priesthoodpower

Pastor with Prophetic Vision

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How would you reply if a stalwart, straight as an arrow family member of yours who was a former bishop and now resides in the stake presidency texted you this.

"We believe that non-members can receive visions too, so, not to scare you but to be better prepared, we as members always knew this was coming but I just didnt know so soon!"

 

https://youtu.be/6TdpMSMP9x4

 

 

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1 hour ago, laronius said:

The link didn't work for me. But just based off your remarks, on a scale of 1-10 how would you rate his sense of humor and his use of emojis to help indicate said humor?

Watching it, I'll say what I think afterwards.

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It is correct that those that non-members can also receive visions and revelations.  We know Joseph Smith obviously had the First Vision and other visions prior to the organization of the Church or even of him receiving the priesthood.  There are the stories of Parley P. Pratt and his vision leading him to recognize and join the church prior to the gospel being preached to him.  Various other times have shown that non-members can receive visions. 

However, in regards to visions pertaining to the world, that is a more difficult thing.  In our days we know there will be false prophets and those claiming to be prophets.  There will also be prophets calling for repentance in the streets with very few listening.  Which is this fellow?  I suppose we could wait and see until November.

I will note that most of the things he says he saw in dreams as a prophecy, he is only now telling us in HINDSIGHT rather than telling us prior to their occurrences, at least from what he indicates in this video you posted.

There have been many that have predicted devastation and destruction in our time.  Most of them have been wrong.  There are groups in the church that have prophesied such, and most of them have not had these predictions come true as of yet.  This makes me skeptical of many of these so called prophecies. 

Some of the things he is stating should be common sense.  For instance, in the church they have long pushed for us to have a year's supply of food.  If we have followed this counsel, regardless of what this fellow is saying in the video, we would already have been forewarned if anything should happen. 

It also does not take a genius to see what probably is going to happen in the US because we are opening schools full time in the Fall.  If we were to take the precautions they did in Germany and other places (where studies have shown there is minimal exposure in schools when proper measures are taken, where desks have plexiglass surrounding every one of them, students stay in the same classrooms instead of migrating to various classes in the halls, you have six foot distancing, and everyone wears a mask...and activities outside are also monitored for distance) it probably would be somewhat safer, but the areas that are pushing to open the schools do not seem to be locations that will take these precautions.  Another study showed that those that do not do this type of precaution have children as a exponential factor in spreading the virus.  Because of this, it doesn't take a genius to realize that the spread of the virus will probably be crazy after the start of the school year.

In addition, We know that though it doesn't stop the spread, heat and sunlight break down the virus more quickly than when those factors are not present.  I think this is a reason it has spread more quickly this summer in the Southern United States (Arizona, Texas, Florida).  It seems counterintuitive, but with how hot it's been, instead of staying outside, people have gone inside more and more.  They are getting it from the indoor communal activities they are participating in.  AS the weather gets colder and people stay indoors more, I think the disease may get deadlier and mortality rates may rise.

This doesn't take a genius to think about.

On the rest of his "predictions", we will see.  Those are pretty massive predictions.  Currently we have not heard much from our own leadership.  If such things were going to happen, it would be good to hear it from them rather than some pastor in Kentucky on the internet.  That does not mean that he can not receive predictions and visions, but we believe the Prophet of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to be the prophet for the world and it is through him that revelation for our time comes. 

Being prepared is not a bad thing to be.  It is encouraged in our church.  Furthermore, with the Book of Mormon, it is not unreasonable that near the millennium, nations will break up and people will be tribe and family vs. tribe and family.  Is that time near...I do not know.  No man knows.  I still wait to see the two prophets in Jerusalem and the temple there being built though.

If Trump wins, I think many will be upset.  If Biden wins, I think many will be upset.  If Trump tries to say the election was stolen from him and tries to fight back, it could turn nasty.  Will it turn violent?  Hopefully not.  Normally we haven't had that type of violence in the streets after elections.  If it does, I suppose we will see what occurs.  The next event close to there to pay attention to, if one feels this may be a possibility is probably General Conference coming up this October.

Edited by JohnsonJones

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Putting everything else he said aside the part where he mentions UN, Russian and Chinese troops on American soil in November made me rather incredulous. Could the election spark unrest? Yes and it very may well. But that is a bit much. 

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45 minutes ago, laronius said:

Putting everything else he said aside the part where he mentions UN, Russian and Chinese troops on American soil in November made me rather incredulous. Could the election spark unrest? Yes and it very may well. But that is a bit much. 

