New 007


Guest Mores
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Guest Mores

Just hot on the heels of the black actress playing the Little Mermaid, we now have a black actress playing the new 007.

First, I want to state that I really don't care about a black woman playing the Little Mermaid.  I never wanted my children to watch the animated feature as I saw no benefit from it.  It just taught girls to disobey their fathers. It showed that even when everything went wrong with her decisions, she ended up getting everything she wanted anyway.  So, I just don't care about the live action version regardless of who's playing the titular character.

Now, to the Bond thing.  To be certain, we are talking about the same universe.  Bond is retired and is called back to action to help out the new agent with the 007 moniker.   007 is now played by a black woman (Lashana Lynch).

The fact that a woman of ANY color is playing the lead role in an spy-action film, is not really concerning to me.  If it's a good movie, then, it's a good movie.  If not, it will fall flat on its face.  So, I don't really care about that aspect.  But ... a Bond film???

The media hype says it's about Bond having to live in the era of MeToo.  Whatever happened to entertainment just trying to be... you know... entertaining.  Does everything nowadays have to have an SJW tilt to it?

On the other hand, the Saint (see what I did there?) in me must wonder if the 007 franchise was ever something that I should be watching anyway.  Maybe not. 

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Guest Scott

Meh.    I haven't seen even close to all of the JB movies, but I always looked at 007 as a title rather than a single person (thought Skyfall did kind of blow this theory).   The stories work out better that way.   Having it be a title, makes it easier to transition from one actor to the other, male or female.   Otherwise, all the movies should still be set in the 1950's (or alternately if it really is still the same person, 007 should be ~90 years old).  

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On the other hand, the Saint (see what I did there?) in me must wonder if the 007 franchise was ever something that I should be watching anyway.  Maybe not. 

Probably not.   Although they seem to have gotten cleaner now days, they are pretty dirty.   I never liked the part about  007  going after married women.   That part does bother me.    

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James Bond is one of the slimiest characters ever to head a movie franchise, certainly since the Roger Moore days. As far as I'm concerned, he (she) is an insult to humanity and to his/her/its specific sex and race. If they want to denigrate black women by having a black woman play the scumbag, then whatever. Equal time with the white guys, I suppose.

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Guest Mores

Let me clarify.

Daniel Craig is still playing James Bond.  But James Bond is retired.  Thus the code number 007 is handed off to a new agent.  This new agent happens to be a black woman.  I don't know the name of the new agent who has taken on the 007 title.  I've named the actress playing the new agent.

Bond was enjoying his retirement when he was called back to help the new 007 with a recent case.  So, James Bond (no longer 007 because he is retired) joins the new 007 (new agent) with the case.

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Guest Mores
1 hour ago, NeuroTypical said:

So, this isn't just the latest actor to play James Bond, except this time James Bond is played by a black woman?  If that's not the case, what do I care?  Glad they're not retiring the number.

Anyone watching the latest Dr. Who?  How is she doing?

Dr. Who was already a woman for a while.  I wish I could remember the details.  But it was not due to rejuvenation.  It was some weird thing happening for just a few episodes.

Does anyone remember that?

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Guest Scott
48 minutes ago, Mores said:

Let me clarify.

Daniel Craig is still playing James Bond.  But James Bond is retired.  Thus the code number 007 is handed off to a new agent.  This new agent happens to be a black woman.  I don't know the name of the new agent who has taken on the 007 title.  I've named the actress playing the new agent.

Bond was enjoying his retirement when he was called back to help the new 007 with a recent case.  So, James Bond (no longer 007 because he is retired) joins the new 007 (new agent) with the case.

I guess I don't see the problem with it then.

Let's hope she has better morals than James Bond, though I'm not expecting that she will.   

I may be being too skeptical here, but I hope they didn't just make her female to show a "romance" (or should I say sexual relation) between the two (James Bond and the new 007), though I still suspect it.    

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Guest Mores
12 minutes ago, Scott said:

I may be being too skeptical here, but I hope they didn't just make her female to show a "romance" (or should I say sexual relation) between the two (James Bond and the new 007), though I still suspect it.    

No.  They made it a point that Bond would make his usual overtures to her only to be rebuffed.

