Tibetan sky burial.

[Fiannan]

YouTube - Sky Burial - Tibet

Interesting. I had no idea of such a practice actually surviving to the present day. The deceased is wrapped, given a funeral, and then three days later put on an alter, chopped up and fed to vultures. This would be quite fascinating to witness. I wonder how the Han Chinese react to this when they move there to take over and find this custom.

[Fiannan]

Wow, no commentary? I would find it a rather interesting ritual to view, that's for sure.

[Gwen]

i don't think i would like to view it, blah i don't like seeing deer that have been hit by cars consumed on the side of the road i can't imagine watching a person being consumed. however i would find it interesting to learn about the ppl who do it, why they carry on the custom, religious or other, etc.

i don't really know a lot about it, i can think of one religious reason it was done and can actually think of a couple non religious reasons a ppl might do this. i can also think of a few hazards to doing it. i must admit i didn't know it was still around.

[Fiannan]

i don't think i would like to view it, blah i don't like seeing deer that have been hit by cars consumed on the side of the road i can't imagine watching a person being consumed. however i would find it interesting to learn about the ppl who do it, why they carry on the custom, religious or other, etc.

i don't really know a lot about it, i can think of one religious reason it was done and can actually think of a couple non religious reasons a ppl might do this. i can also think of a few hazards to doing it. i must admit i didn't know it was still around.

I was speaking to a Tibetan today but I did not have a chance to ask him about this. I think I will wait until I get there next week to see how this all operates.

[Moksha]

YouTube - Sky Burial - Tibet

chopped up and fed to vultures.

This might be taking a Taste of Cultures a bit too literally. Still, ashes to ashes....

[WillowTheWhisp]

It's probably a very practical way of dealing with death but I don't think I'd like to watch either.

[pam]

Why not use this forum to provide information on more positive cultural things instead of something (though it happens)that provides such a horrid image and thought process?

[Fiannan]

Why not use this forum to provide information on more positive cultural things instead of something (though it happens)that provides such a horrid image and thought process?

Actually, is it really that negative? Their religion believes that once the soul leaves the body then the body should be returned to nature. Personally, I find that actually appealing in a sense. Some Indian tribes on the plains would put the body on a platform and allow nature to take its course. I think that is kinda cool.

Once I stay in Tibet I'll share other aspects of the culture. I'm sure there are some interesting things I'l be able to pass along.:)

[SanctitasDeo]

This is very close to a Zoroastrian practice, by the way. They believed that fire and the earth were sacred to God, so neither burial nor cremation were options. They built tower upon which the dead were put, where Nature 'took it's course.'

It isn't exactly pleasant to think about I suppose (funeral rituals rarely are), but the reasoning behind the various practices is fascinating, I think. Kind of like Aztec religion. The actual practices were grotesque, but their reasons hint (to me, anyway) at something that might have been quite good and noble once upon a long time ago...

[SmilingRedhead]

I had never heard of this before so found it quite interesting.

[Gwen]

i wonder what they would think of our rituals of burial? for a ppl so intune with the desire for things to be natural and for things to be taken care of naturaly they must find our embalming process horrid. then we encase them in caskits that are more weather proof and insolated than most homes. i'm sure if you participated in the ins and outs of our process it would be no more appealing of an image than that of the "natural way". it is a reality of this life. doesn't mean i like the scriptures all that much that talk of the worms etc eating the flesh, etc.

i've never heard the stuff about fire and earth being sacred so those being out. that's cool. the reason i had heard (don't know which religion/culture it was) had to do with heaven being in the sky, the birds carried you home to heaven so to speak. i could see in areas where land is very limited you might need it for farming not for burial. so finding another option rather than taking up your land (or if the land is to wet for that kind of thing) it being very practical. i do wonder about desise though. there seems to be a lot of concern of birds carrying deises and such anyway, if the person died from some illness, could that facilitate an outbreak?

[Fiannan]

Actually, from what I understand vultures are immune to just about any microbe or parasite and their stomach acids are the most powerful of any vertebrate species.

I have to agree with you on the burial process. I remember watching a sci-fi horror moview once where they did an embalming on a body and it was really quite disturbing at the time. I know one of the big reasons for embalming becoming popular 100 yeras ago was due to the incredible fear of being buried alive -- no chance if you have been embalmed.

