HEthePrimate
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Posts posted by HEthePrimate
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(((Kartvines)))
I'm so sorry about your loss. I'm a widower myself, and know how much it hurts. The death of a loved one affects different people in different ways. For you, it seems to be nudging you do attend church, and hopefully some comfort there. For me, it almost knocked me out of the Church, wondering how God could let such a horrible thing happen. But in the months following my wife's death, a kind and scholarly friend of mine listened to me and talked with me for hours on end about religion, philosophy, and God, and even though he was not pressuring me to keep attending church, I came away from that with a better understanding of God's character, and a renewed sense of His love, despite all the pain I was feeling. Largely what it came down to was a more personal relationship with God, and a more honest one. Meaning that I came to realize that it's okay to have a real relationship with him, and express frustration, even anger, with him when necessary, as well as more pleasant feelings when appropriate. God is a Big Boy--he can handle the tough stuff, and the fact that He does is yet another reason to believe that he loves us.
Anyway, I didn't mean to wander off on a tangent.
My condolences to you, and I hope you'll know that you're not alone.
HEP
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I'm not a vegetarian myself (I loooove a good burger, and (oh, mouth watering just thinking about it) BACON! But I do respect vegetarians and vegans, if only for their dedication, and it does seem to be a healthy lifestyle, if done in such a manner that you get enough protein.
The scriptures don't say you can't be a vegetarian, nor do they say you have to be. They give us the freedom to choose, along with general guidelines, like don't shed blood unnecessarily, and don't waste meat, the principle being that life is sacred, so don't take it lightly.
My ward seems to have an unusually high concentration of vegetarians and vegans. My good friend's daughter is a total vegan--no animal products at all, including milk. Other members of the same family are "flexitarian," meaning they normally eat vegetarian-style, but will occasionally eat meat when it's offered to them (to be polite).
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Thank you, Vort. Maybe I could have stated my position more clearly, too.Perhaps you're right. I'll have to give it some thought later.
Although sometimes discussions like this can serve to clarify one's thinking. With all the back-and-forth, and seeing how others react to what I said, it can help me think things through a little more, and make me restate things in order to communicate better. I'm the type of person who "thinks on paper" (or in this case, a computer monitor), and it's rare that things come out exactly right the first time.
Peace.
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Vort, I think you're making a bigger deal of this than necessary. I am not against innocence. I am not against prettiness. I am not against "hotness," either, unless one defines "hot" as meaning the same thing as "slutty," which I do not. It is possible the author of the article did not mean "childlike" when he said "innocent," but in our society it often is used that way. I am merely arguing in favor of being mindful of one's language.
There are times when it's okay to refer to a woman as a girl, as in "girls' night out." There are times when it is not appropriate to call a woman a girl, and you will offend someone if you do. Same with the word "boy."
I think you overreacted to what I said, and you answered me rudely.
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I don't see a problem. My father is a scientist, and also a good faithful Mormon. He never felt the need to offer extravagant explanations for the existence of dinosaurs, and we never really saw a conflict with the gospel. But then, we are not strict literalists. My family figures God created the world, but we don't necessarily know how he did or, or how long it took.
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Whether or not the stake is "big," that they've organized a stake in Hyderabad is big news for the LDS who live there. :)
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I don't know what the statute of limitations for petting might be.
If your bishop's a jerk, he might make a big deal about it and postpone your wedding. Otherwise, I expect he'll just encourage you to be careful not to do it again (before you get married, anyway!) and maybe offer some advice.
As to whether or not to confess, it's really up to you. If it's bothering you that much, go ahead and tell the bishop. If it's not bothering you, and you are not likely to engage in petting again before your marriage, then don't.
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How reliable prayer is for me depends on what I'm trying to accomplish with it. If I'm asking questions, or seeking guidance, and expecting direct answers, it's not very effective. If I'm asking for specific blessings and expect to get exactly what I ask for, it's not very effective. But if I pray to express gratitude, to feel a spiritual connection with the universe, or to get something off my chest, it is quite effective.I'm wondering if anyone else feels the way I do about prayer.
I've often heard that God answers every prayer even though he may not answer immediately nor the way we want him to. I still believe this, but it is so frustrating not knowing if I've received an answer or not to important prayers or the wondering if I missed the answer.
Prayer works wonderfully when I understand the answer, even if it is not what I wanted to hear and things don't go the way I asked for. I've had prayers answered in seconds and others that have taken longer for me to realize I got the answer.
My thinking these days is couldn't God have devised a better system for communication between him and us? I mean we have cell phones that seem more reliable than his communication with me.
There are times when I don't even bother to ask him for things since it doesn't seem to help anymore or I'll ask him to bless others since he doesn't seem to be helping me in the areas I feel I need help. And I've heard that you have to do more than ask but do all that you can on your own. Well, there's only so much I can do on my own and that doesn't seem to be enough. And sometimes I just ask for ideas since mine seem to have run out, I feel I get good ideas, but no way to implement them.
Anyone else wonder why prayer doesn't seem so reliable?
