Do you bother dressing modestly at home?


Lee
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1 minute ago, Fether said:

 

The argument you are making us absolutely idiotic. If we had it your way, modesty wouldn’t be a thing and men and women could walk around in underwear everywhere, cause apparently it isn’t your job to control the thoughts of men, but that isn’t what modesty is, even though you keep saying it is.

as quoted before “Modesty is an attitude of propriety and decency in dress, grooming, language, and behavior.”

Also

”Central to the command to be modest is an understanding of the sacred power of procreation, the ability to bring children into the world. This power is to be used only between husband and wife. Revealing and sexually suggestive clothing, which includes short shorts and skirts, tight clothing, and shirts that do not cover the stomach, can stimulate desires and actions that violate the Lord’s law of chastity.” - LDS gospel Library Topics

So yes, according to the Church if Jesus Christ of Latter-Day saints, you do need to watch what you wear to help others keep their thoughts clean.

But it appears you are atheist so that doesn’t matter does it.

What makes walking around in underwear indecent? What makes walking around in swimmers indecent? What makes walking around in a sleeveless top or form-fitting skirt indecent?

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12 minutes ago, Bini said:

What makes walking around in underwear indecent? What makes walking around in swimmers indecent? What makes walking around in a sleeveless top or form-fitting skirt indecent?

“Prophets have always counseled us to dress modestly. This counsel is founded on the truth that the human body is God’s sacred creation. We must respect our bodies as a gift from God. Through our dress and appearance, we can show the Lord that we know how precious our bodies are.
Our clothing expresses who we are. It sends messages about us, and it influences the way we and others act. When we are well groomed and modestly dressed, we can invite the companionship of the Spirit and exercise a good influence on those around us.
Central to the command to be modest is an understanding of the sacred power of procreation, the ability to bring children into the world. This power is to be used only between husband and wife. Revealing and sexually suggestive clothing, which includes short shorts and skirts, tight clothing, and shirts that do not cover the stomach, can stimulate desires and actions that violate the Lord’s law of chastity.
In addition to avoiding clothing that is revealing, we should avoid extremes in clothing, appearance, and hairstyle. In dress, grooming, and manners, we should always be neat and clean, never sloppy or inappropriately casual. We should not disfigure ourselves with tattoos or body piercings. Women who desire to have their ears pierced should wear only one pair of modest earrings.” - LDS Gospel Library>Topics>Topics

What makes all that indecent, your chest, upper thighs, and butt cheeks hanging out. Whether it is skin or not, it’s still there for the world to see

Edited by Fether
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2 minutes ago, Fether said:

“Prophets have always counseled us to dress modestly. This counsel is founded on the truth that the human body is God’s sacred creation. We must respect our bodies as a gift from God. Through our dress and appearance, we can show the Lord that we know how precious our bodies are.
Our clothing expresses who we are. It sends messages about us, and it influences the way we and others act. When we are well groomed and modestly dressed, we can invite the companionship of the Spirit and exercise a good influence on those around us.
Central to the command to be modest is an understanding of the sacred power of procreation, the ability to bring children into the world. This power is to be used only between husband and wife. Revealing and sexually suggestive clothing, which includes short shorts and skirts, tight clothing, and shirts that do not cover the stomach, can stimulate desires and actions that violate the Lord’s law of chastity.
In addition to avoiding clothing that is revealing, we should avoid extremes in clothing, appearance, and hairstyle. In dress, grooming, and manners, we should always be neat and clean, never sloppy or inappropriately casual. We should not disfigure ourselves with tattoos or body piercings. Women who desire to have their ears pierced should wear only one pair of modest earrings.” - LDS Gospel Library>Topics>Topics

What makes all that indecent, your chest, upper thighs, and butt cheeks hanging out. Whether it is skin or not, it’s still there for the works to see

Sexually suggestive clothing to who? Women function just fine at the pool or beach with shirtless men, but heaven forbid, a woman wears a bikini or tankini around men in the same circumstances. It is a harmful concept. 

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1 hour ago, Lee said:

I don't usually comment on how women dress but today my wife and I were lounging around the house all day so my wife was wearing short shorts and a vest top like what you would work out in. In the afternoon my friend was coming over to watch a game, so I told my wife she may want to get dressed she said she was already dresses, so I told her she may want to cover up a bit and she told me she doesn't have to in her own house and she thinks I am out of line asking her to. I like to walk around my house shirtless but if my wife has friends over I put a shirt on. Was I in the wrong for asking my wife to get changed because I had a friend coming over? Do you bother to dress modestly at home ?