Exactly, considering the current state of our nation it should be of no surprise what can happen in the months and years ahead. People that find urgency in this pastors vision are people that go through life with blinders on. 

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There appear to be three parts to this scenario:
1) Non-members

2) Visions

3) Accuracy of prophecy

The first is true. The testimony of Jesus Christ is the Spirit of prophecy. A testimony of Christ is obtained by the spirit of prophecy and revelation. The Lord doesn't withhold his Spirit from his children if they are not members of his Church.

As related to #1, visions aren't withheld from non-members either. I don't remember whose friend it was, John Taylor's, or someone else who had a dream similar to Lehi's vision. Where he was able to view the tree of life but not partake of it in this life, but would in the next. He died before the Church was restored, or a little after. Dreams/visions have brought non-members to the truth.

Accuracy of prophecy is related to their stewardship. If a stake president, was being serious, shared this type of prophecy/vision I would have a hard time believing it to be true. If a stake president sent me this and I wasn't sure I would first clarify his text with a question, and hopefully he would answer without being snarky or cheeky. I have a family member that is really hard to know how he feels because he can be very snarky and cheeky.

If the Lord wants to reveal a truth, which hasn't been revealed yet, he will reveal this truth through his servant the prophets if the Lord wants the collective body of the Church to know. We can also know all things via revelation, but we also need to recognize if the Lord has revealed something to us that has not been revealed by the prophets then we should keep that revelation very sacred and never reveal it until it has been revealed by his servants. It isn't our place/stewardship to reveal new doctrine.

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- At any time in human history, a small percentage of the human race contains "prophets" issuing "prophecies".  

- "A small percentage" in a world with billions of people, means quite a lot.

- The majority of these prophecies involve predictions of note, sensational, important, impactful.  Prophecies without this-changes-everything drama are known as weather reports, or maybe odds on sports betting.

- Occasionally, humans actually experience sensational/important/impactful/this-changes-everything moments.

THEREFORE:
Odds are good that anything exciting that happens, will have been foretold by someone, at some point.  The mathematics of random chance basically make it a certainty.

CONCLUSION:
Just because someone is getting stuff right, doesn't mean they're passing on information received from God.  

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Since this thread is so full of speculation - why is it that Q,QAnon and Ezra's Eagle has been left out?  Just a little bit about Ezra's Eagle and how this has been brought before a lot of members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints through the discovery of Ezra among the Dead Sea Scriptures.  How the Book of Ezra was scripture at the time of Christ but has been removed from the Bible.

Some other thoughts: @Anddenex made a reference to the testimony of Jesus being the spirit of prophesy.   It was interesting that in the video the pastor kept saying he was not a prophet - which could mean that he lacks a testimony of Christ.  This does not mean that he does not believe in Christ but that his testimony of Christ is incomplete.  The Book of Mormon keeps telling us that the "Righteous need not fear".  The ancient meaning of righteous was someone that covenants with G-d.  This thought has been amended in our dispensation to also mean loyal to G-d's covenants.  Unfortunately a growing number of Latter-day Saints are lacking understanding of covenants because these things are taught through symbolism so that the world may not know them.  I liken this to David's Psalm (23)"

Quote

4 Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.

5 Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over.

6 Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the Lord for ever.

There is no greater preparation or protection in the last days than being loyal to our covenants with G-d.  If you are loyal - there is nothing to fear.

 

The Traveler

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2 hours ago, Traveler said:

The Book of Mormon keeps telling us that the "Righteous need not fear".  The ancient meaning of righteous was someone that covenants with G-d.  This thought has been amended in our dispensation to also mean loyal to G-d's covenants.  Unfortunately a growing number of Latter-day Saints are lacking understanding of covenants because these things are taught through symbolism so that the world may not know them.

There is no greater preparation or protection in the last days than being loyal to our covenants with G-d.  If you are loyal - there is nothing to fear.

This gives me a greater perspective. Thanks for sharing.

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I belong to a tradition that believes dreams and visions can come from God. However, this video does not strike me as true or appropriate. Prophecy is for the church, not Youtube, for whoever to see. Further, he defends his insights and his own credentials too much (I read many political sources, I am a pastor, etc.). Beware? Always. This may be a "crying wolf" message, rather than a true warning from God, though. I could be wrong, but this is my discernment.

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10 hours ago, prisonchaplain said:

I belong to a tradition that believes dreams and visions can come from God. However, this video does not strike me as true or appropriate. Prophecy is for the church, not Youtube, for whoever to see. Further, he defends his insights and his own credentials too much (I read many political sources, I am a pastor, etc.). Beware? Always. This may be a "crying wolf" message, rather than a true warning from God, though. I could be wrong, but this is my discernment.

