Marriage 101 FOR DUDES. From a totally unqualified man


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3 minutes ago, JayKi said:

Most people do yes. I have 4 sister and I expect any man who want to marry them to ask me for at least my blessing if not permission. 

Optional blessing i get.  Shows respect - and respect is great.  A horrible relationship with MIL/FIL can really mess things up.

But i really don't get permission - where the parent gets the final word.  People are not property.  

Do you support a society in which the parent would be able to prevent a child from making their own choice in terms of who they can marry?  Not an accusation, just a request for clarification.  i actually don't think you do - you are just explaining Costa Rican society, right?

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Just now, lostinwater said:

Optional blessing i get.  Shows respect - and respect is great.  A horrible relationship with MIL/FIL can really mess things up.

But i really don't get permission - where the parent gets the final word.  People are not property.  

Do you support a society in which the parent would be able to prevent a child from making their own choice in terms of who they can marry?  Not an accusation, just a request for clarification.  i actually don't think you do - you are just explaining Costa Rican society, right?

Well in America at least, there is no way in heck that another person is property so I view that segment of the argument as moot. Legally another person can marry someone even if both sets of parents say no. Heck, they'll still give you a temple recommend. But it depends on the person you are with. I would be a person where permission/approval is 100% the final word. (Unless I got a vision from heaven telling me to disregard my fam's wishes or something.) As a kid my mom did not always get along with my dad's side, my dad did not click with my mom's side, and even my mom didn't click with her own side. My happiest memories were spent at grandparents with cousins so it broke my heart to be withheld from making memories because of my parents' disdain for whatever was going on in the family at the time. In fact, about two weeks ago I was dating a man recently as we started putting a timeline on marriage but found out my dad did NOT approve. Broke my heart but we both decided to end it.

And if there was a country that would prevent someone from marrying based on parental approval I would not call that an abuse of human rights and additionally would support their right to keep that legislation. If the lovers are dead set God wants them to marry against their parents' wishes, they can run away to a country like America. Love will find a way (;

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6 minutes ago, Lee said:

Children are a blessing in some way but it wasn't a blessing I was hoping for. I am not ready to share my life with another person. 

That's such a heavy emotion you are dealing with.  i am so sorry.

All i can suggest is to maintain some hope that when you first hold that child in your arms everything will change.  Everything i've seen indicates that the little rug rats grow on you after a while :).  

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17 minutes ago, lostinwater said:

Do you support a society in which the parent would be able to prevent a child from making their own choice in terms of who they can marry?  Not an accusation, just a request for clarification.  i actually don't think you do - you are just explaining Costa Rican society, right?

To me asking for blessing and permission are same thing because if I dont get blessing then I wont propose until I do. If I were to propose without proving myself then it would show I am no real man. When men ask me to marry my sister if I say no I expect them to prove they are worthy if they decide no to respect my decision that is his choice but I wont respect his engagment to my sister and he wont be family to me. Luckily, except my older sister my sister are respectful of my opinion so they will follow my instruction of whether they marry or not with the man. 

 

But I do not support anyone being anyone else property, you can not control another person and should no try to. But to guide them is okay

Edited by JayKi
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5 minutes ago, lostinwater said:

That's such a heavy emotion you are dealing with.  i am so sorry.

All i can suggest is to maintain some hope that when you first hold that child in your arms everything will change.  Everything i've seen indicates that the little rug rats grow on you after a while :).  

I have contingency plans to ensure I can be a husband and father but from a distance

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8 hours ago, Lee said:

I am not excited about having my life destroyed and likely I will love my mother more.

I hope you can have a change of heart at some point. I wish you well. My wife had poor health which caused us to wait on having kids. Even after the wait, I was stressed about finances when my wife first told me we were expecting. I wanted to be really excited, and I was, but I was also terrified. I think that's normal to have some concern about how things will change. In any event my kids are a great source of joy and I love them. They give my life more purpose than I had before and I hope that you and yours can be blessed in the same manner.

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8 hours ago, Lee said:

Children are a blessing in some way but it wasn't a blessing I was hoping for. I am not ready to share my life with another person. 

Why do you think that? That you're not ready to share your life with another person? From what I've read, you're married. You're sharing your life with your wife, aren't you? Why do you think you won't be ready to share your life with that child?

Edited by BeccaKirstyn
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@Lee from reading your post, both past and present, I think you need reevaluate your thoughts and feelings on marriage and family and seek councel for areas that you struggle in. From what I've read you think:

A. Your marriage is disposable ( past post)

B. It's ok to love your mom more than your wife 

C. Children are a burden

D. Being a distant father and husband is acceptable.

If you want to build an eternal family, I suggest you talk to your bishop about these feeling and see if he can help you. 

Edited by miav
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11 hours ago, BeccaKirstyn said:

Why do you think that? That you're not ready to share your life with another person? From what I've read, you're married. You're sharing your life with your wife, aren't you? Why do you think you won't be ready to share your life with that child?

