Priesthood blessings

[mikbone]

So Im giving a talk on Sunday, 3rd son leaves for Cambodia in 2 weeks.  We were asked to talk on priesthood blessings.

Just wanting to get some feedback on a few concepts.

1)  Does it seem like we are slipping on our duty to give blessings?

In Monson's April 2007 talk "The Priesthood - a sacred gift", he mentions that while in the Navy one week before deployment one of his bunk-mates asked for a priesthood blessing and young Thomas Monson was inspired to pull out his missionary handbook to find the section on blessings (because he had never given, received, or witnessed a blessing on the sick...)  He gave a blessing but obviously did not have olive oil or a assistant elder...

In President Nelsons recent talk, "Ministering with the power and authority of God", He relates how he went to a Sacrament meeting and saw an Elder give his child a name and offered a beautiful prayer...  

Quote

Not long ago, I attended a sacrament meeting in which a new baby was to be given a name and a father’s blessing. The young father held his precious infant in his arms, gave her a name, and then offered a beautiful prayer. But he did not give that child a blessing. That sweet baby girl got a name but no blessing! That dear elder did not know the difference between a prayer and a priesthood blessing. With his priesthood authority and power, he could have blessed his infant, but he did not. I thought, “What a missed opportunity!”

2) The feminist movement purple pants etc...  Do women in the church want the priesthood?

The priesthood only allows one to provide service.  D&C 121:37

And Joseph Smith had no problems with the Relief Society giving blessings,

Quote

Respecting females administering for the healing of the sick, he further remarked, there could be no evil in it, if God gave His sanction by healing; that there could be no more sin in any female laying hands on and praying for the sick than in wetting the face with water; it is no sin for anybody to administer that has faith, or if the sick have faith to be healed by their administrations. (History of the Church 4:602-4.)

Has anyone participated in a blessing or witnessed a blessing with a sister involved?   This following quote is from Joseph F. Smith.

Quote

A wife does not hold the priesthood in connection with her husband, but she enjoys the benefits thereof with him; and if she is requested to lay hands on the sick with him, or with any other officer holding the Melchizedek priesthood, she may do so with perfect propriety. (Improvement Era 10:4.)

I remember from reading a book Ender's Game (Orson Scott Card), Ender received a blessing from his Mother who was or had been LDS.  

Women cannot invoke the authority of the priesthood, but they certainly can have faith and worthiness...

Edited September 26, 2018 by mikbone

[Overwatch]

The first one is simple, give blessings upon request and according to the Spirit's guidance.

The second is a bit vague. Do women want the priesthood? Most likely  lot of them want the influence in their homes. As far as wanting the authority, maybe a small number.

[Chilean]

55 minutes ago, mikbone said:

Do women in the church want the priesthood?

Nah, I don't want it, I don't need to hold it to be benefited from it.  People need to understand that the priesthood is not for personal benefit, there is no way you can get blessings to yourself if you have it. For example my husband is the only priesthood holder in our home (my son is almost 9 and wont receive it until 3 more years), if my husband was to get sick, he cant lay on his hand on his head and pronounce a blessing to himself, he would have to seek for another priesthood holder to give him a blessing.

So, the wonderful thing is that the priesthood has been restored and there are many worthy priesthood holders. Sister don't need to get it. I consider myself to be somewhat feminist, and I think sisters don't need it. Some might think they need it to feel equal to men, but I don't.

I do believe in the future, when being exalted we the sisters might receive the priesthood, but it might not even be in the way we use it now. I don't know.

I do have to confess that about a month ago, one of our sons was sick, my husband had already left for work, and I was to stay with the little one home, and for a second I thought: "I wish I could give him a blessing". and then I thought about a story I heard once when sister missionaries gave a blessing to someone and in the prayer said something about the priesthood that their mission president had, instead of by the power and authority I posses.  Any way, I didn't give him a blessing, but it crossed my mind the fact that if I could by making reference I guess of the priesthood my husband does have.

In the temple sisters have some of the priesthood I guess... right?

Edited September 26, 2018 by Chilean

[Traveler]

This last Sunday in Elder's Quorum the instructor asked of the active members (I assume active means current temple recommend, full tithe payer and such) what they expect from their personal ministers.  I responded that as a missionary I was instructed by my mission president that every home we were welcomed to (and every time we were welcomed) that we should give a priesthood blessing upon the home and its inhabitants.  I also stated that I have always believed (because of my mission experiences) that any time I am in any home as an official priesthood representative I should give a priesthood blessing.

