Bishop letting unworthy members keep recommends?

[NeuroTypical]

I once heard an apostle advise a group of Bishops on Temple Recommend interviews. The Apostle said if the Bishop suspected a member was lying in a TR interview, but didn't know for sure, the bishop should issue the TR unless the spirit said otherwise. He mentioned that the TRI was an opportunity for the member to account for their actions before the Lord, and the Lord would hold them accountable.

LM

[MorningStar]

I think people feel protective of the temple and don't want anyone to go in unworthily, but it's something we have to leave in Heavenly Father's hands. I was really bothered when my roommate went right after she admitted to sleeping with her boyfriend. In that case, I knew it wasn't a rumor because she told me herself, but I didn't say anything. Then she had several more encounters with a few boys, she kept telling me about it and I didn't want to hear it. I kept telling her to go to the bishop because it was stressing me out. Then she lied to me and said she did. One day when I was talking to him, he asked how my roommate situation was going and I said, "Better. I'm really glad (fill in her name) finally talked to you about her issues." He said, "What? She didn't talk to me." "What? She said she did." She actually came home and told me the bishop said it was OK because she was a convert and was trying to overcome old habits. He said, "No, I would never say that." Ugh. Then he wanted to call her in because she was trying to get an endorsement to go to BYU. He asked the Stake President what to do and he said, "If she gets in, she has her reward." You just have to let people lie and deal with the consequences later when it comes to this stuff, I guess. Although I would say something if someone had done something to me personally, say, if someone's husband in the ward made a pass at me, I would tell the bishop because I would have first hand knowledge.

[Misshalfway]

I think people feel protective of the temple and don't want anyone to go in unworthily, but it's something we have to leave in Heavenly Father's hands. I was really bothered when my roommate went right after she admitted to sleeping with her boyfriend. In that case, I knew it wasn't a rumor because she told me herself, but I didn't say anything. Then she had several more encounters with a few boys, she kept telling me about it and I didn't want to hear it. I kept telling her to go to the bishop because it was stressing me out. Then she lied to me and said she did. One day when I was talking to him, he asked how my roommate situation was going and I said, "Better. I'm really glad (fill in her name) finally talked to you about her issues." He said, "What? She didn't talk to me." "What? She said she did." She actually came home and told me the bishop said it was OK because she was a convert and was trying to overcome old habits. He said, "No, I would never say that." Ugh. Then he wanted to call her in because she was trying to get an endorsement to go to BYU. He asked the Stake President what to do and he said, "If she gets in, she has her reward." You just have to let people lie and deal with the consequences later when it comes to this stuff, I guess. Although I would say something if someone had done something to me personally, say, if someone's husband in the ward made a pass at me, I would tell the bishop because I would have first hand knowledge.

This is called staying out of peoples business.

[jadams_4040]

is there any way i can bring out into the open, or go above my ward bishops head in a matter of a recommend? the reason why i ask is our ward bishop is a good bishop, besides the fact that when it comes to the topic of Temple Recommends and a certain female member in our church, he feels that if he removes her recommend he will "loose a member of his flock" but myself and others know this woman wears her garments but STILL has sexual relations and she isn't married, and i also think she drinks (not too sure on this one though). so is there anything I can do to go over the bishops head, because after being told all this by many members, his only reply is "I'm not sure how reliable those statements are."

Its not our place to judge or try and go over a bishops head to achieve our personal goals. And besides that, i honestly beleive "if" what you are claiming is true, {do we know for absolute fact?} I know our bishop yielded temple recomends to us when he knew for a fact that we were not completely worthy ,"{we honestly thought we were} but now after the fact, i know that the bishop knew we were not 100 percent. But God bless this bishop for trusting in and beleiving in us. He was right in doing so! what many and wonderfull blessings have come forth for many family members because of this bishops beleive in our motives and intentions!:)

[lilered]

In light of the following:

Persons cannot continue to engage in serious sin and remain members of the Church. And discipline can be given for encouraging sin by others. There are consequences for evil behavior.

In the same sermon in which he taught that men should not be “cast out,” the Savior commanded his servants that “ye shall not suffer any one knowingly to partake of my flesh and blood unworthily … ; therefore if ye know that a man is unworthy … ye shall forbid him” (3 Ne. 18:28–29).

The Savior also commanded, “But if he repent not he shall not be numbered among my people, that he may not destroy my people” (3 Ne. 18:31; see also Mosiah 26:36; Alma 5:56–61). Consequently, if transgressors do not respond to calls to repentance, the shepherds of the Church flock must take disciplinary action in fulfillment of their God-given responsibilities.

Then is it a sin to know a member has committed a serious sin and do nothing (not tell the Bishop)?

[HappyNIL]

I understand you are upset about this. But if you have no proof it is your word against hers, you get the man or the men to testify she did this or you have pictures or whatever else is tangible proof then take it to the bishop. You did your part by talking to the bishop.

[Moksha]

...our ability to conjure up anger is so utterly neutered by our hedonistic and non-judgmental society.

Where did this lack of anger and non-judgment come from anyway? It certainly wasn't in the Old Testament!!! Did something or someone intervene in the meantime?

those darn hedonists and their low spark of righteous anger!

[sixpacktr]

The thing to remember is that once you have told the Bishop, whether you witnessed the act or have strong reasons to believe that what you have heard is true, then your part is DONE. After that it is between the Bishop, the person in question, and the Lord. Too often people think that they need to be kept 'updated' on what is happening, and if nothing seems to be happening as they think it should, they themselves start gossiping about the Bishop, etc.

Remember, those that demand justice on others without mercy will themselves be judged in like manner...

