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romans8

Preserving the Nephite language

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1 Nephi 3:19 writes "And behold, it is wisdom in God that we should obtain these records,
that we may preserve unto our children the language of our fathers
".

Were these plates the only available books/scrolls that Lehi and family had to prevent
them from losing their ability to preserve their language?   Did they take anything with
them of their Israelite language (which they presumably knew too) or were they solely
knowledgeable about Egyptian?

Matteo

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Why respond to Alfred E. Neuman when he won't even bother to read what's already there before his eyes? The question is one that would be asked only by someone who has never actually read the Book of Mormon but wants to pretend he has. In my estimation, anything he asks is best answered the way Christ answered Herod.

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On 2/27/2021 at 10:45 AM, romans8 said:

1 Nephi 3:19 writes "And behold, it is wisdom in God that we should obtain these records,
that we may preserve unto our children the language of our fathers
".

Were these plates the only available books/scrolls that Lehi and family had to prevent
them from losing their ability to preserve their language?   Did they take anything with
them of their Israelite language (which they presumably knew too) or were they solely
knowledgeable about Egyptian?

Matteo

It’s appears obvious you’ve  never read the Book of Mormon, or if you have you didn’t retain the information found therein that answers your question. Do you remember anything about the Brass Plates, written in Hebrew, that the Nephites brought with them to America from the Holy Land?

If you keep trying to play gotcha while remaining in ignorance of the LDS basics, you’re going to continue to needlessly paint yourself in a negative light.

Edited by Jersey Boy

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On 2/27/2021 at 10:45 AM, romans8 said:

1 Nephi 3:19 writes "And behold, it is wisdom in God that we should obtain these records,
that we may preserve unto our children the language of our fathers
".

Were these plates the only available books/scrolls that Lehi and family had to prevent
them from losing their ability to preserve their language?   Did they take anything with
them of their Israelite language (which they presumably knew too) or were they solely
knowledgeable about Egyptian?

Matteo

We can assume the records might not have been the only books they has with them. But that takes nothing away from the unique role the plates of brass play in preserving the language of their fathers. Note that "language" also refers to the style or manner of expression and expressing thoughts, in this case, sacred, spiritual or priestly language that carries meaning to the appropriately inspired or trained reader. The contents had the language of a holy nation.

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2 hours ago, CV75 said:

We can assume the records might not have been the only books they has with them. But that takes nothing away from the unique role the plates of brass play in preserving the language of their fathers. Note that "language" also refers to the style or manner of expression and expressing thoughts, in this case, sacred, spiritual or priestly language that carries meaning to the appropriately inspired or trained reader. The contents had the language of a holy nation.

One of the very important notions to come out or the modern world's discovery of the Dead Sea Scriptures is that not all Scriptures are created equally.  At the outpost by the Dead Sea there was a large scriptorium where copies of sacred scriptures and other documents were preserved, copied and distributed.  It was discovered that there was a hierarchy of scriptures.  There were the standard copies - made mostly for distribution and reading (both public and private).  There were another set created on and in more sacred context by more sacred materials.  These were special scriptures from which the scribes used to copy to make scriptures for reading and distribution.  Then there was the most important set.  This set was seldom used or referenced.  It was believed that this most important set was made from the most enduring materials by the highest ranking of priests and scribes (seldom by any individual).  This was only used on the occasion to replace the special scriptorium scriptures.  It is speculated that this most important set was only replaced (if ever) after several generations and were stored and kept in the Ark of the Covenant at the Temple in Jerusalem.  It is also believed that the material used for these most sacred of scripture, was meatal.  It is speculated that the Coper Scroll from the Dead Sea was a temple edition.

This is all most interesting speculation in our modern time because according to ancient traditions such sacred relics of such status to be stored at the temple (and perhaps in the Ark of the Covenant) were maintained by priests (from a patriarchal order) and under special covenant to the select order and G-d.  The punishment for a priest of that order to fail in their covenant was death by beheading - which according to covenant must be carried out by priests of the special covenant.  BTW - this idea of beheading based on divine conventual violation is still considered the proper punishment among religious traditionalists of the Middle East.