I also shared a personal experience about priesthood blessings.  For many years in my work I traveled.  Often after long hours of stressful work (work when traveling is always more stressful - at least for me) I would return to my hotel tired but needing to unwind.  Mindless TV seemed the best way to unwind.  However, it seemed that often when I turned on the TV that it would display the worse part of a hard core pron program.  This caused me more stress plus added guilt.  The frequency was to much for chance.   I mentioned this problem to several friends (including my wife).  One friend and stalwart priesthood holder and also fellow Engineer that traveled often with me from time to time mentioned they he also used to have this problem.  He explained to me his belief that unclean spirits are much like a disease - that someone afflicted can leave behind uncleanness that can infect those that occupy the place after the affected person has left.  Thus, someone infected by porn will spread that influence even when they are not present.

To be honest this sounded a little hokey but my friend suggested that whenever I arrive at a hotel room or other place to stay - that I should pronounce a priesthood blessing to disinfect and cleanse the place for my stay.   I thought I should try this.  My heart and mind has been changed because having done this - I have never had the problem repeated.  I am convinced that there are blessings withheld (not given) to many good people that are in need but are not blessed only because a priesthood blessing is not sought.

 

The Traveler

[Traveler]

24 minutes ago, Chilean said:

I do have to confess that about a month ago, one of our sons was sick, my husband had already left for work, and I was to stay with the little one home, and for a second I thought: "I wish I could give him a blessing". and then I thought about a story I heard once when sister missionaries gave a blessing to someone and in the prayer said something about the priesthood that their mission president had, instead of by the power and authority I posses.  Any way, I didn't give him a blessing, but it crossed my mind the fact that if I could by making reference I guess of the priesthood my husband does have.

In the temple sisters have some of the priesthood I guess... right?

 A righteous sister can give a blessing just not by the power of the priesthood.  There was a time when it was believed that sisters could not open or close sacrament meeting with prayer because they do not hold the priesthood.  That has been corrected - women can pronounce opening and closing prayers - including a blessing - to bring the spirit of G-d upon the gathering and to give comfort for those in attendance or for some reason not able to attend.

 

The Traveler

[zil]

33 minutes ago, Chilean said:

In the temple sisters have some of the priesthood I guess... right? 

They are not given the priesthood nor ordained to one of its offices.  They (like anyone set apart in a calling in the Church) act under the authority of the priesthood (ETA: clarifying after Traveler's post - they cannot say "by the power of the priesthood").

@mikbone, I think you have to be very careful with #2 lest you (a) elicit hard feelings among women who do want the priesthood, (b) encourage rebellion among those who think they should be able to do what is described in your quotes.  At some point in time, the leaders of the Church essentially said women should leave those things to the priesthood holders - right or wrong, that is the instruction and we should follow it trusting that it is either right, or the wrong is on the heads of those who forbade it.  I'm happy to discuss these ideas in detail, if it's wanted, and what I've said may be a given for you, just thought it worth mentioning as it seems to be a touchy topic.

Edited September 26, 2018 by zil

[Vort]

1 hour ago, mikbone said:

Just wanting to get some feedback on a few concepts.

1)  Does it seem like we are slipping on our duty to give blessings?

Yes. President Nelson was clear on this point at the April General Conference.

1 hour ago, mikbone said:

2) The feminist movement purple pants etc...  Do women in the church want the priesthood?

I agree with @zil; this is a point better left untouched. Women do not and cannot give Priesthood blessings. I see no reason to raise the topic.

1 hour ago, mikbone said:

Has anyone participated in a blessing or witnessed a blessing with a sister involved?   This following quote is from Joseph F. Smith.

Quote

A wife does not hold the priesthood in connection with her husband, but she enjoys the benefits thereof with him; and if she is requested to lay hands on the sick with him, or with any other officer holding the Melchizedek priesthood, she may do so with perfect propriety. (Improvement Era 10:4.)

I remember from reading a book Ender's Game (Orson Scott Card), Ender received a blessing from his Mother who was or had been LDS.  

Women cannot invoke the authority of the priesthood, but they certainly can have faith and worthiness...

