How important is what we did in high school? Kavanaugh accusation

[The Folk Prophet]

19 minutes ago, Vort said:

If you're worried about people creating an "evil other", don't look at the Republicans. The Democrats are operating in that sphere on a doctorate level while the Republicans are stuck in junior high school.

And this is a great part of the problem. R's have lost their spine. Kavanaugh will probably not be appointed for this very reason.

It's one thing to demonize the other side just for politics. It's another thing to pretend like the devil is no devil at all in the name of...what? Why dare we not call the devil the devil?

Because the left is slowly winning.

[lostinwater]

Dup

Edited September 28, 2018 by lostinwater

[lostinwater]

Dup

Edited September 28, 2018 by lostinwater

[lostinwater]

Dup

Edited September 28, 2018 by lostinwater

[lostinwater]

Vort, Carborendum, and The Folk Prophet

i disagree with you.  However, i don't think any of you are naive or blind, or that we'd be better without you in this country. 

If (not saying you do) anyone can look at 150 some odd million of the people in the US and believe that about them - that's a sentiment i have a hard time understanding.  And one whose fruits (historically speaking) have been pretty much exclusively disastrous.

[The Folk Prophet]

1 minute ago, lostinwater said:

@Vort @Carborendum @The Folk Prophet

i disagree with you.  However, i don't think any of you are naive or blind, or that we'd be better without you in this country. 

If (not saying you do) anyone can look at 150 some odd million of the people in the US and believe that about them - that's a sentiment i have a hard time understanding.  And one whose fruits, historically speaking, have been pretty much exclusively disastrous.

None of us are saying all 150 some odd million democrats are individually evil. And you should know that. I suspect you do.

[Colirio]

To be honest, the Democrat tactics used during this entire "circus" have solidified to me even more that they have nothing else in the playbook. 

 

This is what desperate looks like. 

 

And the the only thing I disagree with Vort on is that I actually think Kavanaugh will be confirmed. 

[Vort]

1 minute ago, Colirio said:

And the the only thing I disagree with Vort on is that I actually think Kavanaugh will be confirmed.

I didn't say he wouldn't be. At this point, I have no idea, and I'm not even sure I want him to be confirmed. Much of my desire to see him confirmed is to stick it to the corrupt Dems. But I think that would be playing into their hands.

The Reps need to figure out how to let the Dems win, but then make sure they pay dearly for the next decade. That will be impossible, or next to it, with the media almost solely backing up the Dems.

[The Folk Prophet]

6 minutes ago, Colirio said:

To be honest, the Democrat tactics used during this entire "circus" have solidified to me even more that they have nothing else in the playbook. 

 

This is what desperate looks like. 

 

And the the only thing I disagree with Vort on is that I actually think Kavanaugh will be confirmed. 

Though...to be fair...the democrat tactics are irrelevant. The facts are these...

...etc., etc., etc.

And they don't add up to a solid case for Ford.

[Guest Godless]

59 minutes ago, Vort said:

True. So what's the solution? To capitulate to your side?

No. A better response would have been to acknowledge Ford's testimony, thank her for her time, and vote their conscience. They still would have taken heat, but it's a better approach than "I hope you're ready for your next nominee to face these accusations".

Quote

Waaaaaait a minute. I thought the response to well-poisoning wasn't to dump in more poison. What happened to that principle?

The difference is that I don't consider Kavanaugh's situation as "well poisoning" like you do. Especially in light of the fact that at least two more women have made accusations against Kavanaugh and will probably not be heard before the vote. Again, I'm not denying some political motive in the timing. But it's important to note that many victims track the careers and success of their attackers, and sometimes there's a point where they decide that their desire not to see the monster who haunts their psyche in a position of power and influence outweighs their fear of confronting said monster and enduring the public scrutiny that will inevitably ensue.  

 

53 minutes ago, Vort said:

When you were being personally attacked and called an attempted rapist?

Let's pretend Kavanaugh had done exactly what you say: Remain cool and rational, only pointing out facts and calmly denying any wrongdoing. How do you suppose the Democrats and their fawning press would have reacted? "Look at that cold-blooded reptilian lawyer! How he can sit there so smug and calm just INFURIATES any compassionate person! He doesn't even express any EMOTION! Is THAT the man we want on our Supreme Court?"

There was no way for Kavanaugh to come out of this unscathed. Some decorum probably would have worked more in his favor when it comes time for a vote, definitely more so than breaking into outbursts of rage and indignance. Calm Kavanaugh may have taken some heat, but no one wants a hothead on SCOTUS.

Quote

I think we're all perfectly aware that Kavanaugh cannot win, and that that fact is purely by design. Let's stop pretending that this has anything to do with actual concerns over sexual assault. This is purely, 100% political.

I simply cannot agree with you on this. For their part, the Dems did their best to make this about Ford and making sure her story was heard. To which the Rs responded with blatant, dismissive partisanship. I really feel like they shot themselves in the foot today. By their own admission (via Graham), they surrendered the moral high ground and are digging themselves in to play the same game they claim the Dems are playing. Can you tell me who's going to win in that scenario? Because I can't. I know who will lose though, the American people and our faith in our political institutions to function in spite of their differences. 

[Just_A_Guy]

22 minutes ago, Vort said:

The Reps need to figure out how to let the Dems win, but then make sure they pay dearly for the next decade. 

We may just have to grin and Barrett.  

[Guest MormonGator]

https://www.redstate.com/streiff/2018/09/27/breaking.-collins-murkowski-donnelly-make-decision

Breaking. 

[The Folk Prophet]

5 minutes ago, Godless said:

no one wants a hothead on SCOTUS.

A) False

B) "Hothead" seems a bit melodramatic.

