Word Of Wisdom

[soc_wker]

I have been an inactive member for several years but have recently started back. My husband is now taking the discussions. I drink green tea per my doctors instructions . I am getting conflicting answers if this is against the WOW. My Bishop says it is. The Bishop at the LDS church across town says it is ok. My visiting teacher says she knows many members that drink it as well as herbal teas.Researching this on other LDS forums I am getting conflicting answers. One from a Stake President says he drinks it for medical reasons as well . Does anyone know the churchs stance on this? Beleive me I do not drink it for the TASTE!! Thanks for the help.

Also if I may can I ask one more question. My former husband and I were married in the DC Temple . We were divoiced many years ago. He has been excommunicated. If my now husband joins the church and later we would want to be sealed in the temple ....what is the exact process to go through to get "unsealed" from my first husband in essence a temple divoice? Also will he have to be contacted ...although I do know what city he lives in and his address would not be imposible to find I would prefer that he not be contacted. Is it a MUST that he be?

soc_wker

[DrewM]

I have been an inactive member for several years but have recently started back. My husband is now taking the discussions. I drink green tea per my doctors instructions . I am getting conflicting answers if this is against the WOW. My Bishop says it is. The Bishop at the LDS church across town says it is ok. My visiting teacher says she knows many members that drink it as well as herbal teas.Researching this on other LDS forums I am getting conflicting answers. One from a Stake President says he drinks it for medical reasons as well . Does anyone know the churchs stance on this? Beleive me I do not drink it for the TASTE!! Thanks for the help.

The First Presidency said this:

It is one thing to drink tea and coffee in the ordinary way, that is, to make a practice of doing so, and especially of taking those beverages strong, and another thing entirely to drink tea or coffee as a medicine. All such things were created in the beginning for the use of man, that is, for a wise use, and it is for the Saints to know for themselves what constitutes a wise use and to govern themselves accordingly. This is the spirit in which the revelation called the Word of Wisdom should be understood and taught. (Statements of the First Presidency, 506-507)

Whether green tea is "against" the word of wisdom or not, that statement should be taken into consideration. Even if your Bishop says you shouldn't, it's up to you to decide whether it's right or wrong. If you drink Green tea and feel it is right, when you're asked whether you live the Word of Wisdom, you should say "yes," in my opinion.

How do you feel about it?

Also if I may can I ask one more question. My former husband and I were married in the DC Temple . We were divoiced many years ago. He has been excommunicated. If my now husband joins the church and later we would want to be sealed in the temple ....what is the exact process to go through to get "unsealed" from my first husband in essence a temple divoice? Also will he have to be contacted ...although I do know what city he lives in and his address would not be imposible to find I would prefer that he not be contacted. Is it a MUST that he be?

I'm not sure. It's best to ask your Bishop these sorts of questions.

[bjw]

My two cents...

I agree with you here that, even though green tea is against the WoW, as long as you are not making a habit of it and it is being used for medicinal purposes I don't think that you should be expected to confess it in your TR interview.

I've had a couple situations. I was buying Full Throttle for awhile when I had insomnia and couldn't get up in the morning, and it was helping me wake up. My doctor said it was a good idea and I only drank it long enough to get my biological clock straightened out. Another situation, prior to my baptism I had an anxiety/depression condition and had to see a psychiatrist for awhile. He thought it would be a good idea if I had a cigar at night out on the patio to calm my nerves and relax me. It helped and I think that if it happened again and a psychiatrist told me to do that I don't think it would be breaking the WoW as long as I only did it once in awhile to help my nerves and not make a habit of it. I think the FP message quoted in the previous post does a good job of describing how we should use substances. Only for our benefit and not as a habit.

IMHO, the WoW was given to keep conspiring men in the last days from ensnaring us in addiction. (See D&C 89:4) The tobacco companies that make cigarettes and add things to the product to get people addicted are a good example of this. This goes for soft drinks, coffee, and tea as well.

One example of alchohol used for medicinal purposes may be Nyquil and certain cough syrups. IMHO, the main thing is that we do not get addicted to anything or use it "recreationally."

[DrewM]

My two cents...

I agree with you here that, even though green tea is against the WoW, as long as you are not making a habit of it and it is being used for medicinal purposes I don't think that you should be expected to confess it in your TR interview.

