For those of you not watching the Super Bowl....


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8 hours ago, Emmanuel Goldstein said:

Our family actually read about the Great and Abominable Church just before the game started. And then we got to watch one of the Great and Abominable Church sacraments during halftime show.

This was no joke either.  I heard one woman complaining on the radio about the highly sexual dancing and the pole dancing at the Superbowl Halftime show.  It is sad to me that there was so little complaining from the general population about the halftime show because I thought it highly immodest and inappropriate especially for minors and children. 

Likely so many people are just so numb with their constant pornography indulgences they just do not care anymore.  This is probably also the reason I hear so much advertising for erectile dysfunction on the radio as well.  Pornography is being consumed continually in too many homes.

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1 hour ago, MormonGator said:

Is it hard to use civilian time when dealing with people who aren't in the military? What about other military terminology? Not an insult, honest question. 

Sheesh,  1900 is 7:00 p.m. and 2000 is 8:00 p.m.  

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5 minutes ago, pam said:

Sheesh,  1900 is 7:00 p.m. and 2000 is 8:00 p.m.  

Right, I know the basics. I was just curious if it was hard for him to switch. Like those who speak two languages sometimes have trouble doing.  

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You think normal military time is hard...wait until you see Zulu Time (Greenwich time).  It's a way to keep all the clocks and times for the military around the world in sync (for example, a fighter getting fuel from a tanker may coordinate in a universal time or Zulu time so that when they say they will tank [fuel up] at 1900Z they both are actually there at the same time, even if the Fighter is coming from Greenland and the Tanker from Austria or some such things as that).

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23 hours ago, MormonGator said:

Is it hard to use civilian time when dealing with people who aren't in the military? What about other military terminology? Not an insult, honest question. 

Not hard, just habit.  I use other codes and jargon as well, though I try to be aware of it.  I don't worry as much with time because most people know it and it makes the most sense to me.  I also always write dates 20200204 out of habit.  

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21 hours ago, MormonGator said:

Right, I know the basics. I was just curious if it was hard for him to switch. Like those who speak two languages sometimes have trouble doing.  

It's not hard, it just looks wrong to me so it bugs me.

 

13 hours ago, JohnsonJones said:

You think normal military time is hard...wait until you see Zulu Time (Greenwich time).  It's a way to keep all the clocks and times for the military around the world in sync (for example, a fighter getting fuel from a tanker may coordinate in a universal time or Zulu time so that when they say they will tank [fuel up] at 1900Z they both are actually there at the same time, even if the Fighter is coming from Greenland and the Tanker from Austria or some such things as that).

Much of the stuff we do is in Zulu time.   When I write an OpOrd that spans timezones, it's the only way it makes sense.

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30 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Thanks @Grunt. I know very little about the military, but I imagine having to walk the line between the civilian world and the military world can be difficult at times. 

With my current position, I spend a TON of time dealing with corporations and civilians, so it's not that bad most of the time.

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21 minutes ago, Grunt said:

With my current position, I spend a TON of time dealing with corporations and civilians, so it's not that bad most of the time.

Do some veterans have a hard time adjusting to the civilian world? 

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Just now, MormonGator said:

Do some veterans have a hard time adjusting to the civilian world? 

Depends on how long they served and what they did.  I think most do to some extent, but not in a debilitating way, but just learning to interact with people again.  For example, when I walk into one of my section rooms, everyone jumps to their feet and calls the room.  Drives me nuts because it's unproductive, but it's courtesy.  If I then give any of them an instruction, they respond affirmatively and immediately drop whatever they're doing to do it.  I have to be very specific when talking to people, like "finish what you're doing, THEN do my task".  

That isn't my leadership style.  I prefer to collaborate.  I prefer to find people better than me at things and let them run with it.  I have to teach them that is OK because in any other scenario, when someone from my rank sits at a table with their subordinates, any "suggestion" or out loud thought is taken as an order, not as offered for discussion.

Most adjustment difficulties are really just cultural or climate things like that.  Things like the army writing style, which is drilled into us, comes across as very insulting sometimes.  We've seen that on this forum.  It's not meant to be.  It's direct, conveying facts in as few words as possible.  It avoids confusion, but sounds short and crabby.

The longer you're in, the harder it can be.   Many senior Soldiers leave the military where people jump if they look at them and go to entry or mid-level jobs.  That requires adjustment.  Not having people kissing your butt or following your directions without question.

When discussing combat fatigue or PTSD, that's a whole different level of adjustment.  The same with spouses who have been head of household for years while Dad is away, then suddenly he walks in the door and wants to be the boss again.

