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12 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

The LDS scriptures:

The Holy Bible (OT and NT - we use the KJV in Sunday School)

The Book of Mormon

Doctrine and Covenants

Pear of Great Price

We sometimes refer to the whole thing as the quad when you want to buy the whole volume at a bookstore.

LDS Article of Faith: 
"We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly.  We also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God."

Therefore, although we use KJV in scripture study, it does not stand on its own.  It needs the Book of Mormon and the words of latter-day prophets to "translate" the teachings in it correctly.

 

One problem is that it is not translated correctly...

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4 minutes ago, brotherofJared said:

I can only guess. Initially, I used to believe that spirit = ghost, but that isn't entirely true. They have the same substance, but a ghost lived in a mortal body once whereas a spirit hasn't. Whether or not it makes any difference as to how we refer to the Holy Ghost may not be important, but for theological purposes, the Holy Spirit is the same as the Holy Ghost and apparently, there are many other names we can use to mean Holy Ghost.

 

The book of Mormon.

The use of the word Ghost to refer to the spirit that left a mortal body and, therefore, getting imbued by the context of the passage through death... became a common usage of the word due to the missing doctrine of pre-mortal existence in Christian teaching.  This becomes inapplicable when you view the ghost of the person to be fully eternal - existing pre-mortal and post-mortal.

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Just now, Jane_Doe said:

Not equal.

My statement was that LDS Christian beliefs are different than Evangelicals.  

The fact that there are 4 person being talked about here:

1) Heavenly Father.

2) Heavenly Mother.

3) Jesus Christ

4) The Holy Ghost.  

Is actually CRITICAL.  LDS Christians 100% agree that there's a Mother in Heaven.  0% agreement that Heavenly Mother and the Holy Spirit are the same person. 

 

 

So why for you is it a problem she is part of the trinity? Why wouldn't she be? She is mother of all and His spirit?

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1 minute ago, anatess2 said:

The use of the word Ghost to refer to the spirit that left a mortal body and, therefore, getting imbued by the context of the passage through death... became a common usage of the word due to the missing doctrine of pre-mortal existence in Christian teaching.  This becomes inapplicable when you view the ghost of the person to be fully eternal - existing pre-mortal and post-mortal.

Okay. it just seems a word best not to use in relation to His Spirit (to me personally) since it confuses lower spirits with His Spirit.

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Just now, e v e said:

One problem is that it is not translated correctly...

Exactly.  I just told you that.  That's why you need the Book of Mormon and the latter-day prophets to translate it correctly.  But to translate it correctly, you need The Bible.  Any version.  Just pick one - then it is corrected from there.  The LDS Church decided to use the KJV in Sunday School just so everybody studying uses the same reference.

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3 minutes ago, e v e said:

So why for you is it a problem she is part of the trinity? Why wouldn't she be? She is mother of all and His spirit?

*Stepping away from the word "trinity" and it's Creedal implications.*

We know that Heavenly Mother and Heavenly Father are ONE together.  That's a statement of fact, made possible through God's sealing power.  That's actually a huge deal for LDS Christians.  

Yes, She is the Mother of all spirits.  

Edited by Jane_Doe

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1 minute ago, e v e said:

So why for you is it a problem she is part of the trinity? Why wouldn't she be? She is mother of all and His spirit?

Because, scripture is very clear on the matter - there are 3 Persons in One God.  Not 4.

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Just now, anatess2 said:

Because, scripture is very clear on the matter - there are 3 Persons in One God.  Not 4.

The trinity is three: He, His Spirit and the son. I have stated His spirit is a girl, and won't repeat that.

I don't know what role the 4th you listed would play.

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2 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

*Stepping away from the word "trinity" and it's Creedal implications.*

We know that Heavenly Mother and Heavenly Father are ONE together.  That's a statement of fact, made possible through God's sealing power.  That's actually a huge deal for LDS Christians.  

Yes, She is the Mother of all spirits.  

I don't know about sealing.

I believe that by THEIR NATURE, they are God, and a family. And that I being from them have their nature. Analogous to a DNA concept, except not material in the way we conceive of 'material'.

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1 minute ago, e v e said:

The trinity is three: He, His Spirit and the son. I have stated His spirit is a girl, and won't repeat that.

I don't know what role the 4th you listed would play.

And that's what we've been telling you - 4 places on the table.  The Holy Spirit is not Heavenly Mother.  You may believe that, if you like.  But that's not LDS teaching so we don't agree with you.

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5 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

*Stepping away from the word "trinity" and it's Creedal implications.*

We know that Heavenly Mother and Heavenly Father are ONE together.  That's a statement of fact, made possible through God's sealing power.  That's actually a huge deal for LDS Christians.  

Yes, She is the Mother of all spirits.  

Also, I don't have creedal implications to have to deal with. I've never signed off on a creed or belief statement, especially the Roman one modern denominations inherited.  

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Just now, e v e said:

I don't know about sealing.

I believe that by THEIR NATURE, they are God, and a family. And that I being from them have their nature. Analogous to a DNA concept, except not material in the way we conceive of 'material'.

*Again, stepping away from the Creedal connotation terms "nature" *

Basic info about sealings, God's power which binds families together:  https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/temples/what-happens-in-a-temple-sealing?lang=eng

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Just now, e v e said:

I don't know about sealing.

I believe that by THEIR NATURE, they are God, and a family. And that I being from them have their nature. Analogous to a DNA concept, except not material in the way we conceive of 'material'.

We believe the same.  We believe that if we change ourselves to align completely with the will of God, we can become God.

