Ted Bundy Tapes


mikbone
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Just watched 2 episodes of this Netflix special, so many questions...

Do you think he was possessed?

How did the police & FBI do such a horrible job?

Was his branch president’s spirit of discernment offline?

Who were his home teachers?

How much did pornography influence him?

Did the illigatemate birth have anything to do with it?

The producers finally got LDS right and did not use the Mormon nickname.

Is his name still on the LDS records?

Does his decision to be an attorney give us any insight into twisted soul?  

Is watching the special glorifying the criminal.  Or is it good to remember that evil exists and to beware of people who have a false persona?

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39 minutes ago, mikbone said:

Is watching the special glorifying the criminal.  Or is it good to remember that evil exists and to beware of people who have a false persona?

Good rule of thumb: "If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things."

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Guest Godless
2 hours ago, mikbone said:

Is watching the special glorifying the criminal.  Or is it good to remember that evil exists and to beware of people who have a false persona?

My wife was a psych major and is itching to watch this. Just haven't had the time yet. Without seeing it, it's hard to answer these questions, but I would note that there's a difference between glorifying and humanizing. It's important to remember that people like Bundy had very real human traits. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he had home teachers. Heck, he may have been a HT himself. It's easy to dismiss people like Bundy as inhuman monsters, but that kind of thinking is what makes us blind to the monsters of today. If we can't see that (seemingly) normal, relatable people can also be monsters, then one day we may doom ourselves to the role of victim.

 

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On 2/2/2019 at 4:32 AM, Godless said:

If we can't see that (seemingly) normal, relatable people can also be monsters, then one day we may doom ourselves to the role of victim.

I'm reading a book called Ordinary Men by Christopher Browning. It's a nonfiction book that explains the psychology of how ordinary, regular guys gradually became Nazi killing machines in the "Final Solution" during WWII.  It's... disconcerting.
 

On 2/2/2019 at 2:08 AM, mikbone said:

Do you think he was possessed?

I just finished the third episode.  I wonder about that  too.  He did describe himself as if he were giving way to an "other" that seemed to take over when he killed.  So maybe? 

On 2/2/2019 at 2:08 AM, mikbone said:

How did the police & FBI do such a horrible job?

In the mid '70s, communication technology wasn't anywhere near what it is today.  Imagine trying to build a puzzle with 100 pieces, but you only have 12, and the other 88 are scattered aronud 12 other homes in your neighborhood.

On 2/2/2019 at 2:08 AM, mikbone said:

Was his branch president’s spirit of discernment offline?

Who were his home teachers?

I wonder about that too.  Is it possible that they were prompted about him and didn't listen?  How do you say "Gee, this guy wants to be baptized but... I just feel like he shouldn't be." 

On 2/2/2019 at 2:08 AM, mikbone said:

How much did pornography influence him?

Did the illigatemate birth have anything to do with it?

Probably less than one might suppose.  Porn is a thousand times easier to acquire today than it was in the '60s, and there's a million times more of it out there.  If it were a major factor with Bundy, I'd expect there to be swarms of serial killers today.  And illegitimate children are becoming the norm now.  (Granted, without the social stigma there was once.)  

On 2/2/2019 at 2:08 AM, mikbone said:

Is his name still on the LDS records?

I wonder about that too, though I suspect that info isn't made public.  I'd imagine that if they excommunicated him without a formal Disciplinary Council, they wouldn't exactly broadcast it.

On 2/2/2019 at 2:08 AM, mikbone said:

Does his decision to be an attorney give us any insight into twisted soul? 

Maybe he was thinking ahead, and figured that knowledge would be useful later...

On 2/2/2019 at 2:08 AM, mikbone said:

Is watching the special glorifying the criminal.  Or is it good to remember that evil exists and to beware of people who have a false persona?

I think there's value in such documentaries for those who are interested in it for reasons of historical or scientific interest. 

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I think he was possessed.  I think the pornography was a big issue that invited in the evil spirit or spirits.

He was buzzare in that he could have a girlfried and go on dates with acquaintances.  But then brutally killed and molested his victims.

What really made me think he was possessed was the night he attacked the 5 sorority girls and then killed another girl on the way home.  It seems that a human would have been satiated.  

