Bensalem
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Posts posted by Bensalem
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Hey I am new to the forums, nice to meet you all. Anyway, I am a Catholic right now but I have been reading the Book of Mormon and talking to the missionaries for a little over a week now and they asked me to be baptized later on in May. I am 20 years old and I haven't attended my first temple service yet, I am quite nervous. Would I have to speak in front of a large group of people as a visitor or anything? What is expected of me after baptism? What is RS and home teacher? I have so many unanswered questions that I haven't asked the missionaries yet, so I though maybe you all could help. Also since I am 20, I know this si a long shot and I probably won't only because I know it takes a long time to save money but is there any chance I could later be a missionary myself? (I am male) Thanks.
I'm curious as to why you want to serve a mission.
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It is a very philosophical discussion that goes way beyond what most on this list can easily do in just very short posts. I suggest you read Blake Ostler's first book on the Attributes of God. It discusses the concepts in depth, which include the concept of, if God knows everything, then there is no libertarian free will, but there is a Calvinist predestination. There is a compelling case for a God that does not know everything. Then, there are in between concepts, such as semi-compatibilism, or the concept that man's free will is only partially free. To have a good discussion on it, would first require everyone to do a lot of homework, such as reading Blake's first volume on God's attributes.
That said, I'm agnostic. I don't know how much God really knows. Nor do any of us really know. We just know he knows more than we do. And until it is revealed, we'll be just guessing as to free will and omniscience.
I'm sure it has all been spoken of before and maybe Blake Ostler's book addresses this, but I don't see how foreknowledge by a Godly third party removes my free will.
The best argument I have heard against the concept of free will comes from atheists who ask, "Is it really free will if the wrong decision results in a sure damnation." To which I reply, "Life in Christ remains a choice and a means to avoid damnation."
Without the Law of Accountability established in Noah, we are no better than the animals in His creation. It seems clear that our human existence is of a higher order or calling than that of the animal kingdom, yet we are free to deny that our being of this higher order is a gift from God. He gave us a life and a spirit like His own and told us we are heirs to a Godly Kingdom, yet we are free to live this mortality no more or better than animals do.
Without the pending Judgment of God we have no promise of attaining His Glory. The animals are not judged and they have no promise of Godhood. If anyone wishes to ignore these truths, they are free to do so. But the promise is withdrawn; and we attain only that which our choices allow.
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I was having a conversation with a Latter-day Saint who believes that our Spirits are made up of matter. His justification for this is D&C 131:7-8.
I'm curious how this would work? How does a material Spirit body fit with our material Flesh and Bone body in any sense? Do the Spirit particles sit between the flesh and bone particles? If you loose an arm are you loosing part of your Spirit body as well?
Just curious, I hold to the classical Christian view that the Spirit is immaterial.
Here's what I know of the subject. Everything that exists must be material, it must be made of matter...spirits included. An immaterial spirit cannot exist. To exist means to be made of substance or matter.
Christ said He was the Light and the Resurrection. After this life we will be resurrected in light and light has substance. Visible light is made of photons and photons have mass. There are no forms of energy that exist in the absence of mass.
Gravity is a form of energy which cannot be seen, yet it cannot exist without matter. Gravity is a byproduct of matter even as the spirit is.
Pre-resurrected and pre-mortal spirits (angels) have shown themselves to man. They are manifested in light, yet are not resurrected. Their substance is different than a resurrected being, but both are material; they both exist in matter.
Likewise, our human bodies are tabernacles of substance in which our spirits live. Where is the spirit that once was life? Mortal death is the absence of our life spirit. The body dies, not the spirit. Hence Christ taught that we are eternal...that the spirit continues; and that the spirit proceeded our mortal life.
How can something come of nothing? If spirits are immaterial, how can they come to live in us? How can the Spirit of Christ live in us if spirit is immaterial? You must at least admit that Christ is material, that the Holy Ghost is real.
Our doctrine, the LDS teachings, come from prophets who have seen and interacted with both resurrected beings (the Father and the Son) and spiritual beings (the Holy Ghost) and have declared that both are material. The "Good News" continues to be broadcast in and through the Church and Her saints which live in revelation from Christ.
So much (too much) of Christianity is nothing more than philosophy etched in stone. God lives and He has shown Himself to His saints.
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No more than male purity is!
