brother01

That's an easy one!:-) Jesus said a man will reap what he sows.

So we clearlly find use for the principle of 'so far as it is translated correctly'! In looking at the specific word translated here I offer the following blue letter bible link: Blue Letter Bible - Lexicon From the use of the word I think the NKJV more correct than the KJV, but that doen't make me right, just that I think I'm right:-) Taking the principle beyond the one verse, based on the principle Jesus gave of believing what Moses said, that brings us to the foot of the mountain when God gave the ten commandments to Moses. Did God say He alone was God? Did God ever say that when Israel offered sacrifices to demons that the demons were also Gods? If Jesus was saying 'God only' VS 'only God', what is your view of the implications for us and the Trinity doctrine?

Seems that I clearly recall Joseph at one time after the 'sell the copyright in Canada' prophecy saying that some revelations are of the devil, some are of God and some come from ones self. Have you ever read the "Navoo Expositor"? Your post sounds more like a story than fact, but then it isn't your story, but the account of others. I didn't think there was anyone who doubted that Joseph Smith Jr. taught polygamy as a new doctrine and revelation.....

According to Jesus, He is the way, truth and light. Jesus revealed Himself, we can all read the testimony of Jesus Christ in the Bible. It was the Holy Scriptures that foretold Him and it is the Holy Scriptures that reveal Him as well, but it is the Holy Spirit by which God allows us to see Jesus for Who He is and understand Him and His teachings. Jesus never taught the disciples to expect direct revelation, but that the Holy Spirit would cause them to remember what He had taught them. The Holy Spirit enlightens the words of Jesus Christ, but Jesus also spoke plainly on many things to reveal the true doctrine of God. As such, and according to the teachings of Jesus Christ in the Holy Scriptures, the matter is to keep to what He said and do it because you believe He is who He said He is, that if He is your Lord, you will do what He said. "Blessed is he who hears and does" is the message of Jesus. So the message of Jesus Christ is not to worry about whether Joseph saw Jesus and the Father, but if Jesus spoke the truth of God and if He told the truth when He said that both His words and the word of God in the Holy Scriptures is imperishable by any means. If Jesus spoke truth, then the matter is to come to know what He taught, not in seeking to add to or take away from what He taught. Do you do what Jesus said? Do you keep the over 200 teachings of Jesus? Check it out! One Disciple to Another

From John 5 we find this quote from Jesus: What did Jesus mean by 'only God'?

The issue of whether God has a physical body is perhaps small in comparison to the view of how LDS see their relationship to God and Jesus Christ. Christians I know believe that Jesus is the Creator, not of the created - a mere elder brother of mankind as Satan is. So to ponder over reasons to believe God has a physical or Spiritual body is a relatively mute matter to discuss. Either God is the only God ever or God was a man who became God as you think you also can become is the greater issue in my mind.

Guess I'm not a social trinitarian:-) The way it seems to me is that we are made up of body, mind and spirit, but I'm just one person. So why can't God be made up of Father, Word and Spirit, as One God, yet the aspects of each are of the One and are One even though one part may abide in an area or demension beyond where the central Father resides.

Thanks, but from my comments there was no intent for asking about what Catholics believe. I thought the other poster had a specific link to a discussion for someone by the 'name' of 'catholic' to converse with here on the trinity topic:-) Two things I marvel at: 1. How Orthodox complain about LDS and the Trinity doctrine, but not Church of Christ. 2. How LDS even entertain that God is not the only God who ever was, is and will ever be - the source of all that is, both seen and unseen. (not just of this world or solar system or galaxy or universe) There are perhaps millions and billions of angels (els), but only one God. The angels and demons both witness this is true, let alone the Son of God and the holy prophets of God.

So why the Catholic comment? I've been to an RCC and had several deep conversations with them over the years. I respect the knowledge of some basics of the doctrine of Jesus Christ, but there are some big issues with RCC history and even bigger issues with doctrines that have been added that are not the doctrine Jesus gave from the Father such as their veneration of Mary, and switching certain things out from paganism and calling them Christian. Jesus wrote to the Church at Pergamos as a compromising Church and spoke about their idolatry and immorality. Most things in the Revelation of Jesus Christ are signified and I take that in such a way that those who add to or take away from what God has declared to be both immoral and practicing idolatry. Their having some statues is a minor issue in comparison to having slurred the very doctrine of Jesus Christ that God gave Him charge to speak and preach and reveal. So how many Churches are guilty of not repenting and turning to God with their whole heart and seeking to observe whatsoever Jesus taught during the first century? Just an added bonus thought, but do we really have the concept of prophecy that the Jewish mind of the old times had? Their concept was that it not only had to be true and according to what God had already given, but that it also had to fit the patterns given... like Abraham and Isaac and the sacrifice to God and Jesus on the cross or the ancient betrothal period and marriage feast to the Church being the bride of Christ that He will return suddenly for and she is to be ready for His coming.. The patterns abound, and these are but two. You might want to see if the added revelations of LDS fit the patterns given by God.

