Cal Posted February 13, 2004 Report Posted February 13, 2004 Originally posted by Peace+Feb 11 2004, 11:23 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Peace @ Feb 11 2004, 11:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Originally posted by -bat@Feb 11 2004, 11:21 PM <!--QuoteBegin--Peace@Feb 11 2004, 11:19 PM No need. The Enquirer stated just yesterday...that it ain't so. Good for you. The National Enquirer is just about as accurate about events as the Book of Mormon. You're batting, well, none. Actually, the enquirer is well known for it's creative writing abilities. Where as the BofM just can't be fiction. Because it is mostly pure doctrine. Whose "pure doctrine"? Doctrine of JS and Oliver Cowdrey or doctrine of native americans 2000 years ago or so? That is the question. Since it is mostly either Biblical or solutions to theological and religious controveries of 19th century early New England, I would say, doctrine of JS and Oliver C. Quote
Guest Starsky Posted February 13, 2004 Report Posted February 13, 2004 Originally posted by Cal+Feb 12 2004, 09:01 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Cal @ Feb 12 2004, 09:01 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Originally posted by -Peace@Feb 11 2004, 11:23 PM Originally posted by -bat@Feb 11 2004, 11:21 PM <!--QuoteBegin--Peace@Feb 11 2004, 11:19 PM No need. The Enquirer stated just yesterday...that it ain't so. Good for you. The National Enquirer is just about as accurate about events as the Book of Mormon. You're batting, well, none. Actually, the enquirer is well known for it's creative writing abilities. Where as the BofM just can't be fiction. Because it is mostly pure doctrine. Whose "pure doctrine"? Doctrine of JS and Oliver Cowdrey or doctrine of native americans 2000 years ago or so? That is the question. Since it is mostly either Biblical or solutions to theological and religious controveries of 19th century early New England, I would say, doctrine of JS and Oliver C. Doctrine of Christ. Quote
Paul Osborne Posted February 13, 2004 Report Posted February 13, 2004 Originally posted by Cal+Feb 12 2004, 08:58 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Cal @ Feb 12 2004, 08:58 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Paul Osborne@Feb 11 2004, 07:56 PM Yes, and every word that comes forth from the prophet's mouth is a divine utterence because he was perfect just like Jesus and never made a mistake or made a wrong assumption. Paul O paul--the problem is A LOT is riding on JS's credibility that is NOT riding on any other prophet. Whether JS was capable of being wrong about his perceptions is a CENTRAL issue to the validity of Mormonism as a whole. So YES, it is a BIG deal when JS is proved wrong about something. The question arizes, what else was he wrong about? Angelic visitations, the origin of writings on metal plates, the history of the native americans?By the way, it was common speculation of the times that the moon was inhabited. This was not original to JS or BY. Cal,Go pick on Moses. Joseph Smith is my buddy. Paul O Quote
Cal Posted February 13, 2004 Report Posted February 13, 2004 Originally posted by Peace@Feb 12 2004, 10:27 PM No need. The Enquirer stated just yesterday...that it ain't so. Good for you. The National Enquirer is just about as accurate about events as the Book of Mormon. You're batting, well, none. Actually, the enquirer is well known for it's creative writing abilities. Where as the BofM just can't be fiction. Because it is mostly pure doctrine. Whose "pure doctrine"? Doctrine of JS and Oliver Cowdrey or doctrine of native americans 2000 years ago or so? That is the question. Since it is mostly either Biblical or solutions to theological and religious controveries of 19th century early New England, I would say, doctrine of JS and Oliver C. Doctrine of Christ. .....which JS plagerized from the Bible. Quote
Cal Posted February 13, 2004 Report Posted February 13, 2004 Originally posted by Paul Osborne@Feb 12 2004, 10:49 PM Yes, and every word that comes forth from the prophet's mouth is a divine utterence because he was perfect just like Jesus and never made a mistake or made a wrong assumption. Paul O paul--the problem is A LOT is riding on JS's credibility that is NOT riding on any other prophet. Whether JS was capable of being wrong about his perceptions is a CENTRAL issue to the validity of Mormonism as a whole. So YES, it is a BIG deal when JS is proved wrong about something. The question arizes, what else was he wrong about? Angelic visitations, the origin of writings on metal plates, the history of the native americans?By the way, it was common speculation of the times that the moon was inhabited. This was not original to JS or BY. Cal,Go pick on Moses. Joseph Smith is my buddy. Paul O Paul--I you can show me why he was a "credible" buddy, maybe he can be my "buddy" too! Quote
Guest antishock82003 Posted February 14, 2004 Report Posted February 14, 2004 Why did Joseph Smith indicate that there are civilizations living on the Moon and the Sun? (see “The Young Woman’s Journal”, Feb 6, 1892) Why did Brigham Young continue to preach this? (see Journal of Discourses, Vol. 13 p. 217) Quote
Paul Osborne Posted February 14, 2004 Report Posted February 14, 2004 Originally posted by antishock82003@Feb 14 2004, 09:54 AM Why did Joseph Smith indicate that there are civilizations living on the Moon and the Sun? (see “The Young Woman’s Journal”, Feb 6, 1892) Why did Brigham Young continue to preach this? (see Journal of Discourses, Vol. 13 p. 217) Because Joseph Smith was of the opinion that there were living inhabitants living on worlds in yonder space. Brigham Young shared the same opinion. What’s the big deal, Antishock? Not every little sentence that comes out of our prophet’s lips have to be divine utterances. They are men and have every right to act and be men too. They share opinions and have wild ideas just as everyone does. Unfortunately it is people like YOU that have ruined it for the prophets in our day because every little itsy bitty word that comes out of their mouths get scrutinized to the point that if there is even the slightest flaw in any opinion-- lo, they are false prophets. People like you have ruined my prophet’s right to just be a regular guy. Poeple like you are trapping him into a box where he can’t speak his own mind!! Now, what have you to say for yourself now? Paul O Quote
USNationalist Posted February 14, 2004 Report Posted February 14, 2004 Yeh i dont know why so many christians go crazy over crazy mormon stuff. I understand that not everything they do is prophetic, and that they cant be expected to be perfect. Look at Moses- after leading those people as Gods chosen prophet he wasnt even allowed to enter zion because of his sin. And yet Christians don't seem to have a problem believeing that he was Gods Prophet. Quote
Guest antishock82003 Posted February 14, 2004 Report Posted February 14, 2004 Originally posted by Paul Osborne+Feb 14 2004, 12:24 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Paul Osborne @ Feb 14 2004, 12:24 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--antishock82003@Feb 14 2004, 09:54 AM Why did Joseph Smith indicate that there are civilizations living on the Moon and the Sun? (see “The Young Woman’s Journal”, Feb 6, 1892) Why did Brigham Young continue to preach this? (see Journal of Discourses, Vol. 13 p. 217) Because Joseph Smith was of the opinion that there were living inhabitants living on worlds in yonder space. Brigham Young shared the same opinion. What’s the big deal, Antishock? Not every little sentence that comes out of our prophet’s lips have to be divine utterances. They are men and have every right to act and be men too. They share opinions and have wild ideas just as everyone does. Unfortunately it is people like YOU that have ruined it for the prophets in our day because every little itsy bitty word that comes out of their mouths get scrutinized to the point that if there is even the slightest flaw in any opinion-- lo, they are false prophets. People like you have ruined my prophet’s right to just be a regular guy. Poeple like you are trapping him into a box where he can’t speak his own mind!! Now, what have you to say for yourself now? Paul O I'm trying to show you that Joseph Smith was full of it. So was Brigham Young. The rest should be plainly obvious to see. How does one separate the man from the prophet then? Oh yeah. The "Spirit". The "Spirit" will help you know when a prophet is full of it, even when the prophet is sure he's being a prophet and you're being the heretic. Yeah. Ok, dude. Whatever... Quote
Paul Osborne Posted February 14, 2004 Report Posted February 14, 2004 Antishock, Frankly, both you and me (Cal too) at times are full of it. We all say and do dumb things during our lives. That is what makes us human. Joseph Smith must have said dumb things too or he wouldn't be human-- perhaps a man from the moon? Prophets have strong opinions about things. So do I. And, so do you too. Paul O Quote
Guest antishock82003 Posted February 14, 2004 Report Posted February 14, 2004 Originally posted by Paul Osborne@Feb 14 2004, 04:04 PM Antishock,Frankly, both you and me (Cal too) at times are full of it. We all say and do dumb things during our lives. That is what makes us human. Joseph Smith must have said dumb things too or he wouldn't be human-- perhaps a man from the moon?Prophets have strong opinions about things. So do I. And, so do you too.Paul O Well. How do you know his revelation on polygamy wasn't a dumb thing? Or the Kirkland bank? Or the Book of Mormon? Quote
Guest antishock82003 Posted February 14, 2004 Report Posted February 14, 2004 Originally posted by Peace@Feb 14 2004, 04:50 PM Same old stuff. Joseph Smith was a liar. He said people live on the moon. The don't. Was he not serious? Quote
bat3 Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by antishock82003+Feb 14 2004, 05:53 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (antishock82003 @ Feb 14 2004, 05:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Peace@Feb 14 2004, 04:50 PM Same old stuff. Joseph Smith was a liar. He said people live on the moon. The don't. Was he not serious? Joseph Smith made up a LOT of things. It's interesting to see his followers pick and choose which ones they can justify believing in, and which ones are just too far out there. Once a mormon realizes that the dude was just totally full of crap, it's no wonder they are pissed off about having belonged and given money to the organization that JS made up. Quote
Guest Starsky Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by antishock82003+Feb 14 2004, 04:53 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (antishock82003 @ Feb 14 2004, 04:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Peace@Feb 14 2004, 04:50 PM Same old stuff. Joseph Smith was a liar. He said people live on the moon. They don't. Was he not serious? Same old stuff. Quote