The law of chastity in the LDS Church is taught in equal portions to both males and females in the Church. So too do nature's demands tug equally. And the spiritual consequences of impurity by either sex remains the same; namely, we become separated from God as the Holy Ghost can no longer abide in us.
The remedy for lack of chastity is also the same for either of the sexes. Repentance through Christ.
The only difference that I see is that in the natural world the women carries the larger burden of condemnation by society. And that the woman is less able to claim purity if her actions result in pregnancy.
In an increasingly promiscuous world, the advent of female birth-control, availability of abortion, and DNA paternity testing has only leveled the field of plausible denial of impure sexual conduct by both male and female participants.
It use to be that impure acts would lead to the corrective act of marriage, but even this is becoming more scarce.
The bottom line is that God holds us all equally accountable for such impure acts.
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I don't see how free agency could exist without free will. I'm really new to the concepts of open theism, but if they are what I think they are then it comes down to this:
God ultimately does not know what choices we will make.
I believe, God may know all of the possible choices we may make, He will have set limitations as far as what we can choose to do, He can also know the ultimate conclusion of mankind. But when it comes to choice he doesn't know.
I'm not ready to give up on the notion of an all knowing God; and I don't believe the reality of us living in a world with free agency requires that I do.
Did I miss the argument that these two concepts cannot coexist?
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Why do you stay in the LDS Church? I'm not necessarily interested in why you joined the Church, but why you stay. Have you ever considered leaving? What brought you back?
I stay because I have a testimony (witness from the Holy Ghost) that the LDS Church is the restored church of Christ. This personal revelation allowed me to know that Christ lives and that He still speaks to man (since He spoke to me). And because the LDS Church came by way of revelation to Joseph Smith, it was a small step of faith to come to know that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God.
I have never thought of leaving because I would than be abandoning the Truth.
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Could you provide a source for where the GAs have taught that marriage doesn't happen after resurrection?
I'll take credit for it (sorry SS if you posted it before me). Elder Talmage in Jesus the Christ uses the example of the Sadducees challenging the Savior to teach this principle:
That's fine; I was thinking of the following post.
LINK TO POST
Please follow Seminarysnoozer's link.
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Could you provide a source for where the GAs have taught that marriage doesn't happen after resurrection?
It actually came from 'Seminarysnoozer'. I'll try to track it down.
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Thank you for your input.So this is now 11 pages old and I'm sure a number of things that I'm about to say will probably have been said before, but here's my 1.5 cents anyways.
I'm a psych major and am hopeful to become a therapist focusing on sex or self worth issues. Sex is one of my pet topics. So take my opinion as you will. I don't feel the research points to what your daughter is stating. It shows a genetic predisposition, but does not negate that there may be environmental/persona/relationsal forces as well. To illustrated, research on twin studies shows that of those that are gay there is a 50% chance their identical twin is gay, 16-22% chance that there fraternal twin is gay, and a 6-11% chance that their adoptive sibling is also gay. The 50% and 20% is high and does show that there are some definite genetic connections to homosexuality. But it also shows that there is something more going on than just genetics. That adoptive siblings (ie. siblings with no genetic connection) also have an increased likelihood of being gay also states that there's more to it than just genetics. We're not necessarily programmed to be something by genetics.
Personally I think there is a common misunderstanding of personal choice and agency. It is not equivelant to the idea or free will. We are not free to do or become anything we want. Our choice is defined between choosing between right and wrong. We all have various attributes that left to our natural selves are antithetical to the Gospel. It's our choice as to whether these things become a wedge or a tool to refine us and help us to grow in the Gospel.
So in short, I don't think it matters how a person becomes gay (whether its genetic, environment, parenting, etc). It's what one decides to do about it that matters. I also don't the a majority of those who are gay will be able to choose to change their attraction as a whole as well. Don't negate that that can happen, but from what I've read about those who are active members and gay, that shouldn't be the overall goal.
With luv,
BD
Good luck with your studies.
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Modern revelation is one thing, and making up doctrine is something else. My point from a different angle could be, "If Jesus was married while here on earth where can we reference it from?" If the answer is "no where" then I believe the answer is Jesus was not married. I could also say Jesus rode around the country side on a 56 panhead, because that's not mentioned in the bible either.
Could our Lord be married after his Resurrection?--Maybe. I dont' see why not. But the question of was he married while on earth leads into other compromising situations that might be even more uncomfortable such as was he a polygamists, why didn't he ever mention his wife/ wives, and did he also practice polyandry?