I share my life with lots of people, my parents, my wife, my friends, my nephew etc. It is the intensity of sharing my life with a child that I don't want to do. The magnitude of having to care for and worry about this child at least until they are 18 but likely the rest of my life. It is terrifying 

Edited by Lee
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9 hours ago, miav said:

@Lee from reading your post, both past and present, I think you need reevaluate your thoughts and feelings on marriage and family and seek councel for areas that you struggle in. From what I've read you think:

A. Your marriage is disposable ( past post)

B. It's ok to love your mom more than your wife 

C. Children are a burden

D. Being a distant father and husband is acceptable.

If you want to build an eternal family, I suggest you talk to your bishop about these feeling and see if he can help you. 

I don't believe that my marriage is disposable

I can't stop loving my mother just because I am married

I am sure you agree that children are a burden, not saying there aren't benefits of having children but there is a burden involved

It is better to be a distant father and husband then to be completely absent 

 

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11 hours ago, SpiritDragon said:

I hope you can have a change of heart at some point. I wish you well. My wife had poor health which caused us to wait on having kids. Even after the wait, I was stressed about finances when my wife first told me we were expecting. I wanted to be really excited, and I was, but I was also terrified. I think that's normal to have some concern about how things will change. In any event my kids are a great source of joy and I love them. They give my life more purpose than I had before and I hope that you and yours can be blessed in the same manner.

I am nervous because I don't want to mess up my child's life. How did your children give your life more purpose?

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42 minutes ago, Lee said:

I don't believe that my marriage is disposable

I can't stop loving my mother just because I am married

I am sure you agree that children are a burden, not saying there aren't benefits of having children but there is a burden involved

It is better to be a distant father and husband then to be completely absent 

 

Go back and read your thread about when to have a child, you definitely said you could reverse your marriage if you no longer loved your wife or she no longer loved you.  That means your marriage really doesn't mean much and you believe it's disposable. Your marriage will never hold if you continue to think that.

 

Of course you don't stop loving your mom after you marry, but you need to love your wife more. One you decide to marry someone that person becomes the number one person you live and care about.

 

I do not believe children are burden, they are a blessing.

 

Sure it's better than being an absent father but it's BEST to be a father who is involved and takes a part in raising and loving their child/children. Many problems we have today are because men do not step up and raise their children or expect the mother to do everything and not be involve. Children need a father in their life who is actively involved in their upbringing. 

 

Again, I think bringing these up to your bishop is a good idea, he can help you work through them and help you become a better husband and father.

Edited by miav
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33 minutes ago, Lee said:

I am nervous because I don't want to mess up my child's life. How did your children give your life more purpose?

Well when they first come along they are completely reliant on their parents, and so the opportunity (and responsibility) to serve them has really given me more purpose or meaning in life by helping me feel more needed and important than ever before. It's true that it's also the perspective I've chosen to approach it from, I could look at them as burdens and just be frustrated with their mother all the time that she doesn't do everything so that I don't have to be bothered. I've chosen to be a part of my kids lives in everything from diaper changes to bedtime stories, happy snuggles to unhappy disciplinary action. I don't love every minute of it, but I do love the journey overall.

Before kids came along, sure I had my wife to take care of, but she didn't rely on me the same way. I suppose I just feel that I'm where I'm supposed to be in God's plan with children in my life. It's like my progression was thwarted, and now I'm learning more about love and service than I ever had the capacity to before. It helps me to better understand the bond that our Heavenly Father must have with us.

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2 hours ago, Lee said:

I share my life with lots of people, my parents, my wife, my friends, my nephew etc. It is the intensity of sharing my life with a child that I don't want to do. The magnitude of having to care for and worry about this child at least until they are 18 but likely the rest of my life. It is terrifying 

It is terrifying, you're definitely right there. And that's a completely valid feeling. But you're judging your ability to be a good father before you've even become one (I know it's soon cause your wife is pregnant). If you approach this new life responsibility as something you're not going to like and not going to be good at before it has even started, then you're dooming yourself for failure. But if you approach it by saying: "I'm scared. I feel inadequate. I feel like I won't be good enough. BUT I will try to be adequate, I will try to be good enough. I will try to love my child the best way I know how. " It's okay to feel inadequate, but you have to keep trying to be better each day (in regards to anything in this life--but in this scenario, being a father). 

I see why you're saying children are a burden--at least I think I do. Your life is not your own anymore once they enter this world. And before they do, that can seem burdensome. There is a lot of research that shows mothers bond with their babies before they are born, and fathers bond with their babies once they are born. So it's not uncommon to feel like you don't really want this child/don't feel connected to it/love it just yet. But don't hold those feelings in your heart as your "end all be all" with how you're going to view this child. Give yourself the chance to love it, care for it, and nurture it. You do have the ability to be a great father because you are made in the image of our Heavenly Father. 

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4 hours ago, miav said:

Go back and read your thread about when to have a child, you definitely said you could reverse your marriage if you no longer loved your wife or she no longer loved you.  That means your marriage really doesn't mean much and you believe it's disposable. Your marriage will never hold if you continue to think that.