Before I even think about responding to your first question I find myself wondering how well you and your wife know each other. In response to your second question (as it was asked) sometimes I stay in my shirt and tie for a while, other times I walk around stark naked for awhile. It's situational, hahaha. Want to get to know me better? Hahahaha :D

 

Edited by Mike
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1 minute ago, Bini said:

Sexually suggestive clothing to who? Women function just fine at the pool or beach with shirtless men, but heaven forbid, a woman wears a bikini or tankini around men in the same circumstances. It is a harmful concept. 

Male and female bodies aren't the same.

We just aren't going to agree on this because our beliefs are founded in our religion and you don't believe in it. You aren't going to accept our answers, and we aren't going to accept your justifications.   

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Just now, Grunt said:

Male and female bodies aren't the same.

We just aren't going to agree on this because our beliefs are founded in our religion and you don't believe in it. You aren't going to accept our answers, and we aren't going to accept your justifications.   

Of course, our bodies are not the same. But men are held accountable just as much as women are, yes? Someone, please explain to me why the female body is sexualised and the male body is not.

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2 minutes ago, Bini said:

Sexually suggestive clothing to who? Women function just fine at the pool or beach with shirtless men, but heaven forbid, a woman wears a bikini or tankini around men in the same circumstances. It is a harmful concept. 

I think that’s the point. Guys tend to be more susceptible to sexual desires. If I knew a girl was tempted to do evil when she saw me wearing a casual v-neck shirt, out of kindness to her, I would stop wearing that v-neck shirt.

As much as you hate the idea of women needing to be modest for men’s sake, it is in fact partly the reason.

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1 minute ago, Bini said:

Of course, our bodies are not the same. But men are held accountable just as much as women are, yes? Someone, please explain to me why the female body is sexualised and the male body is not.

No idea, but it doesn’t matter. If next year women start seeing elbows as men see porn, We would need to start wearing long sleeved shirts. I would do it gladly

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Just now, Fether said:

I think that’s the point. Guys tend to be more susceptible to sexual desires. If I knew a girl was tempted to do evil when she saw me wearing a casual v-neck shirt, out of kindness to her, I would stop wearing that v-neck shirt.

As much as you hate the idea of women needing to be modest for men’s sake, it is in fact partly the reason.

That is pure crap.

Men are not more susceptible to sexual desires. 

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2 minutes ago, Bini said:

Of course, our bodies are not the same. But men are held accountable just as much as women are, yes? Someone, please explain to me why the female body is sexualised and the male body is not.

Yes, men (should be) held accountable just as much as women. Why is the female body sexualized? I think It's obvious, but I wonder if you're asking something different than the obvious.

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2 hours ago, Lee said:

I don't usually comment on how women dress but today my wife and I were lounging around the house all day so my wife was wearing short shorts and a vest top like what you would work out in. In the afternoon my friend was coming over to watch a game, so I told my wife she may want to get dressed she said she was already dresses, so I told her she may want to cover up a bit and she told me she doesn't have to in her own house and she thinks I am out of line asking her to. I like to walk around my house shirtless but if my wife has friends over I put a shirt on. Was I in the wrong for asking my wife to get changed because I had a friend coming over? Do you bother to dress modestly at home ?

https://www.lds.org/handbook/handbook-2-administering-the-church/selected-church-policies?lang=eng#21.1.42

Quote
 

Temple Clothing and Garments

...

Endowed members should wear the temple garment both day and night. They should not remove it, either entirely or partially, to work in the yard or for other activities that can reasonably be done with the garment worn properly beneath the clothing. Nor should they remove it to lounge around the home in swimwear or immodest clothing. When they must remove the garment, such as for swimming, they should put it back on as soon as possible.

Members should not adjust the garment or wear it contrary to instructions in order to accommodate different styles of clothing. Nor should they alter the garment from its authorized design. When two-piece garments are used, both pieces should always be worn.

 

IMO, this counsel is clear and no other counsel should be needed / followed. (Emphasis mine.)

Edited by zil
Wow, copying from HB2 does weird things.
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6 minutes ago, Bini said:

Someone, please explain to me why the female body is sexualised and the male body is not.

Because you live in Antarctica, or in the jungles of Borneo, or at the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean, or on the surface of the moon, or somewhere else that isn't 21st-century America, where literally everything is sexualized, including the male human body.