Guest Starsky Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by bat3+Feb 14 2004, 05:09 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bat3 @ Feb 14 2004, 05:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Originally posted by -antishock82003@Feb 14 2004, 05:53 PM <!--QuoteBegin--Peace@Feb 14 2004, 04:50 PM Same old stuff. Joseph Smith was a liar. He said people live on the moon. The don't. Was he not serious? Joseph Smith made up a LOT of things. It's interesting to see his followers pick and choose which ones they can justify believing in, and which ones are just too far out there. Once a mormon realizes that the dude was just totally full of crap, it's no wonder they are pissed off about having belonged and given money to the organization that JS made up. Same old, same old. Quote
bat3 Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by Peace@Feb 14 2004, 06:14 PM Same old, same old. ....and still not a rational response to be found. Quote
Guest Starsky Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by bat3+Feb 14 2004, 05:16 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bat3 @ Feb 14 2004, 05:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Peace@Feb 14 2004, 06:14 PM Same old, same old. ....and still not a rational response to be found. More of the same old stuff. Quote
Paul Osborne Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by antishock82003+Feb 14 2004, 04:53 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (antishock82003 @ Feb 14 2004, 04:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Peace@Feb 14 2004, 04:50 PM Same old stuff. Joseph Smith was a liar. He said people live on the moon. The don't. Was he not serious? Antishock,Would you please allow Joseph Smith to have some opinions about things that may not make any sense from a physical scientific viewpoint? He was a man of his times. Cut him some slack. God knows every prophet since the beginning of the world has said outrageous things. Prophets are not divine and neither are they perfect but YOU expect them to be just that or they don’t fit your expectations. Prophets since the beginning of the world have said things to upset people and disappoint them. Even Jesus was considered a fool by some people who were glad to see him nailed to a cross. How about you stop hating Joseph Smith so much? You will feel better for doing so. Paul O Quote
bat3 Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by Paul Osborne@Feb 14 2004, 06:23 PM Would you please allow Joseph Smith to have some opinions about things that may not make any sense from a physical scientific viewpoint? Like Native Americans being semitic? Quote
Paul Osborne Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by bat3+Feb 14 2004, 05:09 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bat3 @ Feb 14 2004, 05:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Originally posted by -antishock82003@Feb 14 2004, 05:53 PM <!--QuoteBegin--Peace@Feb 14 2004, 04:50 PM Same old stuff. Joseph Smith was a liar. He said people live on the moon. The don't. Was he not serious? Joseph Smith made up a LOT of things. It's interesting to see his followers pick and choose which ones they can justify believing in, and which ones are just too far out there. Once a mormon realizes that the dude was just totally full of crap, it's no wonder they are pissed off about having belonged and given money to the organization that JS made up. Bat3How about you quit acting like a little ######? You wouldn't recognize a true prophet if he walked up and bit you on the nose. Paul O Quote
bat3 Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Joseph Smith used to like to get physically violent with people who said things that made him angry. Would that be an adequate substitute for nose biting? Quote
Paul Osborne Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by bat3+Feb 14 2004, 05:24 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bat3 @ Feb 14 2004, 05:24 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Paul Osborne@Feb 14 2004, 06:23 PM Would you please allow Joseph Smith to have some opinions about things that may not make any sense from a physical scientific viewpoint? Like Native Americans being semitic? It ain't over until the fat lady sings. Scientific data is always up for change. You guys and your fancy dancy scientific conclusions think you have it all figured out.Well, your wrong.Paul O Quote
bat3 Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by Paul Osborne+Feb 14 2004, 06:31 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Paul Osborne @ Feb 14 2004, 06:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Originally posted by -bat3@Feb 14 2004, 05:24 PM <!--QuoteBegin--Paul Osborne@Feb 14 2004, 06:23 PM Would you please allow Joseph Smith to have some opinions about things that may not make any sense from a physical scientific viewpoint? Like Native Americans being semitic? It ain't over until the fat lady sings. Scientific data is always up for change. You guys and your fancy dancy scientific conclusions think you have it all figured out.Well, your wrong.Paul O Perhaps you have a better way to determine this than DNA testing? How about faith? Faith makes it possible to cure diseases and put men on the moon and make your car go. Perhaps faith will determine that the Native American Indians are actually semitic. Quote
Guest Starsky Posted February 15, 2004 Report Posted February 15, 2004 Originally posted by bat3@Feb 14 2004, 05:30 PM Joseph Smith used to like to get physically violent with people who said things that made him angry. Would that be an adequate substitute for nose biting? Only after he was dragged out of his bed in the middle of a cold night with his family and tarred and feathered.I guess everyone has their breaking point...even a prophet of God...whoopty do. Quote
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