Is this true?


Solace
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Just curious, I have no doubt that God exists, that there are prophets of God in this world. I believe that those prophets with God’s authority are the leadership of the LDS church. I believe that the Book of Mormon is true scripture along with the bible. But I’m confused. This probably doesn’t make sense, let me explain more.

I work in a hospital. Few people at my work are active in the LDS church. Lots are less-active and very few are not members. Every single person who is less-active has stories upon stories about how they feel that Mormons are prideful, hypocritical and full of themselves, etc. They feel like people of the church look down on them because they are not of the so called “elite” of the church meaning that they don’t attend the temple every month, go to relief society activities, do all of their visiting teaching every month, etc (this is when they where active member of course).

One part of one person’s story goes something like this. She just moved to Utah and throughout the week introduced herself to the neighbors. Not all, but quite a few of them asked her if she was Mormon before they started their conversation. She found this strange but didn’t think much of it. Then her neighbor across the street told her something very strange. The neighbor said to her that she seemed to her that she was either not LDS or from out of state. This outright shocked my co-worker. She asked her neighbor why she thought this. The neighbor said that my co-worker first words were not about saving her from hell and that she was talking to her even though she wasn't LDS about life. Then the neighbor thanked my co-worker for this.

Am I making sense? I’m not easily offended and personally don’t see this around me. Most people at my work have gone less-active because of this so-called behavior of the members of this church. Some people on my home teaching list avoid me like a plague, so maybe they think the same about me. This seems very sad to me.

I don’t know…am I making sense? Anyone understand what I’m asking and trying to say, though probably not very well? Do we drive people away because of the way we act and not even realize it?

The only thing that I can think of about this subject that comes close is that every single LDS girl treats me like I’m not worthy to be her friend cause for some reason I find it hard to talk to her, not too confident in myself, etc. (I know, that probably doesn’t make sense, but if you knew me, you would understand), but the girls that I know who are not LDS don't feel this way. But then again, maybe I’m seeing more into it than there is there.

Am I making sense? Please let me know what you think. Are we really that rude as a whole?

This must be somewhat true for people do feel this way about us, but is it so widespread? I don't know, I'm not too sure that I should have asked this. But I'm just curious.

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Only YOU can choose to be offended. No matter where we go, there are going to be social barriers. How do we break them down? We kill them with kindness. Jesus was both popular and unpopular, and so was Joseph Smith and Gordon B. Hinckley. Oh well, popularity isn't everything.

-a-train

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word up to that, a-train. This brings up an excellent point concerning the church. The church, the members and the truth are 3 separate points, or identities. There is truth. It is a self-existent principle which establishes law. The Church is here on this Earth to present and administer truth to the world.

This is where things get murky.

Members are not the church. Members are a group of individuals. Individuals with the right to choose. The choice to follow the church is to find the truth and live it. The more truth in your life the closer you are to the church and therefore to God. When people professing to be "Mormons" go around and do every manner of sin, they are not living the truth. Then those professing "Mormons" give the church a label when it shouldn't be. People will go and say, "Well I know this guy who is an active Mormon and he goes out and drinks every weekend, so that is what they believe." No. That is heresy(and hypocrisy) on the part of the "Mormon." That is why it is so important to live Christlike lives. So stand as witnesses of God at all times, in all things, and in all places.

To know the truth you go to revealed word which is, the Standard Works, the words of apostles and prophets, and, when comfortable, the words spoken by the Power of the Holy Ghost. I say comfortable, because there are times at church when I am too tired to listen carefully enough to receive it into my heart. You have to be wary, because members don't know all the truth. They might speak with good intentions but their words might have inaccuracies and false doctrines without them meaning to. Humans are not perfect. We all make mistakes.

I don't know if I came across clear. My point was:

The members of the church are NOT a representation of the Church. The Church is a representation of what the members OUGHT to be. The Church functions as the administrator of truth.

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If you really want to get technical, though, the only members of the true Church, in the truest sense, are the true followers of Christ. This means those living a Celestial Law. This Law is one that consists of living your life to glorify God. All your efforts, your faith and works, are not done for personal glory(Satan's plan) but for the glory of God.

Read the King Follett Discourse. The overall principle and message taught is we glorify God by progressing to exaltation. How is that done? By gaining knowledge and living in conformity to the truth to have more added light. How do we gain all knowledge, as God has all knowledge? Moroni 10:4-5

4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

5 And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things.

The key is REAL intent. Meaning when you receive the truth, YOU WILL DO WHAT IS REQUIRED, WITHOUT QUESTION, WITHOUT HESITANCE, WITHOUT PERSONAL DESIRE. The will of the Son was swallowed up in the will of the Father while He suffered the atonement. It is humility in the purest sense. Submission in all things to the will of the Father. We won't be perfect at it by any means, but we have to try. 2 Nephi 25:23

23 For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.

The more humble we become, the more truth can be bestowed. By the power of the Holy Ghost we may know the truth of ALL things. If we are 100% humble then we will gain ALL knowledge. That is God's law here. It is an eternal decree from the heavens established from before the foundation of the world. D&C 132:5

5 For all who will have a blessing at my hands shall abide the law which was appointed for that blessing, and the conditions thereof, as were instituted from before the foundation of the world.