6 minutes ago, Godless said:

the Dems did their best to make this about Ford and making sure her story was heard

False

6 minutes ago, Godless said:

To which the Rs responded with blatant, dismissive partisanship.

Also false

7 minutes ago, Godless said:

By their own admission (via Graham), they surrendered the moral high ground and are digging themselves in to play the same game they claim the Dems are playing.

I could be mistaken, but I don't think Graham speaks for how every R is going to behave in any given circumstance.

7 minutes ago, Godless said:

I know who will lose though, the American people and our faith in our political institutions to function in spite of their differences. 

Too late.

[Just_A_Guy]

Apropos of nothing in particular:

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/someone-on-capitol-hill-just-doxxed-republican-sens-mike-lee-orrin-hatch-and-lindsey-graham

[Colirio]

17 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

Though...to be fair...the democrat tactics are irrelevant. The facts are these...

...etc., etc., etc.

And they don't add up to a solid case for Ford.

 

Of course. 

 

And that is exactly the point. The facts all add up to this being a charade to buy time in hopes of extending this game until after the midterm elections. 

[Just_A_Guy]

I just read through the opening statements of Kavanaugh and Ford.

As a result, I like Ford more—and believe her less.

It’s just the opposite with Kavanaugh—I like him less, but believe him more.

We live in interesting times . . .

Edited September 28, 2018 by Just_A_Guy

[Guest Godless]

26 minutes ago, Colirio said:

To be honest, the Democrat tactics used during this entire "circus" have solidified to me even more that they have nothing else in the playbook. 

There were plenty of questions being raised about Kavanaugh prior to Ford's allegations. Things like perjury, for instance, tend to raise a lot of questions. 

[The Folk Prophet]

1 minute ago, Just_A_Guy said:

I just read through the opening statements of Kavanaugh and Ford.

As a result, I like Ford more—and believe her less.

Its just the opposite with Kavanaugh—I like him less, but believe him more.

We live in interesting times . . .

I assume you didn't watch then?

I walked away feeling ambiguous about Ford and quite liking Kavanaugh (mostly...not everything).

But I believed Ford. I just presume she's confused. Admittedly, I have to put aside my ire at the dems and their stupid, stupid questions because she, being naturally associated with them, might get lumped in with that ire. But I honestly believe her. That's irrelevant. Because I also believe she's mistaken.

[Guest Godless]

1 minute ago, The Folk Prophet said:

But I believed Ford. I just presume she's confused.

.

.

.

But I honestly believe her. That's irrelevant. Because I also believe she's mistaken.

How so?

[Colirio]

1 minute ago, Godless said:

There were plenty of questions being raised about Kavanaugh prior to Ford's allegations. Things like perjury, for instance, tend to raise a lot of questions. 

And when those didn't work and the vote was about to take place, they resorted to ole # 3 in the playbook. 

[Just_A_Guy]

11 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

I assume you didn't watch then?

I generally prefer the written over the oral.  Watching and/or listening subjects me to the possibility of being overly impressed by presentation or inappropriately caught up in rhetoric and crowd response.  And I’m terrible at spotting liars, so there’s really no bonus to my being able to hear inflection or watching body language/facial expression. 

It’s easier for me to stay objective if I just read about it later.

Edited September 28, 2018 by Just_A_Guy

[The Folk Prophet]

8 minutes ago, Godless said:

How so?

Somebody else did it.

[Guest]

@anatess2, @Just_A_Guy,

Can living a virtuous life protect you from attacks like this?  Yes.  Imagine the following scenario as an alternative to the sham that is unfolding now.

DiFi: This woman accused you of sexually assaulting her.
BK: What!?!  I've never done anything like that.
DF: She says that in a drunken party you forced....
BK: (chuckle) she said that?  Well, I know that's not true.
DF: You DARE to laugh at this brave and noble woman who has come out of hiding to bring this to light?
BK: Well, I'd like to hear all she has to say.  Let her come here and say EVERYTHING that happened.  I'd like her to say it on a dozen news outlets.  I'd like every newscaster to repeat her lies a million times.  I'd like YOU to repeat it until you have nowhere else to go but to believe her.  And I'll prove you all wrong.
DF: I am utterly offended that you would be so glib as to not take this accusation seriously.  You are showing no remorse for your despicable behavior.  I will do everything in my power to keep you from getting on that bench.
BK: And here I thought I'd have the presumption of innocence.  But I know now that was just naive. So, go ahead and make your threats and your accusations as long as I have my day to defend myself.

Weeks go by.  Several other accusers come out.  DiFi goes so far into it that there's no way to apologize for it.  Ford repeats her lies all over the news and is very consistent in her story.

Here is what he could say if only one thing were true.

Quote

So, she has been completely consistent in the description of what allegedly happened that night.  And she has stated unequivocally that she is absolutely 100% certain that I was the one who did that to her.  

But there's one problem.

Apart from applying alcohol to a wound or drinking cough syrup when I was ill or other medical use, I have never in my life touched one drop of alcohol.  Ask anyone from high school, college, or my professional life.  I've never drunk any alcohol.

Now, if anyone else breathes a word of this again, I will sue you all for slander.  If any Democrats here vote against my confirmation, I will sue you for slander.  You can apologize now and hurry up with the confirmation process.

Yes, it's just a dream.  He does, in fact, drink.  But what if he never did?  Wouldn't that be proof against such an accusation?  That's how living a virtuous life can protect you from an evil accusation.

[The Folk Prophet]

5 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

or watching body language/facial expression. 

 

Here's some body language for you to add to his speech.

Edited September 28, 2018 by The Folk Prophet

[The Folk Prophet]

And here's Ford: