lostnfound
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Posts posted by lostnfound
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8th grade.
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9The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
It also goes on to say:
10 I the Lord search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.
We are rewarded justly for what is in our hearts. Good hearts yield good fruits:
James 1:5-6
5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
This is exactly what Joseph Smith did. A series of events led to this profound point in history. A young man lacked the wisdom to know which church of all that he had attended was true. He sought an answer from the Lord for he was prepared to join whichever one the Lord told him to. He was prepared to act upon his answer. And the Lord answered him justly.
James 1:5 in context was speaking of those in trials..but for argument sake lets say that we did generalize that to mean in all areas..why do we need to pray over something that God has already given to us in his word? We don't need to pray whether or not to worship another God ..he has already told us not to for example. The bible also tells us to test al things..but i can't find a scriputre verse that tells us in its true context to listen to our feelings to see if it is true or not. :)
I hope you know skalenfehl..i am just trying to get a good case for praying over bom alone...i'm not trying to be difficult here.
All of you have brought up some interesting things. -
Why is the heart wicked?
My heart is wicked? It's twisted and black and seeks to disrupt the will of God, and seeks to sin knowingly?
Because if my sincere intent is to follow Christ and I pray to him, my feeling are not SUBJECTIVE, they're how He can communicate with me, and my heart is NOT wicked.
Do you think the Lord Omnipotent is incapable of using your own body and mind to communicate, or must He stick merely to ancient texts, thunderous voices, and burning bushes?
Your heart and MY heart are wicked because this is what the bible tells us..
jeramiah 17:9 King James Bible
The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
ps. to your last comment. I do believe in the power of the holy spirit. and that the spirit speaks to us.
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Eh? What do you mean by this?
hi,, i meant that the reason those people do go into debt has nothng to do with them not manging there money well..or not working their business the right way.
It's the front loading of the inventory, the always staying active etc. -
skalenfehl i wish I could go deeper into that with you in person..but i am going to leave it at that.
The real problem with hemi answering me with if the holy ghost confirmed a no answer for you and that is okay..is because feelings are subjective...and because the heart is wicked that is not a good source...to say it felt right..or it feels good to me so then it must be true. If this is the case..then we would all have to say that many roads lead to christ..since so many people believe that their way is the right way. but that is not the answer as you know. there is only one way and that way is through Jesus alone...
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Hemi, really?!!!! I am confused. Is it your opinion that some can believe it's true confirmed by the holy spirit and others can believe it's not true confirmed by the holy spirit?
God can contridict himself? Is there anybody else that thinks like this?
i think my question got lost..so i am reposting it..does anybody other then hemi see it like this?
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It boils down to this. We believe that a very important part of salvation is the authority to baptize. Jesus Christ called his apostles and gave them the authority to act in His name, going out into the world and baptizing in His name. This is key for us. The authority cannot be found in all the churches that conflict with one another. This was one of Martin Luther's serious concerns. God is not a God of confusion. If it didn't matter which of the many religions, if any, had the authority or if the authority was not necessary, then why not be baptized by just anyone who decided to start their own church? This is the key reason. Authority to act in God's name to perform ordinances essential for salvation. The Bible cannot point to us where this authority is found. The Book of Mormon does. That is our message.
that would be a great thread too..oh man lots of good thoughts came out my one question.
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CNN.com - Scholars: Oldest evidence of Jesus? - Oct. 21, 2002
interesting archeological evidence..Was it' jesus's brother?
It might very well be.
"We may never be absolutely certain. In the work I do we're rarely absolutely certain about anything," said Kyle McCarter, a Johns Hopkins University archaeologist, who said that the finding was probable, but that he had "a bit of doubt."
While most scholars agree that Jesus existed, no physical evidence from the first century has ever been conclusively tied with his life..."
well.there are even people out there that would say the holocaust did even exist. Idiots in my opinion...sorry...if it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck..guess what it is a duck. lol..Jesus has been a central figure throughout history...from believers to non believers.
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one more thought lehi..why do we need to go outside the bible for proof of jesus anyway? 40 authors 2,000 years apart from each other and 3 different languages...all saying the same thing with consistency. Prophecies were fulfilled and over 300 of them just pertaining to christ alone. These writings were real people, real places, real wars etc...To examine the evidence of the bible alone is overwhelming.
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CNN.com - Scholars: Oldest evidence of Jesus? - Oct. 21, 2002
interesting archeological evidence..Was it' jesus's brother?
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minuets
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Then that is your answer....long as you know it was confirmed by the Holy Ghost.
Hemi, really?!!!! I am confused. Is it your opinion that some can believe it's true confirmed by the holy spirit and others can believe it's not true confirmed by the holy spirit?
God can contridict himself? Is there anybody else that thinks like this?
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something did occur to me their is archelogical evidence of tombs with his family tree on them. Would that suffice?
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I'm sorry, lostnfound, but I looked up Josephus and his claims on Jesus are disputed, and their validity has been questioned for a few hundred years now. And, the man wasn't even born until 37 AD, at least 3 or 4 years after the DEATH of Christ, so anything he wrote would not have been a first-hand account anyway.
I imagine similar doubts exist around all of the material you quoted as proof of Christ walking on earth. Was ANYTHING written while he was ALIVE?
You'd think someone would have noticed the multitudes he preached to, whether they were Jewish or Roman or what, and written about it. I don't believe there's any such thing, though. It's all back-written.
Edit:
No, I do not doubt Christ or His existence, however I was a staunch agnostic who saw that there was a great LACK of any physical or historical evidence that Christ actually walked the earth, as the Scriptures teach, and that it's all based on these books written after his purported death... And books which have had 2,000 years to be altered in whatever manner translators and scholars saw fit.
No, there is nothing in history that could conclusively and logically lead me to believe in Christ, that the Messiah had come.
I rely upon the witness of the Holy Ghost
hmm was anthing written while he was alive?? can you count the first hand accounts of people that saw him..paul etc..or i guess you still want others outside of bible...let me look.
I would imagine you would find all kinds of conflicting information out there on everyone of those guys. Check witht the smithosion and their research department.
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I would have you pray over which church is true and whether or not Joseph Smith was indeed a prophet.
okay hemi..since you have the different answer then i have ever heard. what do you say to me if I say I prayed about that sought it all out..and the answer was that it is not true?
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okay i am going to circle this thing..altough interesting topics we could go on and on about..but if lds witness comes to my door are they not going to say pray over the bom to see if it is true? if yes..and they do not know what I believe..why would they not ask me if I 1. I believe bible is true and if i say no..then then say you need to pray over bible and bom to see if its true?
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Indeed, the books of the Bible were miraculously preserved, BUT, certain men and churches sure did their best to keep it out of the hands of the common man. For nearly a millenium the N.T. was only written in Latin, a language which the vast majority of believers couldn't understand, or only had a very basic understanding of. They couldn't go home and study the Bible independently, they had to rely on a priest to read it to them, and tell them if their lives were conforming to what was written in it. A lot of attrocities against true believers occured in the name of the "preserving" the faith, and the general body of the church had no way of confirming if what the church in that day was doing was truely in line with the Bible. Inspite of all this there were many genuine believers, and I believe it was because of the Witness of the Spirit ("feelings") they recieved, because of their desire for the Truth, that they were able to come to this knowledge, inspite of man's best efforts to use religion as a source of control.
you are right the catholic church did only teach in latin and try to keep God's word from the people. but those christians who did not follow man's teachings only God perserved his word through there heritage. Yes they were even killed for their faith. They still had access though to God's word.
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Lost, I'm not sure what you're asking here, but I think it may because you read my date wrong. I mentioned 900 A.D., and I think you may be talking about B.C. ?? In regards to the people having access to the O.T.?
ETA: The New Testament was formed around 3-400AD, right?
i don't know i have to check. but i know paul was writing from prison and to all the churches ..they had his letters and so forth..so God's word was around to the churches..even after those witnesses left. God's word was still around. old and new. God has perserved his word throughout history.
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well don't forget that we also had the old testament around. WE still had changed lives of witnesses..In today's post modern world that would not go over very welll..but in the world of modern thought..that would have been a big deal.
when did the new testment then come to be formed?
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But what of those people inbetween: too late to meet firsthand witnesses, and too early for archeology or widespread literacy?
well don't forget that we also had the old testament around. WE still had changed lives of witnesses..In today's post modern world that would not go over very welll..but in the world of modern thought..that would have been a big deal.
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I didn't come to know it's true, I've always just known from day one. Like I said it's instinctual knowledge that comes from my core essence.
I'm not LDS but I would say, "Whatever floats your boat." I don't have time to argue with people like that. They obviously have some blockage not permitting them to receive the right answer. Usually people that receive that answer are thinking of all the stereotypes about "Mormons" (polygamy, becoming gods, etc..) while engaged in prayer that they lose focus on the Book itself or they've already made up their mind about the "Mormon Religion" and aren't really praying with sincerity about the actual Book and it's contents..
well. that is one to rationalize it. I personally do not fall into that catagory. I know there are others. but i understand what you are saying. :)
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Lost: There isn't proof of the BoM YET. What would you tell those members of the church who lived on the earth before archeology became popular? Just to pull a date out of my posterior here, how about those believers in the Bible who lived in 900A.D. They didn't have access to church historical sights, and the vast majority of them didn't even have access to the Bible, and couldn't have read it if they had. Would you say they were wrong to rely solely on the Spirit, or their "feelings", that the Bible was true? It was the only "evidence" they had to go on that what they were worshipping was the Truth.
great question jenamarie.. well if you lived at the time of jesus..you would have personally seen his miracles...if you lived right after jesus died you may have come in contact with first hand witnesses of Jesus..like paul and peter. ARcheology is the not the only thing there is out there in objectivity.
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I think you misread Hemi's post. Joseph is NOT the Second Comforter. Christ is. :)
i think i misread his post too. sorry hemi..okay i know the holy spirit is called the comforter in the bible..but if you call jesus the 2nd comforter and then was the first comforter?
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True...even though Joseph Smith had the veil parted did not guarantee him the Second Comforter. This came later as written in D&C 88. At the time of Joseph's first vision, his spiritual maturity level was not to that level when he was ready to receive the fullness of the Godhead.
I noticed this also, those who had vision of an important figure beyond the veil, they will not actually see the figure but may reside next to them during that vision. The presence and knowledge of the figure is known but not the vision. Each encounter has a severe penalty for those who receive it and either not live up to that which is receive or fight against it later.
hemi..this is an interesting post..totally off my original subject..but i did not know joseph was called the second comforter.
Do you think these things are coming to pass.
in Scripture Study Forum
Posted
stay tuned to that chapter as we see the endtime prophesy being fulfilled as we type this!