Since President Smith's time a hundred years ago, we have received further light and knowledge. Whether or not such actions were appropriate during President Smith's time, we have been instructed today that the laying on of hands is a Priesthood ordinance conducted under Priesthood authority.

[Just_A_Guy]

31 minutes ago, Vort said:

Since President Smith's time a hundred years ago, we have received further light and knowledge. Whether or not such actions were appropriate during President Smith's time, we have been instructed today that the laying on of hands is a Priesthood ordinance conducted under Priesthood authority.

IIRC there was guidance from the First Presidency around 1946-ish directing that the Relief Society stop doing blessings-by-laying-on-of-hands and call for the elders instead.

That said, I’m a bit unorthodox and have told my wife that she’s welcome to stand in on any father’s blessings done on our kids in our own home.  She has consistently declined.  And I can’t visualize a set of circumstances where I would admit to this unorthodoxy in front of my entire ward.  

On a more general theme, we are told in holy places that a certain subset of women may hereafter “become” priestesses.  The question is not whether women will get the “priesthood”; the question is what the exercise of that priesthood would look like and when it might happen.  I suspect it will be very different than the hierarchy of ordained office and sorts of deference, obedience, and budgetary control that the OrdainWomen set seem to equate with the “priesthood power”.

Also:  didn’t Elder Oaks give a rather hefty talk on this subject within the last year or two?

Edited September 26, 2018 by Just_A_Guy

[mikbone]

59 minutes ago, Traveler said:

To be honest this sounded a little hokey but my friend suggested that whenever I arrive at a hotel room or other place to stay - that I should pronounce a priesthood blessing to disinfect and cleanse the place for my stay.   I thought I should try this.  My heart and mind has been changed because having done this - I have never had the problem repeated. 

I agree with your friend.  It is a bit touchy about dedicating a hotel room.  The manual states we don't have to have a home paid off to to give a dedicatory prayer, but it should be cleared with the owner...  But in the early church the Elders routinely cursed homes, so I think it is fine to disinfect / cleanse a hotel.  Good idea.  

[The Folk Prophet]

4 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

That said, I’m a bit unorthodox and have told my wife that she’s welcome to stand in on any father’s blessings done on our kids in our own home.  She has consistently declined.  And I can’t visualize a set of circumstances where I would admit to this unorthodoxy in front of my entire ward.

Some people just weren't raised right.

[zil]

4 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

Also:  didn’t Elder Oaks give a rather hefty talk on this subject within the last year or two? 

Yes, he gave a talk, pretty sure it was longer than 2 years ago.  I'm sure I could find it, if wanted.

[The Folk Prophet]

5 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

On a more general theme, we are told in holy places that a certain subset of women may hereafter “become” priestesses.  The question is not whether women will get the “priesthood”; the question is what the exercise of that priesthood would look like and when it might happen.  I suspect it will be very different than the hierarchy of ordained office and sorts of deference, obedience, and budgetary control that the OrdainWomen set seem to equate with the “priesthood power”.

Men are given the same promise, which supports your point.

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

2 hours ago, mikbone said:

In Monson's April 2007 talk "The Priesthood - a sacred gift", he mentions that while in the Navy one week before deployment one of his bunk-mates asked for a priesthood blessing and young Thomas Monson was inspired to pull out his missionary handbook to find the section on blessings (because he had never given, received, or witnessed a blessing on the sick...)  He gave a blessing but obviously did not have olive oil or a assistant elder...

In President Nelsons recent talk, "Ministering with the power and authority of God", He relates how he went to a Sacrament meeting and saw an Elder give his child a name and offered a beautiful prayer...  

We have a tradtion (now) in our family that when my husband gives one of our sons the Melchizedek Priesthood, we BOTH talk to him about how to listen to the Spirit (which is really a continuation of an ongoing topic in our home, but this time specific to blessings.)  Then I invite that son to give me a priesthood blessing.  Naturally, they are nervous, but that is why I do it.  I explain to them that it is best that they have that first time blessing with someone they are comfortable with than out in the mission  

Second, my husband and I have talked about this too...about how some men give prayers instead of blessings.  I think they just haven't been taught correctly.  We teach our boys to give blessings.  For example, my husband says in a blessing you don't say, "Father we ask you to bless . . ."  that's a prayer.  In a blessing, you strive to speak by the Spirit, and with faith and you say, "Brother Jones, I bless you that...."   