I personally don't think that Jesus wasn't married because that wasn't his mission here on Earth. Jesus is perfect, he is our Savior, and he is the only reason why anyone can inherit the kingdom. I also tend to believe somehow it would be yet another charge (I'm not implying I would know how) added to him during his trial.
To add the OP's question I can think of another category which is,
3. It isn't validated yet by somone with the proper priesthood authority.
so let us leave it at that....
I was only providing you the LDS justification for the idea that Jesus must be married. Many of the points you made, I have made also in the course of this discussion.
Likewise, LDS thought is that marriage does not occur after the resurrection because of the parable of the childless woman and the seven brothers (Matthew 22:28-32), (Mark 12:23-27), and (Luke 20:33-39). I do not agree with this restriction, but the general authorities of the church do.
I'm just providing the information, not arguing the position.
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I don't think I disagree with you about our limited ability to discern between good and evil while in this life, I believe I was referring to the type of judgments that are of eternally unchanging consequences.
With that in mind, the "good" we are talking about, of course, is also of the kind that has eternally unchanging consequences. To have that kind of good count for eternal blessings, yes, it has to be done with an eye to the glory of God. Did Cain's sacrifice count? Why not, was it not good? His argument was that he did it just like his brother.
Genesis 4; " 3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord.
4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offering:
5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.
6 And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him."
So, what was wrong with Cain's offerings? Didn't he do "good" by giving the offerings?
Joseph Smith gave some insight to this story; "Abel offered to God a sacrifice that was accepted, which was the firstlings of the flock. Cain offered of the fruit of the ground, and was not accepted, because he could not do it in faith Shedding the blood of the Only Begotten to atone for man was the plan of redemption; and as the sacrifice was instituted for a type, by which man was to discern the great Sacrifice which God had prepared; to offer a sacrifice contrary to that, no faith could be exercised ; consequently Cain could have no faith; and whatsoever is not of faith is sin. (Joseph Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 58)
But my daughter's work does have eternal consequences. Noah's covenant of accountability (Genesis 9:5) makes the promise that we shall be judged by our fellow man and also the animals may be witness for or against us. Since Christ taught that the good (or evil) we do unto the poor is done unto Him, it is clear that my daughter's good service is done unto Christ. By NT standards her work is counted in her favor.
As for Cain, it is true that his offering was not in alignment with the symbolism of the atonement, thereby, placing his faith in question. But his larger sin was jealousy, which our Lord warned him of, and which eventually led to the murder of his brother Abel.
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I find this thread interesting, but I'm afraid I don't see any scriptural reference as to where Jesus is married. I feel like I've been suckered into this as I've been searching for passages that might clear this up. Thus far the only links I've found seem to stem from theologians that support the Savior not being married.
Anyway, can someone show me a passage that states where Jesus is married?
No, it doesn't exist. The only thing we have is latter-day revelation that states marriage is required in order to attain the highest exaltation in the celestial kingdom. Therefore, Jesus must be married.
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Bruce R. McConkie explains what the Holy Spirit of Promise is very well here. It does not describe at all what Bensalem described.
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You're understanding of how the Holy Spirit of promise works (in the context of marriage) is different from mine. Based on Doctrine and Covenants 132:18-19*
1) The marriage covenant is made
2) The Holy Spirit of promise ratifies the ordinance
The Holy Spirit of promise does not promise that you will one day receive a spouse; the Holy Spirit of promise promises that your exaltation is assured. In the context of sealings (as explained in D&C 132), the promise is made after you are already married.
What is the difference between promising a wife and promising exaltation, knowing that a wife is required for exaltation?
Jesus must have known that marriage was required. So whether he prays for a wife or prays to confirm his exaltation, when the promise is given, it all comes to the same thing...he shall be married (he shall have a wife), his exaltation is assured.
The Holy Spirit of Promise (aka, the Holy Ghost) is not limited to affirmation of covenants; the promise can be manifested in any "contract, bond, obligation, oath, vow, performance, connection, association, or expectation." (Bruce R. McConkie)
So the expectation (prayer) may have been confirmed before the covenant was made. Btw, a covenant is only a promise connected to a future blessing. So there is nothing wrong in my sequence of events: Prayer leads to confirmation, covenants (promises) are made and blessings are offered, and the fulfillment comes from God in honor of his promised blessing.
