Help! Clearing my own bias


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I'm struggling here and could use some advice.

Earlier today, a call was extended to a member in our ward to be a counselor in the elders quorum. Due to the nature of the calling, we weren't surprised when it was reported back that he wanted some time to think about it. What did take us off guard was his statement that his hesitation was that he felt he needed to be called into the young men organization. 

When that detail was reported back, everyone in our Bishopric was a bit taken aback. We have a fully staffed, smooth functioning Young Men organization that hasn't been together very long. What's more, we have a couple of youth that have been disengaging from the church somewhat, and it is the bishopric's impression that this particular brother would antagonize that situation (even though he is under the impression that he would be the fix).

Anyhow, I have always hated it when Bishoprics have been dismissive of others' impressions. So I really want to take this information seriously. But it flies in the face of what I've felt about this brother for close to a year, so it's hard for me to put my strong biases aside here.

How do you consider something like this without letting your own biases interfere?

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1 minute ago, MarginOfError said:

I'm struggling here and could use some advice.

Earlier today, a call was extended to a member in our ward to be a counselor in the elders quorum. Due to the nature of the calling, we weren't surprised when it was reported back that he wanted some time to think about it. What did take us off guard was his statement that his hesitation was that he felt he needed to be called into the young men organization. 

When that detail was reported back, everyone in our Bishopric was a bit taken aback. We have a fully staffed, smooth functioning Young Men organization that hasn't been together very long. What's more, we have a couple of youth that have been disengaging from the church somewhat, and it is the bishopric's impression that this particular brother would antagonize that situation (even though he is under the impression that he would be the fix).

Anyhow, I have always hated it when Bishoprics have been dismissive of others' impressions. So I really want to take this information seriously. But it flies in the face of what I've felt about this brother for close to a year, so it's hard for me to put my strong biases aside here.

How do you consider something like this without letting your own biases interfere?

Fast and pray after making a decision. No matter how biased the decision is, or how unbiased you try to make it, the Holy Ghost will confirm the correct answer. This brothers's reaction and counter might be an indicator that something is amiss with him. Or maybe the EQ experience will better prepare him for a calling with the YM at some future date.

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I don't think this needs to be an 'either/or' situation. Tell him the bishopric has fasted and prayed about it and the EQ is where he's needed right now but let him know that you're happy to hear of his interest in supporting the youth. Remind him that an official calling isn't required to be a friend or example so suggest he do xyz. This way he's engaged, you can watch to see how it goes and it leaves the new leadership in place. 

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53 minutes ago, MarginOfError said:

Earlier today, a call was extended to a member in our ward to be a counselor in the elders quorum. Due to the nature of the calling, we weren't surprised when it was reported back that he wanted some time to think about it. What did take us off guard was his statement that his hesitation was that he felt he needed to be called into the young men organization. 

When that detail was reported back, everyone in our Bishopric was a bit taken aback.

So, the EQP/Bishop recommend someone, the stake interviewed and approved this brother, and then extended a call to him, and he asked for more time.  That's how the handbook specifies it needs to be done, does that match what you saw done?

How do you know the bishopric was taken aback?  

Edited by NeuroTypical
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I think the Lord calls us, biases and all.  That doesn’t mean that we are free to disregard or run roughshod over other people’s feelings or (as they see it) spiritual promptings; and hopefully there’s always the humility to do a gut-check and say “Lord, are You sure?”  But I think in any calling, we should take some measure of confidence from the fact that the Lord know what we’d be inclined to do with a calling, when He places us in that calling; and not let ourselves get neurotic over our knowledge that someone else in the ward would do our calling differently.

Edited by Just_A_Guy
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Could this brother be mistaking the meaning of his own otherwise true spiritual impressions? Several years back, I interviewed with my bishop (probably temple recommend stuff), and I told him that I had felt prompted to prepare to teach the Book of Mormon gospel doctrine class. He thanked me for my input, then shortly thereafter called me to a different position. Someone else was the gospel doctrine teacher. And that was fine. I did not doubt my bishop's inspiration for a moment. But I knew what I had felt, and I don't think that idea came solely from within me. So perhaps this brother's prompting was to prepare to teach the youth, and he misinterpreted that as a revelation that he was to be called to the young men's organization. Just a thought.

