Encouraging Temple recommend renewals?


NeedleinA
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6 minutes ago, NeedleinA said:

I believe I'm tracking the sentiment here, I think. 

 Since my sphere of stewardship does not offer me the chance to ask the actual members in stake their reasons for not renewing their recommends, asking here acts as a great second place sounding board.

Taking your pizza analogy, we have plenty of customers who come to the restaurant but no one is ordering pizza combo #1. When we have been asking people 'why not?', we are only hearing back that it is 'not for them' but nothing beyond that. What exact part is not for them? The mushrooms, anchovies, the what?

You are correct, it is hard to try and help individuals address their certain concern(s) if we can't figure out the concern to begin with.

One more check mark as to why I appreciate everyone here offering up their thoughts. With varying degrees of Church activity from participants here and the anonymity it helps to drill down to some possible specifics.

 

Oh, your posts on this thread are perfect, you are doing everything right by encouraging dialogue. More importantly, you are actually listening to all of us. 
 

Perhaps the people who only say that the temple is “not for them” and say no more lack the confidence needed to further express themselves? Maybe they don’t feel like they'll be heard? I don’t know, I freely admit I can’t read their minds. 
 

Again, I think you are doing everything right. We could all learn much from this thread, and from you. 

Edited by LDSGator
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You specifically asked my opinion. Here are a few thoughts rattling around in my head.

The cynic in me has trouble see anything but "statistics" motivating the search for a new initiative. There's a bishop and/or stake president who is being asked in interviews with his priesthood leader about the "low" statistics, and he is uncomfortable being asked those questions, so he wants to find a way to raise the numbers to alleviate the pressure being put on him. My point being, look deep inside for what is motivating this kind of thing (in a time when temple attendance has been difficult or impossible or is only just barely available again). Before coming up with a new initiative, make sure that the real motivation is truly pastoral. If the motivation is administrative/statistical, work within yourselves as leadership until the motivation becomes purely pastoral.

Along those lines, I sometimes wonder if one of the best things bishops and stake presidents could do is to learn how to "separate themselves" from their ward. Somehow be able to say to the priesthood leader, "these statistics represent real individuals, and each one has either chosen to have a TR or not, and I am not going to be responsible for each individual's choices (whether to take credit for them having a TR or feel guilty for them not having a TR)." I know it is more complicated than that, but it too often seems that the immediate motivation for something like this is making a report look better rather than true pastoral interest in individuals.

I agree with @LDSGator that some of this is trying to identify why people aren't renewing recommends. Pardon the brief tangent, but one of the interesting things I got out of David Ostler's Bridges was the disconnect between leadership and members. Ostler asked leaders why people went through faith crises and also asked people self-identifying as experiencing a faith crisis, and the reasons differed -- substantially in some cases. I expect the same dynamic might be at play with TR renewals.  Local leaders need to be able to approach their congregants and understand why they aren't renewing their TRs. Maybe (emphasis on maybe), that will inspire some kind of initiative that can help people renew their TR. Or maybe it will identify some other need (unrelated to TRs) that the ward/stake/branch needs, and put the TR statistic on hold.

Somewhere in the search for reasons, be ready for some difficult reasons. Some like @Jane_Doe may have bad interview experiences from the past or real discomfort with some of the TR questions. Are leaders ready to sit with people in their discomfort and minister to them?

I also agree with @Fether that having a current TR is not really the end goal here. The end goal is helping people have a good relationship with God and Christ and the Church. Having a current TR may be an easily measured numeric placeholder for that much more difficult to measure aspect. IMO, honestly focus pastorally on individuals' relationship to God, Christ, and the Church, and TR renewals will naturally follow. In the event the statistics don't, the focus is still on the right end goal.

Those are my thoughts. Probably worth about what you paid for them.

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21 hours ago, NeedleinA said:

Are people lazy? 

One additional thought.

Everybody is lazy. But even a lazy person will get off his butt and run out of his house if it caught on fire. The issue isn’t and never is laziness. The issue is what people see as important.
 

I forgot to turn off the printer in my room and there was a full blue glow. It was mildly annoying, but I didn’t think it was worth the effort of getting out of bed to turn it off so I slept with it on. Now, had the main light in my room been on, I absolutely would have gotten up to turn it off. 
 

Likewise, Many see the request of keeping a current temple recommend during a pandemic as unimportant so they won’t be getting up to do that unless someone can provide a solid explanation. Me, and many like me agree, but have a testimony in simply following the prophet, even on small things like this so they choose to do it anyway.

