Kindness & the Internet


MaryJehanne
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Hey, everyone!

(I'm hoping this will be more of a candid, lighthearted thread!)

What does kindness mean to you? What do you do when someone's aggressive or rude to you?

I have a lot of trouble when people are offensive, which is something I've been trying to work on. When someone's rude, mean, or dismissive, I tend to take it to heart, deeply. Especially lately, I'm now trying to take a deep breath, let things go, and not let it effect how I feel about myself... which can be hard. Especially in the world of the web, most notably things like YouTube comments, I'm continually shocked by how uncaring and harsh people can be. And this isn't to bash people, of course. All of us have had moments where it's hard not to say something biting.

I was wondering how you all deal with unkind or difficult people, and how you manage it online?

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Hi @MaryJehanne, it's great to see you again!

Just now, MaryJehanne said:

What does kindness mean to you?

Love, gentleness, listening, humility.

Just now, MaryJehanne said:

What do you do when someone's aggressive or rude to you?

First few offenses, speak kindly the message to the gist of "X kind of rude.  I'd like to have a polite conversation, can we work in that direction?"

If it become clear the other person is just an aggressive jerk that can't be reasoned with: hit the "ignore" button.  I don't need that toxicity in my life. 

Just now, MaryJehanne said:

have a lot of trouble when people are offensive, which is something I've been trying to work on. When someone's rude, mean, or dismissive, I tend to take it to heart, deeply. Especially lately, I'm now trying to take a deep breath, let things go, and not let it effect how I feel about myself... which can be hard.

I hear you there!  I have the same struggles regularly.

Some places (like YouTube comments) it's just best to avoid those toxic pits.  

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44 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

Hi @MaryJehanne, it's great to see you again!

Love, gentleness, listening, humility.

First few offenses, speak kindly the message to the gist of "X kind of rude.  I'd like to have a polite conversation, can we work in that direction?"

If it become clear the other person is just an aggressive jerk that can't be reasoned with: hit the "ignore" button.  I don't need that toxicity in my life. 

I hear you there!  I have the same struggles regularly.

Some places (like YouTube comments) it's just best to avoid those toxic pits.  

Thank you, Jane_Doe! :)

I think that's another struggle I have... ending a conversation. Even if it's completely unfruitful, I keep replying, because I don't want to be rude to them. :P

It's good to hear someone else say they feel the same! I think, especially on the internet, you can feel so alone, which adds to it. When arguments happen in person, people tend to be less rude, because they can see you. And, you have a sense of community and support, because usually there are people you can see around you.

 

Edited by MaryJehanne
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8 minutes ago, MaryJehanne said:

I think that's another struggle I have... ending a conversation. Even if it's completely unfruitful, I keep replying, because I don't want to be rude to them. :P

I hear you there, and have the same problem.  I keep hoping that the person will change, even when that's clearly not being the case for that conversation.

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1 minute ago, MaryJehanne said:

Thank you, Jane_Doe! :)

I think that's another struggle I have... ending a conversation. Even if it's completely unfruitful, I keep replying, because I don't want to be rude to them. :P

It's good to hear someone else say they feel the same! I think, especially on the internet, you can feel so alone, which adds to it. When arguments happen in person, people tend to be less rude, because they can see you. And, you have a sense of community and support, because usually there are people you can see around you.

 

This is how I deal with people in general... on the internet or not.  This is, of course, just me.

First of all... somebody who was not rude to me in person does not mean that person is nice and kind... especially if that person is rude to me on the internet.  It simply means that the person is very good at keeping up pretenses.  I would rather you be rude to me in person than pretending you are kind.  Make sense?  I value honesty over arbitrary rules of civility.

So, what happens if I find somebody being rude to me?  First, I give them the benefit of the doubt and chalk it up to miscommunication to where I found something rude that was not intended to be one.  I do this because, especially with English only my 3rd language, I tend to seep my Bisaya culture into the way I communicate in English and it ends up sounding rude (Bisaya is not a language of niceties).  So, it would be hypocritical for me to assume rudeness without giving the benefit of the doubt when I myself desire for people to give me the benefit of the doubt before calling me rude.  

Then, if the person is really intentionally rude, then I can do either one of 3 things:  1.)  Give it right back (there are times when I welcome a skirmish, especially of the trolling variety... what can I say, I'm not perfect)  2.)  Forgive them and respond to the points made minus the rudeness to continue to the conversation and gain understanding, or 3.) Forgive them and walk away from the conversation if nothing is going to come out of it.

That's really all there is to it for me.

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1 hour ago, MaryJehanne said:

I was wondering how you all deal with unkind or difficult people, and how you manage it online?

I really do wish I were more like Jane Doe.  But as most people know, I'm not.