Jesus had a direct line to the Father; priesthood-to-priesthood. There was no Melchizedek priesthood on earth at that time except Jesus (and later the apostles). So the Jewish priesthood could not have officiated Jesus' celestial marriage as required by D&C today in the latter-day Temples.
Isn't Jesus turning to the Father in covenant the same as us turning to the LDS priesthood in the latter-days? The goal is the same, our wish and pray is to be sealed in heaven. The blessing is only fulfilled after (and if) we die in a state of worthiness.
The sealing power we maintain in the LDS Church is the same as God and Christ. Its absent from the Jewish landscape does not limit God from officiating a marriage by his own power.
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I might as well throw this out before I go to bed.
I had a tough time figuring out hell in LDS theology. I have basically put my desire for a full understanding on the shelf, but now my niece by marriage is investigating and she has already asked about the Rich Man and Lazarus (one passage I once used in an argument with a JW about the nature of hell as a literal fiery pit, ironic now it seems), I answered as best I could but I can't truly answer the question.
Have there been any books on hell, or any studies saying this is Spirit Prison, this is outer darkness in relation to the biblical and BoM references to hell?
I just wish the Protestant vs LDS views on the topic weren't so disparate, but just because the truth is hard to piece together doesn't mean it's any less true...
I appreciate the insights and thank you for your time.
From Mormon Doctrine by Bruce R. McConkie: Hell is "that part of the spirit world inhabited by wicked spirits..." which "will have an end. As John saw when he wrote, "death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works." (Rev. 20:13)
Then, "death and hell were cast into the lake of fire." (Rev. 20:14)
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As I said to Bensalem I know that the Spirit Wold is divided into two sections Spirit World and Spirit Prison. Please see Post #11 Thanks Brother Ray
The prophets of the LDS church have used those two phrases synonymously. That is why I identified the paradise aspect of the spirit world/prison.
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Thank you for your Post. But, the clarification wasn't necessary. If you'll notice the second line of my Post "I know when we die we all go to the SPIRIT WORLD/PRISON" Brother Ray
Yes, and since there was no mention of the paradise that is also part of the spirit world/prison, I spoke of it for the benefit of all.
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I disagree that Satan claims whoever enters the spirit prison. The spirit prison is also reserved for those that died without knowledge of the truth. They are given the opportunity to learn and to accept the gospel. But that doesn't mean they were automatically claimed by Satan when going there after death.
Only those who have not reached the age of accountability (8 years old and younger) are exempt from Satan's claim. All others are sinners. All sinners are claimed by Satan.
I am making a distinction between spirit prison (abode for wicked spirits) and the paradise (abode for righteous spirits) offered after death in the Spirit World before the resurrection. These are the only two choices available to those who die outside of Christ (meaning they were not baptized in the LDS church).
Prophets of the LDS church have spoken of these two abodes as a Spirit Prison since in both the spirits are waiting to be reunited with their bodies in the resurrection. And, as you have identified, they have also revealed that teaching is going on even to the wicked by the righteous.
But Satan claims the sinner as his own. They are the spirit children of the devil.
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The second option that the premises lead to is "Jesus is not and will not be married". To get a different conclusion besides these two, you would need to discredit the premises. You're theory of a future-married Jesus doesn't really fit the traditional marriage arguments.
I'm not following your argument.
As I understand the workings of the Holy Spirit of Promise:
1) An inquiry is made; Jesus prays to the Father about marriage.
2) The Holy Spirit of Promise promises a wife.
3) The power of God fulfills the promise from heaven.
4) Jesus and his wife come to know each other; the marriage is sealed on earth and his wife returns to heaven.
It follows the traditions established in the Law of Moses. Namely, the man desires a woman; the woman is betrothed (promised) to him; they are sealed for eternity in the eyes of God; and the pair comes together as one in marriage.
The first is Celestial in nature; the second is terrestrial.
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I don't see how the second option fits with what has been revealed. You're proposing that an ordinance is sealed by the Holy Spirit of Promise before it has even been performed? (applying your "absence of evidence" argument again) Is there any example in the scriptures of an earthly ordinance being sealed before it is performed?
Ephesians speaks of the Holy Spirit of Promise sealing the pledge of our inheritance (before actually receiving it) in chapter 1:
"12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory."
I am sure it is the same promise confirmed to Abraham by the Holy Ghost.