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Just now, Fether said:

No idea, but it doesn’t matter. If next year women start seeing elbows as men see porn, We would need to start wearing long sleeved shirts. I would do it gladly

It doesn't matter if you'd wear a cardboard box, it should never be a requirement because you are not responsible for other's thoughts or actions. The focus of stopping unclean thoughts and sinful actions should be directed to the offender. What can the offender do to stop being a pervert or offender? 

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4 minutes ago, Vort said:

Because you live in Antarctica, or in the jungles of Borneo, or at the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean, or on the surface of the moon, or somewhere else that isn't 21st-century America, where literally everything is sexualized, including the male human body.

Bodies are sexualised regardless of gender. However, women's bodies are largely more sexualised than men's bodies, and women pay the price for men not being able to control their thoughts and actions. We are told how to carry ourselves and how to dress, instead of, the dialogue addressing the issue that men are responsible for what they do.

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24 minutes ago, Bini said:

Men are not more susceptible to sexual desires. 

I realize that sexual desire is not the province of only one sex, and I also realize that it's not equally spread out between people. No doubt there are many individual cases of married couples where the wife has a greater sexual desire than the husband. But surely you must realize that on the whole, this is an uncommon situation. Surely you see that in general, within our society, men are much more susceptible to sexual desires than women. For example, pornography for females is a thing, but it is dwarfed by the presence of male-directed porn. Whether this is biological, psychological, societal, or some combination of those, that's how it is.

As for this topic: I agree with you that, obviously, we are responsible for our own desires. I suspect you will get no argument against that point. But we are our brother's keepers, or at least we are our brother's brothers (and sisters). Asking a women to dress more modestly in an effort to help a man doesn't seem beyond the pale, any more than asking a brother to keep his voice quiet or avoid certain words or phrases to avoid offending a sister would be outrageous. We are supposed to support each other.

Modesty encompasses a whole lot more than what we wear. Somehow, discussions on modesty seem always to devolve into whether sleeveless dresses are appropriate or how low-cut your dress can safely be. It would be nice to have a modesty discussion that was more encompassing and less focused on clothing. But seeing as how the very word "modesty" has been co-opted to mean "conservative dress", and given that men (in general) are VERY MUCH more susceptible to sexual desires than are women (in general), it is predictable that almost all such discussions will end up being lectures to young women on how to dress in more appropriate ways.

I'm not particularly happy about that, but I don't think railing against it will solve much. I teach my own daughter what I think, so I'm pretty sure she knows my values. That way, I don't worry so much about what other people are saying.

Edited by Vort
Condescending much? I didn't mean it to sound that way...
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5 minutes ago, Bini said:

Bodies are sexualised regardless of gender. However, women's bodies are largely more sexualised than men's bodies, and women pay the price for men not being able to control their thoughts and actions. We are told how to carry ourselves and how to dress, instead of, the dialogue addressing the issue that men are responsible for what they do.

I understand where you are coming from with your idea.  Since we don't live in a perfect world and we can't control peoples thoughts we have to do our best to follow the Lord's admonitions to be modest.

Men and women are different Bini :C 

“Men’s greater sex drive may be partially due to the fact that their sexual motivation pathways have more connections to the subcortical reward system than in women” [or, in short] “men’s brains are designed to objectify females.”

This was taken from a 2012 psychology today article. Just as a quick reference to how men and woman are indeed different

Do i get what you are saying?  YES, I understand. God was able to see Adam and Eve naked just fine (regardless of the fact that they are his children)  but we aren't on that level XD

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2 hours ago, Lee said:

I don't usually comment on how women dress but today my wife and I were lounging around the house all day so my wife was wearing short shorts and a vest top like what you would work out in. In the afternoon my friend was coming over to watch a game, so I told my wife she may want to get dressed she said she was already dresses, so I told her she may want to cover up a bit and she told me she doesn't have to in her own house and she thinks I am out of line asking her to. I like to walk around my house shirtless but if my wife has friends over I put a shirt on. Was I in the wrong for asking my wife to get changed because I had a friend coming over? Do you bother to dress modestly at home ?

I dress the same way at home as I do out in public. Because I’m an endowed member my clothing is modest. Because of that, the shorts I own are knee shorts. All my shirts have sleeves. I do have some tank tops, but I wear those under particular shirts that are slightly see-through. It helps them become modest.

As for asking your wife if she was going to get changed, IMO, it depends on how you worded it. If my husband tells (orders) me to change my clothes, or, if he words it in such a manner that I’m put on the defensive, I’m going to resist the suggestion and be somewhat defiant. I don’t like being told what to do.😏  If he asks me in a nonchalant voice “is that what you’re wearing?” I will take a look at what I’m wearing and decide for myself if I need to change.