On the bright side, I am always making an effort to be better.  And I feel like I'm making progress.

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Guest MormonGator
1 hour ago, MaryJehanne said:

Hey, everyone!

(I'm hoping this will be more of a candid, lighthearted thread!)

What does kindness mean to you? What do you do when someone's aggressive or rude to you?

I have a lot of trouble when people are offensive, which is something I've been trying to work on. When someone's rude, mean, or dismissive, I tend to take it to heart, deeply. Especially lately, I'm now trying to take a deep breath, let things go, and not let it effect how I feel about myself... which can be hard. Especially in the world of the web, most notably things like YouTube comments, I'm continually shocked by how uncaring and harsh people can be. And this isn't to bash people, of course. All of us have had moments where it's hard not to say something biting.

I was wondering how you all deal with unkind or difficult people, and how you manage it online?

To me, kindness begins and ends with relationships. If you take the time to get to know someone you can find out what bothers them, what doesn't, what topics to avoid, etc. It's all about relationships. 

Agressive/rudeness is several things. It can mask insecurity, it can be poor upbringing, it can be a communication gap between two people, or sometimes, it can just be that the person is cruel or mean. 

I know where you are coming from @MaryJehanne. I take it deeply too. Someone says something about me in a cruel manner, I hate them forever. That is NOT the best way to live your life, but it's who I am. 

Online, I find it best to just ignore people. If they lack the manners/decency to do the same to you, it's on them. It shows what I mentioned above. 

Edited by MormonGator
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7 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

And I feel like I'm making progress.

I like to think I am too.

I still lash out at time...but usually I'm overly tired or hungry or something. Typically now, however, I'm much more likely to respond in a questioning way rather than a caustic statement type way. That being said, (and this is in reply to the OP @MaryJehanne) I have found that it makes little difference how careful I am. I get the same sort of offended vitriolic blame for being horrible when I'm being careful as I do when I'm being horrible. The moral? I make efforts to not be horrible for myself. That's all I can do.

I've said it before, but I'll repeat it again: Offensive is in the eye of the beholder.

Edited by The Folk Prophet
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21 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

This is how I deal with people in general... on the internet or not.  This is, of course, just me.

First of all... somebody who was not rude to me in person does not mean that person is nice and kind... especially if that person is rude to me on the internet.  It simply means that the person is very good at keeping up pretenses.  I would rather you be rude to me in person than pretending you are kind.  Make sense?  I value honesty over arbitrary rules of civility.

So, what happens if I find somebody being rude to me?  First, I give them the benefit of the doubt and chalk it up to miscommunication to where I found something rude that was not intended to be one.  I do this because, especially with English only my 3rd language, I tend to seep my Bisaya culture into the way I communicate in English and it ends up sounding rude (Bisaya is not a language of niceties).  So, it would be hypocritical for me to assume rudeness without giving the benefit of the doubt when I myself desire for people to give me the benefit of the doubt before calling me rude.  

Then, if the person is really intentionally rude, then I can do either one of 3 things:  1.)  Give it right back (there are times when I welcome a skirmish, especially of the trolling variety... what can I say, I'm not perfect)  2.)  Forgive them and respond to the points made minus the rudeness to continue to the conversation and gain understanding, or 3.) Forgive them and walk away from the conversation if nothing is going to come out of it.

That's really all there is to it for me.

That is true. Although, if someone's putting the effort in to be nice, even if they fail at it interiorly, it at least makes me feel like they care on some level. I wish I could be as objective in thinking about it as you! 😣

That's another thing that's very true. Sometimes people just have bad days! It still hurts in the moment. 😞 But I guess that's to be expected!

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26 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

I really do wish I were more like Jane Doe.  But as most people know, I'm not.

On the bright side, I am always making an effort to be better.  And I feel like I'm making progress.

😄 That's a good approach! That's all we can do, isn't it? Pray, and keep moving forward!

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i've noticed that facades of meanness or unreasonableness are usually very easy to crack - especially when you deliver a few well placed taps of kindness when they are least expected, and least deserved.  You can storm the wall with logic and indignation - and it does nothing other than strengthen it.  And it's probably worth pointing out that most people who react in ways we consider to be unkind have some darned good reasons hidden deep down for being like they are - and some very pure hearts underneath all that pain.

Anyways, the old maxim that people who need kindness the most deserve it the least is usually true.

And beyond that, i don't usually quote from the conference talks, but i think there was one that James E Faust gave that said something to the effect of 'none of us are usually as much the innocent victim as it may feel'.  i've found that to be true quite a bit in my case.  What's remarkable, is that no matter how many times i have it pointed out in ways i can't deny, i'm always surprised when it happens again the next time!  