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3 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

 

So, the EQP/Bishop recommend someone, the stake interviewed and approved this brother, and then extended a call to him, and he asked for more time.  That's how the handbook specifies it needs to be done, does that match what you saw done?

How do you know the bishopric was taken aback?  

I work pretty closely with the bishopric.

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3 hours ago, MarginOfError said:

I'm struggling here and could use some advice.

Earlier today, a call was extended to a member in our ward to be a counselor in the elders quorum. Due to the nature of the calling, we weren't surprised when it was reported back that he wanted some time to think about it. What did take us off guard was his statement that his hesitation was that he felt he needed to be called into the young men organization. 

When that detail was reported back, everyone in our Bishopric was a bit taken aback. We have a fully staffed, smooth functioning Young Men organization that hasn't been together very long. What's more, we have a couple of youth that have been disengaging from the church somewhat, and it is the bishopric's impression that this particular brother would antagonize that situation (even though he is under the impression that he would be the fix).

Anyhow, I have always hated it when Bishoprics have been dismissive of others' impressions. So I really want to take this information seriously. But it flies in the face of what I've felt about this brother for close to a year, so it's hard for me to put my strong biases aside here.

How do you consider something like this without letting your own biases interfere?

Perhaps one of the most misunderstood principles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the purpose of callings.  I have pondered and asked for insight into callings most of my life.  I have determined that the reason for callings is not at all what most members think.  The reason I believe this is because of all the exceptions I have encountered.  In case anyone is wondering let me list some of these misconceptions to which I have experienced so many exceptions:

1. We receive callings because of our righteousness and faithfulness.  --- Not really.  Sometimes unfaithful are called - I have known of non-members receiving callings.

2. We are called because of our abilities - Almost all of my callings have been for things for which I have almost zero ability - I do not know of any callings that I feel that I am the most qualified in my ward.

3. We are called to develop new talents.  If anyone feels they have successfully fulfilled all their callings - it is likely the result of misguided pride.  

4. We are called because we are so needed.  Again I think this demonstrates over blown pride.  If we were so needed there would be no releases.

 

For the record - I am convinced we are given callings so we will perform service.  This is because most of us will not go out of our way to serve and if left to our own devices we will likely ignore the spirit and allow many good Saints to fall through the cracks and be forgotten.  Rather we will only love and serve our friends and those we like.  If we did not have callings we would not serve as well as we do when obligated.  Thus I am convinced we are called by priesthood brethren that were called to callings that otherwise we would not be so invested.  Or that we would not otherwise support and sustain those who lead us. We are called that there can be order.

 

The Traveler

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4 hours ago, MarginOfError said:

How do you consider something like this without letting your own biases interfere?

1) Remember the love of God is the first and great commandment. One of my more spiritual experiences came when I was pondering a family and asking God to open my eyes and heart to feel the love he had for them. The experiencing was changing for me.

2) I would think the scripture specifying to pull the beam from our own eye is of value when it comes to our personal bias.

3) Another scripture I like is to bridle our passions that we may be filled with the love of God

4) We are fallible and can make mistakes also such that we are seeking our own will rather than God's will. In this instance provided, we have contradicting revelations (at this time). So, in this light, I would think the bishopric, the stake presidency, or this brother is placing their will in front of God's will. As I know nothing of the communication, this brother may be filling what President Uctdorf said once, paraphrazed, "The Lord has made it known that he is worthy and would serve well as a young man's president, but not necessarily that he should be." The opposite could be true also.

5) I like to remember stories in my life that seem to relate to the following circumstance. In this light, I would remember a story my single's ward bishop shared with me. In this story, as two stake presidents were involved, one stake president had to apply given principle #1 & 4.

6) Stewardship and where the keys preside.

As a caveat, this is stated full well knowing I struggle with mine own biases.

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I hope you will indulge me as I rant.  Your post made me think of several things.  

1) In regards to bias, prejudice, ill feelings etc. I believe change can only come from the inside as a gift from the Spirit, through diligent prayer, repentance, and proactive faith (acting in all ways towards him as if you are NOT biased until the Lord changes your heart).   I've been there and it is hard, but it works (there's a story here about the girl I took to Prom).  Anyway...

