Carborendum

Carb's Take on Racism

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16 hours ago, Carborendum said:

In nations where the racial makeup is almost monolithic, it is difficult to separate the two.  And in practice, they are often not separated.  Mixed race children (granted, this is 20 year old information) in Korea, Vietnam, China, Thailand, Laos, & Japan were treated as second class citizens -- even though they were full citizens.   This was most obvious if the other race was not an Asian race.  Some kids who were half Korean and half Japanese were treated poorly in either nation once they were found out -- even if they were friends before such revelation. 

Here's where our opinion diverges.  Japanese, Korean, Chinese are all the same race - Mongol, 3 nationalities.  Their historical roots are protectionist dynasties.  Filipinos is one nationality, multi-racial - we diversify from aborigine blacks to mongol to malayan to caucasian through mixed offspring due to the historically strategic location of the Philippines as a trade route.

Edited by anatess2

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17 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

Here's where our opinion diverges.  Japanese, Korean, Chinese are all the same race - Mongol, 3 nationalities.  Their historical roots are protectionist dynasties.  Filipinos is one nationality, multi-racial - we diversify from aborigine blacks to mongol to malayan to caucasian through mixed offspring due to the historically strategic location of the Philippines as a trade route.

The Japanese I know would HIGHLY disagree with that.  They believe they are a completely separate race than those of other Asian races.  They even have scientific studies showing they are actually a separate race than those of the other Asian races (I believe they show they are actually related closer to Caucasian races than other races in East Asia such as the Chinese).

Edited by JohnsonJones

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2 minutes ago, JohnsonJones said:

The Japanese I know would HIGHLY disagree with that.  They believe they are a completely separate race than those of other Asian races.  They even have scientific studies showing they are actually a separate race than those of the other Asian races (I believe they show they are actually related closer to Caucasian races than other races in East Asia such as the Chinese).

They can highly disagree if they want.  Only proves their hyper nationalistic tendencies.

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1 hour ago, anatess2 said:

Here's where our opinion diverges.  Japanese, Korean, Chinese are all the same race - Mongol, 3 nationalities.  Their historical roots are protectionist dynasties.  Filipinos is one nationality, multi-racial - we diversify from aborigine blacks to mongol to malayan to caucasian through mixed offspring due to the historically strategic location of the Philippines as a trade route.

You don't appear to recall the discussion on "race" that I defined per the dictionary.

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4 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

You don't appear to recall the discussion on "race" that I defined per the dictionary.

If the dictionary define Chinese as a race or Mexican as a race, then that dictionary should be thrown out.

 

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12 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

You go right ahead.

Done.

Mexican:

Cx1G4NsUcAMe3sd.jpg

Put a random Filipino somewhere in that picture and I guarantee you won't recognize which one is Filipino.

Chinese:

china.56.nations.gif

Now put a random Korean somewhere in that picture and I guarantee you, you won't know which one is Korean.

Edited by anatess2

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It is sad to me that racism exists in this world.  We are all children of Adam and Eve so race does not matter.  It is used, I think, to divide and conquer people.  What race am I?  Human, just like everyone else.  The sin of pride is instilled in racism I believe.

"Another major portion of this very prevalent sin of pride is enmity toward our fellowmen. We are tempted daily to elevate ourselves above others and diminish them."  -- Ezra Taft Benson

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We are one of the least racist countries in the world. Yet, you wouldn't know any better if you were watching cable news. If I were from another planet, and I only knew our culture by what I saw on TV, I'd probably think our country has become significantly more racist over the past 20 years. Race, race, race. It's a constant talking point. Why does every bad thing have to be attributed to race? We easily and quickly impute motive on others. And the reality is, no one really knows why someone did something or said something, except the offender - and sometimes they don't even understand their own psychological motives. Sometimes it's just poor judgement. According to this study from two Swedish economists, less than 5% of Americans would be bothered by having a neighbor of a different race. Looks like the OP was correct in that Asian nations are actually significantly more racist than western countries. Japan and China are both in the 15-20% range. India exceeds 40%. That is kind of eye-opening. The study took place in 2013, FWIW. 