Yes, it often feels like one-way communication. But maybe two-way communication is not the point.
Though if God decides step in from time to time and actually answer, I'm not going to try limiting his ability to do so!
But I think generally speaking, God takes a hands-off approach because the point of this mortal probation is to let us act on our own without his constant supervision or intervention.
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Sometimes yes, sometimes no.So therefore, calling a woman "innocent" is tantamount to calling her "childish"?
So?And yet, there's that pesky apostle using the term.
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Prisonchaplain, I agree with you that what terrorists do is not based on a legitimate interpretation of God's will. The 9/11 terrorists were not representative of mainstream Islam any more than Westboro Baptists are representative of Christianity.We are discussing whether or not it is reasonable to interpret the Bible as if it were God's truth. It was suggested that interpreting any book that way leads to religious terrorism, such as the 9/11 tragedy. My response was that the 9/11 tragedy was not a result of literally interpreting the Qur'an in a legitimate way. That the radicals have no more theological grounding than do the Westboro Baptists, and that those who cheer their wicked deeds do so out of social and political anger, not theological understanding.
Wicked people can use any writing for their purpose. Such abuse has no bearing on a discussion about whether the Bible is God's truth or not.
Still, the fact remains that those people did in fact interpret the Qu'ran a certain way, and acted on it, and Westboro Baptists interpret the Bible in such a manner as to justify their hate.
My concern is that if we allow that wicked acts are justifiable in certain circumstances, like when God commands them, then we run the risk of people being more likely to justify such acts more often. Sure, genocide is horrible and evil when godless people like Hitler and Stalin do it. But when we do it, it's justifiable because God is on our side and/or told us to do it. Why don't we just say that certain acts are not right, period?
Basically, I'm just reiterating my answer to the Euthyphro dilemma, "Is the pious (τὸ ὅσιον) loved by the gods because it is pious, or is it pious because it is loved by the gods?" In my opinion, things are not right because God commands them--God commands them because they are right. Genocide is not right, and so God would not command it.
If it makes you feel better, Prisonchaplain, I do think the Bible (and other scriptures) contain many messages from God, and should therefore be taken seriously. However, I do not think they are completely perfect and error-free.
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Considering how many times you've let slide rude comments made towards me, I see no reason to care what you think.Perhaps you could have asked PC to explain more what he meant instead of a hit and run comment like that. That was rude.
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Indeed, many (though not necessarily all, IMHO) of the "hot" women look like prostitutes, and therefore not innocent in the sense of guilt-free. And kudos to you for wanting to please your husband and not flirt with other men. But I wasn't saying you should do otherwise.I want to be desirable and sexy to my husband (and I am
), but I'm not seeking to be that way to the rest of the world. I have 5 children so I'm obviously not a virgin, but I am still innocent because I have obeyed the laws of chastity and the bounds under those laws. I am virtuous and clean and without guilt. (Had I sinned, I could have repented and remained innocent, of course.)I want to be pretty because I like it, and because we've been told to be neat and comely. I don't want to chase after looking "hot" to anyone but my husband, so I dress modestly and don't flirt with men and behave in a way that my actions are in harmony with my identity as a virtuous daughter of God. (Now that's my brand of feminism!)
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Now there's a respectful, grownup response for you!Sometimes, you just need to tell your inner feminist to shut up.
True, though people also often use it as a descriptor for children. If you look around at our culture, our tv commercials, ads in magazines, etc., the "innocent" look is often deliberately linked to childhood, even when the models are adult women.I believe innocence is associated with lack of guilt. Christ was innocent, not naive.
You can be a "boy" if you want--I am a man.Perhaps for the same reason that Elder Bednar told us men at the last Priesthood Session that we should be "good boys":
I simply wanted to be a good boy. The Lord needs all of us as bearers of His authority to be honorable, virtuous, and good boys at all times and in all places.
Again, way to elevate the discourse, Vort!See, now, that's your inner feminist ranting when it should be keeping its trap shut.
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I get what the article is saying, but question the wording. My "inner feminist" is asserting himself!
Our problem is that society doesn’t value innocence anymore, real or imagined. Nobody aspires to innocence anymore. Nobody wants to be thought of as innocent, the good girl. They want to be hot, not pretty.
Why the emphasis on innocence? What does "innocence" mean? Isn't innocence associated with childhood?
Why would someone want to be perceived as a "good girl" when she's actually an adult woman? Don't women want to be taken seriously as adults, rather than infantilized by being thought of as children, or childlike?
There's nothing wrong with an adult woman being attractive to members of the opposite sex. But let's call her that, "attractive," rather than reducing her to the status of an "innocent" child. The so-called "hot" women could be called something else, like "sultry," or even "slutty". (Hey, if you're going to criticize them, might as well go the whole nine yards!)
FWIW, I do agree with the author in that I prefer "pretty" women to those who look like they just stepped out of a house of ill repute.
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Inexpensive things for a young couple to do on their first anniversary in St. Louis? Hmm, let's see....Anyone have any suggestions for cheap, fun things to do there? My favorite husband and I will be there to celebrate our 1 year anniversary. We plan on eating at Pappy's and Iron Barley (2 restaurants from Diners, Drive-ins, and Dives).