2) In regards to accepting callings,  I like it when the Lord confirms my callings to me but it hasn't always happened.  I have accepted many callings not feeling "good" about them.  I am suffering in one right now.  I was called to Scouts and Deacon's quorum.  I am an arthritic, asthmatic with cardiac arrhythmia who used to be a school teacher but quit because the stress of dealing with kids was destroying my health.   Two years into this calling I asked the Bishop if he really felt inspired to call me because if he had any doubt about his inspiration, I wanted OUT!  He said he didn't have any doubt.  I am still in.  I have also been a YM president twice (a calling which I feel I totally bombed both times).  I have also been a ward choir director for over 20 years (not consecutively) - a calling for which I am qualified and trained - but I am getting a bit tired of.  Nevertheless I am still choir director and probably will be until death.   In such callings, I just have faith that I am learning something (maybe just patience) and hope that the Lord can make something good out of the messes I create.  

3) Listening to the inspiration of others has been a thorn in my side as well.  I have frequently been bothered by leaders who seem not to recognized that others have the right to inspiration in their respective spheres (e.g. Beehive advisor being told she can't do THAT activity when she actually felt inspired to do it).   I think everyone has a right to their own inspiration about their own potential callings as well and have agency to reject a calling and should be able to do so without being judged.   In your case I appreciate this brother being at least willing to consider the Elders calling despite his feelings and hope he will get his confirmation.  However, I also hope he is careful not to suggest to the Bishopric they were wrong and that they should put him in YM (see Oliver vs. Joseph).  That's definitely working outside the "sphere" of his stewardship.  

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I do genuinely appreciate the feedback.  Like @jdf135, I get irritated when leaders don't take into account what those they serve are feeling (happens to me a lot if you can believe it :) ).

One of the problems I have, if I'm honest, is that I feel like this particular person has no business being anywhere near youth that are in a faith crisis.  His approach toward these things is pretty heavy handed, and I don't see the youth he thinks are in need of his help as actually responding to his tactics.  To put it shortly, I am under the impression that this desire to work with the youth is some kind of hero-complex kicking in.  And some of that...I don't want to call it animosity, but I'm not sure what the better word is...is definitely personal.  I mean, to put it in context, this would be like @Vort telling me he has had distinct impressions that he should be called to teach my kids because he doesn't feel like they're being taught adequately by the people we've called (I mean that in the best way, Vort).

So I've spent a few hours over the past two days trying to drop my guard and be open to the idea of calling him to work with youth (this brother, not Vort--let's be realistic :D ). I can't say my position has moved much.  But I also can't say I feel certain that I've successfully let my guard down. Still working on it.  I've imposed an artificial deadline on myself of the start of mutual activities this week.  If I haven't had any change in my feelings, I'm just going to call "stupor of thought" and proceed as usual.  If that's wrong, then I'll have to accept the consequences of that.

Any other advice on how to deal with these kinds of situations is appreciated. 

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I don't think it has to be a one-is-right-the-other-is-wrong thing here.

Perhaps this brother should be preparing to teach the youth, such as learning empathy and gentling his approach.  Such could be a long-term project for him, and not directly relate to the immediate calling. 

@MarginOfError, I think you approach (the praying, spending time considering, artificial deadline) here is very wise.  I would hold to that course.

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For me as a youth, I needed a leader who was blunt and to the point. Someone who was always "sunshine and daises" and who beat around the bush wouldn't have helped me grow and desire to repent. All kids are different, but for me, I needed a kick in the pants and to be told to "buck up"...otherwise I wouldn't have. Regardless of the situation, the best course of action is for the Elder's Quorum president to fast and pray, and to them inform the Ward and Stake leaders of his decision...he holds Priesthood Keys and is entitled to revelation. Although he makes recommendations for his counselors (in consultation with the Bishop), the final say is between the Stake presidency and high council.  They will determine if the call remains extended or is recalled.

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One thing I have learned about callings - especially leadership callings like presidencies, bishoprics, stake callings and even general authorities -- I have yet to meet anyone in such callings (or just about any calling) doing a poor enough job at it that I want to replace them.  I have become very good at sustaining why and who the L-rd calls to his service.  I honestly believe G-d respects those that struggle with their callings as much or more than those that serve with ease. 