I've had a couple situations. I was buying Full Throttle for awhile when I had insomnia and couldn't get up in the morning, and it was helping me wake up. My doctor said it was a good idea and I only drank it long enough to get my biological clock straightened out. Another situation, prior to my baptism I had an anxiety/depression condition and had to see a psychiatrist for awhile. He thought it would be a good idea if I had a cigar at night out on the patio to calm my nerves and relax me. It helped and I think that if it happened again and a psychiatrist told me to do that I don't think it would be breaking the WoW as long as I only did it once in awhile to help my nerves and not make a habit of it. I think the FP message quoted in the previous post does a good job of describing how we should use substances. Only for our benefit and not as a habit.

IMHO, the WoW was given to keep conspiring men in the last days from ensnaring us in addiction. (See D&C 89:4) The tobacco companies that make cigarettes and add things to the product to get people addicted are a good example of this. This goes for soft drinks, coffee, and tea as well.

One example of alchohol used for medicinal purposes may be Nyquil and certain cough syrups. IMHO, the main thing is that we do not get addicted to anything or use it "recreationally."

I agree. I've never drank tea. I've never smoked. I've never drank alcoholic beverages. However, if one of those things had a real medicinal purpose, and if there were no other options, I wouldn't feel too bad doing it nor would I feel like I was in the wrong. It's the word of wisdom. We should use wisdom in deciding how to live it.

[Guest Iggy]

My two cents...

I agree with you here that, even though green tea is against the WoW, as long as you are not making a habit of it and it is being used for medicinal purposes I don't think that you should be expected to confess it in your TR interview.

I've had a couple situations. I was buying Full Throttle for awhile when I had insomnia and couldn't get up in the morning, and it was helping me wake up. My doctor said it was a good idea and I only drank it long enough to get my biological clock straightened out. Another situation, prior to my baptism I had an anxiety/depression condition and had to see a psychiatrist for awhile. He thought it would be a good idea if I had a cigar at night out on the patio to calm my nerves and relax me. It helped and I think that if it happened again and a psychiatrist told me to do that I don't think it would be breaking the WoW as long as I only did it once in awhile to help my nerves and not make a habit of it. I think the FP message quoted in the previous post does a good job of describing how we should use substances. Only for our benefit and not as a habit.

IMHO, the WoW was given to keep conspiring men in the last days from ensnaring us in addiction. (See D&C 89:4) The tobacco companies that make cigarettes and add things to the product to get people addicted are a good example of this. This goes for soft drinks, coffee, and tea as well.

One example of alchohol used for medicinal purposes may be Nyquil and certain cough syrups. IMHO, the main thing is that we do not get addicted to anything or use it "recreationally."

bjw, I will have to respectfully disagree with just one thing in your post. Your Dr. recommending you smoke a cigar. To me that is counter productive. Cigars are just as bad for you as cigarettes. You could have done a number of healthful things to RELAX. Like: meditation, get in a hot tub, take a hot bath while listening to soothing music, yoga, read the scriptures, embroider (My father embroidered and got all of us kids, male and female, doing it too- it is calming), getting a massage from your spouse or giving your spouse a massage, sitting outside after dark and listening to the stars.

The only good part of the smoking the cigar that I can see is that you were sitting outside, alone and being quiet and contemplating. You can more easily do that without the cigar.

Just my opinion.

[Guest prnldsfrms]

The only human's whose opinions on the green tea thing is relevant is that of your current bishop and your stake president.

What you need to do is prayerfully consider the scriptures and writing s of the prophets concerning green tea,and the word of wisdom, and then determine in your heart whether it is acceptable to God in your circumstances. If when you pray about having made that decision, you receive spiritual confirmation that you can continue to drink green tea and answer the question "Do you keep the Word of Wisdom?" in the affirmative honestly, then you don't have a temple recommend problem.

If you do not receive spiritual confirmation that your use of green tea is consistent with keeping the Word of Wisdom, you'll want to ask your doctor what else would provide the benefits of green tea that the doctor wants you to have, so that you do not have to use green tea.

[JohnBirchSociety]

The only human's whose opinions on the green tea thing is relevant is that of your current bishop and your stake president.

What you need to do is prayerfully consider the scriptures and writing s of the prophets concerning green tea,and the word of wisdom, and then determine in your heart whether it is acceptable to God in your circumstances. If when you pray about having made that decision, you receive spiritual confirmation that you can continue to drink green tea and answer the question "Do you keep the Word of Wisdom?" in the affirmative honestly, then you don't have a temple recommend problem.