As far as the women and the Priesthood goes...I agree with @Just_A_Guy.  No need for me to add anything there.

[Just_A_Guy]

2 minutes ago, zil said:

Yes, he gave a talk, pretty sure it was longer than 2 years ago.  I'm sure I could find it, if wanted.

Ayup.  2014.

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

2 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

Ayup.  2014.

Thanks for sharing this.  In the past, I didn't read the messages from the Priesthood meeting because being the Priesthood meeting I assumed that they didn't have anything to do with me.  The Lord has been showing me that I was wrong...via talks from Priesthood that I find quite helpful and enlightening  So I am repenting!     This looks like another such talk.  Can't wait to read it.

[zil]

23 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

Ayup.  2014.

Yup.  That's the one.

[zil]

26 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

Men are given the same promise, which supports your point.

My memory isn't that great, but I'm pretty sure men aren't promised they can become priestesses...

[Traveler]

32 minutes ago, mikbone said:

I agree with your friend.  It is a bit touchy about dedicating a hotel room.  The manual states we don't have to have a home paid off to to give a dedicatory prayer, but it should be cleared with the owner...  But in the early church the Elders routinely cursed homes, so I think it is fine to disinfect / cleanse a hotel.  Good idea.  

Please note that there is a difference from blessing a hotel room to be clean of evil influences and dedicating a facility.  But thanks for your input.

 

The Traveler

[The Folk Prophet]

5 minutes ago, zil said:

My memory isn't that great, but I'm pretty sure men aren't promised they can become priestesses...

How would you know?

[zil]

2 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

How would you know?

OK, I suppose that could happen before the part where women are in the same room...  But if it does, I have one or two concerns...

[Anddenex]

3 hours ago, mikbone said:

So Im giving a talk on Sunday, 3rd son leaves for Cambodia in 2 weeks.  We were asked to talk on priesthood blessings.

Just wanting to get some feedback on a few concepts.

1)  Does it seem like we are slipping on our duty to give blessings?

In Monson's April 2007 talk "The Priesthood - a sacred gift", he mentions that while in the Navy one week before deployment one of his bunk-mates asked for a priesthood blessing and young Thomas Monson was inspired to pull out his missionary handbook to find the section on blessings (because he had never given, received, or witnessed a blessing on the sick...)  He gave a blessing but obviously did not have olive oil or a assistant elder...

In President Nelsons recent talk, "Ministering with the power and authority of God", He relates how he went to a Sacrament meeting and saw an Elder give his child a name and offered a beautiful prayer...  

Yes, otherwise President Nelson would not have mentioned such a subtle chastening pertaining to our duty as priesthood holders and in giving blessings. His example though, which I am thankful for is to correct incorrect teachings that have been in the Church (even taught by area authorities).

Not to be repetitive, but here is my experience again (I am a father of six children so I have given baby blessings and have experienced both sides of what President Nelson has specified). My first child I blessed and gave a priesthood blessing. My second and third child I prayed over them as in the example provided. My last three children I provided a priesthood blessing.

The reason my second and third child were prayed over is because that is what my bishop instructed me on, and clarified that a visiting general authority specified this is how a baby blessing is given. In the old Handbook it used to mention "Address Heavenly Father (as in prayer)." The new manual that came out not long ago removed "as in prayer." I believe it is because people were misinterpreting the "as in prayer." I was told that we don't bless babies we ask Heavenly Father to bless babies.

I learned later on this was incorrect instruction, and thus my last three were blessed appropriately and not just prayed over. I am sad that these two children missed out on a blessing, but they did receive a prayer and thankfully God is answering these prayers. But they still missed out.

I think also his implied meaning is that we brethren who hold the priesthood need to increase our oneness with God to be able to bless as God blesses. He mentioned miracles in his talk, and I have wondered how many miracles I have missed.

Quote

2) The feminist movement purple pants etc...  Do women in the church want the priesthood?

The priesthood only allows one to provide service.  D&C 121:37

And Joseph Smith had no problems with the Relief Society giving blessings,

Has anyone participated in a blessing or witnessed a blessing with a sister involved?   This following quote is from Joseph F. Smith.

I remember from reading a book Ender's Game (Orson Scott Card), Ender received a blessing from his Mother who was or had been LDS.  

Women cannot invoke the authority of the priesthood, but they certainly can have faith and worthiness...