 

The Traveler

Edited by Traveler
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People have all kinds of ideas about church callings and which ones they should be called to. 1st counselor to the EQ presidency is kind of a big deal. This brother was selected by the EQ president in consultation with the Bishop, then approved by the high council and stake presidency.  I can understand why he would wan to think about it.

This brother does not receive revelation for the stake, or the ward in which he resides. It is presumptous of him to think he does, his own personal thoughts about what he would like to be doing are irrelevant.

Personally if I was that EQ president I would pick someone else. 

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1 hour ago, Traveler said:

One thing I have learned about callings - especially leadership callings like presidencies, bishoprics, stake callings and even general authorities -- I have yet to meet anyone in such callings (or just about any calling) doing a poor enough job at it that I want to replace them.  I have become very good at sustaining why and who the L-rd calls to his service.  I honestly believe G-d respects those that struggle with their callings as much or more than those that serve with ease. 

 

The Traveler

Agreed. Often, those who want to be in a leadership position are those who have never done it before. These callings are tough, and oftentimes lonely. I have only ever seen 1 person released form a calling because they were doing a poor job...and it was more because they just couldn't find the time to serve due to a change in work schedule. I have always grown from every calling I have ever been in...and 2 of the last 3 have been ones that I wanted to say no to. :)

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22 minutes ago, omegaseamaster75 said:

People have all kinds of ideas about church callings and which ones they should be called to. 1st counselor to the EQ presidency is kind of a big deal. This brother was selected by the EQ president in consultation with the Bishop, then approved by the high council and stake presidency.  I can understand why he would wan to think about it.

This brother does not receive revelation for the stake, or the ward in which he resides. It is presumptous of him to think he does, his own personal thoughts about what he would like to be doing are irrelevant.

Personally if I was that EQ president I would pick someone else. 

I'm going to step in and advise not to be so quick to judge.  There is a lot more back story here than I have shared, and I am withholding details deliberately. I have no doubt that, as much as I'm struggling to be able to see things from his point of view, that his cognitive dissonance is probably 10 times what mine is.

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I'm going to ask that comments regarding the appropriateness of telling a bishop what callings you should have be moved to a separate thread, as they aren't helpful here.  I'm happy to engage in that discussion. But for this current thread, please focus on the issue at hand; clearing one's mind of their own bias* in order to create the opportunity to understand the Lord's will when presented with information previously not considered.

* Bias here is pretty broad.  It can be that I've already come to a decision, and I inherently believe that my decisions are right. To change my decision now would imply that I was wrong (or less right) before. Therefore, I am biased against changing my decision because I want to be right. Bias can be personal. It can be preconceived based on a list of names provided by an organization president.  I don't much care what the source of bias is.

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1 minute ago, MarginOfError said:

I'm going to ask that comments regarding the appropriateness of telling a bishop what callings you should have be moved to a separate thread, as they aren't helpful here.  I'm happy to engage in that discussion. But for this current thread, please focus on the issue at hand; clearing one's mind of their own bias* in order to create the opportunity to understand the Lord's will when presented with information previously not considered.

* Bias here is pretty broad.  It can be that I've already come to a decision, and I inherently believe that my decisions are right. To change my decision now would imply that I was wrong (or less right) before. Therefore, I am biased against changing my decision because I want to be right. Bias can be personal. It can be preconceived based on a list of names provided by an organization president.  I don't much care what the source of bias is.

I am not sure you can clear you mind of biases...

Which is why I think the Lord's way is better...  He tells us to study, ponder, pray, and then make a decision.  Then we go to the Lord and ask... "Is this the right decision."   Or in other words tell the Lord "I am going to do this thing... If it is right open up the way.... if it is wrong block it, hedge it, stupor it, etc"   When I do this I find out pretty quickly if the Lord is helping or hindering and I respond accordingly.  My biases do not matter and this way the Lord can fully support my agency.

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12 minutes ago, MarginOfError said:

* Bias here is pretty broad.  It can be that I've already come to a decision, and I inherently believe that my decisions are right. To change my decision now would imply that I was wrong (or less right) before. Therefore, I am biased against changing my decision because I want to be right. Bias can be personal. It can be preconceived based on a list of names provided by an organization president.  I don't much care what the source of bias is.