If you do not receive spiritual confirmation that your use of green tea is consistent with keeping the Word of Wisdom, you'll want to ask your doctor what else would provide the benefits of green tea that the doctor wants you to have, so that you do not have to use green tea.

There are no writings in scripture, or elsewhere, by prophets, concerning green tea, that I am aware of. I'm certain there is nothing in the Standard Works, which is all I really care about when determining what is doctrinal or not.

Absent a specific direction from the prophet, do as you will.

Sometimes our cultural mormonism gets a bit absurd. If we are not specifically commanded in scripture, then it is up to the individual, not the Bishop, or the Stake President.

[DrewM]

As I quoted before, the First Presidency has stated:

It is one thing to drink tea and coffee in the ordinary way, that is, to make a practice of doing so, and especially of taking those beverages strong, and another thing entirely to drink tea or coffee as a medicine. All such things were created in the beginning for the use of man, that is, for a wise use, and it is for the Saints to know for themselves what constitutes a wise use and to govern themselves accordingly. This is the spirit in which the revelation called the Word of Wisdom should be understood and taught. (Statements of the First Presidency, 506-507)

It's up to individuals to to know for themselves and to govern themselves when it comes to issues like this. It is not up to your Bishop, Stake President, or anyone else to govern you in this thing. It's up to you only. The temple recommend does not ask "Do you abstain from X Y and Z?" Rather it simply asks "Do you live the Word of Wisdom?" Obviously, that is open to interpretation on your part as to what it means to live the Word of Wisdom. Some may feel that it includes abstaining from caffeine or from meat, etc. For others it may mean something else. The point is, it is up to you to figure out what it means to live the Word of Wisdom and to do so. Seek inspiration and guidance and you will be blessed.

[Moksha]

Yeah, a cup of green tea helps to settle your tummy when you're feeling a mite puny. So will a glass of cola with the fizz shaken out.

Have a cup, get a good afternoon sleep and post here in the evening.

[sjdean]

As I quoted before, the First Presidency has stated:

It's up to individuals to to know for themselves and to govern themselves when it comes to issues like this. It is not up to your Bishop, Stake President, or anyone else to govern you in this thing. It's up to you only. The temple recommend does not ask "Do you abstain from X Y and Z?" Rather it simply asks "Do you live the Word of Wisdom?" Obviously, that is open to interpretation on your part as to what it means to live the Word of Wisdom. Some may feel that it includes abstaining from caffeine or from meat, etc. For others it may mean something else. The point is, it is up to you to figure out what it means to live the Word of Wisdom and to do so. Seek inspiration and guidance and you will be blessed.

Ooh, if taken literally then, I interpret the WoW from my own brief look, I can drink beer - moderately, and I shouldn't drink any drink that is hot, whether it is caffeinated or decaffeinated tea or coffee or even hot chocolate or fruit tea. But that would be my interpretation.

[soc_wker]

I have been an inactive member for several years but have recently started back. My husband is now taking the discussions. I drink green tea per my doctors instructions . I am getting conflicting answers if this is against the WOW. My Bishop says it is. The Bishop at the LDS church across town says it is ok. My visiting teacher says she knows many members that drink it as well as herbal teas.Researching this on other LDS forums I am getting conflicting answers. One from a Stake President says he drinks it for medical reasons as well . Does anyone know the churchs stance on this? Beleive me I do not drink it for the TASTE!! Thanks for the help.

Also if I may can I ask one more question. My former husband and I were married in the DC Temple . We were divoiced many years ago. He has been excommunicated. If my now husband joins the church and later we would want to be sealed in the temple ....what is the exact process to go through to get "unsealed" from my first husband in essence a temple divoice? Also will he have to be contacted ...although I do know what city he lives in and his address would not be imposible to find I would prefer that he not be contacted. Is it a MUST that he be?

soc_wker

A BIG thanks to everyone that was so kind to respond to my post regarding green tea. I will enjoy being a board participate in the future . BUT now does anyone have any feedback on the second part of my post? Thanks and HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL!! from SUNNY FLORIDA where it is 74 degrees...sorry guys that are in 4 foot of snow

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Also if I may can I ask one more question. My former husband and I were married in the DC Temple . We were divoiced many years ago. He has been excommunicated. If my now husband joins the church and later we would want to be sealed in the temple ....what is the exact process to go through to get "unsealed" from my first husband in essence a temple divoice? Also will he have to be contacted ...although I do know what city he lives in and his address would not be imposible to find I would prefer that he not be contacted. Is it a MUST that he be?

