Carborendum Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, laronius said: I think what @Carborendum is getting at is to what end is a person saved, what is the final result of salvation. Is it floating on a cloud playing a harp, is it living in a garden of Eden setting forever happy and content or is it something more? This is one of the major disconnects when LDS and other Christians speak about this subject because we are often speaking about different things. While I appreciate a sincere effort to help, in this case, you're putting words into my mouth that were never there. Edited April 19, 2020 by Carborendum mordorbund 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carborendum Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 (edited) On 4/18/2020 at 5:50 PM, TheTanakas said: Salvation - being saved through faith in the atonement of Christ. I don't think I've ever seen such a clear example (in my personal experience) of such expertise in tautology. I'm impressed. Quote Are you able to explain how the Book of Mormon clarifies what salvation means as the manual said? As you read the manual, have you noticed that each chapter begins with the counsel to seek out the Lord in understanding what you read and the counsel to RECORD your impressions? If you did that, what were some of the impressions you got for March 2-8? Edited April 19, 2020 by Carborendum NeedleinA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTanakas Posted April 22, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2020 On 4/19/2020 at 7:50 PM, Carborendum said: As you read the manual, have you noticed that each chapter begins with the counsel to seek out the Lord in understanding what you read and the counsel to RECORD your impressions? Yes, but it did not explain how the Book of Mormon clarifies what salvation means. Do you know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTanakas Posted April 22, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2020 On 4/18/2020 at 7:38 PM, Vort said: If you have faith in Christ, can you be saved even in your sins? Yes. Christ saved us while we were still in our sins. Do you believe this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted April 22, 2020 Report Share Posted April 22, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, TheTanakas said: Yes. Christ saved us while we were still in our sins. Do you believe this? No, of course I do not believe this nonsense. The Book of Mormon uses the vain falsehoods of the wicked Zeezrom—which appear to coincide closey with your beliefs—to teach the truth of the matter: 34 And Zeezrom said again: Shall he [the son of God] save his people in their sins? And Amulek answered and said unto him: I say unto you he shall not, for it is impossible for him to deny his word. 35 Now Zeezrom said unto the people: See that ye remember these things; for he said there is but one God; yet he saith that the Son of God shall come, but he shall not save his people—as though he had authority to command God. 36 Now Amulek saith again unto him: Behold thou hast lied, for thou sayest that I spake as though I had authority to command God because I said he shall not save his people in their sins. 37 And I say unto you again that he cannot save them in their sins; for I cannot deny his word, and he hath said that no unclean thing can inherit the kingdom of heaven; therefore, how can ye be saved, except ye inherit the kingdom of heaven? Therefore, ye cannot be saved in your sins. On 4/18/2020 at 3:50 PM, TheTanakas said: Are you able to explain how the Book of Mormon clarifies what salvation means as the manual said? Congratulations! Now you have an answer to your question. Will you, like Zeezrom, humble yourself before the truth, acknowledge your false beliefs, and seek the Lord? Or will you take the easy route? Edited April 22, 2020 by Vort NeedleinA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carborendum Posted April 22, 2020 Report Share Posted April 22, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, TheTanakas said: Yes, but it did not explain how the Book of Mormon clarifies what salvation means. Do you know? Yes, don't you? I mean, you seemed to have READ the BoM. So, you know what it says, right? That's what you are claiming about your belief in salvation. Edited April 22, 2020 by Carborendum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTanakas Posted April 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 On 4/22/2020 at 1:42 PM, Carborendum said: Yes, don't you? I mean, you seemed to have READ the BoM. So, you know what it says, right? That's what you are claiming about your belief in salvation. If my definition of what salvation means is correct, then I would say the BoM and Bible agree. If salvation means something else, and the BoM clarifies it, I would be interested to know what clarification it is referring to. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTanakas Posted April 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 (edited) On 4/22/2020 at 1:03 PM, Vort said: No, of course I do not believe this nonsense. While we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Do you believe that? Ignore that question... you already answered it. Edited April 23, 2020 by TheTanakas reposted question already answered Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted April 23, 2020 Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 23 minutes ago, TheTanakas said: On 4/22/2020 at 10:03 AM, Vort said: No, of course I do not believe this nonsense. While we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Do you believe that? Ignore that question... you already answered it. Why are you lying, @TheTanakas? Sincere question. You are clearly and openly lying, apparently not even concerned about hiding it. I'm honestly curious why you would do so. Is your antiMormon agenda really so pressing that you would so easily sell your soul? To wit, for those not following closely: On 4/22/2020 at 9:21 AM, TheTanakas said: Yes. Christ saved us while we were still in our sins. Do you believe this? has now been changed to: 26 minutes ago, TheTanakas said: While we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Do you believe that? @TheTanakas apparently thinks we are either too inattentive to notice his clumsy attempt at shifting the goalposts or too stupid to pick up on it. And we now know that, confronted with the proof that the Book of Mormon does indeed teach about salvation in a way that @TheTanakas did not understand, he will not openly and honestly grant that point, but continue on with his antiMormon trolling. NeedleinA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted April 23, 2020 Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 32 minutes ago, TheTanakas said: If my definition of what salvation means is correct, then I would say the BoM and Bible agree. Another unhidden lie. Your definition of salvation includes the impossible concept of "salvation in sin", which is an actual contradiction of terms. The Book of Mormon makes this crystal clear, and after carefully explaining that to you, I do not believe that you are simply too stupid to see it. NeedleinA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carborendum Posted April 24, 2020 Report Share Posted April 24, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, TheTanakas said: If my definition of what salvation means is correct, But you haven't given a definition. Tautology is not a definition. That's the crux of your hypocrisy. Quote I would be interested to know what clarification it is referring to. I've already explained it to you just as clearly as you explained your understanding of salvation to me. You've refused to expound or explain or discuss that definition (which I've asked multiple times for you to do). But you expect someone else to expound and explain the written word which you've claimed to have read and studied? And you refuse to acknowledge your hypocrisy here? You start expounding more about your position and I'll expound more about the clarification. Simple little exchange. But you're not about the simple exchange of ideas. You're only interested in stirring the pot. Edited April 24, 2020 by Carborendum NeedleinA and Vort 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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