For me the answer to that is humility. We should never have preconceived notions of what we should be doing, or what calling we should have...because the calling we do have is what we should have. It doesn't matter if the thought of something different comes from us or from another. We should never refuse a call to serve. If something is standing in the way of effective service, those concerns should be brought up to the authority extending the call, but we should never refuse because we want something "better" or different. We should be willing to accept what the Lord wants of us, and trust in his better judgement. Wanting to be right isn't bias, it is pride.

Edited by scottyg
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On 5/26/2019 at 6:01 PM, MarginOfError said:

Anyhow, I have always hated it when Bishoprics have been dismissive of others' impressions. So I really want to take this information seriously. But it flies in the face of what I've felt about this brother for close to a year, so it's hard for me to put my strong biases aside here.

How do you consider something like this without letting your own biases interfere?

Unless you are in a position to influence or make a decision your own bias is irrelevant. The brother who was called does not receive revelation for the ward or the stake, and while his preferences for calling may or may not be taken into account his ideas about what he is called to do are irrelevant also.

Are you the Bishop? or just a councilor?  If the First, pray that your personal bias will not get in the way of the Lords work, if the latter keep your mouth shut.

 

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9 minutes ago, omegaseamaster75 said:

Unless you are in a position to influence or make a decision your own bias is irrelevant. The brother who was called does not receive revelation for the ward or the stake, and while his preferences for calling may or may not be taken into account his ideas about what he is called to do are irrelevant also.

Given the number of stories I've heard of a person being called to a position and saying "I had a feeling this was coming," and how those are often celebrated as stories of personal preparedness and sensitivity to the spirit, I find this a curious statement.  It seems dangerously close to using concurrence with leadership as the yardstick of whether revelation/intuition/premonition is "true" or "false"

Quote

Are you the Bishop? or just a councilor?  If the First, pray that your personal bias will not get in the way of the Lords work, if the latter keep your mouth shut.

The exact position I bear in the ward's organization is not a detail necessary for the discussion. But I will note that councilors that do not council with the bishop and offer their viewpoints aren't much good as councilors. Beyond that, we've been advised that those serving on the ward council serve the entire ward, not just their organizations; and that they should be free to offer council on all matters that affect ward members. If you wish to discuss that further, open a thread.

 

Regarding "pray that your personal bias will not get in the way of the Lord's work" -- thank you.  I just wish I knew some more sure way to determine if I were doing that successfully.

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6 minutes ago, MarginOfError said:

Given the number of stories I've heard of a person being called to a position and saying "I had a feeling this was coming," and how those are often celebrated as stories of personal preparedness and sensitivity to the spirit, I find this a curious statement.  It seems dangerously close to using concurrence with leadership as the yardstick of whether revelation/intuition/premonition is "true" or "false"

I would place no stock in those stories. These are all after the fact discussions that the members share with others. As to the actual veracity of these things we don't know do we? nor would we have anyway of knowing unless we were the individual in question. They may be conflating their happiness/dissatisfaction with the calling as the influence of the spirit and thus make the statement "I knew this was coming" 

10 minutes ago, MarginOfError said:

The exact position I bear in the ward's organization is not a detail necessary for the discussion. But I will note that councilors that do not council with the bishop and offer their viewpoints aren't much good as councilors. Beyond that, we've been advised that those serving on the ward council serve the entire ward, not just their organizations; and that they should be free to offer council on all matters that affect ward members. If you wish to discuss that further, open a thread.

I agree the councilors should council. This is not a subject that would come up in ward council so I will assume you are in the bishopric (not that it matters).  I would state to the bishop how I felt but also say that I have a bias in the matter. It is up to him to decide he has the keys to sort out personal bias.

12 minutes ago, MarginOfError said:

Regarding "pray that your personal bias will not get in the way of the Lord's work" -- thank you.  I just wish I knew some more sure way to determine if I were doing that successfully.

See my previous statement, however is you are the Bishop you have the keys and carry the mantel as the leader of the ward to decide.

What you decide will be best if done in a prayerful and thoughtful manner.

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