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[DrewM]

Ooh, if taken literally then, I interpret the WoW from my own brief look, I can drink beer - moderately, and I shouldn't drink any drink that is hot, whether it is caffeinated or decaffeinated tea or coffee or even hot chocolate or fruit tea. But that would be my interpretation.

Well, that's not exactly true. The Church has said, and published that we should not consume:

Alcoholic beverages

Tobacco

Coffee

Tea

But as in the quote I provided, they have said there may be medicinal uses of coffee and tea and that its up to an individual to use prudence and wisdom. The Lord doesn't seek to compel us in everything and spell everything out. He gives us principles and then lets us seek personal inspiration and use personal judgment.

[sjdean]

Well, that's not exactly true. The Church has said, and published that we should not consume:

Alcoholic beverages

Tobacco

Coffee

Tea

But as in the quote I provided, they have said there may be medicinal uses of coffee and tea and that its up to an individual to use prudence and wisdom. The Lord doesn't seek to compel us in everything and spell everything out. He gives us principles and then lets us seek personal inspiration and use personal judgment.

It's one of those arguments that I don't want to get into. Fun though it can be trying to understand what everyones feelings are. Im really not trying to cause trouble.

But er, you did say that:

The temple recommend does not ask "Do you abstain from X Y and Z?" Rather it simply asks "Do you live the Word of Wisdom?" Obviously, that is open to interpretation on your part as to what it means to live the Word of Wisdom. Some may feel that it includes abstaining from caffeine or from meat, etc.

I think that was in response to the question as to whether drinking green tea is in conflict with the Word of Wisdom. It seems strange to me that we should seek clarification over the main bits of the Word of Wisdom, ie, the definition of Strong Drink and Hot Drink, but it's up to you to figure out what Green tea means.

If we are to achieve our own understanding, then that is one thing and I would hope people would be sensible enough to see the dangers and the issues caused and realise actually what a sensible document it is. It really does make so much sense. But if we can seek clarification over one thing, why can't we seek clarification over another?

If people were to just accept the churches clarification, then why are there even questions over the use of caffeinated drinks or the eating of meat?

Sorry, Im prattling on now.

From the outside, I don't pretend to know what Im talking about, but I hope I have valid questions that aren't too impertinent :-)

Out of interest though, I understand that the Word of Wisdom isn't actually a commandment but a guideline anyhow?

Additionally, when the Church provides such clarification of the terms in the Word of Wisdom, such as the meaning of Strong Drink or Hot Drink, does that interpretation take precedence? Does it form an addendum to the scripture? I guess my question is, is it a formal guideline to be followed, or just an opinion?

Cya

Simon

[imported_investigator]

I have lived in Japan for five years. Green tea is a staple in the Japanese culture. If green tea is not against the WOW, someone needs to tell the Japanese, who are required to give it up when they join the church. The green tea is made from the same tea leaf as black tea. The only difference is the tea leaf is fermented prior to making black tea and green tea is made from the fresh tea leaf. The chemical make up is not that much different. Listen to your bishop.

[imported_investigator]

Also if I may can I ask one more question. My former husband and I were married in the DC Temple . We were divoiced many years ago. He has been excommunicated. If my now husband joins the church and later we would want to be sealed in the temple ....what is the exact process to go through to get "unsealed" from my first husband in essence a temple divoice? Also will he have to be contacted ...although I do know what city he lives in and his address would not be imposible to find I would prefer that he not be contacted. Is it a MUST that he be?

soc_wker

As to your second question. It has been my experience that your ex will have to be contacted, however, it has been a while since I had to deal with these issues. Either way, it will be handled through your Bishop. Have faith in him. He will help you on you path back into activity.

[Guest Iggy]

FoExcuse me, tea and tobacco was never okay to use in"medicinal" amounts as regards oral medication. Read those verses again.

8 And again, tobacco is not for the body, neither for the belly, and is not good for man, but is an herb for bruises and all sick cattle, to be used with judgment and skill.

9 And again, hot drinks are not for the body or belly.

Tobacco when used as an herb, meaning making a wash or poultice out of it and using it on CATTLE, HORSES, GOATS, ANIMALS is using it like Father intended it to be used.

