EarthyAngel
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Posts posted by EarthyAngel
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kevin...i have read many statements here.....seems to me...you're not quite the outcast you were led to believe you are.....would like to know?......how do you feel about that?
Are you trying to make me feel better?Kevin, proud of being "one", and not "one of ninety-nine".
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I used to carry a deck of cards with me everywhere I went
Classifying Christian repentence and miracles as a form of magic is a very interesting idea... but it may ruffle some feathers on a site like this. Some people want nothing to do with any form of magic other than their own, regardless of whether it is effective and uplifting or not. It gets labelled as being "of the devil" and/or accused of destroying lives, just because it is outside of Christianity. I'm sure you know that already. So be careful how you say things around here.
Well, fortunately, your message got to me unedited in my email, due to the way subscribing to threads instantly sends replies out. I appreciate the warning.
I just think it's a matter of semantics. Jesus was accused of performing miracles by the power of the devil. So whether you call it magick or miracles, it's not what you call it that matters, but the power behind it, don't you think?
Kevin
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Yes, but I don't do 'practical' magick. I do enjoy learning about Hermeticsm and Alchemy, though. Have you read Jean Dubuis? He's the 'real deal', IMO.
I'm not familiar with his work. And, by the way, the best magick isn't "practical", meaning directed at manifesting into the material world that which you want or need for daily living. The best magick is that which transforms yourself. Repentance through the Grace of Christ is a form of this kind of transformational magick. Technically, it's from the school of magick called "Theurgy", which is magick by the power of Deity. The intent is our own, but the power is Divine. This is generally considered a "safe" form of magick, as it only works when in harmony with the will of the Divine entity one is calling upon. I know that LDS and other Christians prefer to refer to this as "miracles" rather than magick, but magick, by definition, is using one's intention and will (with faith) to change something in the manifest world. So miracles are a form of magick.
Jung inspires me. Only the shadow knows how much.
I don't use Tarot for anything but meditation. Definitely not into practical Kabbalah, though I'm not denying its potential. I'm concentrating on Temperance in particular, but I'm finding it difficult to keep focused. The subconscious/ conscious tension is revealing a watcher at the gate that I am unprepared to deal with at the present, I think. Patience is a virtue.... 
HiJolly
LOL @ "the shadow knows" (thinking of the radio drama). Many would say that the very best use of the Tarot is for meditation. When I read the Tarot for others, it is as a tool to initiate a discussion of an inner aspect of their soul (Jungian translation: "an archetype of the collective unconscious) that is needing to be heard or spoken to. It's a means that is often useful to help people access their inner realities (including shadow selves).
Thanks for this discussion, by the way. I find it surprisingly refreshing. You DO know that many LDS won't even touch a deck of playing cards, because they are based on the "satanic" tarot?
Kevin
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I was really surprised by your first post in my welcome thread. I thought you'd get the message and decide to be nice.
You're coming across as a very rude individual. Seeing as how this is my welcome thread, I'd appreciate it if you'd be nice to the people in it.
Don't be hard on him. He tripped over my Coyote.
Kevin
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What about gravity? That way we could float some more ideas. :)
Ugh! That went over like a lead balloon!
Kevin
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Welcome, Kevin. What an interesting intro and comments. I was born in the Church too, and am currently a definite heretic but not an apostate (except a few days ago when I declared I didn't believe in a literal global flood here on this site -- I've been trying to repent but now that I've brought it up again...
). I too love to study other religions/world traditions. I think the only one I couldn't really adapt to was Thelema. And even that has some truths. When I compare that Tarot deck to the Waite-Rider it provokes some interesting thought. And some of the shamanistic energies/entities seem toxic to me.
Anyway, I've been an active LDS all my life and am currently serving as both a general Church service missionary and a Ward missionary. And a Stake auditor (done! whew!). And a father of 9.
Mormon Mystic for a long while, Heretic, science fan and total nerd,
HiJolly
Thelema and the Golden Dawn are based mostly on Hermeticism, Alchemy, and the Keys of Solomon. In many esoteric traditions, Solomon was considered to be a great magician. Solomonaic magick is a major order of "high magick".
