Trump's Home Raided by FBI


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You've probably heard.  It's all over the news.  Trump's Mar-a-Lago Home was raided by the FBI.  The subtext was that he had some records that belong to the Federal Government that he supposedly took home with him.

The liberal media is, for once, all over the board.  They don't know what to make of it.  There are some liberals siding with conservatives being outraged at an obvious weaponization of the DOJ for political purpose.  Others are saying that they recovered documents that were labeled "Top Secret".  These would obviously be the property of the Federal Government, and therefore would be considered "stolen".  And there are many saying that the story is still developing, so they don't have all the facts.

I believe it was Don Jr. who said that they broke in but didn't find anything in his father's safe.  As you can imagine, every conservative is outraged by this making cries of third world countries (Trump, himself, made this accusation along with others).  Others using the term Banana Republic.

GOP legislators are threatening to bring up the officers of the FBI before a Congressional Hearing about this.  I have no idea if that will even do anything.  AFAIK, I don't think Congress has any authority to convict anyone of a crime unless it's Democrats wanting to imprison several dozen protesters who hurt their feelings over 18 months ago.

So, as usual, because it was perpetrated on a Republican by Democrats, we'll never see any justice because of this.

The White House is denying they even knew about this.  OK, given Biden's current condition, I bet he didn't.  But what is he going to do about this?  Oh, that's right, also nothing.

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The more I see Trump investigated, the more it is going to be hard to believe if anything "really" comes up. Trump called out Epstein. Trump probably has more knowledge on the despicable nature of many of our rich elites and politicians.

Imagine if Hillary and Bill were treated in the same way the Democrats have gone after Trump. We already know the FBI is weaponized, assuming it is accurate that the FBI was used to retrieve a journal of the president (hmm....what was in that journal if the FBI were used to break in?).

Trump was assisted by Russians....crickets...but it appears the Clinton's had more ties with the Russians (irony a little).

There are signs of tyranny for sure, and this would be one of them. We already know the IRS has been weaponized also, and now (shocker) we have a bill to increase the number of workers -- who is going to be investigated with scrutiny?  The signs are all there, we are seeing the same result with Nephi after his prayer on the tower. The one's in fault, and knew they were in fault, were pinning their evil works on Nephi. We are at this point or nearing this to a further degree. Those who were truly evil, excited the minds against Nephi.

I'm not likening Trump to Nephi/Moroni (that was the worst thing Arizona governor/senator?? could have done). I'm simply saying those who are truly corrupt/evil will turn their angst against someone calling out their ploys and excite the public mind against them such that they even begin to believe someone who is innocent is guilty, and those who are guilty are the victims.

Edited by Anddenex
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29 minutes ago, Anddenex said:

I'm not likening Trump to Nephi/Moroni (that was the worst thing Arizona governor/senator?? could have done).

I admit that I don't really get the lionization (here literally) of Trump. I believe it's largely a reflexive reaction to the media's unceasing drumbeat of hatred toward the man. I myself, no huge fan of Trump, have felt the itch to get behind the guy and support him much more than I normally would, just because the leftist hatred of him is soooooooooooo far overboard. My rational faculties are hoping that Trump does not run in 2024, but some vindictive and grudge-holding part of my being secretly wants to see it as a way to give a big middle finger to those who despise Trump supporters.

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55 minutes ago, Vort said:

I admit that I don't really get the lionization (here literally) of Trump. I believe it's largely a reflexive reaction to the media's unceasing drumbeat of hatred toward the man. I myself, no huge fan of Trump, have felt the itch to get behind the guy and support him much more than I normally would, just because the leftist hatred of him is soooooooooooo far overboard. My rational faculties are hoping that Trump does not run in 2024, but some vindictive and grudge-holding part of my being secretly wants to see it as a way to give a big middle finger to those who despise Trump supporters.

EqG3IPKW8AU0cxb.jpg:large

Same. My rational self much prefers the idea of DeSantis. But.... :devil:

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1 hour ago, Anddenex said:

I'm not likening Trump to Nephi/Moroni (that was the worst thing Arizona governor/senator??

The Chief Judge who was murdered by his brother that Nephi prophesied about was plausibly also a wicked man.  If we consider Trump as like one of the Chief Judges, he doesn't have to be compared to Nephi for it to be an accurate comparison.

Personally, I have seen Trump like Morianton from the Book of Ether: a good leader to the people, despite not being a good role model due to his moral failings.

1 hour ago, Vort said:

My rational faculties are hoping that Trump does not run in 2024, but some vindictive and grudge-holding part of my being secretly wants to see it as a way to give a big middle finger to those who despise Trump supporters.

This is me exactly. 😂

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1 hour ago, Vort said:

I admit that I don't really get the lionization (here literally) of Trump. I believe it's largely a reflexive reaction to the media's unceasing drumbeat of hatred toward the man. I myself, no huge fan of Trump, have felt the itch to get behind the guy and support him much more than I normally would, just because the leftist hatred of him is soooooooooooo far overboard. My rational faculties are hoping that Trump does not run in 2024, but some vindictive and grudge-holding part of my being secretly wants to see it as a way to give a big middle finger to those who despise Trump supporters.