Why bring all this up?  Because I believe @CV75 is perhaps even more inspired in their post than they realize?  It could mean that Laban in removing the Brass Plates from the temple to his residence for his own amusements and had broken his sacred covenant which required that he be beheaded by the priestly order that would now maintain the covenant and plates.  Which is why any new Nephite sacred records were to be kept safe - even under threat of life.

To be honest - such are unproven speculations of scholars but for me the pieces fit the narrative - which at the time of Joseph Smith Jr - were completely unknown and without any reference to the young Joseph from an obscure farm in the frontier of America.  And so I ask all those seeking truths (like perhaps @romans8) from G-d --- How many witnesses must you personally receive before you will take the Book of Mormon seriously and covenant with G-d to accept if he will reveal to you personally that it is true!

 

The Traveler

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On 2/27/2021 at 8:45 AM, romans8 said:

1 Nephi 3:19 writes "And behold, it is wisdom in God that we should obtain these records,
that we may preserve unto our children the language of our fathers
".

Were these plates the only available books/scrolls that Lehi and family had to prevent
them from losing their ability to preserve their language?   Did they take anything with
them of their Israelite language (which they presumably knew too) or were they solely
knowledgeable about Egyptian?

Matteo

As @bytebear alludes, it was the gold plates (created and initially written by Nephi) that were written in “reformed Egyptian”).  The brass plates to which Nephi and Lehi are referring in 1 Nephi 3:19 had been created by someone else and were (presumably) written in Hebrew.

The Lehites may have initially brought other Hebrew documents from Jerusalem with them initially; but they were acutely aware that any physical records they possessed/created would, at some point, be lost (Jacob 4:1-4); the brass and gold plates being the only exceptions to this general rule (Alma 37:1-5).

Edited by Just_A_Guy

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On 2/27/2021 at 10:45 AM, romans8 said:

1 Nephi 3:19 writes "And behold, it is wisdom in God that we should obtain these records,
that we may preserve unto our children the language of our fathers
".

Were these plates the only available books/scrolls that Lehi and family had to prevent
them from losing their ability to preserve their language?   Did they take anything with
them of their Israelite language (which they presumably knew too) or were they solely
knowledgeable about Egyptian?

Matteo 

 

If you had taken a moment to perform a simple search of the Book of Mormon you could have quickly answered your own questions. While on the Church website, I searched the Book of Mormon for any use of the word Hebrew and I found the following statement from the  prophet Mormon written a thousand years after the Lehites first arrived in America.

33 And if our plates had been sufficiently large we should have written in Hebrew; but the Hebrew hath been altered by us also; and if we could have written in Hebrew, behold, ye would have had no imperfection in our record. (Mormon 9)

So yes, the Nephites could read and write a somewhat altered form of Hebrew one thousand years after their first arrival in America.

Edited by Jersey Boy

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On 3/1/2021 at 12:21 PM, Traveler said:

How many witnesses must you personally receive before you will take the Book of Mormon seriously and covenant with G-d to accept if he will reveal to you personally that it is true!

I am still reading it and will decide when I have read it all. 

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On 2/27/2021 at 2:43 PM, Jersey Boy said:

It’s appears obvious you’ve  never read the Book of Mormon, or if you have you didn’t retain the information found therein that answers your question. Do you remember anything about the Brass Plates, written in Hebrew, that the Nephites brought with them to America from the Holy Land?

@CV75 explained it a few posts later.

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1 hour ago, romans8 said:

I am still reading it and will decide when I have read it all. 

Here is my observation as an engineer and scientist.  If you are not willing to "pay" the price for truth in the here and now and for every here and now moving forward - you will most likely end up quite lost and confused - whether you ever come to realize it or not.  The scripture reference to such is to be blown about with every wind of doctrine.

I wish you well in your journey and if I can assist you in your quest for truth - I will do so as best I can.  Many years ago I was given divine instruction of the truthfulness of the Book of Mormon but have ended up in the years that have followed in a constant quest trying to figure out and understand the treasures (often hidden - or needing spiritual assistance) to be discovered.

 

 

The Traveler

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