The Rider-Waite Tarot is strongly based on the Kabballah, which Joseph Smith studied, by the way. I read the Tarot. I'm told I'm pretty good. I also like the Tarot because it has strong links to Jungian Transpersonal Psychology.
Shamanism is healing work, first and foremost. It is a toolbox of many different tools from many different cultures. Every primitive culture has its shamen. We discount their wisdom at our peril.
Thanks for the welcome!
Kevin
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Hello Kevin,
WELCOME to LDS.NET, I hope you enjoy it here.
I can't remember when I read such a long thread from start to finish.... Oh and the things I learned.
Glad to have you here.:)
So glad I was able to provide some fertile ground for your growth and learning!
That's actually a very important part of my personal mission in life.
Thanks for the welcome!
Kevin
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Hi Kevin...
Just thought I'd drop a line....(or a few) I don't happen to know you, right???? hahahaha
You sound just like someone I really know; that description fits him perfectly!
I used to joke around with him saying that he had a major spiritual identity crisis...
Anyways... You seem to be an interesting person with a great sense of humor! I liked the way you "prepared" the territory; it reminded me of another person I know who calls himself an atheist and is known for "preparing" people... with his acute intellect and perceptions; he's a very nice person and very knowledgeable as well! I've had many interesting conversations with them... about their philosophies, ideas, and perceptions...
Anyways... be well and take care! Hope you enjoy!
Thanks for the welcome!
I must have a spiritual twin out there... though I'm WAY too much of a mystic to ever really give atheism a try.
Kevin
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Well, this IS an LDS site. Of COURSE there's a "judgement" in my post. I see it and I acknowledge it.
There's nothing wrong with "righteous judgements" as long as they are done in a tactful, agreeable, non-contentious way.
I validated your decisions through my (and probably other forum members) views. (No, I don't speak for the entire forum by ANY means.)
If you've found your path... wonderful!
But having daydreams (and telling us about it) about telling a disciplinary council about your "deeds" (whatever they are) isn't good no matter HOW you follow Christ. It's a spiritual opinion that I would hope that you share, not just a "Mormon" or "LDS" perspective.
It's kinda twisted. And I don't think it's good for the spiritual soul.
I think the purpose of this forum is to help everyone and anyone follow Christ and become closer to Him and our Father in Heaven. That includes our thoughts.
I don't think I'm coming off with a "holier than thou" attitude, but I'm sensing a smugness about you. You're coming here and there's a lot of posts and commotion since you began posting. I'm sure you're enjoying it. Is this a "judgement"? Maybe. Perhaps it's more of an observation.
I'm very good with my articulation, punctuation and spelling, so I hope you are sensing the right spirit and intention behind this post.
In case you forget, please read my signature.
Well, my daydreams are just that... daydreams from a part of me that is a bit mischievous. We all have a bit of that in us, don't we? A Trickster? A Coyote? I do know when to let my inner Coyote out, and when to keep it on a leash. Mythologically speaking, the Tricksters aren't there to be cruel, but to provide teaching opportunities. They stirred things up to help you learn a lesson. I let my Trickster out only when I perceive that there's some good to be achieved, and little risk involved.
I do apologize that I have apparently caused you some consternation, Skippy. You've been trying to be nice... I can plainly see that. And as far as "holier than thou"... no, I don't particularly think it's a particular fault of yours. I was merely trying to point out to you that your particular world-view of what is sin, and requiring of repentance, is perhaps only one of many ways of looking at things. If that idea didn't land on fertile ground with you, I'm okay with that.
One thing you'll learn about me, if you choose to get to know me, is that I'm less concerned about being right than I am about giving people new ideas to consider. The Book of Mormon talks about the law of opposition... that there's opposition in all things. Quantum theory, however, has taught me that there's more than "on" or "off". Sometimes, there's "on" AND "off" all at once. A "third way".
And yeah... I know I get kinda squirrelly that way.
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I'm going to say the obvious, just because it hasn't been said.
First WELCOME!
Second, I would agree with you that you SHOULDN'T go through this process.