We appear, in this thing, to share the same thoughts. I didn't vote for Trump in 2016. I did vote for him because I started gaining sympathy/empathy for a man:

1) Who wasn't a full time politician. Who actually worked in the workforce all his years before running for president.

2) Who was targeted by "all" media (even those who were considered "neutral" outlets). When I looked into every case I could find facts upon it was easy to see a bias, not truth, or twisted truth.

3) The continued assault to impeach him with no evidence but simply to seek to find anything and everything they could to remove him. When people are misrepresenting, fault finding, trying to dig up anything and everything they can against someone -- my mind thinks -- there is something this guy is doing right otherwise the "liberal" side wouldn't keep attacking him.

4) The guy brought out one of the most heinous pedophilia syndicates, and we know all about his visits (but no charges). YET, for some reason the list of people on who visited (excluding Trump -- maybe some others but I don't know) -- are being totally hid from the public. They should be scrutinized just as much as Trump and we should be seeing court dates of those involved that they know were potential "statutory rape' cases.

I could go on but this is enough. I would probably vote for him also again, because if the Dems hate him so much he must be doing something right for America -- constitutionally.

Edited by Anddenex
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I would like to know how many liberals actually believe this raid was about some substantive violation of the law.  I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that the great marjority are thinking, "Finally, they did something to screw him over!" with no thought about whether he actually violated the law, or if any warrants were actually on the up-and-up.

In the end, maybe they are.  But the vast majority of both sides of the aisle are thinkin this is (forgive the expression) trumped-up charges just to "get him."

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I live in California so it doesn't matter how I vote in the presidential election.

But I would hope that we could have at least one intelligent, God fearing, honest candidate on the ballot.  You would think that in out great country we could…

I’m thrilled with Trump’s Chief Justices.  And he certainly can be entertaining, but the haughty know it all attitude rubs me wrong.

Its kinda bizarre having teleprompter in chief.

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56 minutes ago, mikbone said:

I live in California so it doesn't matter how I vote in the presidential election.

But I would hope that we could have at least one intelligent, God fearing, honest candidate on the ballot.  You would think that in out great country we could…

I’m thrilled with Trump’s Chief Justices.  And he certainly can be entertaining, but the haughty know it all attitude rubs me wrong.

Its kinda bizarre having teleprompter in chief.

I agree.  I think God will start sending us better candidates, when we show Him that we are actually faithfully waiting for them.  If I may co-opt CS Lewis:  D&C 98:10-11 is not idealistic gas; nor is it a command to do the impossible.  Trump can at times be adept at “owning the libs”, which is always fun.  But we knew long before 2016 that he just wasn’t a good guy; and beating the Hildebeast didn’t suddenly make him into a good man.   

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14 hours ago, Vort said:

Unless there's a big revelation of real, substantive malfeasance by Trump, I will vote for him if he receives the Republican nomination. I'm not a huge fan of his, except when compared with my feelings toward any national-level Democrat.

More or less how I feel. I didn't vote for him the first time, was a bit stunned when he won (but the whole election that year was surreal).

The reality is I'd likely vote third party again, but he'd at least be supported by me as Republican candidate.

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8 hours ago, Just_A_Guy said:

I agree.  I think God will start sending us better candidates, when we show Him that we are actually faithfully waiting for them.  If I may co-opt CS Lewis:  D&C 98:10-11 is not idealistic gas; nor is it a command to do the impossible.  Trump can at times be adept at “owning the libs”, which is always fun.  But we knew long before 2016 that he just wasn’t a good guy; and beating the Hildebeast didn’t suddenly make him into a good man.   

You've won me over... Not just because of this statement, but I've been mulling over many of your past statements on Trump.  And I've been persuaded over time.

As you know, in 2016, I pretty much felt the same way about him as you did.  But by 2024, I was seeing that as a manager and executive, he did things I liked and were good for the country.  So, I ignored his character flaws for the actual good things he was doing.

Since he lost, I've been wondering what happened to the country in four years that would have caused his loss.  It was easy to blame the loss on voter fraud (which actually did happen on a scale we've never seen before).  But that isn't why he lost.  He lost because more people in the middle were simply tired of his over-the-top rhetoric.  And many people (like me) were ignoring that aspect of him.

While I doubt that anything he said actually abetted violence, I can certainly see why a wave of voters in the middle were tired of him and were willing to give Biden a chance.  That is really why he lost the election.

After I came to grip with the fact that he didn't lose the election to voter fraud, I realized that many faithful God-fearing individuals forgot that God will only intervene as we look to Him.

Neither candidate was a good moral individual.  Neither candidate was "good for America." But what about the primaries?  Why didn't we vote for others who were much better examples?

By the time the general election came around, neither candidate in either the 2016 or the 2020 election would have been good choices.  The only difference would have been the economy.  I wonder, then, whether we're voting for anything but money.  Not that we had much of a choice.  But do we care about anything else?