Tea- Camellia sinensis is the tea plant, when the tea leaves are wetted, wrapped in gauze and applied to a burn it will reduce the pain of the burn and help it to heal faster and with out scarring. I know - when I was 6 years old I put my right hand on the electric burner of the stove just as it went from red to black. The burner was of course still hot- hot enough to burn my hand seriously. My family was extremely poor, and my Mother was pretty well versed in health remedies. She took some green tea, tied it up in some cheese cloth, wetted it with hot water, let it cool enough not to hurt me, and had me hold it in the palm of my hand. Then we put a cotton glove over my hand to hold everything in place. I couldn't use my hand for several weeks. Had to be fed, bathed etc. I have a tiny little scar from that burn on my hand. I have also used steeped tea (green, black, orange pekoe doesn't matter just as long as it is tea)in a bag on my eyes. At the job where I worked someone had used way too much bleach to clean the floors and my eyes got burned from the fumes. I used the steeped tea bags as a poultice on my eyes.

The nicotene derived from the tobacco plant used to be used to euthanize animales. It is injected into the animal and it kills them. I know that my father used steeped tobacco on our dog- he had gotten into something and Dad put the pulpy mess on the dogs skin. I was pretty little at the time, but I remember my (non-member) Uncles saying that at least they could smoke up the rest of the Medicine that Dad didn't use. It wouldn't go to waste or get stale.

As for the medical field touting Green Tea as the miracle cure- Man once touted laudenum as the miracle medicine, and cocaine, and the drinkning of alcohol.

As for me, I will stick to what my Heavenly Father has commanded of me. -see D & C 89

[Guest Iggy]

Yeah, a cup of green tea helps to settle your tummy when you're feeling a mite puny. So will a glass of cola with the fizz shaken out.

Have a cup, get a good afternoon sleep and post here in the evening.

Chamomile is better than green tea and ginger is the best of all. Take fresh ginger root, scrape some into a cup, add hot water and if you like add a little honey. Drink. You can also drink ginger ale. Open it up, let it go flat - no carbonation- drink. Or heat it up a bit to get rid of the carbonation.

Also Peppermint is just as good a chamomile. Take about 6 peppermint leaves, pour boiling hot water over them and let steep for not more than 5 minutes, remove the leaves and drink the water. Again you can sweeten it a bit with honey. Add a little lemon too if you like.

*edited for spelling errors.

[DrewM]

Tea- Camellia sinensis is the tea plant, when the tea leaves are wetted, wrapped in gauze and applied to a burn it will reduce the pain of the burn and help it to heal faster and with out scarring. I know - when I was 6 years old I put my right hand on the electric burner of the stove just as it went from red to black. The burner was of course still hot- hot enough to burn my hand seriously. My family was extremely poor, and my Mother was pretty well versed in health remedies. She took some green tea, tied it up in some cheese cloth, wetted it with hot water, let it cool enough not to hurt me, and had me hold it in the palm of my hand. Then we put a cotton glove over my hand to hold everything in place. I couldn't use my hand for several weeks. Had to be fed, bathed etc. I have a tiny little scar from that burn on my hand. I have also used steeped tea (green, black, orange pekoe doesn't matter just as long as it is tea)in a bag on my eyes. At the job where I worked someone had used way too much bleach to clean the floors and my eyes got burned from the fumes. I used the steeped tea bags as a poultice on my eyes.

OUCH!!! That must have really hurt! Thanks for the information.

[Guest Iggy]

OUCH!!! That must have really hurt! Thanks for the information.

Yeah it did. So much so that by the time I got into Jr High and had to take Home Ec and cook on a stove, I refused to do it.

Mom and Dad had to really work hard with me to help me overcome that fear. To this day ( I am now 55 yrs old) I will not 'test' a stove top, pan, skillet, electric skillet or iron with my finger. I have a small metal spray bottle filled with tap water and I will spritz water on the surface and listen to the sizzle!

Another thing that I have found that works great for burns- such as cigar or cigarette burns (had a date who put his cigar out on my wrist! Yeah I dumped him and then sicked my Uncle the cop on him) I took his bottle of beer and poured it on the burn. (this was in my very inactive years by the way) I called my Uncle at the precinct, he sent a cruiser for me and then they took me to the ER. The ER Dr cleaned up the burn and put a salve on it, he said that the beer kept the pain at bay. I don't even have a scar from that one.