I was 100% with you until your last sentence.  You are not wrong - G-d is merciful and kind.  G-d brings hope and relief to those that wait on him - not fear and abandonment.   Even with the most direr warnings G-d calls that we come to him for refuge. 

 

The Traveler

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So, I've read some rather interesting comments on news sites recently, and they hint that sinister things may be coming.  Now, before I get into that, be aware that NONE of this is backing up this pastor's vision, and in fact, I will attempt to give an explanation of a reason that MIGHT be why he's having these sorts of dreams.

I am not a psychologist nor am I a psychiatrist.  This is based off of things I have read and heard, but not off any education in these areas.

Dreams, or so I understand, from a secular viewpoint, can reflect activities and thoughts that we have had during the day or recent past.  Thus, if you had a fear of your child being stung by bees in the backyard, you may have a dream that a bee somehow gets in your house and stings your child.  If this happens later, from a secular viewpoint, this wasn't a prophecy, but your fears being reflected in your dreams, and as your fears in this instance are a realistic expectations of what might happen, having something similar occur is not surprising.

With that in mind...

I've read several things concerning the upcoming election from both sides, and I've heard some rather violent commentary regarding what people will do if the other side wins.

1.  With the recent actions of Trump regarding the Post office and the consequences that may have on the ballots, as well as the interpretation by many who are not Conservatives or Republicans regarding what they consider a blatant statement that he is doing so to deny people the ability to vote fairly, some of the more liberal commentary has violent overtones.  In essence, they are stating that if Trump wins...it is because he corrupted the vote.

Another aspect they are talking about is that even if Trump loses, even if it is obvious he lost by a great margin, that he may refuse to  leave the White House.  That he is stating these things and making these comments so that he can use them as a legal excuse to retain power.  That he will say he won, even if he lost and will refuse to vacate the White House. 

Their response is that in these instances, they will need to converge on Washington DC and take him out by force if necessary.  That they will attack with violence to counter what they would see as either a corrupt win, or Trump calling it a corrupt win and challenging the results.  Either way, this could lead to a rebellion of sorts from the Liberals (and yes, there are Liberals that carry weapons out there).

2.  I have seen Republicans utilizing some of the things Trump has been stating to say that the Democrats are going to try to steal the election.  That the Democrats are going to corrupt the polls and use the mail in ballots to twist the election.  Some of them have also stated that if the Democrats win, especially if it is in normally conservative states, that it will be evidence of ballot tampering and them using the mail-in-ballot initiative to change the actual vote.  In this reasoning, some of them are proposing violence to keep Trump in Power if this occurs.  I'm not sure how many of them that think this way are out there, but enough that I've found their comments on new sites with commentary.  If there were enough that did this, this could lead to a rebellion of sorts from Conservatives.

Either way, these comments show some dangerous thinking in the US today.  It shows that there are many that are considering violence in regards to the election results regardless of which way they go or who wins.  If this pastor has been reading the same new stories as I have and the same commentary, it may not be unusual that his dreams are reflecting such ideas floating through his head.  If such things occur, it would not necessarily be a prophetic vision he had (and I'm not contending he did not, perhaps he did have such a vision, I'm looking at a more secular way of viewing it), but his dreams reflecting his own thoughts and fears...fears which reading these comments might reflect a dangerous possibility in the future if such people follow through with the comments they have been making.

If such ideas come to fruition, it could lead to more violence and destruction, especially in Washington DC, but perhaps also many cities and locations elsewhere.  We live in unusual times.

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The democrats are being myopic and hypocritical again.  When Trump was elected they claimed voter fraud by Russian interference.  They made an excellence case that we need to be sure our votes are really our votes.  And they got there investigation that found nothing.  Now Trump is warning and forewarning of potential voter fraud... And the Democratic hypocrisy in on full display.  Instead of remembering that we need to be sure that our votes are really our votes they are discounting it.

Such discounting is also very stupid.  If Trump is indeed playing games the best way to disarm him is to have an investigation.  Prove that Trump got nothing and that the vote is secure.  But if the democrats block such an investigation they play right into his hands.  If Trump loses he can make "I told you so argument"  and there will be plenty that believe that because the most logical reason for the democrats to block investigation is because they already know what will be found and they do not want it discovered.   