Do you have a thread to recommend?

My creed? Observe everything that Jesus taught. If He is my Lord I will to do whatsoever He said and grow in my knowledge and faithfulness to those things.

1) Are the persons of the Trinity capable of expressing emotion to each other? (ie can they love each other) What does the trinity doctrine have to do with being a disciple of Jesus or faithful to Him or obedience to what He commanded? If God is One, why do some try to take a spiritual scalpel and dissect God somehow? Jesus said those who had seen Him had seen the Father. Jesus said His Father was greater than Him. Jesus said as we abide in Him and His word that we are one with Him as He is one with the Father...didn't He? (John 17) Jesus said that it was better for us that we have the presence of the Holy Spirit in us than it was for Him to be bodily with us on earth. Yet the Spirit is spoken of as the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ and many other things. Why do some feel the need to define things instead of just abide in them? Jesus said we have to will to do whatsoever He said, and excuse me, but Jesus didn't say 'believe the trinity doctrine or go to hell', but rather, 'Ye believe in God, believe also in Me." 2) Are they capable of communicating with each other? This sounds like a non question to me. What's the point? 3) Can they be in differing spatial locations? (ie differing places, the Father was not crucified with the Son) Jesus went to heaven to prepare a place for those who are His and to be our High Priest, the Spirit is our Comforter and surity of God's ownership and presence. Jesus also said whereever two or more are gathered in His name that He is there with them. Seems that would be in Spirit. 4) Will Jesus maintain his resurrected body in heaven? The revelation of Jesus Christ shows Him quite different than on the cross; more like what He was at the transfiguration event/vision. 5) Is holding to the historic creeds… Can any historic creed compare to the pure teachings of Jesus? None that I've seen:-) a. essential for salvation b. good for spiritual health but not an absolute requirement c. not important d. other…Please specify "D" Jesus said we will be judged by His words, the very doctrine of God He taught, as well as the truth of God taught in the Holy Scriptures. Jesus said these things were both imperrishable, so they need not restoration, but to know what has been revealed and forgotten - but certainly not 'lost' to need to be 'restored'. One Disciple to Another

Hey Justice-- I did see your post and your appeal to authority--the authority of the Book of Mormon (Alma 42 to be specific). For me, nothing in that book is authoritative. Yes, I understand it's premise--that if I have a "sincere heart," "real intent," and "faith in Christ"--its truthfulness will be made manifest. And yes, I understand the logic of LDS--that if anyone has read the book, prayed, and didn't get such affirmation--then by definition they lacked the sincerity, real intent, etc., and they need to try again and keep trying until they get the "right answer." Been there, done that, and yes--I even got a T-shirt out of the deal (printed up for a service project). But by God's grace I got out of that loop a few years back. So your admonition that I pray some more about the BoM and specifically Alma 42--it falls a bit flat with me. I trust you'll understand why I didn't initially respond to your post. Hopefully you didn't invest too much time on it. --Erik John 7:16,17; "My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me. If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God or whether I speak on My own authority." John 14:23,24; "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me." Mt 23:8-12; "But you, do not be called 'Rabbi'; for One is your Teacher, the Christ, and you are all brethren." John 15:9,10; "As the Father loved Me, I also have loved you, abide in My love. If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love." Jesus taught that if we will to do His will, that by doing what He said, that it is then that we receive testimony that God is true, and that Jesus is who He said He is, and that if we believe, obey and abide in Him and His word because He is Lord and Messiah and the Son of God. Jesus never said this is gained by saying a prayer; it is not to 'say this prayer after me and be saved' any more than it is to pray for a testimony of a particular book. It is about the witness of God that gives glory to the Son. It's about believing the Faithful Witness and doing the will of God. It is the faith of Jesus and the testimony of Jesus and the commandments of God.

I was raised Church of Christ, my dad was a preacher sent to do mission work in Utah when I was 4, so I have some knowledge of the LDS from an early age, but didn't get into study of the LDS faith until I married a Mormon lady. At first I was put off because I asked questions. Then the anti-LDS had an open door because they were more than willing to 'talk' about LDS and give their views. After years of study was wasted on historical accounts I discovered the teachings of Jesus Christ. Once I discovered that no one is taking His teachings as seriously as He said they should be, well, I don't belong to any organized 'church' fellowship. I feel uncomfortable most everywhere - some more than others. As one who investigated every major fellowship from Catholic to Pentecostal and LDS to SDA, my faith view is broadened extensively, but the truth is that I've discovered no one takes Jesus seriously. I almost checked the "nondenominational", but that does not fit. Most "nondenominational" are generalists who have separated from one or another Baptist of other basic fellowship and are more about 'feel good faith' than they are about growing in Christ in faith, word and deed. So I checked 'other.' It isn't that I'm not a Christian, it's that I don't want to marginalize my faith. It has cost too much to not put a high value on it.

Why not talk to the wife and try to do a joint call to Dr. Laura?