Brandon Sanderson goes full woke and betrays gospel values?

[LDSGator]

11 minutes ago, mirkwood said:

There is an "audit" of the faculty.  Those not supporting and sustaining church standards are likely going to find themselves unemployed.  Per the news I have read on the topic.  

It’s good for both sides. Those who disagree with the church policies can find other jobs where they’ll be more free to express themselves. The church can tighten the ship and employ who they want to employ. Both sides win. 

[LDSGator]

5 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

Black advances his knight to put white's king in check.

I played chess in high school. I once came in dead last out of 16 people tournament. 

[zil2]

4 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

Those who disagree with the church policies can find other jobs where they’ll be more free to express themselves.

Some folks are claiming, "not really."  In other words, they're saying that some of these folks are at BYU, riding on their Church membership, because other universities wouldn't hire them (their credentials are not impressive enough on their own to land a university position).

[NeuroTypical]

3 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

I played chess in high school. I once came in dead last out of 16 people tournament. 

The world is comprised of two types of people:

- People who I can easily beat at chess every time, without even trying. (Mostly children, the mentally feeble, and people who don't know how to play chess.)

- People who will always beat me at chess, every time, without exception. (Anyone who knows how to play chess.)

[The Folk Prophet]

6 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

The world is comprised of two types of people:

- People who I can easily beat at chess every time, without even trying. (Mostly children, the mentally feeble, and people who don't know how to play chess.)

- People who will always beat me at chess, every time, without exception. (Anyone who knows how to play chess.)

Ditto!

I think I'm smart enough to be good at chess...if it wasn't for the darned A.D.D. attention span lack of patience impulsivity things.

In other words...if I wasn't me, I'd be awesome at chess!! I know it!

[LDSGator]

4 minutes ago, zil2 said:

Some folks are claiming, "not really."  In other words, they're saying that some of these folks are at BYU, riding on their Church membership, because other universities wouldn't hire them (their credentials are not impressive enough on their own to land a university position).

When everything else fails, I can teach at BYU! Hold on, I need to call my bishop. 😉 

 

So, awkward, unpopular question-What does that say about BYU? Are their teaching standards so sub par that they are a last resort, “we will hire anyone to teach” kind of school? 

6 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

The world is comprised of two types of people:

- People who I can easily beat at chess every time, without even trying. (Mostly children, the mentally feeble, and people who don't know how to play chess.)

- People who will always beat me at chess, every time, without exception. (Anyone who knows how to play chess.)

Welcome to my world in Taekwando. I can totally destroy that blind guy with one leg. 

[Vort]

23 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

I played chess in high school. I once came in dead last out of 16 people tournament. 

I remember reading about a supposed chess prodigy whose mother staged an event where he played something like 16 people simultaneously. The poor kid lost every match but one, the one being a forfeit when the opponent got tired of waiting for him and left. People got a good laugh out of that, but I felt bad for the kid.

Edited January 14 by Vort

[Carborendum]

7 minutes ago, zil2 said:

Some folks are claiming, "not really."  In other words, they're saying that some of these folks are at BYU, riding on their Church membership, because other universities wouldn't hire them (their credentials are not impressive enough on their own to land a university position).

So... we ought to keep them in the faculty because they are so unqualified that they can't find a job?

[Vort]

8 minutes ago, zil2 said:

Some folks are claiming, "not really."  In other words, they're saying that some of these folks are at BYU, riding on their Church membership, because other universities wouldn't hire them (their credentials are not impressive enough on their own to land a university position).

Which raises the question: Why does BYU offer them employment? I guarantee you that for every teaching position at BYU, there are three well-qualified individuals among the faithful membership of the Church.

[Carborendum]

8 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

The world is comprised of two types of people:

- People who I can easily beat at chess every time, without even trying. (Mostly children, the mentally feeble, and people who don't know how to play chess.)

- People who will always beat me at chess, every time, without exception. (Anyone who knows how to play chess.)

I used to think I was good at chess.  Then I actually played the game.  I don't think I'm good at chess.

[LDSGator]

2 minutes ago, Vort said:

I remember reading about a supposed chess prodigy whose mother staged an event where he played something like 16 people simultaneously. The poor kid lost every match but one, the one being a forfeit when the opponent got tired of waiting for him and left. People got a good laugh out of that, but I felt back for the kid.

Oh same. It’s grimly funny, but I feel bad for him too. Stage moms are a plague. 

[LDSGator]

4 minutes ago, Vort said:

Which raises the question: Why does BYU offer them employment? I guarantee you that for every teaching position at BYU, there are three well-qualified individuals among the faithful membership of the Church.

Is there a demand to teach there? Are people competing for the professor positions? 
 

BYU might be a great academic school. I know absolutely nothing about their academics. But from the “outside” it’s largely considered a religious school that only appeals to LDS. Again, nothing wrong with that. 

Edited January 14 by LDSGator

[Vort]

52 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

Ditto!

I think I'm smart enough to be good at chess...if it wasn't for the darned A.D.D. attention span lack of patience impulsivity things.

In other words...if I wasn't me, I'd be awesome at chess!! I know it!

