without_you

Is getting pregnant from a sperm donor not allowed in the church?

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My friend, a very close friend, has given up on guys. She's already 34 years old. She wants to inseminate herself from a sperm donor. She's also LDS. I'm very very very against this thing, and I care about her, I've known her for such a looooong time. We are debating over this. I've checked LDS.org, and now I'm looking for advice here. There's absolutely nothing about this on LDS.org. I should check with the Bishop, but first I should check here. 

What are your thoughts about this?

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10 minutes ago, without_you said:

My friend, a very close friend, has given up on guys. She's already 34 years old. She wants to inseminate herself from a sperm donor. She's also LDS. I'm very very very against this thing, and I care about her, I've known her for such a looooong time. We are debating over this. I've checked LDS.org, and now I'm looking for advice here. There's absolutely nothing about this on LDS.org. I should check with the Bishop, but first I should check here. 

What are your thoughts about this?

There is no debate about this.  A child deserves a MOTHER and a FATHER under the covenant of MARRIAGE.

A child is not a Barbie Doll.

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Just now, anatess2 said:

There is no debate about this.  A child deserves a MOTHER and a FATHER under the covenant of MARRIAGE.

A child is not a Barbie Doll.

Yes, but she hasn't been married. What should I say to her when she says: "Guys don't like her and no one wants to marry her". ..Like I try to understand her...and she has so many self-esteem issues because of this. I do admit she's not attractive. I know it's rude but it's just reality. Dating these days is hard. Very hard. 

She has tried and tried and tried so many times. She prayed for a good husband.

I think it's wrong....but that might be her only choice?

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1 minute ago, without_you said:

Yes, but she hasn't been married. What should I say to her when she says: "Guys don't like her and no one wants to marry her". ..Like I try to understand her...and she has so many self-esteem issues because of this. I do admit she's not attractive. I know it's rude but it's just reality. Dating these days is hard. Very hard. 

She has tried and tried and tried so many times. She prayed for a good husband.

I think it's wrong....but that might be her only choice?

It doesn't change the fact that A CHILD DESERVES A MOTHER AND A FATHER.  She should not be spreading her misfortune by making innocent victims.

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6 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

It doesn't change the fact that A CHILD DESERVES A MOTHER AND A FATHER.  She should not be spreading her misfortune by making innocent victims.

Ok, I will tell her that. Thanks

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6 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

It doesn't change the fact that A CHILD DESERVES A MOTHER AND A FATHER.  She should not be spreading her misfortune by making innocent victims.

What should I say to her? She keeps bring up that she won't ever get married..She thinks God has cursed her appearance....I'm really trying to help her

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3 minutes ago, without_you said:

What should I say to her? She keeps bring up that she won't ever get married..She thinks God has cursed her appearance....I'm really trying to help her

Her problem is not finding a husband.  Her problem is she thinks God is so cruel as to "curse her appearance".  Plus the problem that she thinks marriage is built on a foundation of APPEARANCES.

How you help her is for her to learn some more about what Love means in God's kingdom.

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2 minutes ago, without_you said:

What should I say to her? She keeps bring up that she won't ever get married..She thinks God has cursed her appearance....I'm really trying to help her

She can either trust God and his promises... Or she can trust herself.

Plenty of people in this life do not get the blessings that other people might get... It all depends on highly individual circumstances.  While desiring the blessings and working for it is very very good...  Crossing the line into disobedience and sin to try to get it... is well...   crossing the line

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A single woman has so many options. There are so many people in this world who are in need of mothering. There are tons of career paths to take such as teaching, daycare, nursing, social work, etc., etc., etc. What is her job? There may be opportunities there to mother. If not, there are so many volunteer opportunities. She could look on justserve.org to find volunteer opportunities in her area.

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This good sister needs to realize that it's not about her, or her hurt feelings, or her loneliness. It's about another human being.

In the 1970s there was a sitcom called The Mary Tyler Moore Show, about a single career girl (as they were called then) and her adventures at her television station employment. One of the characters was an almost preternaturally self-obsessed TV cook played by Betty White. In one episode, this character described her pain and horror at the death of an acquaintance, ending her heart-rending story with the plaintive cry, "And I know God killed her to punish me!"

Your friend's unhappiness and heart-break might lead her to a life choice that would involve others, not just her. It's not all about her. I realize this might sound callous, but I don't mean it to. I'm sympathetic with how she must feel. But as others have stated above, a child deserves both a mother and a father, married to each other. To intentionally deprive them of this even before conception strikes me as wrong and selfish.

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2 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

She can either trust God and his promises... Or she can trust herself.

Plenty of people in this life do not get the blessings that other people might get... It all depends on highly individual circumstances.  While desiring the blessings and working for it is very very good...  Crossing the line into disobedience and sin to try to get it... is well...   crossing the line

Thank you. That was beautiful. 

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16 minutes ago, without_you said:

Thank you. That was beautiful. 

You are welcome...  It is great to be "Anxiously Engaged in a Good Cause."  But we should not use our Anxiousness and Good Causedness as a justification to cross the bounds the Lord has set.