Maybe, if we could show through our primary votes whom we would really vote for -- that might make a difference.  Then if we (at least in our hearts) feel that the general election is just the lesser of two evils, the Lord may have mercy on us.  But FAR too many people thought Trump was a heavenly blessing to America.  That simply wasn't so.

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A moment of real open and honest comment from Pelosi:

Quote

All I know about that is what is in the public domain.  I was surprised that it flashed on my phone last evening. So I don’t really have too much to say, except that, to have a visit like that, you need a warrant. To have a warrant, you need justification. And that says that no one is above the law – not even a president or a former president of the United States. But that, all of this will, I’m sure, be made known to us over time. But I have no knowledge of it.

I do know that there has been chatter — or more than chatter — about the presidential, president’s documents and how they must be preserved for history. And we’ll see what the justification was for the raid. I just don’t know. I think everybody was surprised by it.

She's right.  I believe we will have to wait until all the facts come out.  Maybe it was justified; maybe it wasn't.  But I believe the American people need to hear all the facts.  It strikes at our faith in all our government institutions.  We need something to explain all this.  And the silence we're getting from the Executive Branch isn't helping.

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1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

A moment of real open and honest comment from Pelosi:

She's right.  I believe we will have to wait until all the facts come out.  Maybe it was justified; maybe it wasn't.  But I believe the American people need to hear all the facts.  It strikes at our faith in all our government institutions.  We need something to explain all this.  And the silence we're getting from the Executive Branch isn't helping.

Agreed.  And frankly, it’s looking like the magistrate judge who signed the warrant was an Obama donor; which stinks to high heaven. 

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2 hours ago, Carborendum said:

But by 2024, I was seeing that as a manager and executive, he did things I liked and were good for the country.  So, I ignored his character flaws for the actual good things he was doing.

This is where I am. Do I like him as a person? No, I think he's an idiot. Do I think he did a good job at his actual presidential duties? Yes. 

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2 minutes ago, Backroads said:

This is where I am. Do I like him as a person? No, I think he's an idiot. Do I think he did a good job at his actual presidential duties? Yes. 

I believe Trump has his flaws. But I cannot help but question this sort of rhetoric. The primary reason people seem to think Trump's an "idiot" seems to be because he does things like call other people idiots and the like. Irony meter activated. ;)

(Note: please take this in the light-hearted spirit it was intended, hopefully communicated with the winky emoji. @Vort, I'm telling you...emojis are awesome!!)

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4 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

@Vort, I'm telling you...emojis are awesome!!

One of the many reasons I hate emojis is that they have become an excuse to insult people and use unsociable language, then place any blame for offense on the lack of intelligence or simple oversensitivity of the offended party. "Nice pic. Your makeup looks like you got jumped by a violent gang of kindergarteners armed with colored Sharpies. 😀 Also, your mother is ugly and smells awful. 😁"

Edited by Vort
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Just_A_Guy said:

Agreed.  And frankly, it’s looking like the magistrate judge who signed the warrant was an Obama donor; which stinks to high heaven. 

Here's the scorecard as far as I see it.  This is only based on the reports thus far.

Accusation Against Trump:

  • He took classified documents to his home after he left the office of POTUS.  He was an ordinary citizen then.  He is not allowed to have possession of such.
  • May not be true.
    • While he still held the office, the POTUS can declassify anything at a whim.  That is one of the powers of the POTUS.  It doesn't have to be formally done.  He can just decide.
    • If the current POTUS decided to re-classify them, then there is a process by which anyone in possession of such documents must be notified before accusation of any crime.

Accusation Against TPTB:

  • The warrant gave free rein on taking ANYTHING in the entire building.  This kind of broad authority is almost NEVER given without a great deal of probable cause combined with suspicion of a VERY serious offense.  @Just_A_Guy please, correct me if I'm wrong.
  • The judge had openly criticized Trump in very public forums at a level that he should have recused himself.  But he didn't.
  • By all reports no one (incl the White House) even knew anything was going on. This was kept very close to the vest of the AG's office.

As of yet, we have not heard a whimper from the AG.  So, as far as we know, it has nothing to do with the classification of the documents.  It could be a completely different matter that the documents were connected with.  But if the people serving the warrant didn't explain anything, I wonder what the warrant was for.

Doesn't a warrant need to state the nature of the accusation and the purpose for which the warrant was served?  Yet, we have a bunch of people from Trump's team that don't seem to have any idea.  The Feds just came in broke open a safe and took a bunch of stuff because they could.

That's the story we've got so far.

Edited by Carborendum
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1 hour ago, Vort said:

One of the many reasons I hate emojis is that they have become an excuse to insult people and use unsociable language, then place any blame for offense on the lack of intelligence or simple oversensitivity of the offended party. "Nice pic. Your makeup looks like you got jumped by a violent gang of kindergarteners armed with colored Sharpies. 😀 Also, your mother is ugly and smells awful. 😁"

Hopefully that's not how @Backroadstook my post! 😱

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