But the Godhead is 3 persons - Father, Jesus, Holy Ghost.

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2 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

And that's what we've been telling you - 4 places on the table.  The Holy Spirit is not Heavenly Mother.  You may believe that, if you like.  But that's not LDS teaching so we don't agree with you.

Okay we disagree, though the reasoning for adding a fourth, the Holy ghost,  that has not been given. 

I do know she is His Spirit, and that there, is something He Himself showed me and told me. So I believe Him and my own eyes.

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2 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

We believe the same.  We believe that if we change ourselves to align completely with the will of God, we can become God.

But the Godhead is 3 persons - Father, Jesus, Holy Ghost.

The holy ghost concept really isn't on my radar, as we agreed to disagree on that point. Maybe Rome did that bait and switch.

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10 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

*Stepping away from the word "trinity" and it's Creedal implications.*

We know that Heavenly Mother and Heavenly Father are ONE together.  That's a statement of fact, made possible through God's sealing power.  That's actually a huge deal for LDS Christians.  

Yes, She is the Mother of all spirits.  

I also don't think that in Eden I was free of a body. I had a very gorgeous body, which will be restored soon. 

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38 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

Going to break this down into different aspects:

1) Your views being your views: zero problem there.  You have the right to believe whatever your conscious dictates to be true.

2) Any possibility of an LDS Christian agreeing with you views:  from the standpoint of doctrine of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, your beliefs is partially correct and partially false.   Yes, there is a Mother in Heaven (that part is correct).  But no that Mother in Heaven is not the Holy Spirit-- they are two different people.  So while an LDS Christian totally agrees with the Mother in Heaven part, there's a disagreement with your belief that Heavenly Mother  = the Holy Spirit.  

It's not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing. The environment is hostile and one would not expect that from a Christian group. We have @Vort questing her credentials as if that has anything to do with the topic and others condemning other views that one non-LDS poster has already stated his surprise at the result

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8 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

We believe the same.  We believe that if we change ourselves to align completely with the will of God, we can become God.

But the Godhead is 3 persons - Father, Jesus, Holy Ghost.

See, I believe I will be restored to my deity, not that I will become a deity... That the eden body lost will be restored. My believing this has to do with having seen my true body.  (And true, I might not understand everything I see, yet, but I felt I understood well enough what I saw with my eyes.)

Edited by e v e

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2 minutes ago, e v e said:

The holy ghost concept really isn't on my radar, as we agreed to disagree on that point. Maybe Rome did that bait and switch.

We don't go by Rome as we believe the early Church went into apostasy soon after the death of the biblical apostles.  LDS is a restored gospel.

The organization of the LDS Church is patterned after the organization of heaven.  The Church on earth is presided over by a President and his 2 counselors - 3 males.  Each of them are sealed to their wives for all time and eternity - each of them are one with their eternal companions.  They do not get to be called to stand in those callings without their wives.  This is patterned after the organization of the 3 persons in the Godhead.  

 

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4 minutes ago, e v e said:

See, I believe I will be restored to my deity, not that I will become a deity... That the eden body lost will be restored. My believing this has to do with having seen my true body.  (And true, I might not understand everything I see, yet, but I felt I understood well enough what I saw with my eyes.)

God - in LDS belief - is a State of Being.  That State of Being is expressed fully as a Will - the Will that is God with all truth and knowledge.  It is the reason why we are in our mortal probation - that we may gain full knowledge and understand all truth and freely exercise our own will with this truth and knowledge so that our will may become fully aligned with the Will that is God.  When we achieve that - then we enter that State of Being that is God.  These 3 persons -the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are ONE with the Will that is God, and therefore, they are God.

Make sense?

 

 

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1 hour ago, e v e said:

I am curious about the history of the term being used for His Spirit as I don't like that much, since it implies a disembodied being, and obviously Miss has an immortal gorgeous body

One reason for believing that our Heavenly Mother is not the Holy Ghost is that logically, I figure she must be a resurrected, embodied person, while we are told that the Holy Ghost currently does not have a physical body.

Edited by SilentOne

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9 minutes ago, SilentOne said:

One reason for being confident that our Heavenly Mother is not the Holy Ghost is that logically, I figure she must be a resurrected, embodied person, while we are told that the Holy Ghost currently does not have a physical body.

Why does it have to be an either / or? I haven't experienced as an either/or.

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35 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

God - in LDS belief - is a State of Being.  That State of Being is expressed fully as a Will - the Will that is God with all truth and knowledge.  It is the reason why we are in our mortal probation - that we may gain full knowledge and understand all truth and freely exercise our own will with this truth and knowledge so that our will may become fully aligned with the Will that is God.  When we achieve that - then we enter that State of Being that is God.  These 3 persons -the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are ONE with the Will that is God, and therefore, they are God.

Make sense?

 

 

What I understand is that God is a being with His nature,  which is native to all souls of His (but in a very wee form at the moment).. And yes, of course a soul in that weakened situation could reject Him, and go astray, choosing instead the nature of this world. God is not just a God state...He and She are God by their core nature, which is the birthright of His Souls to receive, soon. 

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1 hour ago, e v e said:

Because They have a son, who in turn has sons and daughters...

The reason we are in God's family is not because they have a son who has sons and daughters. It is because God is the Father of all spirits. That includes all spirits. However, to be members of the family which enjoys eternal in the presence of God, they have to be adopted through Christ. That doesn't mean that all the others who used to be in the family are no longer our brothers and sisters under God.

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