Freemasonry (edited)

[Traveler]

2 hours ago, wenglund said:

There is also the precursor to Free Masons--i.e Rosicrucianism, which appears to be a Christian outgrowth from mid-eastern mysticism, like Kabbalah, both of which have varying amounts of adherents today.. 

What I find most fascinating, though, isn't so much the sacred found among secret societies, but what has been hidden in plain sight, particularly among royalty, European especially. Take for instance the Coronation of Queen Elizabeth II, which, if I recall correctly, is an ancient ritual dating back to the 4th century AD , most notably the anointing and Investiture ceremonies, which seem eerily reminiscent of one of our own temple rituals with similar purpose.

I am of the opinion that the two may have the same, if not similar ancient origins.

But, don't tell Dan Brown because he will likely distort it to an ungodly extent. (Pun intended)

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

 

There is a form of Theravada Buddhism taught in remote areas of the Himalayas that practice a ritual initiation that is also similar that include a new name and covenant attire.  Also if a LDS person was to visit a Buddhist cemetery they would encounter statues of Buddha in interesting poses.  When I asked about the poses I was informed that they are sacred and that the full meaning is not known or to be disclosed.

 

The Traveler

[mordorbund]

5 hours ago, LadyGator said:

I’ve grown up around Masons and Shriners and it’s just a harmless adult fraternity

 

[BJ64]

In Nauvoo there is a Masonic Hall that dates to the time of Joseph Smith. However if you visit it now you will find it called the Cultural Hall. It seems that someone wants to distance the church from freemasonry. 

[mordorbund]

5 minutes ago, BJ64 said:

In Nauvoo there is a Masonic Hall that dates to the time of Joseph Smith. However if you visit it now you will find it called the Cultural Hall. It seems that someone wants to distance the church from freemasonry. 

Yes..... even the Illuminati are embarrassed to be associated with the Mormons.

[NeedleinA]

24 minutes ago, BJ64 said:

In Nauvoo there is a Masonic Hall that dates to the time of Joseph Smith. However if you visit it now you will find it called the Cultural Hall. It seems that someone wants to distance the church from freemasonry. 

Who is the "someone" that you speak of?
When I was in Nauvoo they had a newspaper article hanging on the wall of the bakery next door talking about the Masonic ties of the Cultural Hall.
In addition, if someone is trying to hide this fact, they aren't doing a very good job at it since it is sitting in the Church's newspaper?

Edited August 10, 2018 by NeedleinA

[BJ64]

12 minutes ago, NeedleinA said:

Who is the "someone" that you speak of?
When I was in Nauvoo they had a newspaper article hanging on the wall of the bakery next door talking about the Masonic ties of the Cultural Hall.
In addition, if someone is trying to hide this fact, they aren't doing a very good job at it since it is sitting in the Church's newspaper?

From the Historic Nauvoo website. 

Perhaps things have changed but when I was there for the Nauvoo temple open house any mention of it being a Masonic Hall was conspicuously absent. 

[BJ64]

Deleted 

Edited August 10, 2018 by BJ64
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[BJ64]

However, if you read the book Nauvoo A Place of Peace a People of Promise you will discover that most of the history of that time is conspicuously absent from teachings about church history. 

[BJ64]

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Edited August 10, 2018 by BJ64

[NeedleinA]

On LDS.org, simply type "Masonic Hall" in the search block and watch the conspiracy theory evaporate.

Church History in the Fulness of Times Student Manual - Chapter 19

Quote

The three-story Masonic hall, also called the cultural hall, was used for theatrical productions, concerts, Masonic ceremonies, political gatherings, art exhibits, funerals, banquets, and court sessions. Church, military, and police meetings were also held in this impressive building.

“Maps,” Doctrine and Covenants Student Manual (2002), viii–xvi  - Masonic Hall (top square)

Etc. Etc. Etc.

 

[BJ64]

1 hour ago, NeedleinA said:

On LDS.org, simply type "Masonic Hall" in the search block and watch the conspiracy theory evaporate.

Church History in the Fulness of Times Student Manual - Chapter 19

“Maps,” Doctrine and Covenants Student Manual (2002), viii–xvi  - Masonic Hall (top square)

Etc. Etc. Etc.

 

Does the sign out front mention Masonic Hall and do the missionaries make mention of it? It didn’t and they didn’t when I was there. 

[john4truth]

If there is anything good we seek after it. Marsall Hays Houston Temple president says there are no rules concerniy Freemasonry. I have went all the way through. I am a Knights Templar and member of the York Rite College. I am not offended with discussion.There is some false docrine concerning membership. Less informed claim Joseph Smith was not a Mason. missionaries really hurt their standing by opposing Freemasonry. Our area is ran by Freemasonry by taking care of the needy with no membership required. I feel comfortable saying the local Lodge helps the needy more than all other groups combined. As long as you don't make it your religion is an an aid in being Christ like. 

 

[NeedleinA]

6 hours ago, BJ64 said:

Does the sign out front mention Masonic Hall and do the missionaries make mention of it? It didn’t and they didn’t when I was there. 

Enjoy

 

 

Edited August 10, 2018 by NeedleinA

[BJ64]

That’s s new sign. Thank you for posting it. 

