

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BTW....

I just "rejoice" and say, "Thank you, Jesus"... when I see "ugliness" and "nastiness" on the internet presented as a Christian walk for a JW or a LDS, or others who are not mainstream Christians... Who wants to be that type of Christian... one that is noted for being "ugly"????

and BTW... I did say, "Thank you, Jesus" several times while reading these responses.

And on the other hand, it saddens me to see mainstream Christians behave in the same manner... being "ugly" and thinking that they are presenting something that someone might want. No one wants "ugly".

Ammon... twhite is the most impressive LDS I have had the pleasure of having discussions with.... Never condemning, always patient....

~serapha~

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Guest Starsky

Originally posted by serapha@Apr 13 2004, 07:54 AM

I also have a desire to do missionary work, which includes correcting false teachings regarding our Church on the Net so that investigators who study our Church by lurking on the Net read what we really believe.  I do this via visiting various other Christian websites that preach falsehoods about our Church.  On occasion, I will hit a snag and come here for help so that I might help those who lurk and investigate the Church.  So far, I've had many who have approached me in private with sincere interest in the Church from that which I write.  Thus, I feel that I am doing my task as a member missionary.

That is who I am and what I want.

Hi Ammon,

<grin>

There are a lot of "snags"...

But concerning apologetics... when it goes to the personal level rather than professional responses, people are turned off to any denomination. The Christianity forum are just that... question and answer forums, or discussion panels. They aren't designed to be whipping posts for individuals with personal insults.

It has been interesting to "watch" this thread (and others).... It appears that when a question is raised that criticizes the CoJCoLDS's, the criticism is re-directed to the person rather than the issue.

Personally, I like your responses....

~serapha~

Now that should make Ammon really proud. He has pleased the anti-mormon Christian.....

There are a few points made I would like to emphasize...

First: Teaching the gospel on any other level than spiritual is wrong.

Second: When one of 'our' own puts up questionable material in the guise of getting answers and then throws the answers he gets out, you have to wonder where he really is coming from.

Third: I believe the fact that an anti is pleased with Ammon's answers tells it all....don't you?

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Guest Ammon

Starsky, I'm not sure why you insist on being so bitter and vindictive toward me, but I would ask that you simply not reply to my threads going forward; because it appears that all you seek to do at this point is make harsh personal attacks against me, which I find wholly unproductive and unChristlike. :(

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Guest Ammon

Originally posted by serapha@Apr 13 2004, 09:38 AM

Ammon... twhite is the most impressive LDS I have had the pleasure of having discussions with.... Never condemning, always patient....

~serapha~

twhite is a good man with far more patience than any internet personality than I know.
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Guest Ammon
Originally posted by Snow+Apr 12 2004, 10:02 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Snow @ Apr 12 2004, 10:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Ammon@Apr 12 2004, 06:01 PM

You see, the antimormon sites, which claim to be "Christian" sites, and which our Church's investigators are reading in record numbers due to powerful search engines like Google,

Do you realize that even now, companies with vast financial resources like Yahoo and Microsoft are developing new technologies that will create even more powerful search and query engines? Whatever will the Church do? Where will we turn? How will we survive.

Our very survivial depends upon the apologetic efforts of people just like you, without whom we would surely succumb (can I say that word in public?) to the lying hatemonger of the antiMormons.

I mean geeze Ammon, get a grip. It's either the Lord's church or its not. If it is, try and and take the panic out of your voice.

Try here:

http://www.fairlds.org/apol/misc/misc09.html

I have "a grip." Even if one soul is lost because of the false writings of these so-called "Christian" sites, the loss is tragic. The worth of one soul is great, is it not? My efforts are not to "save the Church" as you insulting suggest, but to save souls... one at a time. That's the way missionary work is done. I've already had success in what I do. And I will continue to do it. And even if all my efforts add a net total of one soul to our ranks, my efforts are worth it.

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Guest Starsky

Originally posted by Ammon@Apr 13 2004, 10:56 AM

Starsky, I'm not sure why you insist on being so bitter and vindictive toward me, but I would ask that you simply not reply to my threads going forward; because it appears that all you seek to do at this point is make harsh personal attacks against me, which I find wholly unproductive and unChristlike. :(

You are the one who is vindictive and in the wrong here. I have only pointed that out. You ned to change what you are doing or I will not stop telling you that you are working for the wrong side in the wrong way.

I am a moderator here....one of the rules is that you don't put out stuff that is offensive to the majority of posters...not counting the anti-mormon posters.

Before I came up on your posts, I read a few other posters posts who were questioning your intent.....I read closer and found that I also questioned your intent....

Now you can consider yourself warned.....you start putting out like you are who you say you are and doing what you say you are doing, or you will be put on Mod status and the moderators will decide if you posts are post worthy.

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Guest Starsky

We disagree here and there...but we are still friends! That is the way of it...

I wonder if those in the Christian discussion board are all true friends or just get along buddies.....

IOW only buddies if they are in total agreement all the time.... :rolleyes:

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Originally posted by serapha@Apr 13 2004, 07:54 AM

But concerning apologetics... when it goes to the personal level rather than professional responses, people are turned off to any denomination. The Christianity forum are just that... question and answer forums, or discussion panels. They aren't designed to be whipping posts for individuals with personal insults.

It has been interesting to "watch" this thread (and others).... It appears that when a question is raised that criticizes the CoJCoLDS's, the criticism is re-directed to the person rather than the issue.

Za know, every once in a while you stumble upon a post that is so pretentious and delusory that you should just let is pass, sure that everyone easily sees just how hornswoggled the post is. This is probably one of those posts, but even though it is tempting, I won't let this one pass.

What a bunch of bovine corprolith!

These types want to be free to attack you in the most possible terms possible by denigrating your religious tenets, calling your scripture fraudulent, your prophets criminal, your connection to your Savior fallacious, and your faith bankrupt and then pretend to get all huffety when you are offended by their very personal offense.

...and to top it off they have the audacity to passive-agressively respond by saying that the ones whom they are personally attacking are taking the low-road by taking offense at the attack.

Right.

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"Any more takers want to take a swing or two at the original post questions?"

Im your huckleberry. ;)

Four possibilities:

1. Prez is just too dang old. He couldn't remember it, and so tried to talk around it.

2. Like has been said before, he didn't want to get into the theology on TV. (Cause it is a heretical doctrine after all...)

3. He's hoping to change LDS beliefs to move the church into a more mainstream christianity.

4. Prez has lost the spirit and is an apostate. He is the "man of sin" spoken of in the NT, and no longer holds the keys of the priesthood. (that's a Mormon Fundamentalist perspective, by the way.)

Jason

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