 

map_racism.jpg

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Everybody with much international experience knows that the US is among the most racially progressive (i.e. least racist) places in the world, western Europe definitely included. But it is politically incorrect to say so. Most people do not have extensive international experience, so instead they watch television news, read online articles, and conclude that the US is the most racist place on the planet.

I would feel even more disgust toward such people if I didn't realize that, in many areas, I am one of them. I "know" pretty much only what I'm taught, unless I happen to be lucky (or unlucky) enough to learn by my own experience. And even then, I contextualize my own experience through the filters I have learned in my lifetime. I am sure that at least some of the idiots flagellating themselves for their evil "white privilege" actually believe the nonsense they're spouting. I wonder how much different I really am from them.

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48 minutes ago, Vort said:

Everybody with much international experience knows that the US is among the most racially progressive (i.e. least racist) places in the world, western Europe definitely included. But it is politically incorrect to say so. Most people do not have extensive international experience, so instead they watch television news, read online articles, and conclude that the US is the most racist place on the planet.

I would feel even more disgust toward such people if I didn't realize that, in many areas, I am one of them. I "know" pretty much only what I'm taught, unless I happen to be lucky (or unlucky) enough to learn by my own experience. And even then, I contextualize my own experience through the filters I have learned in my lifetime. I am sure that at least some of the idiots flagellating themselves for their evil "white privilege" actually believe the nonsense they're spouting. I wonder how much different I really am from them.

I have come to realize that white people who flagellate themselves for their evil "white privilege" are pretty racist for thinking they have it better than everybody else.

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1 hour ago, anatess2 said:

I have come to realize that white people who flagellate themselves for their evil "white privilege" are pretty racist for thinking they have it better than everybody else.

To "automatically assume" that "if you're black, you're unfortunate, downtrodden, and pitiful" is a racist assumption.

One of my biggest clients is a black man.  He makes no ostentatious pretenses.  He doesn't brag about anything he's done.  He doesn't wear any clothing or accessories that would make you believe he's wealthy.  But he is a very successful businessman.  And he watches a LOT of money go through his business.

The project we're drumming up right now would be about a $200MM project, possibly more.  And he does so out of a very small office and a pickup truck.  He wears a plaid button-up shirt with a pair of jeans and work boots.

No one who knows him believes he's unfortunate except for the elitist liberal.

Edited by Carborendum

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Well, now there is a quiz on FB you can take to find out how privileged you are. First question, "Are you white?" Other very leading questions. I didn't finish as I have the media, celebrities, and politicians to let me know I'm privileged based on my skin color. But, I'm very relieved to see some of my white friends taking this quiz to learn more about themselves and post about how they never realized how privileged they are. I wonder if they were surprised to find out how angry they are based on the month of birth, too, or what LOTR character they are based on their initials. I hope these quizzes help them with their privilege, anger, and problems with their initials.

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Just now, beefche said:

Well, now there is a quiz on FB you can take to find out how privileged you are. First question, "Are you white?" Other very leading questions. I didn't finish as I have the media, celebrities, and politicians to let me know I'm privileged based on my skin color. But, I'm very relieved to see some of my white friends taking this quiz to learn more about themselves and post about how they never realized how privileged they are. I wonder if they were surprised to find out how angry they are based on the month of birth, too, or what LOTR character they are based on their initials. I hope these quizzes help them with their privilege, anger, and problems with their initials.

From a certain point of view, they are all privileged.  But so are all others who would take it.  Any American who has a job (or a job holder in the household) is quite privileged.  Look at how poor people are in other countries.

Being an American is a HUGE privilege (i.e. Blessing).  But instead of being thankful for a blessing from God, we're supposed to feel ashamed of it?  And they don't think of it as a religion?