 

Of course you don't stop loving your mom after you marry, but you need to love your wife more. One you decide to marry someone that person becomes the number one person you live and care about.

 

I do not believe children are burden, they are a blessing.

 

Sure it's better than being an absent father but it's BEST to be a father who is involved and takes a part in raising and loving their child/children. Many problems we have today are because men do not step up and raise their children or expect the mother to do everything and not be involve. Children need a father in their life who is actively involved in their upbringing. 

 

Again, I think bringing these up to your bishop is a good idea, he can help you work through them and help you become a better husband and father.

I was misinterpreted I'm sure you acknowledge your marriage is reversible. 

Who but you says I can't love my mother the most?

can a blessing not carry some burden?

i agree it is better to be a full time parent. I'm just saying I have a plan to be a part time father if it doesn't work out so I can still be a father and husband.

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3 hours ago, BeccaKirstyn said:

It is terrifying, you're definitely right there. And that's a completely valid feeling. But you're judging your ability to be a good father before you've even become one (I know it's soon cause your wife is pregnant). If you approach this new life responsibility as something you're not going to like and not going to be good at before it has even started, then you're dooming yourself for failure. But if you approach it by saying: "I'm scared. I feel inadequate. I feel like I won't be good enough. BUT I will try to be adequate, I will try to be good enough. I will try to love my child the best way I know how. " It's okay to feel inadequate, but you have to keep trying to be better each day (in regards to anything in this life--but in this scenario, being a father). 

I see why you're saying children are a burden--at least I think I do. Your life is not your own anymore once they enter this world. And before they do, that can seem burdensome. There is a lot of research that shows mothers bond with their babies before they are born, and fathers bond with their babies once they are born. So it's not uncommon to feel like you don't really want this child/don't feel connected to it/love it just yet. But don't hold those feelings in your heart as your "end all be all" with how you're going to view this child. Give yourself the chance to love it, care for it, and nurture it. You do have the ability to be a great father because you are made in the image of our Heavenly Father. 

I have cared for a child before, when my nephew was born I was in the delivery room and I lived with my sister in law to help her care for him. I found it too hard and even though she needed my help I left. I loved my sister in law and nephew but I couldn't do it. My nephew lives with me now he is 8 and I still find it hard to care for him. I know I'm not ready to be a parent and I'd rather leave than mess up my child's life. 

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5 minutes ago, Lee said:

Who but you says I can't love my mother the most?

There are only two people in scripture we are commanded to love with all your heart, might, mind, and strength - God and your wife.

When speaking of a husband and wife being one, it is described thusly (emphasis mine):

Quote

Genesis 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

And it's described that way over, and over, and over (click "thusly").

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13 minutes ago, zil said:

There are only two people in scripture we are commanded to love with all your heart, might, mind, and strength - God and your wife.

When speaking of a husband and wife being one, it is described thusly (emphasis mine):

And it's described that way over, and over, and over (click "thusly").

Madame I wanted to agree with this. It sounds excellent. Review this command that we were all given

https://www.lds.org/scriptures/nt/matt/22.35-40

But I still give you trophy

* I also saw your italics but I am sure we are supposed to love everyone. Feel free to roast me back [ON THIS POST]

Edited by Overwatch
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4 minutes ago, Overwatch said:

Madame I wanted to agree with this. It sounds excellent. Review this command that we were all given

https://www.lds.org/scriptures/nt/matt/22.35-40

But I still give you trophy

* I also saw your italics but I am sure we are supposed to love everyone. Feel free to roast me back [ON THIS POST]

It doesn't say to love your neighbor or yourself with all your heart, might, mind, and strength - just God.

And yes, we are supposed to love everyone.  And yet, that "all" language is used strictly for God and wife.  What any given person wants to do with that is their business.

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Just now, zil said:

It doesn't say to love your neighbor or yourself with all your heart, might, mind, and strength - just God.

And yes, we are supposed to love everyone.  And yet, that "all" language is used strictly for God and wife.  What any given person wants to do with that is their business.

I actually clicked on your link and it made total sense.

This never happened

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33 minutes ago, zil said:

There are only two people in scripture we are commanded to love with all your heart, might, mind, and strength - God and your wife.

 When speaking of a husband and wife being one, it is described thusly (emphasis mine):

And it's described that way over, and over, and over (click "thusly").

do you think is sin to love your mother more than wife ?

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Just now, JayKi said:

do you think is sin to love your mother more than wife ?

It's not my job to define sin or try to determine whether a person is sinning.  Go read the scriptures.  Ask God.  I'm just pointing out what the scriptures say (that are relevant to Lee's question, so that he can ponder and pray for himself).

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Just now, zil said:

It's not my job to define sin or try to determine whether a person is sinning.  Go read the scriptures.  Ask God.  I'm just pointing out what the scriptures say (that are relevant to Lee's question, so that he can ponder and pray for himself).

@JayKi that is a no.

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