The process you are describing is part of the process of repentance... and I can just tell by your posts, that you aren't repentant at this time.
That's okay! (Just not forever.) BUT, you do respect other people to not waste their time. I can only appreciate that.
Sometimes apathy is enough to just keep us where we are... until we feel compelled to move in A direction - either towards Christ or further away.
Again, welcome!
Now, you see... though you may not see it, there's inherent judgment in your response. You're right that I shouldn't go through this process, but not because I'm unrepentant. The way I see it, I have nothing to repent for... at least none of the things that I'd be confessing, anyway. The spirit of Christ is in me, to the extent that I am aware of my real sins... when I have lacked compassion for others; when I have acted selfishly for my own gain at the expense of another; when I have looked down upon others, convinced of my righteousness.
None of the things that would get me excommunicated are sins, in my estimation. In fact, some of those things I have done I am quite proud of, because they have deepened my sense of compassion and connection with other human beings.
I guess you could say that my definition of sin is much different now than when I was active LDS. I worry less about sin these days... I have chosen to stop eating from the Tree of Good and Evil... Instead, I choose to eat from the Tree of Life, which is the Tree of Love. When a people learns to put the principles of Compassion and Empathic Connection before their pharisaical checklist of Righteousness... they will begin to see Zion coalesce.
And I have chosen to move toward Christ... though it is not the path you expect.
Kevin
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Kevin,
I'm just curious... what line of work are you in?
The reason I ask is that you remind me of some people on a very good discussion board for my industry. (And yes, I consider them good people who do a lot of good for the work that they do.)
Spiritual line of work.
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Ummm can I answer that tomorrow when I've had some sleep? lol
Please do. ;-)
You can love or hate me as you choose just as well tomorrow as tonight.
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Who'd have thunk all because of an introduction. hahahaha
You see, it's all part of my Jedi mind tricks...
It starts with my genuine expectation that I will, by my virtue of being an apostate (and heretic) and somewhat proud of it, generate some hostility toward me.
So, instead of trying to sneak in here do it all quiet-like, I'd just start off by announcing my status as apostate (and heretic), and that I really do expect to be hated for that by some.
Because of that act, I have created some cognitive dissonance in some, who definitely do NOT want to think of themselves as capable of hating someone on that basis (or at all), and found a number of people ready and willing to jump to my defense... because Heaven forbid that my expectations should be true!
That said, now that I have revealed my diabolical plan to trick people into coming over to my side... do I now lose their support, and earn their hatred (because no one likes being tricked), or do they stick with me, further convinced of their need to convince me that I am not the subject of hatred, but rather of love and support... because don't we all want to be thought of (and think of ourselves) as loving and supportive people?
And now that I have thoroughly messed with everyone's heads, maybe I'll start seeing some authenticity from people, which is my REAL goal in the first place.
:-)
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Don't we already have humanitarian missions such as this?
A drop in the bucket by comparison.
If the LDS church had 50,000 volunteer humanitarian missionaries in the field, it would generate some real buzz (as well as a huge benefit to those in need).
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By all means report it fent. I am in agreement that moderators need to follow the same rules. And yes we have a system in place to monitor who uses it.
Good, because as the Internet itself has taught us... there's nothing like anonymity to bring out the abusive side of people.
I have a strong need for fairness and consistency, and a strong suspicion of those with blanket authority.
I believe in being authoritative, not authoritarian.
I already believe there's been an injustice done to me because I dared to disagree with one of the moderators, so please pardon me for being hyper-vigilant.
Kevin
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That's certainly a good product feature of Mormonism, and one that has only recently been adopted within the LDS protocol. I'm content for folks to follow their hearts and to follow truth wherever it takes them.
Any message of hope is incredibly attractive to the impoverished Latin American countries. The evangelical missionary movement in these countries is also very impressive. In some ways, those products are much more feature rich than their Mormon competition, both emotionally and 'spiritually' as it were.
I really enjoyed the humanitarian efforts we were able to contribute while I was on my mission to Mexico. Sadly, it just wasn't anywhere near as effective as the humanitarian efforts made by other religions with the same agenda.
