brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, anatess2 said: True. But - the teaching of the Holy Ghost as a male personage in the Godhead is taught by the LDS Church and not just a personal view of a few individuals. This is what I've been trying to tell you. I disagree. As far as I can see so far, we have a few individuals who did not specify the gender of the Holy Ghost but suggested that it might be male, but they didn't go so far as to say that the Holy Ghost definitely was. A few obscure comments by some GAs do not constitute the doctrine of the church. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Jane_Doe said: 0% agreement that Heavenly Mother and the Holy Spirit are the same person. That's not true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, e v e said: One problem is that it is not translated correctly... Some of it isn't. But there is plenty of truth to be found in the Bible. e v e 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, brotherofJared said: Some of it isn't. But there is plenty of truth to be found in the Bible. True. What happens is that when some things are not true and have been altered by bad translation, they can affect other understandings. brotherofJared and Jane_Doe 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Jane_Doe said: We know that Heavenly Mother and Heavenly Father are ONE together. That's a statement of fact, made possible through God's sealing power. They are still two separate beings. 1 hour ago, Jane_Doe said: Yes, She is the Mother of all spirits. To my knowledge, we have no such doctrine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, anatess2 said: Because, scripture is very clear on the matter - there are 3 Persons in One God. Not 4. True, but her point is that one of those three might very well be our Heavenly Mother. e v e has never stated that there were 4 in one God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, anatess2 said: And that's what we've been telling you - 4 places on the table. And eve is telling you that there would still be 3 places at the table. Quit asserting your understanding into her statements. Edited February 13, 2020 by brotherofJared Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 25 minutes ago, brotherofJared said: Basically, I was saying that we are all children of God but not by procreation. True. I would agree, except that He and She, by Love, created Eden and their sons and daughters. She is the mother of all, and not by procreation upon this earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, e v e said: The holy ghost concept really isn't on my radar, as we agreed to disagree on that point. Maybe Rome did that bait and switch. It occurred long before Rome. King Josiah seems to be where the change was made. It was bad enough that Lehi and his family left Jerusalem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, e v e said: See, I believe I will be restored to my deity, not that I will become a deity... This is a valid point and is aligned somewhat with LDS doctrine. e v e 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 minute ago, brotherofJared said: It occurred long before Rome. King Josiah seems to be where the change was made. It was bad enough that Lehi and his family left Jerusalem. I can learn about Lehi, since I am not familiar... or with Josiah. But I do agree it was before Rome. I know this that it was before Rome though I don't know how or why. Sometimes when He brought me to Him, the things He showed me went into me so fast, I felt to be missing all I saw, because was all happening so beyond my finite comprehension and not in a way where I could think about or see each thing one by one... but sometimes, when something happens or is said, I recall a tiny bit that was hidden that went into me so fast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, anatess2 said: God - in LDS belief - is a State of Being. That State of Being is expressed fully as a Will - the Will that is God with all truth and knowledge. It is the reason why we are in our mortal probation - that we may gain full knowledge and understand all truth and freely exercise our own will with this truth and knowledge so that our will may become fully aligned with the Will that is God. When we achieve that - then we enter that State of Being that is God. These 3 persons -the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are ONE with the Will that is God, and therefore, they are God. Make sense? God, in LDS belief, is a being, not a state of being. God is defined as the ability to continue the seeds. Though we might have all knowledge and power, it would be relatively useless if we could not continue the seeds. No. your explanation does not make sense. e v e 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, SilentOne said: One reason for believing that our Heavenly Mother is not the Holy Ghost is that logically, I figure she must be a resurrected, embodied person, while we are told that the Holy Ghost currently does not have a physical body. That makes sense and is the reason I have a problem with the Holy Ghost being our Heavenly Mother. However, Joseph Smith said that the Father is a personage of spirit in one of his famous lectures (Lectures of Faith 5) which has been interpreted to me that He is a resurrected being. It seems likely, that Heavenly Mother is also a resurrected being and therefore also a personage of spirit which is why I leave that door open. I have no concluded one way or the other which is true. e v e 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 15 minutes ago, e v e said: True. I would agree, except that He and She, by Love, created Eden and their sons and daughters. She is the mother of all, and not by procreation upon this earth. Not by procreation anywhere. Being a resurrected being, she cannot procreate