7 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

@estradling75, you did it.  You finally did it.  Nobody will ever believe your avatar now.

I still do not like people so I think I am safe  :)

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30 minutes ago, Connie said:

A single woman has so many options. There are so many people in this world who are in need of mothering. There are tons of career paths to take such as teaching, daycare, nursing, social work, etc., etc., etc. What is her job? There may be opportunities there to mother. If not, there are so many volunteer opportunities. She could look on justserve.org to find volunteer opportunities in her area.

She's a criminal defense lawyer and holds an associates in Psychology. Sometimes she has too much stuff to do. I'll try to get her involved in this. I highly doubt it she has time for herself though.

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3 minutes ago, without_you said:

She's a criminal defense lawyer and holds an associates in Psychology. Sometimes she has too much stuff to do. I'll try to get her involved in this. I highly doubt it she has time for herself though.

That doesn't make sense.  If you doubt she has time for herself, why would she think she has time for child?

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18 minutes ago, Alia said:

This will be a very unpopular opinion but it's between her and the Lord. 

This is true. The Church strongly discourages in-vitro fertilization when using semen from anyone but the husband, or an egg from anyone but the wife. However, as Alia said, this is between her and the Lord. Also, children are meant to be reared by a father and a mother. Being a single parent, especially of a newborn is very tough and time consuming. Another thing to consider since she is LDS, is that if she conceived, she would be unable to have the child sealed to her...children can only be sealed to both a father and a mother, not just 1. If she eventually got married, and wanted a sealing, she would need to seek permission from the actual father of the child...it would get very messy, complicated, and difficult. I would recommend against it - it is difficult, but better to wait upon the Lord.

Edited by scottyg

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1 minute ago, anatess2 said:

That doesn't make sense.  If you doubt she has time for herself, why would she think she has time for child?

I don't know. Maybe I can convince her to take some time off 

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In addition having a child is hard. My wife and I have struggled from lack of sleep, depression, loss of certain social activities, high costs for child care etc. I don't say this to discourage others from having children, my daughter means the world to me, but trying to do all these things by myself without my wife would be 10 times harder. I'm not saying it's impossible, many good brothers and sisters find the strength they need to rise to the occasion, but why would you purposely make yourself a single parent? And just to satisfy a whim at that? I feel for her, a lot actually, I know what it's like to want a child and not be able to have one (infertility for years) but she needs to stay within the bounds the Lord has set.

Edited by Midwest LDS

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30 minutes ago, Alia said:

This will be a very unpopular opinion but it's between her and the Lord. 

 

13 minutes ago, scottyg said:

This is true. The Church strongly discourages in-vitro fertilization when using semen from anyone but the husband, or an egg from anyone but the wife. However, as Alia said, this is between her and the Lord.

Well, sure. And if you smoke pot, or commit adultery, or distribute porn flicks, or open a marijuana and cocaine dispensary, or embezzle a hundred million dollars, or go out breaking the eggs of bald eagles, it's between you and the Lord. Everything you do is between you and the Lord.

I think you're suggesting that we can't really say whether she's justified or not, whether her in vitro fertilization as an unmarried woman is a good or a bad thing. If this is correct, then you are mistaken. We are perfectly able to judge right from wrong, good from bad, even in this case. It's not a particularly difficult judgment to make.

EDIT: After rereading what you wrote, maybe you were not suggesting any such thing. But I'll leave what I wrote because I think the rest of it is true, even if I was wrong about your motive.

Edited by Vort

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https://www.lds.org/study/manual/handbook-2-administering-the-church/selected-church-policies-and-guidelines/selected-church-policies?lang=eng#title_number71

Especially:

Quote

21.4.3
Artificial Insemination

The Church strongly discourages artificial insemination using semen from anyone but the husband. However, this is a personal matter that ultimately must be left to the judgment of the husband and wife. Responsibility for the decision rests solely upon them.

Artificial insemination of single sisters is not approved. Single sisters who deliberately refuse to follow the counsel of Church leaders in this matter are subject to Church discipline.

Handbook 2 answers a multitude of questions.

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1 minute ago, Vort said:

 

Well, sure. And if you smoke pot, or commit adultery, or distribute porn flicks, or open a marijuana and cocaine dispensary, or embezzle a hundred million dollars, or go out breaking the eggs of bald eagles, it's between you and the Lord. Everything you do is between you and the Lord.

I think you're suggesting that we can't really say whether she's justified or not, whether her in vitro fertilization as an unmarried woman is a good or a bad thing. If this is correct, then you are mistaken. We are perfectly able to judge right from wrong, good from bad, even in this case. It's not a particularly difficult judgment to make.

I am simply stating what is in the church handbook.

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1 minute ago, scottyg said:

I am simply stating what is in the church handbook.

Please note my edit. I might have misunderstood your point.

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2 minutes ago, zil said:

Wow, I didn’t realize the Church’s position was that stringent vis a vis single women who pursue in vitro.

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