And I use the spirit of discernment daily in my work.  I have patients requesting narcotic medications and disability all the time.   I’m a fix ya get you back to wirk doctor not a disability doctor.  And I dont give narcotics to addicts.

 

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I remember that stylized channel 2 logo and half a dozen buildings from Salt Lake - not the most fun blast from the past.  I guess this was going on when I was old enough to have picked up on it, but I don't remember any of it - I wonder if my parents kept the news off when I was around or something. 

Totally different age back then.  Nobody did that sort of thing.  Folks in Aspen must have been severely embarrassed that Bundy escaped not once, but twice from them.  "Oh yeah, I guess there is a skinny person-sized hole in our jail cells.  Huh."

We all forget how different things were back when, well

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On 2/1/2019 at 7:08 PM, mikbone said:

Is his name still on the LDS records?

It is on record that he was excommunicated in 1976.   He was later baptized for the dead and that record was expunged in 2009.

As to possession, I think he was just evil rather than possessed.

As a side note, it's weird that people think of him as being LDS, since he was only LDS for a short time.   He was a Methodist before LDS and a Hindu after being excommunicated from our church. 

He was never converted to our church, but likely only got baptized to get trust from people and to be manipulative.   He was arrested for smoking pot not long after being baptized.

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9 minutes ago, Scott said:

He was never converted to our church, but likely only got baptized to get trust from people and to be manipulative.   He was arrested for smoking pot not long after being baptized.

Yeah, he qualifies as a Jack Mormon.

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The series was fascinating. I remember the TV movie and it was filmed at the cottonwood mall very close to where I lived.  Not sure if that was the actual mall since it looked like a different mall.  The was a Sears in the shot and the CW mall had JCPenney.   And I also got nostalgic seeing the old newscasters and logos.

The thing is, he escaped an went to Florida and could have laid low and instead attacked a whole sorority.  He either thought he was invincible or wanted to go out with one final event.

And then you hear him explain himself.  He never admitted guilt until he was about to be executed and only then too buy time. 

He really in his own mind disassociated his crimes from his mind.  And he thought the world was insane and here was normal.He described events in third person and hypotheticals.  He used the church to fit in.  His Ward and Bishop and many others in his life truly thought he was a victim of mistaken identity.  He was that charming.

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On 2/1/2019 at 7:08 PM, mikbone said:

Just watched 2 episodes of this Netflix special, so many questions...

Do you think he was possessed? No, just evil.

How did the police & FBI do such a horrible job? You mean like catching him and prosecuting him to execution?

Was his branch president’s spirit of discernment offline? Alma 14:11

Who were his home teachers? Not their fault, one bit.

How much did pornography influence him? He said it played a big part, just before he died.

Did the illigatemate birth have anything to do with it? Probably.

Is his name still on the LDS records? Is Adolph Hitler’s? His work has been done several times.

Does his decision to be an attorney give us any insight into twisted soul?  No

Is watching the special glorifying the criminal.  Or is it good to remember that evil exists and to beware of people who have a false persona? They who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

What I was disturbed by was the glee of those that attended the all night party at his execution.

Edited by Emmanuel Goldstein
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58 minutes ago, bytebear said:

His Ward and Bishop and many others in his life truly thought he was a victim of mistaken identity.  He was that charming.

Yes, the ward he was in even had a special fast since a criminal had "the same name" as their ward member and they were afraid it would affect his life.   They had no idea that he was the killer and it just wasn't someone with the same name.

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Haven't watched it, but as this question was intriguing I'm throwing in my two-cents:

On 2/1/2019 at 7:08 PM, mikbone said:

Do you think he was possessed?

Yes.

But I think possession is seriously misunderstood and corrupted by "the movies" and the idea of being a mindless puppet when possessed.

I think possession is, actually, a very common thing.

On 2/1/2019 at 7:08 PM, mikbone said:

Does his decision to be an attorney give us any insight into twisted soul?  

A dig at @Just_A_Guy?

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20 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

Haven't watched it, but as this question was intriguing I'm throwing in my two-cents:

Yes.

But I think possession is seriously misunderstood and corrupted by "the movies" and the idea of being a mindless puppet when possessed.