Nope, we're not trying to take you away from God.  We're just trying to get you to be ashamed of partaking of the Tree of Life.  Nothing to see here.

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25 minutes ago, beefche said:

Well, now there is a quiz on FB you can take to find out how privileged you are. First question, "Are you white?" Other very leading questions. I didn't finish as I have the media, celebrities, and politicians to let me know I'm privileged based on my skin color. But, I'm very relieved to see some of my white friends taking this quiz to learn more about themselves and post about how they never realized how privileged they are. I wonder if they were surprised to find out how angry they are based on the month of birth, too, or what LOTR character they are based on their initials. I hope these quizzes help them with their privilege, anger, and problems with their initials.

Oh... I saw that video.  Made me LAUGH OUT LOUD.  "Have you ever been told you can't afford something?"... my very white husband got security called on him because the grocery store thought he could't afford to pay for the conditioner and was trying to steal it.  "Have you ever been denied because of your race?"... my very white husband got let go because the new black manager wanted only black and brown people under her.  "Have you ever had somebody walk on the other side of the street from you?"... I asked my son about that and he said - if you're walking on the street all skeevy (not sure what word that is he used, it sounded like skeevy), like you're going to shank me, I'm moving to the other side of the street, no matter what color you are.  Where the race comes in is - when a white person is acting all skeevy he's probably on meth, if it's a black person, he's on coke.  Hah hah.

So, if a white Bosnian walk on the other side of the street from the white Slovak, who gets to drop a finger?  How about a white Italian getting off the elevator when the white Sicilian boss enters the elevetor?  Hah hah.

 

Edited by anatess2

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If a new poster came here and started his/her intro with something like, "Mormons are known for X-bad-thing, but hey, let's have an honest conversation about religion. You guys are open-minded aren't you?" Chances are the individual would not last long. Frankly, who would put up with more than two or three posts? Yet, somehow, when it comes to race discussions, that 'new poster' would likely be a college professor, a virtue-signaling administrator, or worse, a politician trying to slurp up some votes. Nevertheless, we're all expected to shout AMEN! to this new orthodoxy. Then again, one of the best compliments I ever received was when my peer, a Korean professor (yes, in Korea) told me I was 4/3rds Korean. :winner:

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2 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

You noticed how red South Korea was on that "racism" map, right?

My understanding is that when people are asked whether they would prefer to have poor people of the same race or wealthier people of a different race as neighbors they almost always want the wealthier as neighbors. What is too often labeled as RACIST is most often RACIAL--and that is most often based on ignorance and media portrayals. I suspect that racist hatred is far less of a problem than we imagine. The solution being offered actually forces us into more racial-centric thinking though...which seems to make the problem worse.

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I don't get the distinction between racist and ignorance/media-based racial.  Are they not the same thing?  Meaning, when you remove someone's ignorance and they've internalized the truth about a human's inherent worth no matter what the color, is it possible for either term to remain applicable? 

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I was skeptical, but no, there it is:

Quote

Indeed, the two organizations have collaborated on a handful of employment and education initiatives. But those were “minor efforts,” Colom said. They “do not befit the stature and magnitude of what the LDS Church can do and should do.”

 

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19 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

I don't get the distinction between racist and ignorance/media-based racial.  Are they not the same thing?  Meaning, when you remove someone's ignorance and they've internalized the truth about a human's inherent worth no matter what the color, is it possible for either term to remain applicable? 

Many people think racially. There are stereotypes, of course. There's also the current misinformation--that whites hate "the other," and that African-Americans can't possibly succeed because everyone else has created a system of oppression they are incapable of overcoming, etc. Racism is of a different character. Truth may expose the difference. However, some racial thinking may take more than one telling. We love our biases and often take overwhelming evidence to change. Racism refuses to be corrected. It assumes certain superiorities are indeed race-based. Sadly, sometimes individual souls are convinced of their own inferiority based on race, as well.

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