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2 hours ago, MrShorty said:

If the motivation is administrative/statistical, work within yourselves as leadership until the motivation becomes purely pastoral.

I won't pretend to speak for other stakes elsewhere, but I know for our stake presidency/leadership the concern is thankfully pastoral in nature.
We all are very open about the fact that numbers/stats are only small tools/indicators to help get us to the real goals BUT they are not the goals. In this case: temple attendance, saving ordinances, service to those who have passed on and ultimately exaltation are the real focus.

We can't get to step 2 (the temple) without step 1 (recommend). If we can't get to step 2 (covid), we can at least strive for step 1 in the meantime.

It reminds me of stories where members of the Church in eastern block countries, post WW2, would save their tithing in jars, etc. even though they had no one to give it to. They saved it up in the hopes that someday they could actually turn it in. While they were limited in their ability, they still did the best they could at that particular time in those particular circumstances.

Edited by NeedleinA
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I do not have any additional insights to why members might choose to not renew recommend...

However I do have a really  really good reason for those that are questioning why they should have a recommend if they can't use it.

Learning/relearning/reinforcing humility.  God gives command we are under covenant to obey the commands.  There is no only if I understand/agree with it exception clause.  One the biggest acts of Faith is following a command we do not understand/agree with.

Yes it can absolutely suck to be asked to take things on Faith, but that is exactly the test of this life...  And as a test it is understandable that we struggle with it, it wouldn't be a test otherwise

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Frankly, I’ve been trying to have as little face time with my bishop as possible lately; because we are returning to in-person 2nd hour meetings and I’ve just assumed he’s swamped putting out fires, starting callings that have gone vacant, and handling priesthood ordinations or things like that.  My TR isn’t expiring anytime soon—but if it were, I’d probably put it off a couple of months (with the temples being closed anyways and all) unless or until my bishop announced “no, guys, really, I do have time for this—please come get your recommend renewed”.

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2 hours ago, mordorbund said:

Temple recommend? Is that the little card where they cut off a corner when you break one of the rules? Or did they stop doing that when we quit Scouting?

 No, it’s the card you carry around where when people who see you sin they put a green dot, but when you do something good they put a star.

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Has anyone else heard this story before? If so, was it recent? 
I'm trying to figure out why it has come to my mind, and trying to rule out if 'we' all recently heard it for some reason like in a General Conference talk??

Quote

Behind the Wall:
The Church in Eastern Germany
(Part 1: Saints in Isolation,
 

Some members remained faithful despite years of isolation. Gunter Schulze, now bishop of the Dresden Ward, spent much of his time during that period finding and caring for isolated members—some in Poland, some in outlying areas of the German Democratic Republic. One of these was an elderly sister in Upper Silesia.

“We visited with her a long time. Finally she went behind the stove and brought out a knotted stocking and began untying the knots, several knots. Then she held out her two hands like a scale and weighed money from the knotted stocking. She said, ‘This is my tithing. I have been saving it for over twenty-five years now. I knew the priesthood would come into my home again someday!’”

 

Edited by NeedleinA
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I had a fun exchange a couple of months ago.  My wife and I were trying to get our recommends renewed.  We had already gotten with the bishopric.  We now needed to meet with the Stake Presidency.

It happened to be ward conference one week, so all three of them were there instead of the one counselor that often visits.

As they found out we were trying to renew our recommends, one of the counselors came to us and said he only had a minute.  He asked if we could do our interview together (in the room at the same time).  My wife looked at me because she knew there was something that might make me say no.  I was able to confidently look her in the eyes and say, "You know everything about me."

She gave me a kiss and we went into the interview room.  He only asked the questions once.  We both answered "yes" or "no" as appropriate.  And at our age & experience, we really didn't have any questions.  So, he signed and we were off.

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I am/was one of those people whose recommend expired during COVID.  I didn't realize it because I had no reason to pull it out and look at it with the temples closed.  I only realized it because my wife started talking about getting hers renewed and mine expired before hers did. (I had put mine through the wash so we were out of sync)

So I queued up with her for renewal...   The reason I am sharing is because my experience with the stake was just like @Carborendum's only through Zoom

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10 hours ago, NeedleinA said:

Has anyone else heard this story before? Is so, was it recent? 
I'm trying to figure out why it has come to my mind, and trying to rule out if 'we' all recently heard it for some reason like in a General Conference talk??

Sounds like various stories that President Monson (I believe) told several times, but I can't find any record of it.