For Sunburns, sponge the burn with vinegar- straight apple cider vinegar - then take a cool or tepid shower. Wash very gently with a mild bath soap and gently towel dry. If you have it, apply moisturizer. I am very fair skinned and I burn extremely easy- I have used this treatment all my life and the vinegar takes the hurt of the burn away. You will need moisturizer on the burned area so go with one that is real low in perfume.

Oh, guess I really derailed this topic!

[Connolly]

Green tea and black tea are the exact same plant. The leaves are quick dried for green tea and slow dried for black tea, allowing them to oxidize as they dry.

That said, the final decision is up to you. This church heavily emphasizes following the spirit. If the green tea contains therapeutic elements which help you and that is the real reason for its consumption then there really isn't a WoW violation in there. If it still troubles you then seek an alternative. Let the spirit be your guide.

[Guest AutumnBreez]

The only human's whose opinions on the green tea thing is relevant is that of your current bishop and your stake president.

What you need to do is prayerfully consider the scriptures and writing s of the prophets concerning green tea,and the word of wisdom, and then determine in your heart whether it is acceptable to God in your circumstances. If when you pray about having made that decision, you receive spiritual confirmation that you can continue to drink green tea and answer the question "Do you keep the Word of Wisdom?" in the affirmative honestly, then you don't have a temple recommend problem.

If you do not receive spiritual confirmation that your use of green tea is consistent with keeping the Word of Wisdom, you'll want to ask your doctor what else would provide the benefits of green tea that the doctor wants you to have, so that you do not have to use green tea.

I say look for an alternative. Arthritis- hottub may feel great, but doctor may write a prescription for Marajuana. It seems too easy to justify a earthly doctors orders. I say ask the real Doctor- Heavenly Father.

What do you need from Green Tea exactly? Blueberries have antioxidants. Fish oil contains Omega 3- good for many ailments, blood pressure, arthritis, even Attention Def. Dis. (ADD).

Weightloss? other ways than just tea.

I don't know if someday tea and/or coffee will be highly contaminated (pesticides to terrorism) or other to make it unfit for anyone, but we are given warnings to obey. We don't nor did others during Abraham's time know all the whys, but they were given instruction for a purpose:

1. to obey the word of God (discipline)

2. keep them/us from potential harm

Best regards- AutumnBreez

[sgallan]

I say ask the real Doctor- Heavenly Father.

Okay, say I have cancer and it has spread to the lymph nodes. My doctor says I should do radiation and chemo and I have about a 70% chance to live. So I pray about it, and my answer is "I don't need those things to survive".

What is your opinion on this senario? What would be your opinion on this same senario if it were your child who was diagnosed with the same sort of thing, and the answer to your prayer was, "forgo the radiation and chemo"?

Just curious as to how far you would take this religious edict. It has come up before and even made the national news.

[Moksha]

I just ran across this post by Bill at Beliefnet, and I thought I would share it:

Mormons scoff at Christian Fundamentalists who read the Bible literally, even when it produces absurd results. Yet, without realizing it, many Mormons read Mormon scriptures literally, even when doing so produces absurd results. In the case of the Word of Wisdom, the hermeneutics are all over the place.

1. The Word of Wisdom expressly states that it is "not given by commandment." Yet, it is commonly interpreted as a commandment, the violation of which is some kind of sin.

2. The Word of Wisdom does not say "coffee and tea." It warns about "hot drinks." Literally, that would include hot lemonade, hot tea, hot coffee, hot chocolate, warm milk or even hot, boiling, water. It has since become a Mormon interpretation that "Hot drinks means coffee and tea."

3. The Word of Wisdom goes through another loop when one is confronted with iced tea and iced coffee, neither of which could be considered "hot drinks." The typical response is that they, too, are a violation of the Word of Wisdom because - coffee and tea being what was meant by "hot drinks" - such beverages are verboten regardless of the beverage's actual temperature.

4. Having banned all "hot drinks" - including the cold ones - one would think that coffee and tea are absolutely off the table, but that would be wrong. When confronted by "decaf" versions of coffee and tea, a sizable number of Mormons imbibe and are not penalized for doing so. The rationale is that caffeine, which is common to both drinks, is the culprit fingered by the Word of Wisdom.