As some have shared, there are women who want women to hold the priesthood. As we have seen on here not every woman feels that way. I know my wife doesn't, as she says, "Do you think I want more responsibility than I now have"?

I am not sure what you mean by the priesthood only allows one to provide service. The scripture shared is regarding holding the priesthood correctly.

I am familiar with Joseph's teaching and past history. I am familiar with Joseph F. Smith's teaching as you have shared, and also Joseph Fielding Smith's teachings from his books "Doctrines of Salvation." I think it to be very cautious though that Joseph Smith, Joseph F. Smith, and Joseph Fielding Smith were implying priesthood authority. I am not fully aware of Joseph's meaning as I couldn't find any clarification, but from Joseph F. Smith and Joseph Fielding Smith they appear to have had the same meaning. They assist with faith in the priesthood, not with authority.

Joseph Fielding Smith also mentioned "priests" who hold the office of a priest could assist with blessings if no Melchizedek priesthood holder was present. Again, even though he holds an office within the priesthood, with blessings of this nature they would be acting in faith, not authority.

I, personally, like these thoughts and believe them to be true. I have never though asked my wife to give a blessing, nor my priest aged son. I do not believe I have ever been in a position that would honor the conditions I am familiar with that Joseph F Smith and Joseph Fielding Smith mentioned.

I believe this concept though has allowed some people to make inappropriate decisions. I know of one woman, whose husband passed away, who decided that she could give her children a priesthood blessing (even though plenty of priesthood holders were around) and use her husband's priesthood to give the blessings. She began with in the name of my husband's priesthood... In light of this, it is not Joseph Smith, it is not Joseph F. Smith, and it is not Joseph Fielding Smith who we should be looking to for answers with how it should be "now." it is the current prophet and we need to listen to what they are teaching.

The current teachings I am familiar with is that women are able to act "in power" of the priesthood, not authority. I know in my family where my wife was able to act "in power" of the priesthood on behalf of one of our children. I accept and know we have a loving Savior and Father in heaven who are fully aware and love all their sons and daughters.

Edited September 26, 2018 by Anddenex

[mikbone]

31 minutes ago, Traveler said:

Please note that there is a difference from blessing a hotel room to be clean of evil influences and dedicating a facility.  But thanks for your input.

 

The Traveler

Yeah, I tried to differentiate the two.  Thats the issue though.  Dedicating a house is in the handbook.  Cleansing a hotel room is off the reservation, so to speak.

 

Do you ask God to cleanse the room as in a prayer, or do you invoke the priesthood and command a blessing.

 

Casting out spirits is not in the handbook.  Ive never had the need or seen an exorcisism.  But one of my MTC teachers claims that he performed such.  His recommendation was to command the evil spirit to leave the body AND NEVER RETURN.  He told us that this bit of knowledge might have saved him from a  very hectic and long night.

[Traveler]

17 minutes ago, mikbone said:

Yeah, I tried to differentiate the two.  Thats the issue though.  Dedicating a house is in the handbook.  Cleansing a hotel room is off the reservation, so to speak.

 

Do you ask God to cleanse the room as in a prayer, or do you invoke the priesthood and command a blessing.

 

Casting out spirits is not in the handbook.  Ive never had the need or seen an exorcisism.  But one of my MTC teachers claims that he performed such.  His recommendation was to command the evil spirit to leave the body AND NEVER RETURN.  He told us that this bit of knowledge might have saved him from a  very hectic and long night.

There are many examples in scripture - but I avoid using the worldly term of exorcisism.  If you like examples - Jesus provides several in the New Testament.  But I personally would recommend paying attention at the temple - everything you need to know is covered there quite well.

 

The Traveler

[Anddenex]

22 minutes ago, mikbone said:

Casting out spirits is not in the handbook.  Ive never had the need or seen an exorcisism.  But one of my MTC teachers claims that he performed such.  His recommendation was to command the evil spirit to leave the body AND NEVER RETURN.  He told us that this bit of knowledge might have saved him from a  very hectic and long night.

The highlighted portion would be incorrect from the MTC teacher. As to the ability of an evil spirit returning is solely upon the righteousness of the individual who received the blessing. The evil spirit may be cast out, but will return if the individual still chooses the life that caused such to begin with.

[mikbone]

Matthew 17:15-21  Is kinda scarry.