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Some things I know, and some things I've never been quite sure of.
I know when we die we all go to the Spirit World/Prison until the final judgement. We will then go to Outer Darkness, Telestial Kingdom Terrestrial Kingdom or Celestial Kingdom.
Right so far?
I know in the Celestial Kingdom we can be with our families, and I'm pretty sure that in the Teleslial Kingdom we can't be with our family. But I'm not sure about the Terrestrial Kingdom.
Also since everybody will first go to the Spirit World. Will we be with family there? Since Missionaries will still be teaching, so there will still be opportunity to learn, I'm guessing yes, but I have never been told one way or the other.
Another question that I have always wondered about Can our loved ones look down on us from the Spirit World? Or is that something that is reserved for Heavenly Father, Jesus, The Holy Ghost, and Angels. Brother Ray
One clarification: The Spirit World is divided into two conditions. When we die in Christ we enter paradise as spirits; when we die in our sins Satan claims us and we enter the spirit prison. In both, our spirits await the judgement and we are either resurrected into everlasting glory or everlasting misery. We can escape the grasp of Satan while in the spirit prison by turning to Christ and receiving a proxy baptism into the LDS church.
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My wife, is definitely a "winner" and is of such caliber as pertaining to imperfect souls, that women of her character, honesty, love for life, love for children, love for people, hard work and dilligence (despite how she may feel) would have qualified for the Savior's companion.
However, she was born in my time, she condescended herself in saying "Yes" to me. I guess, I only have to look at my relationship of a near perfect woman, married to an imperfect man to recognize that it is plausible that a pefect man could easily marry an imperfect woman.
I am just playing the devil's advocate pertaining to "she's got to be a winner." Most of the women upon this earth are "winners."
The couples I know in the LDS church are awesome. Both halves are genuine and kind. Their children are wonderful. Their service to Christ, stellar. If I didn't have the promise of a like creation, I would be jealous.
Thanks for sharing your tribute.
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I suppose. I don't have a strong opinion about that one way or the other but I wouldn't arrive at that conclusion by process of elimination. I wouldn't say that that is what it has to be because there is no other reasonable explanation.
One of the things I love about this religion is that we truly believe in the power of Jesus to fully redeem us from our mortal chains back to a state of purity we had before coming here and beyond. I have a testimony of that power and I see all of my brothers and sisters with that very potential. I would tend to believe that Jesus could see the potential even more than I possibly could and this is probably why He says things like 'forgive them for they know not what they do' or even is able to forgive the sinner and look beyond the outward appearance of the leper.
In fact, I think this is one of the main tests in this world, do we focus on the carnal or do we focus on the spiritual? Those that focus on the carnal as if that is some type of permanent state to the point of declaring that that is who the person really is and they start to convince themselves that that is true and learn to love that idea will eventually have a harder time seeing the spiritual. The carnal becomes reality over the spiritual making it unbelievable that Jesus could be associated with such a creature. I believe that God and Jesus sees carnality for what it is, something that in the end turns to dust. Satan loves to make the carnal things of this world seem more important than they really are.
If we are so fortunate to be resurrected into a Celestial state, don't you think that our carnal features would be equally glorious as God's and Jesus. We are told that we will be "one" and inherit all if we our worthy of that Kingdom. So, the only thing Jesus would have to find as an "equal", (if you really think that is a requirement) is in terms of spiritual pathway and potential, one that spiritually would make it into the same state of glory He achieves by His resurrection.
I agree. And will go a bit further to say that the female counterpart to Jesus was also selected to be his wife by the Father from the beginning of time. She's got to be a winner, spiritually speaking of course.
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I agree with this statement.
Thanks for understanding.
PS - Could you please correct my spelling error (blesses vs blessing). I edited it in the original.
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I learned that the Savior was the only begotten Son of God in the flesh in the MTC as well. It took me aback then. As this is being discussed here and I did a little searching to see if this was still taught (it is), I realized there is probably a good reason as to why the lesson asserts this so strongly. For example, it says;
Jesus Christ is the Firstborn in the spirit and the Only Begotten Son of God in the flesh.