5. Ah, but the plot thickens again. If caffeine is the culprit, then Mormons should not be able to drink cola drinks or eat chocolate. In fact, a number of Mormons don't consume either, nor does BYU carry colas (though it does carry chocolate). But no - this is not an official violation of the Word of Wisdom. Instead, it is left up to each person to decide for himself or herself. People are told to follow the Spirit but the Spirit apparently tells different people different things -- and there is no way to enforce what the Spirit says.

In the end, the Word of Wisdom is subject to a hermeneutic (interpretive rule) that is impossibly crooked. People are not commanded, though failure to obey is cause for the loss of a temple recommend. And the rule they are to follow is to refuse "hot drinks," but only if those "hot drinks" are coffee and tea (as opposed to hot chocolate, hot cider and hot lemonade). Furthermore, coffee and tea are wrong, unless they're decaf, because caffeine is really the culprit. However, other caffeinated products, including colas and chocolate, are up to the individual consumer.

In the meantime, nobody ever loses a temple recommend for not eating meat "sparingly." Nobody loses a recommend for endangering their health with poor sleeping habits, foods high in fat, foods high in sugar, or "herbal supplements" - many of which are hustled by companies operating in Utah.

And yet, so much of this mess could be avoided if people read the Word of Wisdom with the same hermeneutics they use to decipher so many passages in the Old and New Testament. Nobody takes Jesus literally when he speaks of cutting off the offending hand or gouging out the offending eye. They choose to read the Sermon on the Mount with a modicum of intelligence. So why not do the same for the Word of Wisdom?

The Church does not have bishops and stake presidents splitting hairs in temple recommend interviews. Applicants are simply asked whether they obey the Word of Wisdom. What's more, the spirit of the Word of Wisdom is simply this: Take care of your body, because physical health affects spiritual health. A person following the broader outlines would get plenty of rest, eat well, avoid foods and other products that harm the body and try to live a stress-free life. He or she would also regularly exercise, brush their teeth and see a doctor periodically to pursue preventative medicine.

Compared to this broader perspective, the other view - which engages in a legalistic dispute over what items to throw in and what items to toss out - comes off as petty and incomplete.

That said, I always look at the fine print whenever I hear what a health boon coffee and tea are supposed to be. Chocolate, for example, has been hailed for its antioxidants, but 90% of chocolate contains relatively few of the stuff. To get those high antioxidants, you have to consume dark chocolate, the kind that taste like a dog's butt. With all health claims, especially the ones found in studies funded by interest groups and published outside of peer-reviewed journals, it pays to read the fine print. Remember when they said that beer and wine were good for you? Read the fine print. You have to consume the right products and in the right quantities.

Even so, anything that improves health cannot be a violation of the Word of Wisdom. But all people - Mormons and non-Mormons alike - should consider the likely effects of their dietary habits.

[Elgama]

I say ask the real Doctor- Heavenly Father.

Okay, say I have cancer and it has spread to the lymph nodes. My doctor says I should do radiation and chemo and I have about a 70% chance to live. So I pray about it, and my answer is "I don't need those things to survive".

What is your opinion on this senario? What would be your opinion on this same senario if it were your child who was diagnosed with the same sort of thing, and the answer to your prayer was, "forgo the radiation and chemo"?

Just curious as to how far you would take this religious edict. It has come up before and even made the national news.

I'd pray about it still as Heavenly Father knows best in all cases - you may have a 70% of living but you also have a 30% of dying, He knows which. Radiation and Chemotherapy are not pleasent and are poisons, my Auntie had a 70/30 chance - she died within 13 weeks of her diagnosis very painfully and sick in hospital - having being a nurse in the 1940s-60s she was very distressed with the state of the hospital and care she received, had she forgone the treatment she could have been cared for at home by Macmillan nurse and her family and would have died much more comfortably.

At the end of his life my Father in Law made what in my opinion was the correct decision to reject the liver transplant - he had peripheral neuropathy and the transplant would have just restored him to a life of increasing pain and waiting for the transplant meant he did not get his last slice of lemon meringue pie again he died painfully in hospital when what he really wanted was to be comfortable at home had he had his blessing and made the decision earlier his last couple of weeks would have been much better.

Death is not the worst prognosis for an illness, I wish my illness had it as an option.

-Charley

[Elgama]

I just ran across this post by Bill at Beliefnet, and I thought I would share it:

just thought I would add the suggestion about sleep is not in D&C 89 its actually in 88 so if we are being literal its not part of the Word of Wisdom. I do have a strong testimony that steering clear of any hot drinks and meat is good for us, but its not doctrine lol/

-Charley