Oh, I could climb the very highest Himalayas,
Be among the greatest-ever tennis players,
Win at chess or marry a princess or
Study hard and be an eminent professor.
I could be a millionaire,
Play the clarinet, travel everywhere,
Learn to cook, catch a crook,
Win a war, then write a book about it.
I could paint a Mona Lisa,
I could be another Caesar,
Compose an oratorio that was sublime.
Oh, the door's not shut on my genius, but
I just don't have the time.

Edited January 14 by Vort

[LDSGator]

BYU has to choose between becoming like Notre Dame or a religious school that actually takes their religion seriously. Notre Dame is CINO-no one there cares too much about the “Catholic” part of the university. BYU probably doesn’t want that. 

[zil2]

8 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

So, awkward, unpopular question-What does that say about BYU? Are their teaching standards so sub par that they are a last resort, “we will hire anyone to teach” kind of school? 

Yeah, I wondered the same thing.  Is it a case of "secret woke" hiring more "secret woke" regardless of credentials, or is it just someone making up insults to explain away how these folks came to be at BYU.  I don't know.

[zil2]

10 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

So... we ought to keep them in the faculty because they are so unqualified that they can't find a job?

That was not my suggestion.  My suggestion was that maybe they won't be able to find another job.  Their problem and no one else's as far as I'm concerned.

Edited January 14 by zil2

[zil2]

9 minutes ago, Vort said:

Which raises the question: Why does BYU offer them employment? I guarantee you that for every teaching position at BYU, there are three well-qualified individuals among the faithful membership of the Church.

Exactly.  See my conspiracy theory answer to Gator.  I have no idea, nor do I have any idea why the person making the claim was making the claim.  I'm just helping the interwebs to get its daily dose of unfounded nonsense.

[Vort]

On 1/14/2025 at 11:10 AM, LDSGator said:

Is there a demand to teach there? Are people competing for the professor positions? 
 

BYU might be a great academic school. I know absolutely nothing about their academics. But from the “outside” it’s largely considered a religious school that only appeals to LDS. Again, nothing wrong with that. 

BYU positions are very competitive. When we were in grad school, BYU tried to recruit Sister Vort to join the Department of French as an associate professor. (We were tempted, but we ended up going a different direction. Basically, Sister Vort had decided to put aside her career aspirations to stay at home with our children.)

BYU positions are highly coveted among Church members. There are plenty of people who would gladly take a professorial position at BYU, even if it meant a pay cut.

Edited January 16 by Vort

[Carborendum]

3 minutes ago, zil2 said:

That was not my suggestion. 

Yes, I understood that.  My emoticon was aimed at the people you were referring to.

[LDSGator]

4 minutes ago, zil2 said:

Yeah, I wondered the same thing.  Is it a case of "secret woke" hiring more "secret woke" regardless of credentials, or is it just someone making up insults to explain away how these folks came to be at BYU.  I don't know.

Beats me. I feel sorry for all parties involved. I don’t understand professors who apply there and have no interest in holding up BYU values. But, on the other side of the coin, if they can’t find someone who has proper credentials and a publishing record who wants to teach there, that’s a red flag too

[Carborendum]

6 minutes ago, zil2 said:

Yeah, I wondered the same thing.  Is it a case of "secret woke" hiring more "secret woke" regardless of credentials, or is it just someone making up insults to explain away how these folks came to be at BYU.  I don't know.

I recall that the BYU President that was hired some time ago raised some eyebrows.  They weren't sure if he was going to do exactly as you indicate here or not.

[LDSGator]

4 minutes ago, Vort said:

BYU positions are very competitive. When we were in grad school, BYU tried very hard to recruit Sister Vort. We were tempted, but we ended up going a different direction. Basically, Sister Vort had decided to put aside her career aspirations to stay at home with our children. But the point is that BYU positions are highly coveted among Church members. There are plenty of people who would gladly take a professorial position at BYU, even if it meant a pay cut.

A lot of colleges are like that down here too. 

[zil2]

4 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

I don’t understand professors who apply there and have no interest in holding up BYU values.

Like Sanderson, they want to change it from within.

ETA: Woke figured out a long time ago that it's easier to indoctrinate children than to pass laws or change the views of adults.

Edited January 14 by zil2

[LDSGator]

13 minutes ago, zil2 said:

Like Sanderson, they want to change it from within.

Absolutely true. But BYU is hardly blameless. It’s pretty cool to have a best selling fantasy writer on your staff and it will certainly draw students and attention. And money. 
 

Edited January 14 by LDSGator

[Vort]

1 minute ago, LDSGator said:

Absolutely true. But BYU is hardly blameless. It’s pretty cool to have a best selling fantasy writer on your staff and will certainly draw students and attention. 

Yep. BYU has always struggled with balancing doctrinal fidelity with worldly recognition and acclaim. I do not blame the institution for this; it's kind of all rolled up in that ball of wax. If you're going to offer a university that grants recognized degrees, I don't see how you avoid the issue. But it has always been a problem, and it highlights the absolute need for the school's top administration to be first and foremost faithful Latter-day Saints who love the gospel.