I think possession is, actually, a very common thing.

A dig at @Just_A_Guy?

And my wife.  

I did find it interesting that he was distraught about his average LSAT score.

He still got into a law school though.  University of Puget Sound.  

And then he transferred to the University of Utah.  

Transferring from Medical School or Law School is much more difficult then transferring from undergrad. 

He fooled so many people.  

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12 hours ago, bytebear said:

I remember the TV movie and it was filmed at the cottonwood mall very close to where I lived.  Not sure if that was the actual mall since it looked like a different mall.  The was a Sears in the shot and the CW mall had JCPenney.   

Yay cottonwood mall!  I used to walk there with friends, stop off on my way home from middle school, go to movies there.  My grandpa built the place and lived across the street, on a property that eventually became those condos.

Not sure if you've heard or not, so if you haven't, please don't shoot the messenger, but this is the Cottonwood Mall these days...

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2 hours ago, The Folk Prophet said:

A dig at @Just_A_Guy?

I was hoping no one would notice we went to the same law school.  

I vaguely remember hearing about a common-law “irresistible impulse” defense to crimes of violence, and sort of wonder whether Bundy didn’t tell some of his stories with an eye towards deploying that defense.  But, I’m not interested in him enough to really dig through his statements or give myself a refresher course on the law in that field.  

Edited by Just_A_Guy
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I've been thinking about it, and I really don't think pornography played much of a role.  

Yes, I know he said it did.  Bundy was also a serial liar.

No, I'm not defending pornography.  Just trying to keep a perspective.

Ted Bundy came up in a time when porn existed in the form of magazines and stag films.  The maximum amount of porn a person could consume in a month in the '60s is a tiny fraction of what one can get access too in a day, now, and it's more explicit, more graphic, more violent and more extreme than anything from back then.  If Ted Bundy was nudged toward serial murder by porn, then we're all in very serious trouble.

Bundy was not just a serial killer, he was a serial liar.  Know the easiest lies to tell?  The ones people already want to believe.  He sure wasn't going to admit to being evil.  Scapegoats are a fun way to minimize personal responsibility, and this is one people love to hear.

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5 hours ago, unixknight said:

I've been thinking about it, and I really don't think pornography played much of a role.  

Yes, I know he said it did.  Bundy was also a serial liar.

No, I'm not defending pornography.  Just trying to keep a perspective.

Ted Bundy came up in a time when porn existed in the form of magazines and stag films.  The maximum amount of porn a person could consume in a month in the '60s is a tiny fraction of what one can get access too in a day, now, and it's more explicit, more graphic, more violent and more extreme than anything from back then.  If Ted Bundy was nudged toward serial murder by porn, then we're all in very serious trouble.

Bundy was not just a serial killer, he was a serial liar.  Know the easiest lies to tell?  The ones people already want to believe.  He sure wasn't going to admit to being evil.  Scapegoats are a fun way to minimize personal responsibility, and this is one people love to hear.

I'm not so sure he was lying on this. 

Different people react to things in different ways. 

For example I was fine at a slaughter house and seeing the processes there.  A Nephew of mine was not and became a vegetarian for a time after that. 

I've heard that Pornography is a major element that influences many criminals, not just those who murder.  It is a major influence on many of them from what I've read in the news.

Of course, it could be the news is biased, but I think that there is an element of truth there that it can contribute to the criminal element of some people. 

Just another reason for people to avoid that type of stuff.

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5 minutes ago, JohnsonJones said:

I'm not so sure he was lying on this. 

Different people react to things in different ways. 

For example I was fine at a slaughter house and seeing the processes there.  A Nephew of mine was not and became a vegetarian for a time after that. 

I've heard that Pornography is a major element that influences many criminals, not just those who murder.  It is a major influence on many of them from what I've read in the news.

Of course, it could be the news is biased, but I think that there is an element of truth there that it can contribute to the criminal element of some people. 

Just another reason for people to avoid that type of stuff.

I think porn can be an influence, I'm just not convinced that Ted Bundy is a reliable source for it.

If it were always an influence, I'd expect the rate of violent crime to have skyrocketed in line with the increasing availability of Internet porn.  That hasn't happened.

Edited by unixknight
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