"Well Behaved Women . . . "


Guest LiterateParakeet
 Share

Recommended Posts

3 minutes ago, unixknight said:

I think that's what it should be.  

Yes.  It is what IT IS.

Gender Wage Gap does not advocate for women's rights on the basis of the equality of the sexes.  Gender Wage Gap is an attempt to EQUALIZE OUTCOMES regardless of underlying multi-variant reasons on the basis of a perceived Oppressive Patriarchy.  This is ANTI-FEMINIST.

Edited by anatess2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, unixknight said:

I wish that were so, but spend 5 minutes watching a discussion between two people who both consider themselves feminists yet disagree on a bunch of its aspects shows that to not be the case.  For an example, this very thread.

I just got done telling @LiterateParakeet her error on telling me I'm not a feminist.  So, as far as I know, there is nobody in this thread who uses the label Feminist while displaying anti-feminist sentiments.  So what exactly do you mean by "this very thread"?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

I just got done telling @LiterateParakeet her error on telling me I'm not a feminist.  So, as far as I know, there is nobody in this thread who uses the label Feminist while displaying anti-feminist sentiments.  So what exactly do you mean by "this very thread"?

The fact that you two could disagree on what precisely a feminist is/does/believes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, unixknight said:

The fact that you two could disagree on what precisely a feminist is/does/believes.

No.  We didn't disagree on that.  We disagreed on the reason for people to label themselves Feminist.  She uses the label, I do not.  I prefer to let my actions speak for itself.

Edited by anatess2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don’t think there is one “right” definition of Feminist. It’s sort of an umbrella term that means different things to different people. Out in the world, my first impression of that label conjures up images of loud protesting women who want equal pay, equal treatment, pro-choice because whether they were consenting or not, being pregnant is something men did to them. They want the equal ability to walk away from that little responsibility like the men can if they so choose. It’s also high powered CEOs who are scary intimidating bosses because they are so full of their own power. 

In the church, I hear Feminist and I immediately think of women who want the priesthood and want to run the church. 

But I know people who consider themselves Feminists who don’t fit squarely under all those categories.  

You can’t pigeonhole Feminists.

Edited by carlimac
Link to comment
Share on other sites

And FWIW, I felt surges of Feminist rage at one point when I was stuck home with 5 kids under 9. My husband could go to work, then leave his office, lock his door and go golfing for five hours without telling me under the guise of “networking”. I had no way to get hold of him in an emergency. (Before the days of cell phones.) He really got an earful from me when I found out where he had been.  He pretty much gave up golf after that. I somehow didn’t feel all that triumphant- rather just whiney.  

That’s another negative image I have of Feminists. Whiners!  But obviously not all of them are. The loud obnoxious ones give Feminists a bad name.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, anatess2 said:

No.  We didn't disagree on that.  We disagreed on the reason for people to label themselves Feminist.  She uses the label, I do not.  I prefer to let my actions speak for itself.

It all amounts to the same thing, in my book.  Definition of the label, reason for using it... whatever.  If it were simple and universal, there wouldn't be much to disagree on.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, unixknight said:

It all amounts to the same thing, in my book.  Definition of the label, reason for using it... whatever.  If it were simple and universal, there wouldn't be much to disagree on.

It is not the same thing.  The label Feminist has been usurped by toxic women who believe that they are victims of an Oppressive Patriarchy.  It's been going on for about 4 decades as political parties start catering to "the Female Vote".  This is the same path as the tragedy of fatherless children experienced in black families as political parties started catering to "the Black Vote".  That is why there is a huge discrepancy between people who identify as Feminists and people who believe in equality of the sexes.  The Gillette Commercial, the latest Edeka Commercial, the Captain Marvel Movie - these have become staples in today's society that even people on 3H don't realize are toxic as it becomes normalized.   As a mother of 2 boys I had to make sure I insulate my boys from this toxicity.

I've said it before and I'll say it again.  The Modern Feminist Movement is CANCER.  It needs to be burned down so FEMINISM can rise from its ashes.

Edited by anatess2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest MormonGator
16 hours ago, carlimac said:

The loud obnoxious ones give Feminists a bad name.

I think that's true with all ideologies. From the right wing Trumpers to the left wing Michael Moore fans-the extremes give everyone else a bad name. 

Edited by MormonGator
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

It is not the same thing...

The definition of the term vs. who gets to apply it is all the same argument from what I'm seeing.  The rest of the stuff you said is just preaching to the choir if you're addressing me with it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, unixknight said:

The definition of the term vs. who gets to apply it is all the same argument from what I'm seeing.  The rest of the stuff you said is just preaching to the choir if you're addressing me with it.

It is not.

Okay, here's an exercise for you.  Watch this 2-minute video and see if you can spot where toxic feminism has influenced Emma Watson - a UN Goodwill Ambassador.  Just to be clear, Emma is not a toxic female - she's actually one that really tries to do the right thing,  but she's so young, she grew up in the age of toxic feminism and it shows.  All of the power in the Feminist Movement are currently held by people like these - people who are influenced by toxic feminism without even realizing it.  It needs to be burned down and unfortunately, Emma Watson's movement has to burn down with it.

Edited by anatess2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

It is not.

Why do you keep  trying to convince me that toxic feminism exists?  I know it does.  Like I said, you're preaching to the choir.

I'm not sure if we actually even disagree, or whether you think I'm arguing something different from what I am.  I'll state my position:

There's no set definition of the term 'feminism' because different people look at it form different points of view.  Thus, 'feminism' means different things to different people.  Therefore, any discussion of whether or not someone is a 'real' feminist is just a 'No True Scotsman' fallacy.  Nobody gets to be the gatekeeper on who may call themselves a feminist.  (Which was the point I was making in my first post of this thread when I talked about the co-worker who insisted that my wife couldn't be a feminist because she's pro-life.)