Among the spirit children of Elohim, the first-born was and is Jehovah, or Jesus Christ, to whom all others are juniors.14
Jesus Christ is not the Father of the spirits who have taken or yet shall take bodies upon this earth, for he is one of them. He is the Son, as they are sons or daughters of Elohim.15
[Jesus Christ] is essentially greater than any and all others, by reason (1) of His seniority as the oldest or firstborn; (2) of His unique status in the flesh as the offspring of a mortal mother and of an immortal, or resurrected and glorified, Father; (3) of His selection and foreordination as the one and only Redeemer and Savior of the race; and (4) of His transcendent sinlessness.16
There is no doubt in the minds of Latter-day Saints in relation to the existence and personage of the Lord God Almighty, who is the Father of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. There is no doubt in the minds of Latter-day Saints that Jesus is the Son of God, being begotten of the Father in the flesh.17
Jesus Christ is the Son of Elohim both as spiritual and bodily offspring; that is to say, Elohim is literally the Father of the spirit of Jesus Christ and also of the body in which Jesus Christ performed His mission in the flesh, and which body died on the cross and was afterward taken up by the process of resurrection, and is now the immortalized tabernacle of the eternal spirit of our Lord and Savior.18
Jesus Christ was born of his mother, Mary. He had a fleshly tabernacle. He was crucified on the cross; and his body was raised from the dead. He burst the bonds of the grave, and came forth to newness of life, a living soul, a living being, a man with a body, with parts and with spirit—the spirit and the body becoming a living and immortal soul.19
God the Father … is the Father of our spirits, and … the Father in the flesh, of his Only Begotten Son, Jesus Christ, who joined divine immortality with the mortal, welded the link between God and man, made it possible for mortal souls, on whom the sentence of death had been placed, to acquire eternal life, through obedience to his laws. Let us, therefore, seek the truth and walk in the light as Christ is in the light, that we may have fellowship with him, and with each other, that his blood may cleanse us from all sin.20
Maybe the reason this is so important as to be asserted is because it reminds us of the deity of Jesus Christ, as our Savior and Redeemer, as well as being born in this earthly state of a mortal mother. Being born in this state of a mortal mother left Him able to experience the pain, suffering, temptations and sorrows so necessary for Him to experience to be able to understand what we face here perfectly and to know how to succor us in the flesh. Being born of an Immortal, Perfect Father gave Him the power to perfectly resist temptation, suffer infinitely for our sins and not become overwhelmed by the suffering, and then to be resurrected to a perfected body. A gift also given to all of us freely. Some scriptures come to mind;
Alma 15:1-9;
1 And now Abinadi said unto them: I would that ye should understand that aGod himself shall bcome down among the children of men, and shall credeem his people.
2 And because he adwelleth in bflesh he shall be called the cSon of God, and having subjected the flesh to the dwill of the eFather, being the Father and the Son—
3 The Father, abecause he was bconceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son—
4 And they are aone God, yea, the very bEternal cFather of heaven and of earth.
5 And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, asuffereth temptation, and yieldeth not to the temptation, but suffereth himself to be mocked, and bscourged, and cast out, and disowned by his cpeople.
6 And after all this, after working many mighty miracles among the children of men, he shall be led, yea, even aas Isaiah said, as a sheep before the shearer is dumb, so he bopened not his mouth.
7 Yea, even so he shall be led, acrucified, and slain, the bflesh becoming subject even unto death, the cwill of the Son being swallowed up in the will of the Father.
8 And thus God breaketh the abands of death, having gained the bvictory over death; giving the Son power to make cintercession for the children of men—
9 Having ascended into heaven, having the bowels of mercy; being filled with compassion towards the children of men; standing betwixt them and justice; having broken the bands of death, taken upon ahimself their iniquity and their transgressions, having redeemed them, and bsatisfied the demands of justice.
So, I see the necessity of the Savior being born of a mortal mother and a perfected, immortal Father. It makes a lot of sense to me.
Nothing objectionable in all of that.
Catholic going to Convert?
in Advice Board
Posted
Okay, just wondering. In answer to your question, I believe you can be a missionary. After baptism you will receive the gift of the Holy Ghost and the priesthood of Christ will be made available to you. All missionaries hold the Melchizedek priesthood. This is the same priesthood the Apostles had and you will have to enter a Temple to receive the ordinances.
You can also receive this priesthood and not serve a mission.
After all this and if you still wish to serve Christ as a missionary, you will have to speak to your Bishop and submit some paperwork to Utah. All missions are decided in Utah by the prophets and apostles of the Church.
Good luck with your conversion and with the promise of baptism the saints welcome you to Israel.