The rear was so great that many people had tubes into their coffins with a strong attached to a bell that was above ground. A person would have the job to sit in the graveyard (even at night) and listen in case a bell was rung by a person who had been buried alive. That is where the term "graveyard shift" came about.

[Aelswyth]

YouTube - Sky Burial - Tibet

Interesting. I had no idea of such a practice actually surviving to the present day. The deceased is wrapped, given a funeral, and then three days later put on an alter, chopped up and fed to vultures. This would be quite fascinating to witness. I wonder how the Han Chinese react to this when they move there to take over and find this custom.

The Zoroastrians (from whence came the three wise men) practice, or used to practice, this kind of thing. The body was put on the top of a tower and left for the carrion birds. They are known in English as "Towers of Silence". The reason behind it is the law laid out in the Avesta, which states that the corpse in unclean and should not pollute either earth, water or fire; so it is instead exposed to sun and birds on the tower until the bones are clean and bleached (which can take up to a year). The bones are then placed in an ossuary with lime until they disintegrate. The remains mix with run-off rainwater and go through a series of sand and coal filters before being washed out to sea.

It is not practiced now by Iranian Zoroastrians, since the Islamic government outlawed it in the 1970s. But it is still practiced to this day by the Zoroastrian community in India, the Parsi, and is considered one's final act of charity, by providing the birds with what would otherwise be destroyed.

I think the Tibetan sky burial may have come from early nomadic Zoroastrians who remained on the steppes instead of settling in Persia, and ended up in India and Tibet. The one difference that has developed is that the Tibetans chop the corpse up; this is not done by the Zoroastrians.

[Aelswyth]

Actually, from what I understand vultures are immune to just about any microbe or parasite and their stomach acids are the most powerful of any vertebrate species.

I have to agree with you on the burial process. I remember watching a sci-fi horror moview once where they did an embalming on a body and it was really quite disturbing at the time. I know one of the big reasons for embalming becoming popular 100 yeras ago was due to the incredible fear of being buried alive -- no chance if you have been embalmed.

The rear was so great that many people had tubes into their coffins with a strong attached to a bell that was above ground. A person would have the job to sit in the graveyard (even at night) and listen in case a bell was rung by a person who had been buried alive. That is where the term "graveyard shift" came about.

I think the whole embalming thing stems from the same reason the Egyptians mummified their corpses: a very literalistic belief in physical resurrection. Same reason why burial was considered preferable to cremation in the West for such a long time; how can the body be resurrected when it's disintegrated into ashes? Of course, now we know that even in burial the body will eventually disintegrate, so the resurrection must be accomplished by means unknown to us at this time. But the practice remains, even though we know it's unnecessary (or at least we hope!). :)

[Moksha]

I was just thinking of the contrast between this sky burial and the ancient Mormon practice of placing their deceased warriors in a longship and letting it glide on fire from the fjords of the Great Salt Lake. The rest of the Mormon participants would blow a note of passing from one of the horns on their helmets and perhaps give a wife or two a squeeze.

Nowadays, the EPA would frown on this practice for disturbing the brine shrimp.

[SanctitasDeo]

I think that EPA would also rather dislike the pollution resulting from the many casseroles placed alongside the deceased.

[Moksha]

I think that EPA would also rather dislike the pollution resulting from the many casseroles placed alongside the deceased.

There would be an addendum to their report however, noting that there is always room for Jell-O.

[Fiannan]

Okay, a couple of days ago I was invited to witness the ceremony by one of the head official monks in one of the holiest monestary sites in Tibet. However, new regulations prohibit outsiders from viewing the actual feeding of the vultures. I was able to visit the alters as well as view the entire ceremony where the monks bless the dead bodies as well as foods and other objects at the same time. Quite an interesting experience and one in which very few westerners have had the opportunity to view first hand.

[MorningStar]

I think all methods of burial are disturbing because death is disturbing. I'm just grateful that it's not permanent and that we'll be resurrected! :)

[pam]

Fiannan are you still in Tibet? I'm reading on the news about all the violence and protests going on there right now. Just wanted to see if you are okay.

[Fiannan]

Thanks Pam. I am home now. I'll address the riots in general discussiom.

[Canuck Mormon]

Good to hear you're home and safe.