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Guest MormonGator
2 hours ago, Lee said:

I don't usually comment on how women dress but today my wife and I were lounging around the house all day so my wife was wearing short shorts and a vest top like what you would work out in. In the afternoon my friend was coming over to watch a game, so I told my wife she may want to get dressed she said she was already dresses, so I told her she may want to cover up a bit and she told me she doesn't have to in her own house and she thinks I am out of line asking her to. I like to walk around my house shirtless but if my wife has friends over I put a shirt on. Was I in the wrong for asking my wife to get changed because I had a friend coming over? Do you bother to dress modestly at home ?

First off, what game were you going to watch? 

Second, when it comes to my house I usually wear athletic pants and a t shirt. In public I will wear shorts or pants, so I do dress differently in public than I do in private. I also go to nudist resorts a lot where clothes are optional. 

It's her house too, so in my view you don't really have a right to tell her how to dress there, even if there is company coming over. 
 

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Just now, MormonGator said:

It's her house too, so in my view you don't really have a right to tell her how to dress there, even if there is company coming over. 

A husband always has the right to question his wife's dress choices. Whether exercising that right is a wise idea is a completely different question, often with the opposite answer.

From Lee's description, it sounds like his wife was not nude or seminude, or prancing around the house in her underwear or a bikini. So if she feels good about wearing such clothing casually (i.e. apparently not wearing the temple garment), then I'm not quite sure how company coming over changes that equation.

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Just now, Vort said:

A husband always has the right to question his wife's dress choices. Whether exercising that right is a wise idea is a completely different question, often with the opposite answer.

If you say so. It's not how we run our marriage. I can't imagine telling LG what to wear or what not to wear,  but whatever works for us doesn't work for everyone. 

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Just now, MormonGator said:

If you say so. It's not how we run our marriage. I can't imagine telling LG what to wear or what not to wear,  but whatever works for us doesn't work for everyone. 

I don't believe I have ever questioned my wife's choice of dress in 30 years of marriage. I certainly have that right as her husband, but I have yet to exercise it. Why? Many reasons, the principal of which is that I like being married and prefer to continue the association.

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Just now, Vort said:

 I like being married and prefer to continue the association.

Yeah, with your personality I'd suggest you do whatever possible to keep Mrs. Vort happy.That you found a woman who can put up with you is a miracle in itself! 

(playing!) 

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2 hours ago, Lee said:

I don't usually comment on how women dress but today my wife and I were lounging around the house all day so my wife was wearing short shorts and a vest top like what you would work out in. In the afternoon my friend was coming over to watch a game, so I told my wife she may want to get dressed she said she was already dresses, so I told her she may want to cover up a bit and she told me she doesn't have to in her own house and she thinks I am out of line asking her to. I like to walk around my house shirtless but if my wife has friends over I put a shirt on. Was I in the wrong for asking my wife to get changed because I had a friend coming over? Do you bother to dress modestly at home ?

Yes, I dress modestly at home. I try to be a good example to my children. And I generally believe in being by brother’s keeper and helping to bear the burdens of others. I personally see the attitude of “I’m comfortable the way I am and others just have to deal with that” to be very selfish. I think it’s more important to show respect for others. I always appreciate it when people show respect to me, so I try to do my part.

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1 hour ago, Bini said:

Of course, our bodies are not the same. But men are held accountable just as much as women are, yes? Someone, please explain to me why the female body is sexualised and the male body is not.

Umm . . .human nature anyone?

Same reason why billboards have scantily clad women on them, why magazines have them, etc. B/c the male brain is hardwired for sex!  For those who don't believe in God, it's actually really easy to think of in terms of evolutionary science.

You can certainly claim all you want to you are not responsible for men's thoughts but if you wear sultry clothing into an all-male club you are going to get comments and looks, catcalls, etc. You might as well as howl at the moon wanting to change it.

Why are men the heaviest consumers of visual pornography? Hardly any man alive would seriously read romance novels, but tons of women do . . .it's porn for women.  Why . . .b/c men and women are wired differently that's why!

So you can either get on a pedestal and claim that men are evil b/c they sexualize the female body, or simply recognize it's human nature how men are hardwired.  Now I'm not saying men shouldn't control their thoughts or passions, but just to recognize that it's a freaking struggle to do so! A little compassion towards men might go a long way . . .

Edited by dellme
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