BTW, I don't know what you're talking about when you say he only went after married women.  I recall that happening once in all 24 films (26 if you count the two non-franchise films).  And she made it clear they had an "open marriage".

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Guest Scott
33 minutes ago, Mores said:

No.  They made it a point that Bond would make his usual overtures to her only to be rebuffed.

OK, good.

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BTW, I don't know what you're talking about when you say he only went after married women.  I recall that happening once in all 24 films.  And she made it clear they had an "open marriage".

I should have only said often, and some of them aren't married, but only in a relationship.   I haven't seen that many.  

Looking online, here are some of the ones where he went after women who were either married or in a relationship:

Tomorrow Never Dies

Casino Royale

Licence to Kill

The Spy Who Loves Me

The Man with the Golden Gun

A View to Kill

Octopussy

Thunderball

 

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Guest Mores
2 minutes ago, Scott said:

Looking online, here are some of the ones where he went after women who were either married or in a relationship:

BIG difference.

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Guest Scott
12 minutes ago, Mores said:

BIG difference.

Fair enough.  You win.   

In Casino Royale,  The Spy Who Loves Me, and Tomorrow Never Dies, they were definitely married.  

I admit that it does both me a bit, but maybe I shouldn't watch them anyway.

Trying to look up which Bond girls were married and which ones were merely in relationships probably isn't a wholesome activity for the forum anyway, so I think I'll just zip it as far as that topic goes.  🤐

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Guest Mores
17 minutes ago, Scott said:

In Casino Royale

Bond did not sleep with Solange.  He went to her as a source of information because he noticed that her husband (the main baddie) was treating her badly.  He figured she might have cause to share information --  a woman scorned and all that.

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The Spy Who Lovesd Me

(sorry, had to correct it.  It was bugging me).

I have no idea to whom you're referring here.

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Tomorrow Never Dies

This is the one film I recall it happening.  But I was wrong.  It was not an open marriage.  It was that she and Bond had a romantic history.  And...

So, one.  As I said.

I'm not defending Bond's proclivities.  I'm just being accurate.  I don't think that Bond was ever supposed to be a role model for anyone.  But Sean Connery (the actor, himself) was just such an archetypal man to such a degree that he could to anything and it would look like you're supposed to be like him. 

Sad that he's known for the womanizing roles he had for half his career.  He had other roles that were much more admirable (see Darby O'Gill and the Little People, The Presidio, The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, Finding Forrester, The Hunt for Red October, Indiana Jones, The Rock...).

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Guest Scott
1 hour ago, Mores said:

Bond did not sleep with Solange.

Kissing someone's wife passionately on the floor is still going after a married woman.  

I'm not going to post a link though.

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I have no idea to whom you're referring here.

Felicca.

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Guest Godless
6 hours ago, Mores said:

The media hype says it's about Bond having to live in the era of MeToo.  Whatever happened to entertainment just trying to be... you know... entertaining.  Does everything nowadays have to have an SJW tilt to it?

On the other hand, the Saint (see what I did there?) in me must wonder if the 007 franchise was ever something that I should be watching anyway.  Maybe not. 

Based on the comments in this thead, I'd say that Bond is one movie franchise that could use a healthy dose of feminism. The open, unapologetic misogyny of the series has been problematic for a while. In this case, maybe the "SJW tilt" could save franchise from itself.

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Guest MormonGator
5 minutes ago, Godless said:

Based on the comments in this thead, I'd say that Bond is one movie franchise that could use a healthy dose of feminism. The open, unapologetic misogyny of the series has been problematic for a while. In this case, maybe the "SJW tilt" could save franchise from itself.

SJWs hate the misogyny, hard right religious people hate the immorality. Bond movies (which I've only seen one of, and don't even remember) are bringing both sides together! You can unite in disgust and hate! 

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The problem with the new 007 is not the new 007.  The problem with the new 007 is the responses to the new 007.

SJWs think... the <insert group identity here> are finally getting representation!  If you don't like the film you're just <insert sexist, racist, bigot, whatever here>.  The problem with this is - SJWs are too stupid to realize they're literally being sexist, racist, bigot, whatever to wildly celebrate and defend representation of the group identity taken from the work of a cis-gendered white man tokenized for representation such that the group identity is riding the cis-gendered white man's success coattails.  It's like they are so happy with the crumbs they're getting because, why... they don't think that group identity can create its own stories written specifically for that group identity's cultural application of the human archetypes and become as successful?  Doesn't that make you... sexist, racist, bigot, whatever...?