We plan on doing a session at the temple, go up the Arch, visit the zoo and botanical gardens.
Anything else? Any place/restaurant a must see?
No, I'd better not! This is a family-friendly board!
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Well, we are Mormons, after all!I'm sorry beefche but I can not resist the temptation regarding your wording as you say, "My favorite husband..."
How many husbands do you have that you have a favorite??
I don't think "my favorite" beloved will allow me to get away with this statement, she keeps telling me "only one wife".Have fun in St. Louis!
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Remember that the next time a terrorist flies an airplane into a skyscraper and claims God commanded him to do it.Count me in the first camp. Therefore, if a prophet says God called for the destruction of the Amalekites, then I assume that God called for the destruction of the Amalekits.
God is the one who gets to make the rules, since he made the game, the equipment and the players. Let me hasten to add that his rules are just and fair--and loving.
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Oh my gosh, you've foiled me now! I guess you're right, the Church never labels people, after all!Please provide examples of the Church labelling such people. I'm sure you can come up with just gazillions, seeing as how it's so common.
Actually, there's my friend Dave, my friend Eric, my friend Anne, and my friend Kerstin. I could go on, but what's the point? For privacy purposes I won't share their last names or any other details, and you'll just dismiss what I say.
You could try doing an experiment upon my words, disagree with the Church, and see what the leaders say.
BTW, I like your new avatar.
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I'm picturing putting some in a fishbowl, or making a "rock" garden. Then when I have a visitor over, just reach into the rock garden, take one out, bite down on it, and watch my visitor's expression!Anatess and HEP.. Here you go!
And apparently some WalMart's sell chocolate rocks from a different company for less than $5.
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Wouldn't it be so much easier if they just prayed about it? They're prophets, right?A note on the debate on how the church handles it (with Mahone and KirtlandSaintinZion).
Mahone is correct on the church policy. The records are annotated and that person is not allowed to hold callings with kids.
However, there is a secondary policy in place where if one feels that annotation is unfair (like in a situation like KirtlandSaintinZion described) then they can apply to the first presidency to have that annotation (and restriction) removed from their records.
The first presidency reviews information like church callings and service since the time of the event, repentance, etc. They rely heavily on the stake presidency (the stake pres has to submit the application for annotation removal) and bishops opinion for that.
They also have church lawyers review the case. All legal action that was taken, the details of the offense, and any other records (legally or otherwise; like psyc evals) that the person thinks is relevant to the request. The lawyers give the first presidency their recommendation based on the legal risks the church would be taking if it were removed.
Then the first presidency makes a decision.
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Never mind the skin cancer!I eat my lunch outside, weather permitting. My medical/health knowledgable co-worker insists that's the best thing to get vitamin D.
Just kidding. My mom's always worried about me getting skin cancer, but I can't help going outside because I like it. Besides, it's not as if I'm outside all day long!
Actually, I did get basal cell carcinoma once, but that was on my chest "where the sun don't shine" (because I'm normally wearing a shirt). Got it hacked off, and it's fine now, just so you don't have to worry about it.
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Dude, for real? You can actually buy those?Oh, oh, oh, then there was the time I forced her to bite down onto a pebble. Her siblings were looking in horror. She wasn't sure but like a good girl, she did as dad told her to do. She bit down, gave me the absolutely funniest look of "what the heck" and then her face lit up:
Next thing, her hand shot out wanting more. Then her siblings had the same absolutely funniest look of "what the heck" until I said - "It's chocolate that looks like rocks." Then I had more hands shooting out demanding to try it. They inhaled the rest of the batch, having fun and loving the novelty of it all.
They're resilient or at least they were too young to remember it.
Too cool! I've gotta get me some!
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Well, kinda both--it's both kidding around and making a statement.Which individuals has the Church normally seen fit to label as "wicked" or "apostate"?
Or maybe your smiley means you're really just kiddin' around, ha ha.
Pretty much anybody who doesn't agree with the Church gets labelled either "wicked" or "duped."
Most anybody who is, or has been, a member of the Church who doesn't agree with the Church is labelled both "wicked" (or "duped") and "apostate." Because they're extra special double evil.
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Yes. Contrary to popular belief, it is possible--and sometimes appropriate/desirable--to turn down a calling.I can see that. I honestly have no idea what this person's motives were--a lot of trouble was gone to in order to not be known as a pedophile-one method of which was illegal.
I have to wonder if a simple "No, thanks, bishop" would suffice.
Limiting God
in LDS Gospel Discussion
Posted
FWIW, I like the "archaic" language of the King James Version--it's beautifully written. Of course it helps that I grew up reading that version, and understand that people who aren't used to the language might have trouble with it. So I have no problem with people who read more recent versions/translations, and sometimes read the NIV myself, as I was told by an Institute teacher who knows Greek and Hebrew that it's a more accurate translation. But for sheer beauty of expression, the KJV is excellent! (And what I'm used to, which of course has nothing whatsoever to do with it!
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