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27 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

The democrats are being myopic and hypocritical again.  When Trump was elected they claimed voter fraud by Russian interference.  They made an excellence case that we need to be sure our votes are really our votes.  And they got there investigation that found nothing.  Now Trump is warning and forewarning of potential voter fraud... And the Democratic hypocrisy in on full display.  Instead of remembering that we need to be sure that our votes are really our votes they are discounting it.

Such discounting is also very stupid.  If Trump is indeed playing games the best way to disarm him is to have an investigation.  Prove that Trump got nothing and that the vote is secure.  But if the democrats block such an investigation they play right into his hands.  If Trump loses he can make "I told you so argument"  and there will be plenty that believe that because the most logical reason for the democrats to block investigation is because they already know what will be found and they do not want it discovered.   

I would be curious to see the dems cry voter fraud If Trump wins again.

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1 hour ago, Fether said:

I would be curious to see the dems cry voter fraud If Trump wins again.

I see no reason why they would stop now.  For the last several election cycles the Dems have thrown everything including the kitchen sink at the Republican Candidates.  In so doing they set themselves up as the "Boy who Cried Wolf." Then Trump came along and they found they might really be facing a "Wolf" but that the "Villagers" were no longer really interested in coming to the rescue.  For them to stop would require them to recognize how their own actions help create the situation we now find ourselves in. 

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18 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

I see no reason why they would stop now.  For the last several election cycles the Dems have thrown everything including the kitchen sink at the Republican Candidates.  In so doing they set themselves up as the "Boy who Cried Wolf." Then Trump came along and they found they might really be facing a "Wolf" but that the "Villagers" were no longer really interested in coming to the rescue.  For them to stop would require them to recognize how their own actions help create the situation we now find ourselves in. 

I wonder if Trump could pull a “told you so! But too bad so sad, you didn't listen to me so you have to deal with me now”

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2 hours ago, Fether said:

I would be curious to see the dems cry voter fraud If Trump wins again.

I left the Republican party (in Utah) because of voter fraud.  I went to a number of news outlets with proof and was in essence scolded.  I am convinced that every election is - to one degree or another involved in voter fraud.  I believe I discovered that the Democrats are much better at voter fraud than the Republicans.  There is so much political gas lighting going on that I believe either party could start a civil war just over voter fraud.  There is a great deal of talk - politically - from both major parties that if the opposing candidate is elected that this country will be ruined.  I am becoming convinced that both are correct.

I have considered voting for the lessor of two evils but for the last several decades that has not worked out at all - in my mind.  It does not seem to matter what party is in power - our national debt gets increasingly worse and our freedoms and liberties are slipping away and as a nation we are becoming divided and more angry and violent with each other.   I wonder if this nation has crossed a threshold - thinking that there are human solutions and that we need not and should not look to G-d for our deliverance.  Separation of Church and State seems to mean G-d has no place in determining the moral laws of our society.

 

The Traveler

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16 hours ago, Fether said:

I would be curious to see the dems cry voter fraud If Trump wins again.

Of course they will--and they will use Trump's own words to justify the endless investigations they will demand...after all, POTUS even said there was likely to be fraud--we have a duty...!

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9 hours ago, prisonchaplain said:

Of course they will--and they will use Trump's own words to justify the endless investigations they will demand...after all, POTUS even said there was likely to be fraud--we have a duty...!

If you listen carefully to what the opposition (to Trump) has planned you will realize that steps are already being calculated to remove Trump from the White House by force following the election.  As for myself - I do not feel that we have had a "valid" election for our federal offices - for decades.  In short wide scale voter fraud (among other things).   I will likely vote but I have yet to decide if I want my dog in the fight that I believe is coming.  I am not sure of my duty - especially in light of escalating violence.   When I was in the army during the Vietnam conflict I faced the possibility of taking a human life to protect this country.  I do not want to revisit such a possibility again but I am most concerned that in the hearts and minds of many - that there is not an alternative.  

 

The Traveler

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On 8/16/2020 at 11:45 PM, JohnsonJones said:

 

I am not a psychologist nor am I a psychiatrist.  This is based off of things I have read and heard, but not off any education in these areas.

Dreams, or so I understand, from a secular viewpoint, can reflect activities and thoughts that we have had during the day or recent past.  Thus, if you had a fear of your child being stung by bees in the backyard, you may have a dream that a bee somehow gets in your house and stings your child.  If this happens later, from a secular viewpoint, this wasn't a prophecy, but your fears being reflected in your dreams, and as your fears in this instance are a realistic expectations of what might happen, having something similar occur is not surprising.

