The timing of truth


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6 hours ago, Traveler said:

From time to time I have looked back through the rear view mirror of life and pondered how ready I was for important things.  I could give several examples but I will use the example of my mission.  I had looked forward and prepared for my mission from my youth.  I had worked and saved to pay for my mission.  When I served there were 6 discussions - I had committed all of them to memory more than a year before my mission call.  There were 250 basic scriptures - I memorized all those as well.  I came of age for my mission at the height of the Vietnam conflict and spent 2 years in the army to insure I could serve a mission and while serving in the military - I assisted (with the spirit) of bringing over 2 dozen converts.  I believed I was ready.

I was not ready to be arrested by the FBI as the prime suspect in a murder - in my first area.  I was not prepared for poor leadership among the missionaries.  I was not prepared for missionaries that would rather be home than on their mission.  I was not prepared for a convert that would lie about their belief so they could be baptized for the primary purpose to defraud and rob a wealthy member.  I was not prepared to interview converts for baptism - in particular my first such interview with a young teenage girl that thought she was sexually impure and unworthy for baptism because she has kissed a guy.  And I was most unprepared for a homosexual struggling to repent and change their heart.   I could list many more.  But with all this and those I taught on my mission - I was astonished how quickly the spirit could turn a heart to repentance and prepare someone for baptism.

I believe every person alive today has all they need to be able to repent and accept the Savior when he returns - even if it is tomorrow.  However, it is my prejudice that those that think in their pride that (like me when I received my mission call) that they are prepared - are likely to be surprised and struggle wondering how they could have not prepared - like the 10 virgins without oil.  And that those what when Jesus returns fall at his feet and plead for forgiveness of all their failings and beg for mercy - are likely to be the most ready.

 

The Traveler

There is a great deal of difference in preparing one's self and being prepared for things you don't even know would be in store for you. Think Liberty Jail.

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6 hours ago, Scott said:

Joseph Smith disagreed (read the link I provided).  The order is a lot older than Joseph Smith as well.   It dates back to at least Enoch (Moses 7) and is in the Book of Mormon (4 Nephi 1).

Commandments or counsel are modified with the times because people follow them in different degrees through time, not because the principles change.

Sometimes they become less stringent and sometimes more.   An example is the Word of Wisdom.  It used to be more of a cousel than a commandment that keeps you from having a temple recommend.

The Word of Wisdom was reveled in 1833.    Church members were counselled to follow it.  After 1921 it became a commandment and a requirement for a temple recommend.  That doesn't mean the principle changed. 

In relationship to timing, I believe the United Order was timely and appropriate to accomplish the purposes of the Lord. Firstly, we needed to understand that there is a United Order. Secondly, we needed to have a goal or a Celestial objective to guide our actions. I believe we live the United Order within our capacity to live it.

That being said, if the Saints in Kirkland had faith enough that God would not let them die, it could have been established in Joseph Smith's day, but it is difficult to continue a principle when you're being taken advantage of and once property is acquired it seems that we forget how it was obtained and then there are those who think that there should be no surplus, take for example the $38 Billion estimated surplus that some "whistleblower" felt was inappropriate. In fact, we forget who it all belongs to anyway, which seems to indicate that those who forget, also forget that there is a God.

Like the forbidden fruit, I have no doubt that God knew the outcome when he revealed it. He knew that the saints would fail. It was all set in motion for a purpose and I believe that purpose will fulfill the Lord's objectives.

IOW, the timing is the Lord's and therefore is perfect.

 

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10 hours ago, brotherofJared said:

That's pretty vague. I'm not sure how you're applying that to the purposes that were served by polygamy.

Okay - I will be a little more explicit.  His reference were to brethren taking additional wives without being specifically commanded to do so. 

 

The Traveler

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10 hours ago, brotherofJared said:

There is a great deal of difference in preparing one's self and being prepared for things you don't even know would be in store for you. Think Liberty Jail.

Hmmmmmm - not knowing what comes next or how to behave when something unexpected happens is just about the best definition of being unprepared I can think of.  Or as I use to tell my scouts when I was the scout master - there is no such thing as bad weather or bad luck - just bad equipment and bad attitude.  The only way I know to prepare for unforeseen things going wrong is to experience it.   In essence life is a Kobayashi Maru  --  or as stated in the Book of Mormon - everything has its opposite.  Without failure there is no success and the only way failure is possible is for something, somewhere and somehow to be possible, probable and finely to be for which we are unprepared.  

 

The Traveler

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26 minutes ago, Traveler said:

Hmmmmmm - not knowing what comes next or how to behave when something unexpected happens is just about the best definition of being unprepared I can think of. 

The Traveler

You probably misstated this one.  Knowing what comes next is not part of Preparedness.  Scout Motto is being prepared for any eventuality including those you don't know is coming.

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8 hours ago, anatess2 said:

You probably misstated this one.  Knowing what comes next is not part of Preparedness.  Scout Motto is being prepared for any eventuality including those you don't know is coming.

Having been a scout master - the level of being prepared as a scout is very simplistic.  For example, if they are going on an overnight camp out then they need to take a sleeping bag.  You would be surprised how difficult it is to instill such simple logic.  It has been 30+ years but (despite providing an list of essential items) I learned that I must inspect all the personal items scouts were bringing on camp outs -  Yes, kids would forget sleeping bags - even on cold weather camp outs.  But there is more - parents would think nothing of sending their new scout on his first camp out never even having made a bed in their life.

This may draw some ire, especially from younger generations but regardless of what they are thinking - they are not prepared for the day if they remain in the pj's and neglect to make their bed.  What kind of preparedness is showing up at an air port for travel in pj's?

The whole point is that there are degrees of preparedness.  I most certainly agree we must prepare for the Last-days as Saints of G-d.  It is just that all the things we talk about - I am not sure that by themselves are as necessary as the mind set to accomplish them is to get us started.  If we cannot follow our prophets when their guidance does not fit our paradigm - then we lack the faith to succeed.  Sometimes it is not so much about preparation as it is the faith to take the next step not knowing at all or being prepared for what will follow.  

Because of COVID 19 I am not prepared for loosing our rental income to meet the loans remaining on our rental property - that will not be paid off for another 5 years.  We have our food storage - it would not be fun - we just went through it (got rid of stuff that is no longer good - that we canned over 40 years ago😦) - but we could survive for at least 2 years - but I am not prepared for what is going on currently.  I am not prepared for not seeing the grand kids except via face time - the wife is less prepared.  I could make a grand list of what I am not prepared for but it is also my impression I will get through current conditions better than most - including other Latter-day Saints.  

If we have a 9.0 or more  earth quake (not just 5.7 we just had) - I am not prepared - but we will survive.

 

The Traveler

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