[Palerider]

The thing to remember is that once you have told the Bishop, whether you witnessed the act or have strong reasons to believe that what you have heard is true, then your part is DONE. After that it is between the Bishop, the person in question, and the Lord. Too often people think that they need to be kept 'updated' on what is happening, and if nothing seems to be happening as they think it should, they themselves start gossiping about the Bishop, etc.

Remember, those that demand justice on others without mercy will themselves be judged in like manner...

you are right on with your remarks......all the poor Bishop can do is interview the person and if they don't fess up....you got nothing...

[Elgama]

you are right on with your remarks......all the poor Bishop can do is interview the person and if they don't fess up....you got nothing...

Plus we don't know what happened in the interview

-Charley

[Palerider]

Plus we don't know what happened in the interview

-Charley

ditto

[Hemidakota]

Actual, if the Bishop has the key of discernment, he will know. I been in interviews, where the person would say something that is not true, then I would come back and say no to the interviewer or you are not ready. Next line comes from the spirit, "Is there anything else you like to discuss?"

There was person I interviewed, sobbing with tears, I would of threw the book at but the spirit constrained me to tell that brother his sins are forgiven. What transpired and what the Savior thought about him was two different points. The Savior always wins...humor.

We just don't know the will of the Savior or the FATHER in some matters and need to rely on the spirit to convey it vice the book or manual.

Then we have councilors, who would intervene and convene as a Bishopric to discuss this issue. Through counseling and prayer, they would come to agreement.

We have to allow the spirit to make the final determination as it was with the Adulterer that was taken to the Lord.

[Jbs2763]

i might have said this already...but you need to mind your own &^$* business....alot of people leave the chruch to to busibodyness.....

[Palerider]

Actual, if the Bishop has the key of discernment, he will know. I been in interviews, where the person would say something that is not true, then I would come back and say no to the interviewer or you are not ready. Next line comes from the spirit, "Is there anything else you like to discuss?"

There was person I interviewed, sobbing with tears, I would of threw the book at but the spirit constrained me to tell that brother his sins are forgiven. What transpired and what the Savior thought about him was two different points. The Savior always wins...humor.

We just don't know the will of the Savior or the FATHER in some matters and need to rely on the spirit to convey it vice the book or manual.

Then we have councilors, who would intervene and convene as a Bishopric to discuss this issue. Through counseling and prayer, they would come to agreement.

We have to allow the spirit to make the final determination as it was with the Adulterer that was taken to the Lord.

even though what you said is true....all you can do is ask the question again and if they respond the same way....its pretty tough at that point.....

[Hemidakota]

Most people don't realize how important it is to remove the 'excessive baggage' [sins] from our shoulders. Move forward again and return back to the path.

The duty of a Branch President, Bishop, and Stake President is not to condemn the member but to ensure he/she has the every opportunity to receive all the benefits pertaining to the fullness of time. This group of men are there to support what ever they can for the membership.

[Palerider]

Most people don't realize how important it is to remove the 'excessive baggage' [sins] from our shoulders. Move forward again and return back to the path.

The duty of a Branch President, Bishop, and Stake President is not to condemn the member but to ensure he/she has the every opportunity to receive all the benefits pertaining to the fullness of time. This group of men are there to support what ever they can for the membership.

lets also not forget....if they stop attending church its his fault too....:)

[Hemidakota]

Do you mean, it was the Bishops fault, they stop attending church?

[Palerider]

Do you mean, it was the Bishops fault, they stop attending church?

I was joking.......but yes....the poor Bishop gets the blame for that....:)

[bcguy]

I don't like snickering. It landed me in a argument in the past because of the person that I turned in was told I was the only that reported him by the squadrons Sargent.

Anyway, In this case one member admitted she did not pay taxes on her paper route. Her husband obviously knows this as this is a tax issue. He has a calling and is doing speeches on a regular basis.

The next case was a woman who slept with her future husband before she was divorced from her former husband. It is rumor in our family that the kids have mentioned this. They are good people but do not know what to say.

I guess no one can be perfect but at least don't admit it and then smile about it. That would be from the person who does not pay there taxes.

[tiancum]

I say, tell the bishop if you know info first hand.

My friend had to turn in his dad when he found some horrible porn his dad was using...or whatever people do with porn.

Then, let the bishop take care of it. It is his stewardship, not ours.

As far as I understand it, if a person answers all the questions correctly, lying or not, they can't be denied a temple recommend. The sin is on their shoulders, not the bihsop's

[ruthiechan]

If it really bothers you, then talk to your Bishop, after that let it trouble you no more. I remember reading in the Miracle of Forgiveness about a gal who came into the Bishop told him her troubles in tears and then begged him not to take a way her temple recommend because it was the only place she could feel the Spirit.

[Getaclue]

My wife (extobe) is not worthy if her recommend either and she has her Bishop snowed but I fortunately am not AT ALL on the line for her actions so whoopdy-friggen-doo. If her Bishop knows something and is not doing his proper job then he will pay the price in the end. If she is attending the temple or wearing her garments unworthily... she will pay the price. One way or another the Lord has a way of balancing the spiritual books for everyone eventually. Focus on your own salvation and leave the treachery and debauchery to others judgment. "Vengence is mine" is a divine statement. I would never want to be accused of trying to judge anyones worthiness because mine sucks and I think I am a decent saint... Its her funeral...

Grant

are you serious you just judge your wife’s worthiness of having a temple recommend... maybe her life it up side down and she has made bad decision as of late but I'm 100% that it has to do with you. if my wife was molesting my children and addicted to porn I might just not be on the strait and narrow... your so going to pay for your transgressions in the end and I don't think the savor is going to hold your family very accountable for there actions since you have messed them up for life... kind of like we as parents are responsible to teach are children the correct way to live and if you fail to do so there sins are on our heads... I think raping your kids is not teaching them the right way of life.