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A couple of fun experiences doing temple recommend interviews as a bishop:

Our stake president, who was a member of my ward, needed to renew his recommend at the same time I needed to renew mine.  So we sat down across from each other at my desk.  I asked him the questions, he asked me the questions, I signed my recommend twice (member and bishopric) and his once (bishopric), turned the book around to him and he signed his recommend twice (member and stake presidency) and mine once (stake presidency).  We shook hands and went on our way.

One of my last weeks prior to being released, as we were getting ready for the day, my wife asked if I would do her renewal interview.  I thought about it for a moment and suggested she visit with one of my counselors.  Later at church she approached me and asked again that I do her renewal interview.  I asked if she wouldn't be more comfortable meeting with one of my counselors.  She said, "no" so we sat down in my office and did the interview.  I didn't think much of it as it seemed to have been just another recommend interview.  Later while sitting at dinner our son asked how her recommend interview had gone.  She responded saying it had been one of the toughest recommend interviews she had ever had.  I was totally surprised as it had seemed uneventful to me.  She said I was very direct and businesslike in my asking of the questions.  That's how I am so I didn't understand.  She went on to explain that by being as serious as I am with the interview it comes across as intimidating.  We ended the conversation with me wondering if everyone I'd ever interviewed had come away feeling that way.

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10 minutes ago, hzdbl5 said:

A couple of fun experiences doing temple recommend interviews as a bishop:

Our stake president, who was a member of my ward, needed to renew his recommend at the same time I needed to renew mine.  So we sat down across from each other at my desk.  I asked him the questions, he asked me the questions, I signed my recommend twice (member and bishopric) and his once (bishopric), turned the book around to him and he signed his recommend twice (member and stake presidency) and mine once (stake presidency).  We shook hands and went on our way.

One of my last weeks prior to being released, as we were getting ready for the day, my wife asked if I would do her renewal interview.  I thought about it for a moment and suggested she visit with one of my counselors.  Later at church she approached me and asked again that I do her renewal interview.  I asked if she wouldn't be more comfortable meeting with one of my counselors.  She said, "no" so we sat down in my office and did the interview.  I didn't think much of it as it seemed to have been just another recommend interview.  Later while sitting at dinner our son asked how her recommend interview had gone.  She responded saying it had been one of the toughest recommend interviews she had ever had.  I was totally surprised as it had seemed uneventful to me.  She said I was very direct and businesslike in my asking of the questions.  That's how I am so I didn't understand.  She went on to explain that by being as serious as I am with the interview it comes across as intimidating.  We ended the conversation with me wondering if everyone I'd ever interviewed had come away feeling that way.

I never thought abut that! It must be very awkward to interview your wife for a temple recommend! 

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4 hours ago, hzdbl5 said:

She said I was very direct and businesslike in my asking of the questions. 

Years ago there was a Stake Pres. Counselor, doctor, who: had every part of the temple recommend memorized, very direct and never broke eye contract... ever!

By time it was done I confessed to being a Russian spy and for stealing a lolli-pop in the 3rd grade.
AWKWARD to say the least.
He was a family friend too. Soon as the interview was over, poof! right back to being his normal ol' self. He did it with everyone and all of us jumped for joy if they got the other counselor instead.

Good times.

 

Edited by NeedleinA
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4 hours ago, NeedleinA said:

Years ago there was a Stake Pres. Counselor, doctor, who: had every part of the temple recommend memorized, very direct and never broke eye contract... ever!

By time it was done I confessed to being a Russian spy and for stealing a lolli-pop in the 3rd grade.
AWKWARD to say the least.
He was a family friend too. Soon as the interview was over, poof! right back to being his normal ol' self. He did it with everyone and all of us jumped for joy if they got the other counselor instead.

Good times.

 

I never knew you were a Russian spy.

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14 hours ago, Just_A_Guy said:

Wow.  You give @Vort’s doe-eyed Icelandic chick a run for her money.

What are you insinuating? Halldóra is NOT a spy. She is NOT trained in lethal bladework and poisoning drinks. She most certainly does not use her seductive charms to learn industrial and intellectual property trade secrets for a clandestine multinational cabal based outside of Reykjavik. I mean, come on! Have you ever heard such nonsense? Please.

Edited by Vort
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1 minute ago, Vort said:

What are you insinuating? Halldòra is NOT a spy. She is NOT trained in lethal bladework and poisoning drinks. She most certainly does not use her seductive charms to learn industrial and intellectual property secrets for a secret multinational cabal based outside of Reykjavik. I mean, come on! Have you ever heard such nonsense? Please.

Gee, and all I meant to imply is that she’s hawt.

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