 

Exactly! The sub-conscious mind sits in the background observing things during our waking hours while the conscious mind is active. At night when we sleep the conscious mind takes a back seat and the sub-conscious mind becomes active, giving us dreams of things we have already observed and learned.

My thoughts after seeing the video for the first time? This pastor is an idiot!
My thoughts of my LDS relative that sent me the video with a sense of warning and urgency? Hes an idiot too! 

Ill stick to the prophecy's of our LDS apostles who receive impressions and messages from God while in a conscious state.

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On 8/24/2020 at 11:00 PM, priesthoodpower said:

Exactly! The sub-conscious mind sits in the background observing things during our waking hours while the conscious mind is active. At night when we sleep the conscious mind takes a back seat and the sub-conscious mind becomes active, giving us dreams of things we have already observed and learned.

Hmmmmmm my dreams are mostly disjointed, illogical, confusing and generally screwed up - rarely are my night dreams worthy of remembering or applying to anything I encounter when I am awake.   There may be an occasion when I dream things that I desire to be so - but again it is usually a desire of my heart and what I want to be.  I have had vision dreams where G-d has given me comfort and guidance - but such is rarely what I desire but rather require that I, and not so much the world, need to change or do something.

I am very skeptical when someone has a dream or vision from G-d directed towards me (and not them) with a need to change or do something.

 

The Traveler

Edited by Traveler

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11 hours ago, Traveler said:

Hmmmmmm my dreams are mostly disjointed, illogical, confusing and generally screwed up - rarely are my night dreams worthy of remembering or applying to anything I encounter when I am awake.   There may be an occasion when I dream things that I desire to be so - but again it is usually a desire of my heart and what I want to be.  I have had vision dreams where G-d has given me comfort and guidance - but such is rarely what I desire but rather require that I, and not so much the world, need to change or do something.

I am very skeptical when someone has a dream or vision from G-d directed towards me (and not them) with a need to change or do something.

 

The Traveler

 

The Traveler

My argument about anyone that says they had a vision from God while dreaming is that it can be explained through what we know from science. You can be driving down the street and not notice that you passed three apple trees on the side of the road, you didn't notice it nor remember it, but your subconscious took notice. You can have a dream about apple trees ten years later and think that it was out of the blue. 

The vision this pastor explains on the video contains all the elements and items he is already aware of....a calender, civil unrest, biblical warnings. His dream is exactly as @Traveler explained, his only, and not Gods prophecy to youtube viewers. 

 

 

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On 8/9/2020 at 7:39 PM, priesthoodpower said:

How would you reply if a stalwart, straight as an arrow family member of yours who was a former bishop and now resides in the stake presidency texted you this.

"We believe that non-members can receive visions too, so, not to scare you but to be better prepared, we as members always knew this was coming but I just didnt know so soon!"

 

https://youtu.be/6TdpMSMP9x4

 

 

 

My wife is Pentecostal not Latter day Saint but somehow or another after I wrote to her through ChristianMatchmaker  .com back on August 8, 2000 she

somehow was told that I was going to be her husband... and that she should fast and pray for me for thirty five days.  She did it..... and Jesus woke her up

early in the mornings and got her to pray for me.  She did some sort of DELIVERANCE for me from three thousand miles south - south west of where I was living.  I bought a plane ticket to Ecuador within a few months as I got to know her more.  

Jesus even told her that I would love her kids as if they were my own..... and always tell her the truth.... and He even told her that I would phone her on a specific Friday night at seven pm her time.... and I did.  

I am involved in a discussion in another forum where somebody is asking me questions that only a well read actual member of the LDS could answer... if any of you would like to assist it is:

 

"Latter day Saints and Unified Field Theory of Modern World Problems...."

by DennisTate on politicalforum  .com where Latter day Saints have total freedom of expression.  

I feel that if Latter day Saints can agree more with other denominations due to what is being revealed through near death experience accounts....  this planet can be won over to the Holy Spirit and by the year 2185 what was shown to near death experiencer and former Skeptic Howard Storm will come to pass.

 

 

Quote

Howard Storm's light being friends told him more about the new world to come. According to them, God wished to usher in the kingdom within the next two hundred years. In order to do so, God had rescinded some of the free will given to creatures, in favor of more divine control over human events. This new world order, according to Howard, will resemble some near-death descriptions of heaven. People will live in such peace and harmony and love that communication will be telepathic, travel instantaneous and the need for clothing and shelter eliminated. The lion will indeed lie down with the lamb.

 

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