I never disagreed with you on your points about toxic feminism being a thing, or that many parts of it have taken on misandry.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, unixknight said:

Why do you keep  trying to convince me that toxic feminism exists?  I know it does.  Like I said, you're preaching to the choir.

I'm not sure if we actually even disagree, or whether you think I'm arguing something different from what I am.  I'll state my position:

There's no set definition of the term 'feminism' because different people look at it form different points of view.  Thus, 'feminism' means different things to different people.  Therefore, any discussion of whether or not someone is a 'real' feminist is just a 'No True Scotsman' fallacy.  Nobody gets to be the gatekeeper on who may call themselves a feminist.  (Which was the point I was making in my first post of this thread when I talked about the co-worker who insisted that my wife couldn't be a feminist because she's pro-life.)

I never disagreed with you on your points about toxic feminism being a thing, or that many parts of it have taken on misandry.

@unixknight.  If you keep calling Hot Chocolate, a drink with coffee beans, it doesn't make Hot Chocolate a drink with coffee beans.  Hot Chocolate is Hot Chocolate, it has a SPECIFIC DEFINITION and coffee is NOT IT regardless of how many individuals call coffee Hot Chocolate.  The ONLY WAY Hot Chocolate becomes Coffee is if Merriam Webster changes the definition of Hot Chocolate to Coffee.  But, if the UN Ambassador of Goodwill, the President of Canada, and professors of academia continues to teach that Hot Chocolate has coffee beans, the only way you can take the Hot Chocolate word back so you can stop arguing over the compatibility of Hot Chocolate with the Word of Wisdom is to burn down the movements of those Hot Chocolate Is Coffee people with power.

 

Edited by anatess2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

@unixknight.  If you keep calling Hot Chocolate, a drink with coffee beans, it doesn't make Hot Chocolate a drink with coffee beans.  Hot Chocolate is Hot Chocolate, it has a SPECIFIC DEFINITION and coffee is NOT IT regardless of how many individuals call coffee Hot Chocolate.  The ONLY WAY Hot Chocolate becomes Coffee is if Merriam Webster changes the definition of Hot Chocolate to Coffee.  But, if the UN Ambassador of Goodwill, the President of Canada, and professors of academia continues to teach that Hot Chocolate has coffee beans, the only way you can take the Hot Chocolate word back so you can stop arguing over the compatibility of Hot Chocolate with the Word of Wisdom is to burn down the movements of those Hot Chocolate Is Coffee people with power.

And some people define hot chocolate as also having marshmallows while other don't.  Some purists would say Swiss Miss doesn't make 'true' hot chocolate while others permit Hershey's chocolate syrup to be used in making 'hot chocolate.'  

This is why the "no true scotsman' argument is a fallacy. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, unixknight said:

And some people define hot chocolate as also having marshmallows while other don't.  Some purists would say Swiss Miss doesn't make 'true' hot chocolate while others permit Hershey's chocolate syrup to be used in making 'hot chocolate.'  

This is why the "no true scotsman' argument is a fallacy. 

Completely incongruent to the situation.  It doesn't change the definition of Hot Chocolate to have marshmallows in it.  

It only becomes true scotsman argument if YOU ARE ARGUING THAT MISANDRY IS FEMINISM.

Edited by anatess2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest MormonGator
36 minutes ago, unixknight said:

This is why the "no true scotsman' argument is a fallacy. 

Dude! I was just talking about this to a friend last night. I said that "No true Metallica fan could like the song Nothing Else Matters." I even said it was a "True Scotsman" logical fallacy, but who cares? I was right. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, anatess2 said:

Nobody in this thread does and the ones that do outside of this thread are not in positions of power.

I don't see the relevance.

In any case, I think we're talking in circles now.  Let's agree to disagree.  You're welcome to the last word, if you like.  😊

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest MormonGator
5 minutes ago, unixknight said:

I don't see the relevance.

In any case, I think we're talking in circles now.  Let's agree to disagree.  You're welcome to the last word, if you like.  😊

And the Black Album is horrible. It started their decline. Those are MY last words. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, unixknight said:

I don't see the relevance.

In any case, I think we're talking in circles now.  Let's agree to disagree.  You're welcome to the last word, if you like.  😊

I'll take it.

The ginormous relevance is people in positions of power like Emma Watson - UN Ambassador of Goodwill, most, if not all, professors in Western academia, most, if not all, heads of western states, most, if not all, members of Congress/Parliament/etc in the west, most, if not all heads of Tech Giants, most, if not all, influence makers in the Entertainment Industry, most, if not all, mainstream media - all define misandry as feminism.  None of them have "a problem with marshmallows on their hot chocolate".

Edited by anatess2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest MormonGator
1 minute ago, unixknight said:

That was my gateway into not only Metallica, but metal in general.  (No, Van Halen is NOT metal.)

Oh son, sit down a minute. 

That album isn't metal. It's radio friendly metal. Could you see "Nothing Else Matters" on Master of Puppets? Ride the Lighting? Kill em All? No way. Same with Unforgiven and frankly, same with 99% of the songs on that album. Don't get me wrong, it's not a bad album. It's a bad Metallica album. 

The soapbox has been brought out and I am unleashing righteous fury. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, MormonGator said:

Oh son, sit down a minute. 

That album isn't metal. It's radio friendly metal. Could you see "Nothing Else Matters" on Master of Puppets? Ride the Lighting? Kill em All? No way. Same with Unforgiven and frankly, same with 99% of the songs on that album. Don't get me wrong, it's not a bad album. It's a bad Metallica album. 

The soapbox has been brought out and I am unleashing righteous fury. 

But but...  I liked 'Of Wolf and Man...'

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share