[Grunt]

17 hours ago, LadyGator said:

@MormonGator is right, you have to be male to be a Mason, however there are several groups for women and girls. Ladies can be members of Eastern Star as well as Amaranth. Men can also be members of both of these groups but I believe you have to be a Mason. Young ladies can become members of The International Order of the Rainbow for Girls (IORG) or Job’s Daughters. All of these groups have Masonic affiliation there is also a young men’s group called DeMolay. I’ve grown up around Masons and Shriners and it’s just a harmless adult fraternity, and Gator and I have met one or two that are LDS.

👋

[NeedleinA]

1 hour ago, BJ64 said:

That’s s new sign. Thank you for posting it. 

When were you there, what year?

[Just_A_Guy]

14 minutes ago, NeedleinA said:

When were you there, what year?

He said Nauvoo Temple dedication; so that would have been what, 2002-ish?

Also:  based on a tour of the Beehive House I took about 5 years ago . . . Well, suffice it to say, whatever information you get from the missionaries giving tours of any of the Church’s historic sites is likely to  be . . . ahem . . . general.  These are not trained historians, they didn’t request the assignments they have, and—speaking anecdotally—they see history as a means to the end of proselytizing; rather than a worthy interest in its own right.  I’d love to see that change; but for now—it apparently is what it is (or was); and it just reminds us that we shouldn’t be looking to the Church to spoon-feed us our historical dogma.

Edited August 10, 2018 by Just_A_Guy

[anatess2]

38 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

He said Nauvoo Temple dedication; so that would have been what, 2002-ish?

Also:  based on a tour of the Beehive House I took about 5 years ago . . . Well, suffice it to say, whatever information you get from the missionaries giving tours of any of the Church’s historic sites is likely to  be . . . ahem . . . general.  These are not trained historians, they didn’t request the assignments they have, and—speaking anecdotally—they see history as a means to the end of proselytizing; rather than a worthy interest in its own right.  I’d love to see that change; but for now—it apparently is what it is (or was); and it just reminds us that we shouldn’t be looking to the Church to spoon-feed us our historical dogma.

But, but... that means.... they're hiding it!!!

[NeedleinA]

3 hours ago, BJ64 said:

That’s s new sign.

1 hour ago, Just_A_Guy said:

He said Nauvoo Temple dedication; so that would have been what, 2002-ish?

BYU Digital Collections show the sign there back in 2002
https://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/digital/collection/RelEd/id/4241/rec/4

 

Edited August 10, 2018 by NeedleinA

[BJ64]

2 hours ago, Just_A_Guy said:

He said Nauvoo Temple dedication; so that would have been what, 2002-ish?

Also:  based on a tour of the Beehive House I took about 5 years ago . . . Well, suffice it to say, whatever information you get from the missionaries giving tours of any of the Church’s historic sites is likely to  be . . . ahem . . . general.  These are not trained historians, they didn’t request the assignments they have, and—speaking anecdotally—they see history as a means to the end of proselytizing; rather than a worthy interest in its own right.  I’d love to see that change; but for now—it apparently is what it is (or was); and it just reminds us that we shouldn’t be looking to the Church to spoon-feed us our historical dogma.

Yes I was there in 2002. 

Speaking of church historic sight tours things have changed a lot from say thirty years ago. 

Living not that far from Salt Lake I have been to the Beehive House many times. In the old days it was Relief Society volunteers who gave historical tours of the house and explained its construction, its use and modifications over time, what was done in the restoration, how the drapery fabric and carpets were reproduced and so forth. One lady who gave us a tour once had been involved in the restoration and told us about climbing around in the basement and attic. 

Now sister missionaries who know almost nothing about the house give the tour which is not much more than a missionary discussion. 

When we went to Nauvoo and saw the sights along the way we discovered that every church site has been turned into a missionary opportunity. While that may be beneficial for the church it anoyed is a bit because we were in a hurry and just wanted to see the sights without having to wait for the next tour group so that we could sit through long missionary discussion. Like I said it might be beneficial but if I was touring sights of another church and they were preaching to me I’d leave. In fact we did not tour the Comunity of Christ properties in Nauvoo because we didn’t want to hear their lectures. 

Mind you that this was during the temple open house so every church site along the route was packed with tourists on their way to see the temple.  

As a side note the first group of saints to leave Nauvoo took three months to cross Iowa. It took us six hours to cross it. 

[Maureen]

2 hours ago, BJ64 said:

...In fact we did not tour the Comunity of Christ properties in Nauvoo because we didn’t want to hear their lectures...

If you didn't tour the Community of Christ properties while in Nauvoo, then how do you know if they gave lectures?

M.

[BJ64]

1 hour ago, Maureen said:

If you didn't tour the Community of Christ properties while in Nauvoo, then how do you know if they gave lectures?

M.

I’ll rephrase that. We didn’t go on their tours because we didn’t care to hear what they had to say. 

It’s amazing what minute things people here find to argue about.  

Edited August 10, 2018 by BJ64

[LadyGator]

22 hours ago, mordorbund said:

 

I know the song well, and have even been to a couple of those conventions unfortunately the song makes them sound way more fun than they really are. 😊

[LadyGator]

11 hours ago, Grunt said:

👋

Hi @Grunt nice to “see” you again 😊

[Maureen]

4 hours ago, BJ64 said:

I’ll rephrase that. We didn’t go on their tours because we didn’t care to hear what they had to say. 

It’s amazing what minute things people here find to argue about.  

Are you thinking my comment is arguing? I was just not seeing any logic in your sentence, since to know that they gave lectures you would have to had heard them lecture. And since you didn't attend their tours, I was guessing that maybe you needed to "rephrase" your sentence. And look, you did.

M.