 

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2 hours ago, Backroads said:

... I actually haven't seen a Bond film... Ever.

They really aren’t that great. I haven’t seen the old ones, but there really isnt much of a character arch with the newer ones. 

A super awesome super secret agent fighting a super bad guy. There are some cool scenes and they play with some cool concepts, but as a whole they are not great.

I'm a bigger fan of the Mission Impossible series.

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6 minutes ago, Fether said:

They really aren’t that great. I haven’t seen the old ones, but there really isnt much of a character arch with the newer ones.

Dr. No was released the year I was born. It was a sci-fi spy thriller, different from what the viewing public of the early '60s was used to. Though a pretty low-budget affair, it was well-written and directed, and Sean Connery was perfectly cast as the debonaire Bond making his British way through a Cold War world. That is the reason, and possibly the only reason, the franchise took off like it did. The subsequent installments certainly do not qualify it as an all-time great series. Those who owned the franchise quickly settled on car chases, cool tech, lewd double entendres (Pussy Galore? Seriously? <barf>), and lots and lots and lots of sex and skin (of the female variety) as their signature hook.

Hey, it worked. I might complain, but as Joe Paterno used to say, nothing succeeds like success.

12 minutes ago, Fether said:

I'm a bigger fan of the Mission Impossible series.

The '60s TV series was truly revolutionary, almost like a Bond film that was made for TV and that the whole family could watch. It was frankly much better than Bond, IMO. More clever and less dependent on silly devices than on subterfuge (with the exception of the face masks, an MI staple). The movie franchise has done very well, largely because the much-maligned Tom Cruise just nails the role. My only beef with the movie franchise—and it's huge—is that they made Jim Phelps into a bad guy to start things out. That's simply sacrilege, or the Hollywood version thereof.

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I was always in it for Q and the fancy gadgets.  Those were cool.  Then other movies started doing fancy gadgets too.  Either the 007 movies stopped making them such a centerpiece of their shows, or I grew up to the point where I realized they never were the centerpiece to start with, so I lost interest.

Seriously.  My treehouse had a computer board on it, and I could tell you what every single button did. Absolutely no girls allowed, not even if they were covered with gold paint.

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Guest Mores
5 hours ago, Fether said:

They really aren’t that great. I haven’t seen the old ones, but there really isnt much of a character arch with the newer ones. 

A super awesome super secret agent fighting a super bad guy. There are some cool scenes and they play with some cool concepts, but as a whole they are not great.

I'm a bigger fan of the Mission Impossible series.

All the Bond films need to be assessed in light of the era in which they were made.  The earlier films were made to old movie standards.  None of them had the kind of budget or technology that we're used to seeing in today's big films.  As a result, they haven't aged well.  But during the era in which they were made, they fit the bill.

There were the interim films that were somewhat modern and relied more on flash and the Bond theme and name than actual storytelling or film quality or acting or... They really weren't good movies.  But they sold tickets.  What can we say?

The first real "modern" film was the reboot series with Daniel Craig.  And Casino Royale still stands up by modern film standards.  There really was good character development, good story telling, good plot twists, absolutely well choreographed action sequences.  Craig ended up injuring himself to the point that he didn't want to return for additional films.  He did a couple more.  But he was offered $100 MM to do the next two or three films.  He turned them down.

I just realized that this may be the reason why a new 007 was required.  Craig didn't want to do all the action sequences.  He was really afraid he'd never walk again.

The last few films with Craig are what you can use to compare to the films we're used to seeing today.  As I said before, through the moral lens of a Latter-day Saint, there is a lot that makes the series out of bounds.  But as far as the world of today...  meh.

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On 7/15/2019 at 7:00 PM, Vort said:

James Bond is one of the slimiest characters ever to head a movie franchise

Haha - I agree with you to the extent that *IF* James Bond were a real person, I wouldn't be exactly thrilled about my sister or daughter dating him. But he's kinda fun in a movie. (Maybe he shouldn't be, but he is.)

Having said that I haven't kept up with the most recent movies - I'm basing that mostly on Moor and Connery.

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