There is the scripture "the first shall be last and the last will be first," referring to the humble. This is how it is brought to pass. We will not be perfect, that is why we have the atonement. The atonement makes up for our shortcomings but only if we abide the law given for the blessing.(2 Nephi 25:23,26,29)

So back to King Follett. You glorify God by gaining knowledge and living the truth to the best of your ability.(Dallin H. Oaks- good, better, best). If you won't become humble then you won't be able to gain knowledge and you won't be able to glorify God to your capacity, which is Celestial Law.

1 Nephi 13:37

37 And blessed are they who shall seek to bring forth my Zion at that day, for they shall have the gift and the power of the Holy Ghost; and if they endure unto the end they shall be lifted up at the last day, and shall be saved in the everlasting kingdom of the Lamb; and whoso shall publish peace, yea, tidings of great joy, how beautiful upon the mountains shall they be.

Read "my Zion" as my glory. Realized that two nights ago, actually. Those are the members of His kingdom, of His Church.

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I think Solace was looking for a simpler answer then all THAT!:D

I just moved to Utah going on 3 years ago, and so far have not encountered any of what you're talking about. Luckily. I've been visiting this state since I was a kid(lotsa relatives here), and always heard those kind of stories. And I knew people that had moved here, then moved right back(to Washington state) because of what they encountered.

I dunno. Maybe it's a region by region thing here. Maybe I lucked out and moved to a "friendly" area. Our ward was very warm from the start, with no apparent issues at all. It's a age-mixed ward, meaning there's a alot of young couples, as well as old timers that grew up here. So I imagine if I was going to encounter any issues, I would have by now.

I've talked to a few friends at work and asked them about this. One fella is from California, and not a member. I asked him point blank if he's had any prob's with self-righteous Mormons since moving here, and he said no, not at all. And he IS an overly sensitive guy. We have to be careful how we tease and joke around with him.

So, maybe it's alot in how sensative you want to be about it, or maybe you were unlucky enough to move into the middle of a bunch of LDS hypocrites. I know they're out there. I've encountered plenty of them outside Utah.

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I don't live in Utah but that is the type of thing that I hear about there in Utah.:D

I was just trying to make a distinction between individual choices and how they are separate from the church. I got the feeling that Solace might be connecting the actions of men with the Church, which is an institution. I wanted to help resolve any fears that might arise about the Church.(I just got a feeling that there might be.)

We learn of the truth independent of others. And so we live our lives independent of others. So no need to worry.

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The church membership is made up of people who are on lifes journey. As such, we are all in very places on our lifes trip. We are also all have different personalities and understandings. It follows then that some have not developed as far as others when it comes to practicing true "Charity" when it comes to their neighbors, acquaintances, or outsiders. On the other hand, many who are not living the way they know they beleive and should, sometimes resent having someone point it out or infere they are not. It is called guilt.

James 1:19 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath:

Mornoni 7:45 And charity suffereth long, and is kind, and envieth not, and is not puffed up, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil, and rejoiceth not in iniquity but rejoiceth in the truth, beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

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i agree with Thirdperson, the church is absolutely perfect in everyway, but the members are not. i have come across a few members in my life who have treated people badly based on what they believe, But i think that people from other faiths can be like this too. i dont think it is because they are lds, i think that it is just who they are, and they would act the same if they belonged to any other faith. I grew up in the church as did my little sisters, one of my little sisters had a best friend who told her that she wasn't lds enough! and stopped hanging out with her.

This devasted my sister, and i think that this event has influenced her in her decisions that she has made later on, to give up believing in the church. Just remember the church is perfect, and we all should be doing our best to reach out a hand of friendship to everyone, but sometimes this doesn't happen. hope that makes sense and helped at all!

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One part of one person’s story goes something like this. She just moved to Utah and throughout the week introduced herself to the neighbors. Not all, but quite a few of them asked her if she was Mormon before they started their conversation. She found this strange but didn’t think much of it.

Non-members in Utah frequently report that the first question they are asked is, "what religion are you"? I have been asked this on numerous occasions myself in Utah. I think this is a Utah cultural thing. When I lived in California, I never got asked that question. I suspect it would not have been considered polite.

Another lament non-members have is that once they are asked the question and seem unamenable to missionary efforts, then they claim they are on the pariah list.

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It is a downright shame that anyone thinks that of members but I have to agree that many members are regular people-no better than anyone else. We should NEVER become over zealous, prideful or boastful about our religion as to make others fall away or reject this gospel. If we DO do that, then we don't really understand the gospel. Members in our church and even other religions are extremely imperfect, that's why we must strive everyday to become more humble and service oriented to ALL-to become a true follower of christ.

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