spirits. She may be intimately involved with creating spirits, but she doesn't procreate them anywhere, never has, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 5 minutes ago, brotherofJared said: That makes sense and is the reason I have a problem with the Holy Ghost being our Heavenly Mother. However, Joseph Smith said that the Father is a personage of spirit in one of his famous lectures (Lectures of Faith 5) which has been interpreted to me that He is a resurrected being. It seems likely, that Heavenly Mother is also a resurrected being and therefore also a personage of spirit which is why I leave that door open. I have no concluded one way or the other which is true. I think I said something similar to this in a post on this page, that she has a glorified body, and, that she is spirit. Even I forgot what i wrote by this point. Grin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 13 minutes ago, e v e said: I can learn about Lehi, since I am not familiar... or with Josiah. Read the Book of Mormon to learn about Lehi, but it does not specify that this disagreement about the wife of God being an issue. The Bible was written to remove all references to her. This redaction was commissioned by King Josiah but we only know about this from the Dead Sea Scrolls and some detailed scholarly work. The wife of God has been a well-kept secret for many thousands of years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) In response to Silent One, on page 12, on the topic you just mentioned, I wrote: Why does it have to be an either / or? I haven't experienced as an either/or. Edited February 14, 2020 by e v e Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 Oh, my goodness. This entire thread is an embarrassment to this site and all who participate in it, LDS or not, Christian or not, female or not. All sentient beings feel their cheeks burn when reading this thread. NeedleinA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 minute ago, Vort said: Oh, my goodness. This entire thread is an embarrassment to this site and all who participate in it, LDS or not, Christian or not, female or not. All sentient beings feel their cheeks burn when reading this thread. 🤣🤣🤣 🙄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 Just now, brotherofJared said: Read the Book of Mormon to learn about Lehi, but it does not specify that this disagreement about the wife of God being an issue. The Bible was written to remove all references to her. This redaction was commissioned by King Josiah but we only know about this from the Dead Sea Scrolls and some detailed scholarly work. The wife of God has been a well-kept secret for many thousands of years. I think I understand, from a personal point of view He showed me, why. There can be more reasons, which could be found. But, consider, that she is His Treasure and love, and in the state of sin men were and are in, He does not want her polluted by misunderstandings. Much as you would not throw a pearl before swine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 22 minutes ago, brotherofJared said: Read the Book of Mormon to learn about Lehi, but it does not specify that this disagreement about the wife of God being an issue. The Bible was written to remove all references to her. This redaction was commissioned by King Josiah but we only know about this from the Dead Sea Scrolls and some detailed scholarly work. The wife of God has been a well-kept secret for many thousands of years. deleted, because I don't like to speculate. I was speculating as to why what you describe, happened. Edited February 13, 2020 by e v e Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 47 minutes ago, e v e said: deleted, because I don't like to speculate. I was speculating as to why what you describe, happened. I believe the reason it happened was described in Mosiah 8, that men will not that she should rule over them. e v e 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 14, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, brotherofJared said: I believe the reason it happened was described in Mosiah 8, that men will not that she should rule over them. I read it. Yes. What I noticed was the term pillars used in a footnote. (I need to recheck.) I know what are the 7 pillars..those are Her 7 torches. These seven torches are from eden, are feminine beings, and are mentioned in Ezekiel. The seven torches are told in Revelation too, as ‘the seven lamp stands upon the sea of glass’ . In Zechariah they are referred to as “the seven eyes of God which cross through His land. Edited February 14, 2020 by e v e Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brotherofJared Posted February 14, 2020 Report Share Posted February 14, 2020 2 minutes ago, e v e said: I read it. Yes. What I noticed was the term pillars used in a footnote. (I need to recheck.) I know what are the 7 pillars..those are Her 7 torches. These seven torches are from eden, are feminine beings, and are mentioned in Ezekiel. The seven torches are told in Revelation too, as ‘the seven lamp stands upon the sea of glass’ . In Zechariah they are referred to as “the seven eyes of God which cross through His land. All of which have symbolic meaning. God doesn't really have 7 eyes across His land e v e 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e v e Posted February 14, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, brotherofJared said: I believe the reason it happened was described in Mosiah 8, that men will not that she should rule over them. I read it now and understand and I think so, yes. I created an image, in the past, of the seven pillars as described in I think it was, Zech 1. (The same pillars described here...?) Edited February 14, 2020 by e v e Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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