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11 hours ago, Grunt said:

Depends on how long they served and what they did.  I think most do to some extent, but not in a debilitating way, but just learning to interact with people again.  For example, when I walk into one of my section rooms, everyone jumps to their feet and calls the room.  Drives me nuts because it's unproductive, but it's courtesy.  If I then give any of them an instruction, they respond affirmatively and immediately drop whatever they're doing to do it.  I have to be very specific when talking to people, like "finish what you're doing, THEN do my task".  

That isn't my leadership style.  I prefer to collaborate.  I prefer to find people better than me at things and let them run with it.  I have to teach them that is OK because in any other scenario, when someone from my rank sits at a table with their subordinates, any "suggestion" or out loud thought is taken as an order, not as offered for discussion.

Most adjustment difficulties are really just cultural or climate things like that.  Things like the army writing style, which is drilled into us, comes across as very insulting sometimes.  We've seen that on this forum.  It's not meant to be.  It's direct, conveying facts in as few words as possible.  It avoids confusion, but sounds short and crabby.

The longer you're in, the harder it can be.   Many senior Soldiers leave the military where people jump if they look at them and go to entry or mid-level jobs.  That requires adjustment.  Not having people kissing your butt or following your directions without question.

When discussing combat fatigue or PTSD, that's a whole different level of adjustment.  The same with spouses who have been head of household for years while Dad is away, then suddenly he walks in the door and wants to be the boss again.

I have a son-in-law who was in the military.  In his career field apparently 80% of the guys get a divorce, and another 80% after they get out or something like that. 

My daughter said that while they were with the military it was like she was a single mother.  He was not home that much.  I would suppose that's why they claim so many get divorces after they leave or retire from the military. 

I have several wonderful grandkids from them though of whom I am very proud.  They are still married and so I see that as a good thing. 

Also very active in church from what I've seen.  I can only imagine that their shared faith has helped them in some ways (though that could just be my bias).

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12 minutes ago, JohnsonJones said:

I have a son-in-law who was in the military.  In his career field apparently 80% of the guys get a divorce, and another 80% after they get out or something like that. 

My daughter said that while they were with the military it was like she was a single mother.  He was not home that much.  I would suppose that's why they claim so many get divorces after they leave or retire from the military. 

I have several wonderful grandkids from them though of whom I am very proud.  They are still married and so I see that as a good thing. 

Also very active in church from what I've seen.  I can only imagine that their shared faith has helped them in some ways (though that could just be my bias).

That's exactly right, though I don't know the percentages.  They are high, though.  When I leave, my wife is a single mother.  Time "on the Homefront" doesn't pass for me.  If I'm gone a day, week, month, etc, it feels like nothing has changed when I walk back through the door.  I assume my normal role immediately.  

I can imagine that for many women, that is frustrating.  For them, time HAS passed at home.  Something as simple as a child asking if they can go for a hike in the woods, something SHE has decided during that time, now becomes a joint decision.  My wife and I are very in sync, but I can imagine that scenarios like that can result in differing opinions, which can cause controversy and aggravation.  Who is this guy suddenly questioning my decisions?  He didn't care while he was gone?  

Bouncing in and out of the family can cause major problems.  I'm lucky to have such a great partnership with my wife.

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2 hours ago, Grunt said:

That's exactly right, though I don't know the percentages.  They are high, though.  When I leave, my wife is a single mother.  Time "on the Homefront" doesn't pass for me.  If I'm gone a day, week, month, etc, it feels like nothing has changed when I walk back through the door.  I assume my normal role immediately.  

I can imagine that for many women, that is frustrating.  For them, time HAS passed at home.  Something as simple as a child asking if they can go for a hike in the woods, something SHE has decided during that time, now becomes a joint decision.  My wife and I are very in sync, but I can imagine that scenarios like that can result in differing opinions, which can cause controversy and aggravation.  Who is this guy suddenly questioning my decisions?  He didn't care while he was gone?  

Bouncing in and out of the family can cause major problems.  I'm lucky to have such a great partnership with my wife.

My cousin who is now living with me got divorced because after his last tour it's like a different person came home to his wife.  Something happened in Afghanistan and he's not talking about it.  He became suspicious of everything and everybody including his wife's workmates and close friends.  The wife couldn't adjust and couldn't cope.  He's fine here with me for some reason - I guess because my husband kinda became his "brother" so he has another strong male presence to lean on.

Soldiers have a tough life and it takes a very strong spouse to be able to put up with it.

 

Edited by anatess2
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Supporting people who leave the military is very topical in Australia at the moment. Yesterday the government, after lots of pressure for more than a year, announced a high level inquiry into the high levels of suicide amongst military personnel.

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/veteran-suicide-inquiry-will-be-bigger-and-better-than-a-royal-commission-pm-says

 

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