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25 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

To me, kindness begins and ends with relationships. If you take the time to get to know someone you can find out what bothers them, what doesn't, what topics to avoid, etc. It's all about relationships. 

Agressive/rudeness is several things. It can mask insecurity, it can be poor upbringing, it can be a communication gap between two people, or sometimes, it can just be that the person is cruel or mean. 

I know where you are coming from @MaryJehanne. I take it deeply too. Someone says something about me in a cruel manner, I hate them forever. That is NOT the best way to live your life, but it's who I am. 

Online, I find it best to just ignore people. If they lack the manners/decency to do the same to you, it's on them. It shows what I mentioned above. 

That is true. Some people have a much higher tolerance for things than others!

Very true.

I guess it's part of being human. No one wants to feel like they're unloved by someone, which is the message being mean/rude/cruel sends... One of the important things I'm trying to remember is that, as much as it feels bad that a person doesn't like me, the only love I should care about having is God's. And His will never go away. 😌

Yes! That's something I have to work on. :P

 

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29 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

I like to think I am too.

I still lash out at time...but usually I'm overly tired or hungry or something. Typically now, however, I'm much more likely to respond in a questioning way rather than a caustic statement type way. That being said, (and this is in reply to the OP @MaryJehanne) I have found that it makes little difference how careful I am. I get the same sort of offending vitriolic blame for being horrible when I'm being careful as I do when I'm being horrible. The moral? I make efforts to not be horrible for myself. That's all I can do.

I've said it before, but I'll repeat it again: Offensive is in the eye of the beholder.

That's another thing that's difficult. 😕 At least the most important thing is your intentions! As long as you're trying to be kind, that's what matters to God. :)

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1 minute ago, MaryJehanne said:

That's another thing that's difficult. 😕 At least the most important thing is your intentions! As long as you're trying to be kind, that's what matters to God. :)

Well...I would add...sometimes kindness is not the Christlike thing to do/be. Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to justify being a jerk. But...I'll just throw it out here:

cleansing+the+temple.PNG

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8 minutes ago, lostinwater said:

i've noticed that facades of meanness or unreasonableness are usually very easy to crack - especially when you deliver a few well placed taps of kindness when they are least expected, and least deserved.  You can storm the wall with logic and indignation - and it does nothing other than strengthen it.  And it's probably worth pointing out that most people who react in ways we consider to be unkind have some darned good reasons hidden deep down for being like they are - and some very pure hearts underneath all that pain.

Anyways, the old maxim that people who need kindness the most deserve it the least is usually true.

And beyond that, i don't usually quote from the conference talks, but i think there was one that James E Faust gave that said something to the effect of 'none of us are usually as much the innocent victim as it may feel'.  i've found that to be true quite a bit in my case.  What's remarkable, is that no matter how many times i have it pointed out in ways i can't deny, i'm always surprised when it happens again the next time!  

And that's part of the value of being kind, too! It's more valuable to God when we love for His sake when people make it difficult. If it was easy, and people were always loving to us, we would never really be tried.

It is true that no one is really innocent! But people may be innocent in some situations, at least (just misunderstood, or maybe the other person was looking for something to snap at). There is a Catholic psychologist who wrote on something similar... the idea of us finding offense where it doesn't exist! But I think, when the offense really does exist, it makes sense that we feel bad. No matter what we've done wrong in our lives, we're creatures of God. He loves us and has told us to love others, so anything short of that is unjust, no matter how much a person seems to deserve it.

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A Tinker's Debt is Always Paid:
Once for a simple trade.
Twice for freely given aid.
Thrice for any insult made.

Patrick Rothfuss, The Name of the Wind (The Kingkiller Chronicle, #1)

 

Hebrews 13:2

 

 

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/1989/04/beware-of-pride?lang=eng

Edited by mikbone
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2 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

Well...I would add...sometimes kindness is not the Christlike thing to do/be. Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to justify being a jerk. But...I'll just throw it out here:

cleansing+the+temple.PNG

At least from a Catholic perspective, we would say Christ was being kind there! It is very kind to correct people, and lead them away from sin (which is what was happening there). He was also trying to keep the respect due to His Temple, but even in that dimension, He wasn't hateful to those people, and He knew it was an act that would serve to instruct people in the present and future.

Kindness involves love, and sometimes you have to put on a stern face. Kind of like a parent who puts on a mean face to scold a slightly naughty 2-year-old. I just read about an abbot (or someone along those lines), who faked anger to correct one of the brothers. Once the brother left, he was perfectly at peace again, and asked if he'd seemed to be convincing.

When someone is cruel, not just rough or authoritative, it's seated in a sense of hatred (lack of love).

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