If I were in a position to help coordinate the missionary efforts in those countries, I would certainly shift the focus toward humanitarian service, education, and quality of life (e.g. clean water, agricultural efficiency, disease prevention, etc.)
I concur...
Wouldn't it be wonderful if there were an LDS "Peace Corps"? Volunteer an additional 2 years of your life just in the form of humanitarian service? Surely such a mission would be consistent with LDS doctrine and ideals? Have it be run by the Presiding Bishopric and the Relief Society. Instead of an MTC where they learn the discussions, they instead learn how to build solid, affordable housing, install wells, teach low-till or no-till farming techniques, install solar cookers (instead of burning wood fuel) and other such skills to improve the quality of life.
Such efforts would certainly help the LDS Church build street cred in those regions.
Kevin
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Having a generic moderator account makes sense and doesn't seem like a violation of the rules. I was thinking more of a specific moderator having a specific alternate username, which does seem that way. But now I understand the intent here.
Yeah, I understand, too...
And not surprised that they're keeping a close eye on me, rabble-rouser that I am.
I do keep wondering, however, at this feeling I have that the rules might be vague enough to simply slap an infraction on someone, merely because moderators (or Heather) don't like or don't agree with what's been said.
And Heather's own statement that she can make or break rules at will seems to imply that this is really an autocratic environment, and "rule of law" doesn't apply here.
Am I wrong?
Kevin
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Actually, it IS appropriate. And the person who wrote that (not me) IS a moderator. If any member of this site doesn't want to read and follow the rules, they are free to leave at any time. If they wish to ignore the site rules, their leaving may be more compulsory.
Hmmm... the profile of "Moderator" has still only made one post, and is still identified as a "Junior Member", rather than as a "Moderator".
So, I really can't blame someone for believing that someone created a new profile, using the name "Moderator" in order to pose as a moderator, without actually being one.
And now that you vouch for "Moderator" as being a moderator, and their profile still has them as being from Afghanistan, and a Junior Member... I just wonder what game is being played here.
Sorry if it makes me curious.
Kevin
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Yikes, Western Europe really IS an incredibly hard place to sell Mormonism. Eastern Europe as well. They've all but pulled the plug on the missionary program in Russia.
The momentum has slowed down quite a bit overseas, but you're right, Latin America is ripe for the plucking.
I'd actually be happy to see more Latin American Catholics convert to Mormonism. At least the LDS church says that the use of birth control is a personal choice for a couple to be made prayerfully with God.
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lol...this was a joke...I have been here for a long time but I am now ready to let you know that this place is my addiction lol.
Just take it one day at a time, my friend... one day at a time.
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Maybe some do. Myself, for example. I'll grant that it sure caused (and still does, sort of) a lot of grief.
HiJolly
Was it the doctrine that caused and still causes the grief, or the saints disobedience of the principle?
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Am I the only one who thinks that it wouldn't be so bad if it was allowed again?
I think it's an awesome idea. You'd see a mass exodus from the Church, but the 1 or 2 million who'd remain faithful would probably survive it.
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For what it's worth... my parents joined the Church AFTER learning this doctrine. It's really what convinced them to be baptized.
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I served a full time mission for the LDS church.
So did I! *high fives*
It was fun to go overseas and learn a new language. In retrospect, I'm kinda glad I never baptized anyone. (Western European missions are HARD. Those wicked Europeans just don't want the Truth! Easier to baptize a bunch of Brazilians.)
Hi! I'm Kevin. I'm an Apostate.
in Introduce Yourself
Posted
I've been meaning to get back to your post, mrscurlymo. There's much I want to respond to in it. I just want to say for now:
I'm not "inactive", and I'm not "bitter". I'm "done". That chapter of my life has been written and is closed.
I will not return to the LDS church. No good would come of it. I would be miserable. I'm full of joy and love and peace as I am right now.
The ONLY suffering I am experiencing in my life right now is in relation to my financial health (because I've chosen personal happiness and freedom over monetary security and materialism) and my physical fitness (because I'm still too lazy to get my fat backside out every day to exercise like I should).
Why would I ever want to go back?
Kevin